Date   

Re: updating to the latest snap, but still waiting for the update to finish

Brian's Mail list account <bglists@...>
 

Well I just updated to the latest master and it failed to restart. the error screen one could not read said it could not write to the log file and it thus stayed shut down. A manual start started it. I did look at the old log and noted that it was still dealing with attempting to delete old bits of files when it was asked to shut down, watchdog stopped then it all stopped with only the old error of multiple whatever they are then silence. I suspect as I said in the original ticket for this. its so busy processing locked files that when it comes to rename nvda.log to nvda.old.log it fails and hence does not create it and just gives up writing a log in the program files called nvda.exe.log which is the lack of ability to write to the log that it should have started as a new log but in fact is still locked in a queue waiting for windows to catch up and rename the old one!
Clear as mud? Well the good news is an easc and a restart of nvda is all it needes. Windowa 7 in this case.
Brian

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----- Original Message -----
From: "Chris Mullins" <cjmullins29@gmail.com>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Thursday, December 07, 2017 11:59 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] updating to the latest snap, but still waiting for the update to finish


Hi
I had this with the 2017.4 release and it turned out to be a UAC window in
the background waiting for permission to allow the install.

Cheers
Chris

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Sarah k
Alawami
Sent: 7 December 2017 05:56
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] updating to the latest snap, but still waiting for the
update to finish

I think I have a very broken nvda update. I followed the directions. The
update downloaded, however I still hear the beeps saying it's updating etc
et etc. I tried to close out but no joy. Narrator is not telling me much
either. Running nvda latest snap on windows 10 pro..

Take care all.




Re: odd behavoior with NVDA

Gene
 

The description of the problem is that NVDA will become staticy. That isn't expected behavior from background processes such as antivirus scans.  Also, this clearly didn't happen before the update.  What is implied by the context of the question is that this is a new behavior that wasn't experienced before with NVDA.  That Implies a problem that, if more people report it, may be a bug.
 
Gene 

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Thursday, December 07, 2017 9:52 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] odd behavoior with NVDA

What application?I've noticed this a bit, but its not something that has
changed. I'd always assumed background anti virus scans etc.
 If you are finding that you are losing just the voice and you are using
espeak then temproraly use another synth to see if it continuees, in the
mean time more details of haw when and in what is really needed.
 Brian

bglists@...
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----- Original Message -----
From: "Jessica D" <jldail13@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Thursday, December 07, 2017 2:54 PM
Subject: [nvda] odd behavoior with NVDA


Hi,
After installing NVDA 2017.4 last night, I’m experiencing odd behavior.

NVDA will become staticy while typing.
What can I do?



Sent from Mail for Windows 10





Re: IMPORTANT COMMUNITY DIRECTIVE: to use NVDA 2017.4, Windows 7 SP1 or later is absolutely required

 

i am completely against any update, no different if updates are for
softwares or operating system!
i only use anything that i need!

On 12/7/17, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io
<bglists=blueyonder.co.uk@groups.io> wrote:
Not necessarily, many of the ones that could have been pirates have allowed

windows 10 on them, so I think this ias a pink herring. Its more likely they

just turned them off then forgot. Also some of those machines tend to be
second user hand me downs so they are probably unaware the updates had been

turned off. You only tend to open the bonnet when things stop working!

Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk, putting 'Brian Gaff'
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----- Original Message -----
From: "Ron Canazzi" <aa2vm@roadrunner.com>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Thursday, December 07, 2017 2:33 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] IMPORTANT COMMUNITY DIRECTIVE: to use NVDA 2017.4,
Windows 7 SP1 or later is absolutely required


I wonder if those who have such systems have pirate copies of Windows and
have turned off auto update.



On 12/7/2017 4:58 AM, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io wrote:
Could I ask how people could end up without sp1, as I seem to recall from

friends that this update some years back now was pushed automatically to

existing systems and its not just nvda which relies on it either.

