Date   

Re: Waterfox

Dennis L <dennisl1982@...>
 

Is there a addon for fire fox 60 that will do what navigational sounds does?

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Brian's
Mail list account via Groups.Io
Sent: Saturday, May 12, 2018 11:22 AM
To: nvda@groups.io
Subject: [nvda] Waterfox

Hi just installed this. It looks reasonable so far, though it did very
quickly flash up something about restricted accessibility but it vanished
before I could respond The ad blocker it imported did not block ads,
eventually ublock origin was tested and its better.
Now it keeps on presenting a button to check if updates are there for add
ons in the add on manager, but it seems not to do anything. If I search I
find its all the time trying to get me to download firefox instead.
So navigational sounds work, downloads work and setting new search
providers works.
I think most of it seems like the old Firefox, though some pages seem to
take a little longer to load, such as filehippo

Also no read article mode as even the 52 version of Firefox has is not
there, maybe there is an add on for this?

Obviously I have not made it the default browser as yet, but it does seem a
lot simpler to set up though it shares the add on manager sulk mode of
Firefox, where you need to close it and open it again to make it work.
So anyone using it got any tips for it. I have not tried chrome as yet. I do
not really want to fill up my drive with browsers just yet.
Brian

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Re: edit field in Google site

Brian's Mail list account <bglists@...>
 

Look in tools web developer and also look at other toolbars and make sure they are not set to do something to the page.
The web developer one seems to be the most common one I accidentally activate into some odd display mode.
However apart from that what about search fields in other pages such as
www.startpage.com


Brian

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----- Original Message -----
From: "Robert Mendoza" <lowvisiontek@gmail.com>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Saturday, May 12, 2018 12:34 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] edit field in Google site


Hi, Brian


Mine if you could guide me to change from Firefox ESR. Thanks.

Robert Mendoza

On 5/12/2018 3:41 PM, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io wrote:
Its working here for me. Could you have changed the view of Firefox somehow, so the tools are in use instead?


Brian

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----- Original Message ----- From: "Robert Mendoza" <lowvisiontek@gmail.com>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Saturday, May 12, 2018 3:05 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] edit field in Google site


In addition, the said earlier post does not occurs in Chromebecause after it loads the site the focus started to land in edit field. Not sure what exactly behaving this to Firefox ESR lately.

Robert Mendoza

On 5/12/2018 9:58 AM, Robert Mendoza wrote:
I noticed after updated to the master snapshot of nvda by using Firefox ESR version 52.8, the focus does not landed to edit field. in the site of Google. Not sure if this has been raised before





Waterfox

Brian's Mail list account <bglists@...>
 

Hi just installed this. It looks reasonable so far, though it did very quickly flash up something about restricted accessibility but it vanished before I could respond
The ad blocker it imported did not block ads, eventually ublock origin was tested and its better.
Now it keeps on presenting a button to check if updates are there for add ons in the add on manager, but it seems not to do anything. If I search I find its all the time trying to get me to download firefox instead.
So navigational sounds work, downloads work and setting new search providers works.
I think most of it seems like the old Firefox, though some pages seem to take a little longer to load, such as filehippo

Also no read article mode as even the 52 version of Firefox has is not there, maybe there is an add on for this?

Obviously I have not made it the default browser as yet, but it does seem a lot simpler to set up though it shares the add on manager sulk mode of Firefox, where you need to close it and open it again to make it work.
So anyone using it got any tips for it. I have not tried chrome as yet. I do not really want to fill up my drive with browsers just yet.
Brian

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Using Pontes Media Downloader.

Matt Turner
 

Hi folks, just wanted to let yall no, that the issue with downloading large playlist from youtube has been fixed.

It downloaded/ converted a channel, with186 videos.


Re: edit field in Google site

Robert Mendoza
 

Hi, Brian


Mine if you could guide me to change from Firefox ESR. Thanks.

Robert Mendoza

On 5/12/2018 3:41 PM, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io wrote:
Its working here for me. Could you have changed the view of Firefox somehow, so the tools are in use instead?


Brian

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----- Original Message ----- From: "Robert Mendoza" <lowvisiontek@gmail.com>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Saturday, May 12, 2018 3:05 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] edit field in Google site


In addition, the said earlier post does not occurs in Chromebecause after it loads the site the focus started to land in edit field. Not sure what exactly behaving this to Firefox ESR lately.

Robert Mendoza

On 5/12/2018 9:58 AM, Robert Mendoza wrote:
I noticed after updated to the master snapshot of nvda by using Firefox ESR version 52.8, the focus does not landed to edit field. in the site of Google. Not sure if this has been raised before




Anyone using master having add on download and install issues?

Brian's Mail list account <bglists@...>
 

IO - speech.speak (09:23:08.565):
Speaking [LangChangeCommand ('en_GB'), u'list with 2 items', u'stable version', u'link']
IO - inputCore.InputManager.executeGesture (09:23:11.030):
Input: kb(desktop):enter
DEBUGWARNING - NVDAObjects.IAccessible.IAccessible._get_IAccessibleRole (09:23:11.073):
accRole failed: (-2147024809, 'The parameter is incorrect.', (None, None, None, 0, None))
DEBUGWARNING - NVDAObjects.IAccessible.IAccessible._get_IAccessibleRole (09:23:12.920):
accRole failed: (-2147024809, 'The parameter is incorrect.', (None, None, None, 0, None))
DEBUGWARNING - NVDAObjects.IAccessible.IAccessible._get_IAccessibleRole (09:23:12.923):
accRole failed: (-2147024809, 'The parameter is incorrect.', (None, None, None, 0, None))
IO - speech.speak (09:23:12.947):
Speaking [LangChangeCommand ('en_GB'), u'Opening Mozilla-1.5.nvda-addon dialog You have chosen to open: Mozilla-1.5.nvda-addon which is: NVDA add-on package (53.1 KB) from: \u2026ithub-production-release-asset-2e65be.s3.amazonaws.com Would you like to save this file? ']
IO - speech.speak (09:23:12.967):
Speaking [LangChangeCommand ('en_GB'), u'What should Firefox do with this file? grouping']
IO - speech.speak (09:23:12.973):
Speaking [LangChangeCommand ('en_GB'), u'Open with radio button checked Alt+o 1 of 2']
IO - inputCore.InputManager.executeGesture (09:23:28.302):
Input: kb(desktop):tab
IO - speech.speak (09:23:28.336):
Speaking [LangChangeCommand ('en_GB'), u'combo box NVDA collapsed']
IO - inputCore.InputManager.executeGesture (09:23:29.918):
Input: kb(desktop):tab
IO - speech.speak (09:23:29.948):
Speaking [LangChangeCommand ('en_GB'), u'OK button']
IO - inputCore.InputManager.executeGesture (09:23:32.127):
Input: kb(desktop):space
IO - speech._speakSpellingGen (09:23:32.147):
Speaking character u'space'
DEBUG - queueHandler.registerGeneratorObject (09:23:32.147):
Adding generator 5
DEBUG - queueHandler.pumpAll (09:23:32.158):
generator 5 finished
IO - speech.speak (09:23:32.346):
Speaking [LangChangeCommand ('en_GB'), u'Mozilla Apps Enhancements - Mozilla Firefox']
IO - speech.speak (09:23:32.415):
Speaking [LangChangeCommand ('en_GB'), u'Mozilla Apps Enhancements document']
IO - speech.speak (09:23:32.418):
Speaking [LangChangeCommand ('en_GB'), u'\u2022 download ', u'link', u'stable version']
DEBUGWARNING - RPC process 4488 (nvda_slave.exe) (09:23:32.446):
Python warning:
C:\Program Files (x86)\NVDA\library.zip\configobj.py:28: DeprecationWarning: The compiler package is deprecated and removed in Python 3.x.
ERROR - RPC process 4488 (nvda_slave.exe) (09:23:32.471):
__main__.main:
slave error
Traceback (most recent call last):
File "nvda_slave.pyw", line 101, in main
ValueError: No such action
IO - inputCore.InputManager.executeGesture (09:23:43.111):
Input: kb(desktop):control+alt+r
IO - speech.speak (09:23:43.157):
Speaking [LangChangeCommand ('en_GB'), u'Taskbar']
IO - speech.speak (09:23:43.201):
Speaking [LangChangeCommand ('en_GB'), u'reboot nvda with log terminal']
IO - speech.speak (09:23:43.203):
Speaking [LangChangeCommand ('en_GB'), u'80 space', u'blank']
INFO - core.main (09:23:43.315):
Exiting

Not sure what this is about but raised a ticket for it anyway.
Brian


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Re: edit field in Google site

Brian's Mail list account <bglists@...>
 

Its working here for me. Could you have changed the view of Firefox somehow, so the tools are in use instead?


Brian

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----- Original Message -----
From: "Robert Mendoza" <lowvisiontek@gmail.com>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Saturday, May 12, 2018 3:05 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] edit field in Google site


In addition, the said earlier post does not occurs in Chromebecause after it loads the site the focus started to land in edit field. Not sure what exactly behaving this to Firefox ESR lately.

Robert Mendoza

On 5/12/2018 9:58 AM, Robert Mendoza wrote:
I noticed after updated to the master snapshot of nvda by using Firefox ESR version 52.8, the focus does not landed to edit field. in the site of Google. Not sure if this has been raised before


Re: Deja Vue all over again?

Brian's Mail list account <bglists@...>
 

I think the problems will start when such features get established in the workplace and then if multiple sessions can be running of an app in different sets its going to get very confusing as to which version one is actually in, leading to mistakes. Whereas a sighted user can see at a glance several sets are running, the blind person is going to be stuck as usual only within a single set at a time and making sure its the right one is really important.
Brian

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----- Original Message -----
From: "Shaun Everiss" <sm.everiss@gmail.com>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Saturday, May 12, 2018 5:26 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Deja Vue all over again?


Well just like universal and desktop apps for me windows gets more and more confusing, as long as I can open programs the old way and close them the old way I will be happy.




On 5/11/2018 8:44 PM, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io wrote:
I probably should not have listened to this, but I did. it was an explanation of the new sets feature of windows 10 in the next update.
They are talking about having program sets, that open in tabs on a single window. IE programs opening inside the same window hence the name set, you switch between sets with alt tab, but between applications in a set with shift tab, which could pose some issues for things already using these keys I'd say. In other words its a bit like browsers do with tabs.
Now when I first came to Windows in 3.1, it had program groups withed many programs inside one icon named a group. Obviously in those days the power to have so much going on at the same time was just not there, but this does seem to be going back to those days in a way.
So instead of just shortcuts in the groups, you keep the running session of that software, almost like windows within windows.
Back in the old days, a program called Desqview tried to do this in Dos, but once again the power was not there to really achieve this.
I'm not sure how all this will impact the key presses we are all now used to like alt tab, and I guess if we do not want to make up sets, then there will be no differences. However they have already started multiple virtual desktops and this seems to be on top of this. One might get very confused unless the non power user or learner can revert things to default while one tries to get used to things.

On top of that a lot of the functions seems to be going toward doing most things in Edge, and using bing as the only search system in programs like Notepad which is also being updated they say to make it more Linux like, something I'm not familiar with.
Just listening gave me a headache!
Brian

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.


Re: Deja Vue all over again?

David Moore
 

In the near future we will understand why these changes are great, and we will realize that we will like it. It is like Dos. I thought that I would grieve myself to death, because I had every DOS command memorized. Now, though, I can be more efficient with Windows, because there is now a search field in almost every app and in Windows itself. I can type a few words of a document, and my document is right there to enter on.

Sets will be great when you want to use the same group of programs over and over.

David Moore

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 

From: Shaun Everiss
Sent: Saturday, May 12, 2018 12:26 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Deja Vue all over again?

 

Well just like universal and desktop apps for me windows gets more and

more confusing, as long as I can open programs the old way and close

them the old way I will be happy.

 

 

 

 

On 5/11/2018 8:44 PM, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io wrote:

> I probably should not have listened to this, but I did. it was an

> explanation of the new sets feature of windows 10 in the next update.

> They are talking about  having  program sets, that open in tabs on a

> single window. IE programs opening inside the same window hence the

> name set,  you switch between sets with alt tab, but between

> applications in a set with shift tab, which could pose some issues for

> things already using these keys I'd say. In other words its a bit like

> browsers do with tabs.

> Now when I first came to Windows in 3.1, it had program groups withed

> many programs inside one icon named a group. Obviously in those days

> the power to have so much going on at the same time was just not

> there, but this does seem to be going back to those days in a way.

> So instead of just shortcuts in the groups, you keep the running

> session of that software, almost like windows within windows.

> Back in the old days, a program called Desqview tried to do this in

> Dos, but once again the power was not there to really achieve this.

> I'm not sure how all this will impact the key presses we are all now

> used to like alt tab, and I guess if we do not want to make up sets,

> then there will be no differences. However they have already started

> multiple virtual desktops  and this seems to be on top of this. One

> might get very confused unless the non power user or learner can

> revert things to default while one tries to get used to things.

> On top of that a lot of the functions seems to be going toward doing

> most things in Edge, and using bing as the only search system in

> programs like Notepad which is also being updated they say to make it

> more Linux like, something I'm not familiar with.

> Just listening gave me a headache!

> Brian

> bglists@...

> Sent via blueyonder.

> Please address personal E-mail to:-

> briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'

> in the display name field.

>

> .

 

 

 

 


Re: Deja Vue all over again?

 

Well just like universal and desktop apps for me windows gets more and more confusing, as long as I can open programs the old way and close them the old way I will be happy.

On 5/11/2018 8:44 PM, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io wrote:
I probably should not have listened to this, but I did. it was an explanation of the new sets feature of windows 10 in the next update.
They are talking about  having  program sets, that open in tabs on a single window. IE programs opening inside the same window hence the name set,  you switch between sets with alt tab, but between applications in a set with shift tab, which could pose some issues for things already using these keys I'd say. In other words its a bit like browsers do with tabs.
Now when I first came to Windows in 3.1, it had program groups withed many programs inside one icon named a group. Obviously in those days the power to have so much going on at the same time was just not there, but this does seem to be going back to those days in a way.
So instead of just shortcuts in the groups, you keep the running session of that software, almost like windows within windows.
Back in the old days, a program called Desqview tried to do this in Dos, but once again the power was not there to really achieve this.
I'm not sure how all this will impact the key presses we are all now used to like alt tab, and I guess if we do not want to make up sets, then there will be no differences. However they have already started multiple virtual desktops  and this seems to be on top of this. One might get very confused unless the non power user or learner can revert things to default while one tries to get used to things.

On top of that a lot of the functions seems to be going toward doing most things in Edge, and using bing as the only search system in programs like Notepad which is also being updated they say to make it more Linux like, something I'm not familiar with.
Just listening gave me a headache!
Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk, putting 'Brian Gaff'
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.


Re: edit field in Google site

Robert Mendoza
 

In addition, the said earlier post does not occurs in Chromebecause after it loads the site the focus started to land in edit field. Not sure what exactly behaving this to Firefox ESR lately.

Robert Mendoza

On 5/12/2018 9:58 AM, Robert Mendoza wrote:
I noticed after updated to the master snapshot of nvda by using Firefox ESR version 52.8, the focus does not landed to edit field. in the site of Google. Not sure if this has been raised before


edit field in Google site

Robert Mendoza
 

I noticed after updated to the master snapshot of nvda by using Firefox ESR version 52.8, the focus does not landed to edit field. in the site of Google. Not sure if this has been raised before

--
Robert Mendoza


Re: Announcing Carter Temm's Text Information 1.0#AddonRelease

David Moore
 

I am using it, and I love it, because I can easily find definitions of any word that I land on. I could always do this with JAWS, but now, I can do this just as easily with NVDA. Thank you so much, Carter and Joseph.

David Moore

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 

From: Kerryn Gunness via Groups.Io
Sent: Friday, May 11, 2018 5:14 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Announcing Carter Temm's Text Information 1.0#AddonRelease

 

very good

 

----- Original Message -----

From: Joseph Lee

Sent: Saturday, May 5, 2018 11:14 AM

Subject: [nvda] Announcing Carter Temm's Text Information 1.0 #AddonRelease

 

Hi all,

 

On behalf of the NVDA add-ons reviewers, I’m delighted to announce the release of Carter Temm’s Text Information add-on. Based on text you found, it’ll let you look up things such as IP addresses, definitions of English words and so on.

 

More info can be found at:

https://addons.nvda-project.org/addons/textInformation.en.html

 

Cheers,

Joseph

 


Re: facebook and edge

David Moore
 

Yes, Gene!

It is the same in chrome.

The mobile Facebook site is laid out almost identical in Chrome and Edge.

I like it much better, because like you said, you have the good web layout with links and headings and that, but you get to see almost everything that you do on the regular Facebook site.

When I enter on the main menu, I was able to see all of my groups, news, town hall, and much more than you get to see in IE.

I am really liking it much better, using the mobile site in Edge and in Chrome.

Have a great one, Gene, and I will try to remember to have Skype on LOL!

David Moore

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 

From: Gene New Zealand
Sent: Friday, May 11, 2018 10:28 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] facebook and edge

 

Hi david

 

Just logged into the mobile version of face book it has certainly changed. it is more like the full version now. it is still in a web page type of setup. Where you can jump around with headings, links and buttons etc with single letter navigation keys  they still have the shortcut keys there to jump around the website. it took me a little time to find the log out part otherwise i would still be in there now.

 

I jumped around a few sections just to see the setup and can not recall having to go into focus mode and browse mode as much as you would do in the main one to see the extra parts of face book it seems to be more fluent.




Gene nz

On 5/11/2018 10:46 AM, David Moore wrote:

Thanks a lot, Gene!

I am really liking the experience the more I use it. The mobile site in Edge has more you can do with Facebook, than IE offers with the same mobile site. Thanks, Gene!

Talk soon!

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 

From: Gene New Zealand
Sent: Thursday, May 10, 2018 4:15 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] facebook and edge

 

Hi David

 

The last time i used it it was very easy and much like a web page if i remember right. It is much more stripped down than the main site. If i remember right there was a audio tutorial on the main face book with written material and on the end of the audio one was a look at the mobile version.  It would be good if you can write one then share it with the community.

 

Gene nz

 

 

On 5/11/2018 1:39 AM, David Moore wrote:

Hi!

I am just starting to use the Mobile site of Facebook in Edge with latest NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803 as well.

I will do a tutorial once I figure everything out, and I am sure that it is better to use it on Edge than it is on IE. So far, I like it better. I am trying it in Chrome as well.

I will let you know how it goes with me using Edge, and I will then do a tutorial for using mobile Facebook in Edge!

David Moore

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 

From: Gary Metzler
Sent: Thursday, May 10, 2018 5:24 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] facebook and edge

 

Hi All,

 

Is there a tutorial for using the mobile facebook site and edge?  I am using the latest nvda and win10.  Thanks for any help.

 

Regards, Gary kn4ox

Send to: gmtravel@...

 

 

 

 

 

 


Re: Announcing Carter Temm's Text Information 1.0 #addonrelease

Kerryn Gunness <k_gunness@...>
 

very good
 

----- Original Message -----
From: Joseph Lee
Sent: Saturday, May 5, 2018 11:14 AM
Subject: [nvda] Announcing Carter Temm's Text Information 1.0 #AddonRelease

Hi all,

 

On behalf of the NVDA add-ons reviewers, I’m delighted to announce the release of Carter Temm’s Text Information add-on. Based on text you found, it’ll let you look up things such as IP addresses, definitions of English words and so on.

 

More info can be found at:

https://addons.nvda-project.org/addons/textInformation.en.html

 

Cheers,

Joseph


Re: Deja Vue all over again?

Brian's Mail list account <bglists@...>
 

It was on Mushroom fm so its kind of gone when its gone.
Brian

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Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal E-mail to:-
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----- Original Message -----
From: "Gene" <gsasner@ripco.com>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Friday, May 11, 2018 10:23 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Deja Vue all over again?


Listened to what? No link nor reference by name to anything is made.

Gene
----- Original Message -----

From: Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io
Sent: Friday, May 11, 2018 3:44 AM
To: nvda@groups.io
Subject: [nvda] Deja Vue all over again?


I probably should not have listened to this, but I did. it was an
explanation of the new sets feature of windows 10 in the next update.
They are talking about having program sets, that open in tabs on a single
window. IE programs opening inside the same window hence the name set, you
switch between sets with alt tab, but between applications in a set with
shift tab, which could pose some issues for things already using these keys
I'd say. In other words its a bit like browsers do with tabs.
Now when I first came to Windows in 3.1, it had program groups withed many
programs inside one icon named a group. Obviously in those days the power to
have so much going on at the same time was just not there, but this does
seem to be going back to those days in a way.
So instead of just shortcuts in the groups, you keep the running session of
that software, almost like windows within windows.
Back in the old days, a program called Desqview tried to do this in Dos,
but once again the power was not there to really achieve this.
I'm not sure how all this will impact the key presses we are all now used
to like alt tab, and I guess if we do not want to make up sets, then there
will be no differences. However they have already started multiple virtual
desktops and this seems to be on top of this. One might get very confused
unless the non power user or learner can revert things to default while one
tries to get used to things.

On top of that a lot of the functions seems to be going toward doing most
things in Edge, and using bing as the only search system in programs like
Notepad which is also being updated they say to make it more Linux like,
something I'm not familiar with.
Just listening gave me a headache!
Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk, putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.


Re: Deja Vue all over again?

 

Hi,

By default, it’ll behave like old releases. The change happens if you tell it to show only windows, at which point only Sets and standalone windows will show up. I’ll explain my reasoning when the time is more appropriate (Sets is in early development).

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Melissa Jean
Sent: Friday, May 11, 2018 10:01 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Deja Vue all over again?

 


On May 11, 2018, at 4:23 AM, Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:

Listened to what?  No link nor reference by name to anything is made.

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

Sent: Friday, May 11, 2018 3:44 AM

Subject: [nvda] Deja Vue all over again?

 

I probably should not have listened to this, but I did. it was an
explanation of the new sets feature of windows 10 in the next update.
 They are talking about  having  program sets, that open in tabs on a single
window. IE programs opening inside the same window hence the name set,  you
switch between sets with alt tab, but between applications in a set with
shift tab, which could pose some issues for things already using these keys
I'd say. In other words its a bit like browsers do with tabs.
 Now when I first came to Windows in 3.1, it had program groups withed many
programs inside one icon named a group. Obviously in those days the power to
have so much going on at the same time was just not there, but this does
seem to be going back to those days in a way.
So instead of just shortcuts in the groups, you keep the running session of
that software, almost like windows within windows.
 Back in the old days, a program called Desqview tried to do this in Dos,
but once again the power was not there to really achieve this.
 I'm not sure how all this will impact the key presses we are all now used
to like alt tab, and I guess if we do not want to make up sets, then there
will be no differences. However they have already started multiple virtual
desktops  and this seems to be on top of this. One might get very confused
unless the non power user or learner can revert things to default while one
tries to get used to things.

On top of that a lot of the functions seems to be going toward doing most
things in Edge, and using bing as the only search system in programs like
Notepad which is also being updated they say to make it more Linux like,
something I'm not familiar with.
 Just listening gave me a headache!
Brian

bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.



Re: Deja Vue all over again?

 

On May 11, 2018, at 4:23 AM, Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:

Listened to what?  No link nor reference by name to anything is made.
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Friday, May 11, 2018 3:44 AM
Subject: [nvda] Deja Vue all over again?

I probably should not have listened to this, but I did. it was an
explanation of the new sets feature of windows 10 in the next update.
 They are talking about  having  program sets, that open in tabs on a single
window. IE programs opening inside the same window hence the name set,  you
switch between sets with alt tab, but between applications in a set with
shift tab, which could pose some issues for things already using these keys
I'd say. In other words its a bit like browsers do with tabs.
 Now when I first came to Windows in 3.1, it had program groups withed many
programs inside one icon named a group. Obviously in those days the power to
have so much going on at the same time was just not there, but this does
seem to be going back to those days in a way.
So instead of just shortcuts in the groups, you keep the running session of
that software, almost like windows within windows.
 Back in the old days, a program called Desqview tried to do this in Dos,
but once again the power was not there to really achieve this.
 I'm not sure how all this will impact the key presses we are all now used
to like alt tab, and I guess if we do not want to make up sets, then there
will be no differences. However they have already started multiple virtual
desktops  and this seems to be on top of this. One might get very confused
unless the non power user or learner can revert things to default while one
tries to get used to things.

On top of that a lot of the functions seems to be going toward doing most
things in Edge, and using bing as the only search system in programs like
Notepad which is also being updated they say to make it more Linux like,
something I'm not familiar with.
 Just listening gave me a headache!
Brian

bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.




Re: I've largely changed my mind about Chrome, I like itmuchmore now

Gene
 

This message is long and those who aren't interested in the topic may want to skip it or not read much of it.  It is a discussion of why I think first letter navigation is inefficient a lot of the time when working with book marks and how to use search efficiently. 
 
If you used the search, as in Firefox and it may work the same way in Chrome, it is inefficient to use favorites by first letter navigation if you have a lot of them that start with the same letter.  You said, you press s until I find it.  What does that mean?  Pressing s seven times and listening to the first word or the first two words in each result?  If you know you are looking for a link about supplements and that the word supplement is in the link, you can just type s u p p.  I separated the letters so they will be spoken individually.  You would actually type supp and then conduct the search.  You will see every book mark with the word supplement in it.  If you know something distinctive such as that you are looking for a supplement site that you know the distinctive name of or that has a distinctive word you know in the book mark name, you can type that name or even part of that name.  If a distinctive word is boost, if you type that word, you will see just that one book mark in the results if it is the only one with that wword. 
 
When I want to find the newsline bookmark in firefox, I don't type the letter n five times or more.  I open the search, type NFB tab once to the results, down arrow twice and press enter.  I typed NFB because that efficiently shows me linkks for Newsline, which is what I'm looking for.  NFB is a word in the bookmarks.  I have more than one link to different sections of Newsline but I know that if I down arrow twice in the results, that will take me to the section I almost always want to start in.  I just checked.  If I use first letter navigation, I have to type n eight times to get to what I want.  What if I want to find something with n that I would have to type n nine or ten times for? 
 
Not only does using search eliminate the need to use first letter navigation in this cumbersome way, it eliminates the need for me to organize book marks into folders or move them up or down in the list for ease of access.  Search looks at all book marks wherever they are.  I can experiment.  I don't want to type much when using the search unless I need to.  If I am using the search to find a book mark I use regularly and one search brings up an inconvenient number of results, another search probably won't.  If line brings up too many results and news certainly will when searching for Newsline, then what about NFB?  Since I tried NFB along with one or two other searches to see which one is efficient, I remember that NFB is the search to use. 
 
If I'm looking for the New York Times, I don't have to type New York Times or York Times, I can just type rk ti and the first result is the home page.  The New York Times has a page called Today's Paper.  I can just type 's pap.  That's apostrophe s space p a p.  Today's paper is the first result in my search results.  It would be the only result except that at some point, I made a vook mark to a specific Today's Paper page I wanted for reference so there are two results. 
 
While some of this may be preference, I think some is not.  I think using a search feature like this is more efficient in general.  There are times when opening the book marks menu and up arrowing once or twice or three times to get to a book mark is just as or more efficient.  A lot of the time, the search feature is.  I never have to organize bookmarks in any way and I don't have to type the same letter eight times to get to something and I don't have to remember lots of sequences for efficiency such as Newsline, type n four times, Today's Paper, press t 3 times, Newsweek, type n six times, etc. 
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Friday, May 11, 2018 9:20 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] I've largely changed my mind about Chrome, I like itmuchmore now

Gene,

It is not inefficient if you only have an idea of the name of the bookmark.

Like if I want to press the Nebraska Lottery page, I need to press N twice, if I want the Norfolk weather page, I press N three times and so on.

And if I am looking for something that has to do with supplements, I can press S until I find it.

I try naming my favorites in a way I will look for them later.

Glenn

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: Thursday, May 10, 2018 9:46 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] I've largely changed my mind about Chrome, I like itmuchmore now

 

You may prefer it but it is very inefficient to press a letter key six times if you have a lot of favorites or bookmarks, whatever people may call them, with the same letter.  To make moving to favorites more efficient in Internet Explorer, I used to move ones I used a lot up in the list so I could use first letter navigation efficiently for them.  From having to press a letter key four or five or maybe more times, I would move it up in the list so I would only have to press the letter perhaps once or twice.  But that is a real annoyance and as time goes on you have to do it for more items as you get more and more favorites.  The method Chrome is using goes along with the trend in Windows that has been going on for years, allowing people to use search interfaces, such as in the Windows start menu for example.  It is much more efficient if implemented correctly. 

 

I found, through playing around with book marks in Chrome, that you can move as you wishh if you have your book marks in a folder other than in the main one.  When I imported my book marks from Firefox, they were placed in a folder called Imported.  If I open the folder, I can move by first letter navigation an by arrowing.  In the main folder, you can arrow, of course, but first letter navigation doesn't work.  So you can move any book marks in the main folder to one or more other folders and get that ability again.

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

From: Ervin, Glenn

Sent: Thursday, May 10, 2018 9:32 AM

Subject: Re: [nvda] I've largely changed my mind about Chrome, I like itmuchmore now

 

I personally prefer the way it’s done in IE, that is to open Favorites (bookmarks in FF) and pressing the letter of what I’m looking for, or up arrowing if it is a recent bookmark.

I hope I can always continue that method.

Glenn

 

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: Wednesday, May 09, 2018 2:29 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] I've largely changed my mind about Chrome, I like itmuchmore now

 

If you want to get to a bookmarkin Chrome, you don't necessarily have to go into the book mark interface.  I haven't played with this enough to know how well it works, but there is a feature where you can type some or all of the name of the site you are looking for into the address bar and it looks in book marks and history for it and places results in a list you down arrow through after typing.  I don't recall now if you should read the current line to get the first result or just start down arrowing.  Others can evaluate the feature bbecause I just played with it a very small amount.  But it may eliminate the need for first letter navigation.

 

Also, if ease of use of bookmarks is very important to you, Firefox is much much better at ease of use than Internet Explorer.  It has a dedicated search book marks feature where you type part or all of the name of a book mark and down arrow through a list and first letter navigation works in the list of results as I recall as well.  If I type york times or even just rk tim in the search, then tab once to the list, I find my new york times book marks there. 

 

I wouldn't assume that bookmarks are an important reason blind people still use Internet Explorer as their main browser.  Most blind computer users probably haven't given this issue any thought because they probably haven't seen it discussed anywhere.  When you are considering changing to a different browser, unless you know about the question, you aren't likely to think about book mark navigation.

Gene

----- Original Message -----

From: brian

Sent: Wednesday, May 09, 2018 11:07 AM

Subject: Re: [nvda] I've largely changed my mind about Chrome, I like itmuchmore now

 

    If and chrome has first naavigation then and only will I switch to it from ie thats the reason that so many blind people still use ie because of first letter navigation if you have a lot of favorites or bookmarcks thats a lots of down arrowing just to get to the one that you want.  this  is a lack in googles part since ie has always had this feature so why can't chrome have it/?  I know that nvda does work with chrome so if this could beadded then I think that more blind people would switch to chrome. Google just doesn't get it. 

Brian Sackrider

 

On 5/8/2018 7:55 PM, Dan Beaver wrote:

Interesting,  when I cursor through the bookmarks in Chrome on my system it works and activates the bookmark when I press enter on one of them.  I haven't had a problem with this issue at all.

 

Dan Beaver

 

On 5/8/2018 7:45 PM, Rich De Steno wrote:

I notice Chrome does not have "first letter navigation" for the bookmarks.  I had to arrow down until I found the one I wanted.  Also, when I press Enter on a bookmark, it does not activate.  I had to go into the applications key to activate the option "open in new window". 

 

On 5/8/2018 2:43 PM, Steve Nutt wrote:

Hi,

 

For the curious, you get to the toolbar by pressing Alt+Shift+T.  Focus is placed on the first item, then you can arrow left and right through the toolbars.

 

All the best

 

Steve

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Steve Nutt
Sent: 08 May 2018 19:37
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] I've largely changed my mind about Chrome, I like itmuchmore now

 

Sorry about this message, I meant NVDA doesn’t see the toolbar, but neither does JAWS.

 

All the best


Steve

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Steve Nutt
Sent: 08 May 2018 19:19
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] I've largely changed my mind about Chrome, I like itmuchmore now

 

Hi,

 

Excellent tutorial.

 

The only thing it doesn’t touch on is how you access the toolbar.  Someone installed the High Contrast accessibility extension today and asked me how to enable/disable it, or how to change the colour invertion.  According to help, you have to click it from the toolbar, but it seems that JAWS doesn’t see it.

 

Any ideas please?

 

All the best

 

Steve

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of David Moore
Sent: 06 May 2018 23:29
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] I've largely changed my mind about Chrome, I like itmuchmore now

 

Hi all!

No problem at all.

I will paste my text tutorial right here in the message so you can all read it here or copy and paste it somewhere on your computer. Here is the tutorial on using Chrome!

Tutorial for Using the Google Chrome Browser

By David Moore

This tutorial will be done with the latest update of Chrome.

I will also use JAWS 18, JAWS 2018, and NVDA 2017.4 for this tutorial, because they all work the same in Chrome.

Finally, I will use Windows 10 Creators Update latest public build.

I will assume that you have downloaded and installed Chrome.

There should be a shortcut on your desktop.

 

Section One:

Launching Chrome:

One way to Launch Chrome, is to press the Windows key or CTRL+Escape and type Chrome in the search edit field, and press enter when you hear JAWS say Chrome.

However, since you have already downloaded Chrome, You will have a shortcut icon on your desktop.

So next, find the shortcut for Chrome on your desktop, and press enter to open Chrome.

The short cut will actually say Google Chrome, so press G to find the Google Chrome icon on your desktop.

The first very important step, is to press Windows+up arrow to maximise the window. Chrome often opens with the window not maximise, and you will get undesirable results.

 

Section Two:

Bringing up a web site.

Press CTRL+L or Alt+D

and type the following:

www.freedomscientific.com

The Freedom Scientific web site comes up very quickly.

All navigation commands like: H for heading, E for edit field, C for combo box, and so on all work just the same in Chrome.

 

Section Three:

The Virticle Chrome menu:

I will press Alt+F.

The Chrome menu is open.

This is a very large virticle menu that you just keep pressing up and down arrow through.

I will press insert+up arrow to hear the first option in this menu.

New Tab, CTRL+T.

You can press that command right from the web site you are on.

New Window, CTRL+N

You can press these commands right from your web page, instead of coming here.

New incognito Window.

History sub menu.

I will press right arrow here to see what is in this sub menu!

History, CTRL+H

So, there is a key command for reading your history.

You can read a few sites you were on right here.

I will press left arrow to close this history sub menu.

Downloads, CTRL+J

There is the command for opening your downloads you have downloaded with Chrome.

Next, the important Bookmarks sub menu.

I will press right arrow, to open this.

I hear, bookmark this page, CTRL+D

That command will bookmark the page you are reading.

Next down arrow, says show bookmarks bar, CTRL+Shift+B

That command, will show your bookmarks on your Chrome browser for all to see. I do not want that.

Here is the important one.

manage bookmarks

The command is, CTRL+Shift+O

In here, you can organize your bookmarks into folders, see the bookmarks you have imported from different browsers, and very importantly, you can download, to your computer, an HTML file of all of your bookmarks in Chrome.

On your computer, you can press enter on this file, after it downloads, and a page will show up in Chrome with a list of all bookmarks you have saved in Chrome. This is an awesome way to download all of your bookmarks right to your computer, so you can back them up.

That is all for manage bookmarks.

Next, I hear import bookmarks and settings.

press enter on this, and you can import all bookmarks and settings from IE, and Firefox, right into Google Chrome, and they will be in their corresponding folders.

Now, I hear all of my saved bookmarks as I continue to arrow down.

Very important!

Sometimes, when I open that bookmarks sub menu, I do not land on the choices I mension here, but instead, I start hearing my saved bookmarks. If this happens, I press up arrow a few times, and it gets me to these choices.

Keep in mind, that many of these choices, like bookmark manager, have key commands, so you do not have to come to this bookmarks sub menu at all. You only need to come here most of the time, to arrow through your saved bookmarks, and enter on the desired one.

To save a web site as a bookmark,

Just press CTRL+D and press enter, and your bookmark is saved.

I will now press left arrow, to close the Bookmarks sub menu!

I will continue to down arrow through this virticle Chrome menu that we entered by just pressing alt.

The next few are very self explanatory.

The next one I will mension, is the more tools submenu.

I will press right arrow on this.

I hear Save Page as, and the command, CTRL+S.

Next, Save to desktop.

This allows you to save the favorite of the page right to your desktop. This is how you do this in Chrome, instead of doing this in the file menu in IE.

It is hidden under this more tools submenu.

Clear Browsing data, and there is the key command, CTRL+Shift+Delete key.

Extentions, In here, you can add extentions, delete extentions and so on.

These are the same as add ons, in IE.

I will press left arrow, to close the More Tools sub menu, and we are back to the virticle Chrome menu.

The last two that I will mention, are settings, and the help sub menu.

If you press the left arrow on the help sub menu, you can open the help system, just like in other programs, so that is all I will say about help.

Now, we will press enter on settings, and a web like page will open where the virtual cursor will turn on with JAWS, and NVDA will be in Brows mode.

 

Section Four:

Adjusting Settings and Advanced settings:

Now that this web page is open, I will just down arrow down the page and we will deal with each setting.

Important:

I have already signed into Chrome.

So now, arrow down until you hear sign into Chrome and press enter.

You just enter your email address and password, I think it has to be the same email address and password that you used to set up your Google account.

I am not sure about this.

You do not need to sign into Chrome, if you do, you can sync all of your activity between all devices that you have Chrome on. That is the only advantage of signing in.

I will continue with what I hear after you have signed in.

If you do not sign in, press H until you hear Appearance.

Each group of settings is a heading that you can get to by pressing H. This makes it very easy, because you just press H until you hear the group of settings you want to work with.

Now, because I have signed in, this is what I hear before getting to appearance.

The first thing you hear:

Settings.

That is the very top of the web page.

Down arrow, and you hear:

Main Menu Button.

That will just take you back to the virticle menu we were in.

If you down arrow again, you will just hear blank.

Down arrow, again, and you hear:

Settings again, but now, this is a heading. You can get here just by pressing H at the top of the page.

If you down arrow, you hear:

Search Settings.

This is where you can type in a setting that you want to change.

Down arrow again, and there is the edit field where you type in the setting you want to work with.

Down arrow again, and you hear another heading saying people.

Down arrow again, and I hear David Clickable.

This is because I have already signed into Chrome.

Down arrow again, and I hear my Gmail email address.

Again, this is because I have already signed into Chrome to sync my settings and all of that.

Down arrow again, and I hear:

Edit person.

This is where I could change my name.

Down arrow again, and I hear:

Sign Out.

This is because I have already signed in to Chrome.

Down arrow again, and I hear:

Sync.

Down arrow again, and I hear:

On, Sync everything.

This is a combo box, where you can choose what to sinc; I chose everything in this combo box.

Again, all of this is because I have signed into Chrome already.

Down arrow again, and you hear:

Sync button.

Down arrow again, and you hear:

Manage other people clickable.

Don't worry about the clickables. There is a clickable for many things, but then there is the button you enter on right after that.

Down arrow again, and you hear:

Manage other people button.

This is what you would press enter on to set up another user.

Down arrow again, and you hear:

Import bookmarks and settings Clickable:

Down arrow again, and you actually hear

Import bookmarks and settings button.

Here, you press enter and import all of your bookmarks and settings from other Browsers like IE.

This is another way of doing this, because remember,

We had a choice of manage bookmarks in the book marks sub menu in the virticle menu.

There is more than one place to do things in Chrome.

Now, we have a series of headings, that you can just press H for heading, to get to.

Now, we have gotten to the appearance heading. Down arrow and you hear:

themes, which I did nothing with.

Next, you can open the Chrome web store. You can get hundreds of extentions, and more.

Then, you hear Themes button.

Do nothing with this.

Next, you hear:

Show home clickable.

Just skip that.

There are many buttons that say clickable, and then there is a button that you actually press enter on to work with it.

Just work with the buttons, and skip over these vclickables.

Down arrow, and you have an edit box where you can put in your home page you want to get to by pressing Alt+Home.

Next, there is the home button toggle.

Press the spacebar to turn this on or off. If it is on, you can have the home button show at the top of the Chrome Window.

I have it checked.

Now, there are two radio buttons, and I chose the one to enter with a custom web address.

Search Heading:

We are at another heading, where you can set your search Engine.

There is a combo box below, and I set it to Chrome, because I like to have my searches from the address bar done with Crome instead of Bing.

Next heading:

Default Browser.

Here, you can choose weather you want Chrome to be your default browser or not.

Just leave this alone if you do not want Chrome to be your default browser.

Next Important heading:

On Start up.

Here is where you put in your URL that you want to show as soon as you start Chrome.

There are three radio buttons to pick from, but I chose to open with a specific page or pages, which is the third radio button.

Under this, you can type in the URL of the web site that you want to open when you start Chrome.

Under this, there is a link where you can add more pages you want to show when Chrome starts up.

Now, we are up to the search engin heading.

This is a heading.

There are headings on this settings page.

I chose to use Google search engin in the address bar. This is a combo box.

The next heading, is on start up.

Finally, here is where you set up your home page.

There are three radio buttons here.

I chose the third one, to open a selected page or selected pages.

Next, I was able to enter:

www.Google.Com.

That is my home page that will open each time I start Chrome.

Next important group of settings, the advanced settings.

Now, you have to press enter on the advanced settings button before more headings of settings will show.

The Advanced settings are collapsed, so you have to press enter to show more headings of settings.

Now that these advanced settings are open, we get to the next heading of settings.

There is much more we can customize under the advanced settings.

Privacy and security heading:

Down arrow from here, and you hear:

Use a web service to resolve navigation errors.

You have a clickable, and a toggle.

Press spacebar to toggle this on or off.

Again, ignore the clickables.

Now you have:

Use a prodiction service to enable you in searches.

I left this unchecked.

Next, you have a setting to speed up the loading of web pages:

I checked this with spacebar.

The next three settings I just left alone.

I checked the one that says:

Use a web service to help with spelling.

I leave manage certificates alone.

Next, you have content settings, but this is not a new heading.

We are still working with the same heading.

The only thing of interest here, is the clear history button.

This was available in the virtical menu, so don't worry about this.

Now, we get to the next heading of settings.

Passwords and forms:

Under this heading, just make sure that you check to be able to have Chrome save passwords.

Languages Heading:

I did nothing with this.

Downloads heading:

This is where you choose where you want your downloads to be saved on your computer.

Printing heading:

I did nothing with this.

Accessibility heading:

I did nothing with this.

Now, we have the System heading:

Down arrow, and you hear:

Continue running background apps, when Google Chrome is Closed.

I have this unchecked.

Next,

Use hard ware excelloration when Available.

I have this checked.

Next, you hear:

Open proxy settings button.

I left this alone.

Last Heading LOL!

Reset.

Here, you can reset all settings back to their origional.

We are done with Settings.

Now, just press CTRL+F4 to get back to the Freedom Scientific Web site.

This settings web page, opens in another tab.

That is it for settings.

Notice, we made a lot of changes under the advanced settings. You cannot see these, unless you press enter to expand these.

Now, press the Alt key again. Up arrow once to get to the end of the menu where we were with the settings.

You see exit, up arrow and you see the help sub menu, right under the settings choice.

I press right arrow on this help sub menu, and you can enter on the help center to get a lot of help using Chrome.

To open a web site, just press CTRL+L or Alt+D and type the URL.

Chrome for me, is so much quicker with web sites that involve streamming TV and Watching movies, and so on.

For me, Chrome opens large news sites very quickly compared to IE.

Lastly, All JAWS and NVDA navigation key commands work in Chrome. For example, you can press F7 to open a list of links with JAWS, and the elements list with NVDA. All of that is the exact same.

This is the end of the tutorial.

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 

From: Monte Single
Sent: Sunday, May 6, 2018 6:25 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] I've largely changed my mind about Chrome, I like itmuchmore now

 

Hi David,

 

Please post your tutorial again;  especially for those of us who are not always paying attention  to all details.

 

Thanks,

Monte

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of David Moore
Sent: May-06-18 4:21 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] I've largely changed my mind about Chrome, I like it muchmore now

 

Hi all!

I have been telling people just how great Chrome is for two and a half years.

I am so happy that all of you are finding it to be true.

If anyone needs my text tutorial I wrote on how to use Chrome, and take you through all settings, I will paste it on the list.

I have done this around ten times on all the lists, but you are still finding out for the first time, just how great Chrome is.

Just read works great for just reading an article on the page.

CTRL+J allows you to hear the status of the downloads. Now, CTRL+Shift+O allows you to open the bookmarks manager, and you can arrange them in different folders and back them up.

Chrome is great with Youtube, and streaming media. Chrome is good for a lot other than just simple browsing.

Have a great one, and I am celebrating that you are finally getting used to Chrome!

David Moore

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 

From: juan gonzalez
Sent: Sunday, May 6, 2018 5:23 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] I've largely changed my mind about Chrome, I like it muchmore now

 

I use the add on called sound on for navigational sounds.

 

-----Original Message-----

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io

Sent: Sunday, May 6, 2018 9:28 AM

To: nvda@nvda.groups.io

Subject: Re: [nvda] I've largely changed my mind about Chrome, I like it much more now

 

Would anyone know if Chrome has sounds? one of the annoyances with current firefox is figuring out when downloads are finished or when a page is refreshing itself, ie you normally hear the ticks  in the old version due to navigational sounds.

Until i find a browser with this function of sound I'm loathe to get a new browser over ff52, but the problem is that I've been reading that some sites now do not support the old versions of Firefox and tell you so when you have things like modal windows whatever they are.

On XP to make Firefox perform even reasonably you need to use a version 45, as after this the actual load up times are hugely slowed, my guess is that the code is made for multi processor  devices, not single core ones.This is also why on xp you might find that Chrome and firefox are similar in page loading times.

 

Things are no pushing ahead so fast on sites that its not uncommon to see the message you browser is unsupported get this or that then you can come back.

To me this is a weird thing for commercial sites to do, as they are, in effect pushing away potential customers, but hey, that is their business.

Brian

 

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----- Original Message -----

From: "Gene" <gsasner@...>

To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>

Sent: Sunday, May 06, 2018 10:57 AM

Subject: [nvda] I've largely changed my mind about Chrome, I like it much more now

 

 

I may have sent messages in the past in which I expressed a much stronger liking for Firefox than Chrome.  At this point, I've changed my mind and, unless things change over time, as they may as Firefox continues to implement its new internal technical changes, I consider Chrome to be superior for general browsing. I haven't tested it for uses such as streaming or RSS or other uses.  I will therefore only address general browsing and the interface.  Others may want to comment on other aspects I haven't compared.

 

This is a long message, a bit of a review and a bit of discussion of the interface.  I hope those interested in the subject find it useful.

 

If you try Chrome and find it superior for general browsing, you may still not want to use Chrome as your main browser.  There are various considerations.  I'll explain why I changed my mind and what you may want to consider.  You may have other or different considerations as well.

 

The reason I say Chrome is better for general browsing is because it loads pages faster than Firefox.  You may want to compare and see if the difference is important to you.  There is a very noticeable difference.  I hadn't compared Chrome with Firefox for speed on a fast machine.  I compared them on a slow machine running XP perhaps six or eight months ago.  I had expected that, if Chrome was faster, there would have been a noticeable difference, even though the machine was slow.  But there wasn't a difference that amounted to anything.

 

I recently decided to compare on a reasonably fast machine running Windows 7 since many people have said on lists I'm on that Chrome is faster.  There is a very noticeable difference in speed on my Windows 7 machine.  I don't know what the results would have been on a fast XP machine.

 

I haven't used Chrome much but the increase in speed is the reason I say it's better for general browsing.

 

The Chrome interface is different than Firefox or Internet Explorer.  It isn't difficult to learn but it is different.  You will likely want a tutorial or some instructional material.  If you are good at learning by exploring, you may not want or need such material, at least not to use in depth, but you may benefit in early learning by using material.

 

The main things to know in terms of the differences in the interface are that Chrome shows many things as web pages, such as settings and history and there is one menu, which you can open with alt f, that is, hold alt and press f.  Of course, there are submenus and there are also items that open like web pages such as settings.

 

I don't recall if there are classic dialogs that open from the main menu.

But if you work with settings, you need to know that the settings interface doesn't work quite properly in the following way:

It's a web page-like interface but there some controls that don't work as they should.  I tried to activate two buttons today and I couldn't do so in browse mode using NVDA.  I don't know what JAWS does.  I had to manually go into forms mode, and activate the buttons.  I may have had to tab to the button because forms mode may not have been properly calibrated with browse mode in that interface, at least at times.

 

I seem to recall that in another instance, I needed to be in browse mode to activate something but I'd have to experiment more to know if that is the case since I don't have a clear memory of whether that was necessary.

 

There's a very useful settings search feature in settings.

 

One of my main objections to Chrome in the past was that the book marks interface is not nearly as comvenient to work with as Firefox because the search feature in Chrome book marks appears to be inaccessible.  I very recently learned from someone on a list I follow that this problem can be more or less eliminated.  I say more or less because I haven't played with it much, but enough to see that it works well or reasonably well.  I'm hedging because I'd want to play with it more before saying just how well it works.  It' appears to work well from the very little testing I've done.  If you are in the address bar, you can type some or all of what you want to find such as york times or new york times and you can up and down arrow through results.  Some of them will be search results using a search engine but the top results in the list should be from book marks and history.  Try reading the current line after typing to see if that contains the first result.  I haven't played with the feature more than a little and I'm not sure.  But if it works well, this would eliminate what I consider to be an important deficiency. In other words, this feature may make book marks just as easy to use in Chrome as in Firefox.

 

If you use Firefox extensions that you consider important and use them a lot, that may be a consideration in which browser you want to use.  and then, there's just convenience of not learning a new interface and continuing to use the familiar Firefox.  You, of course, can determine questions like that.  It's nice to have pages load a good deal faster, but the importance of speed may vary from user to user.  But if you haven't compared with a hands on test, you may wish to.

 

Browsing is either identical or nearly identical between the browsers because they both use browse mode, or the Virtual PC cursor, which is the JAWS name for the same thing.

 

So you can compare by installing Chrome, and then opening and using some web sites.  Control l moves you to the address bar, just as in Firefox.  I believe when you open Chrome, you are automatically placed on the address bar, but you can check.  If you want to make sure, it takes almost no time to execute control l.

 

I hope those who are interested in this subject find these comments useful.

If people are curious or dissatisfied with Firefox or another browser, they may want to try Chrome.  I haven't used Edge at all so I don't know how Edge compares.

 

Gene

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

-- 
Rich De Steno

 

 


Re: facebook and edge

Gene New Zealand <hurrikennyandopo@...>
 

Hi david


Just logged into the mobile version of face book it has certainly changed. it is more like the full version now. it is still in a web page type of setup. Where you can jump around with headings, links and buttons etc with single letter navigation keys  they still have the shortcut keys there to jump around the website. it took me a little time to find the log out part otherwise i would still be in there now.


I jumped around a few sections just to see the setup and can not recall having to go into focus mode and browse mode as much as you would do in the main one to see the extra parts of face book it seems to be more fluent.




Gene nz

On 5/11/2018 10:46 AM, David Moore wrote:

Thanks a lot, Gene!

I am really liking the experience the more I use it. The mobile site in Edge has more you can do with Facebook, than IE offers with the same mobile site. Thanks, Gene!

Talk soon!

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 

From: Gene New Zealand
Sent: Thursday, May 10, 2018 4:15 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] facebook and edge

 

Hi David

 

The last time i used it it was very easy and much like a web page if i remember right. It is much more stripped down than the main site. If i remember right there was a audio tutorial on the main face book with written material and on the end of the audio one was a look at the mobile version.  It would be good if you can write one then share it with the community.

 

Gene nz

 

 

On 5/11/2018 1:39 AM, David Moore wrote:

Hi!

I am just starting to use the Mobile site of Facebook in Edge with latest NVDA and latest Windows 10 1803 as well.

I will do a tutorial once I figure everything out, and I am sure that it is better to use it on Edge than it is on IE. So far, I like it better. I am trying it in Chrome as well.

I will let you know how it goes with me using Edge, and I will then do a tutorial for using mobile Facebook in Edge!

David Moore

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 

From: Gary Metzler
Sent: Thursday, May 10, 2018 5:24 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] facebook and edge

 

Hi All,

 

Is there a tutorial for using the mobile facebook site and edge?  I am using the latest nvda and win10.  Thanks for any help.

 

Regards, Gary kn4ox

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