Also now, how would a user get it and install it, is it relatively simple

on the Microsoft site or would you suggest going the whole way and going

to 10 before 31st Dec while a free update is there. I'm assuming that the

old version of 7 will still allow the update.
Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk, putting 'Brian Gaff'
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----- Original Message ----- From: "Joseph Lee"
<joseph.lee22590@gmail.com>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Wednesday, December 06, 2017 6:18 PM
Subject: [nvda] IMPORTANT COMMUNITY DIRECTIVE: to use NVDA 2017.4,
Windows 7 SP1 or later is absolutely required


Dear NVDA community,



It was brought to developers' attention that some people were having
issues
upgrading to NVDA 2017.4, and turns out some were using Windows 7 RTM
build.
Thus the following community directive:



In order to use NVDA 2017.4 or later, Windows 7 Service Pack 1 or later

is
ABSOLUTELY required.



To find out which Windows release you've got:



1. Press Windows key to open Start menu.
2. Type "winver" without quotes and press Enter.
3. Check the build shown on About Windows dialog.



If the build number is 7601 or higher, you're all set. If it is lower
than
that:



* If using Windows 7 RTM (build number is 7600), please use NVDA
2017.3, upgrade to Windows 7 SP1 first, then update to NVDA 2017.4.
* If using versions other than 7 (build number is less than 7600),
then NVDA 2017.3 is the last supported version for you.



In the next few weeks, some add-on authors will announce minimum
supported
versions of NVDA and Windows. For example, if you are using
StationPlaylist
Studio add-on, starting from version 17.12 stable, Windows 7 SP1 or
higher
is absolutely required.



Thank you.

Cheers,

Joseph



--
They Ask Me If I'm Happy; I say Yes.
They ask: "How Happy are You?"
I Say: "I'm as happy as a stow away chimpanzee on a banana boat!"







--
we have not sent you but as a mercy to the entire creation.
holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
in the very authentic narration from prophet Mohammad is:
indeed, imam husayn is the beacon of guidance and the ark of salvation.
best website for studying islamic book in different languages
www.al-islam.org


Re: links on single line

 

hi gene.
i am completely agree with you.
while i use internet for more than 3years, i did not learn screen
layout and i only use simple layout.
whats the advantages of screen layout realy?

On 12/7/17, Gene <gsasner@ripco.com> wrote:
There are times when it is beneficial to use the arrow keys. There are
times when there are small amounts of text between links and you will miss
them moving in all the ways you mention. And there are times when there are
two or three sentences between a lot of links such as on many newspaper
sites. When I look at the top news links on The New York Times page, I
often let use read to end to hear for part of that section to hear the link,
the headline, and the few senteences of text about the story that follow the
link.
At times, moving in other ways shows you convenient ways to find things that
you would miss otherwise. On the New York Times home page, there is a
button that says all. Links and text for the most important stories are
under this all button. If you only move by link, you won't know this. I
don't recall now how I found this button as the very convenient and reliable
landmark that it is, but it wasn't by moving just by links.

Also, an important reason I said that preserve screen layout shouldn't be on
by default is for new or inexperienced Internet users. I don't want a new
or inexperienced user to worry about moving by line or tabbing or in some
other way while moving through links. I want the new or inexperienced user
to have as much uniformity as possible. Defaults are not set for
experienced users. If they were, no screen-reader would have their speech
set nearly as slowly as it is. Why is this rule not followed with the
screen layout setting?

Also, I'm quite sure I saw a similar setting choice in JAWS. I don't recall
if I checked in Window-eyes.
Gene
----- Original Message -----

From: Chris
Sent: Thursday, December 07, 2017 8:52 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] links on single line


I am with you clare, 100% 😃





From: Clare Page
Sent: 07 December 2017 14:02
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] links on single line



Hi!

I always keep Preserve Screen layout on, not because I have sighted people
looking at my screen, but because I don’t see any need to move between links
with up and down arrows, when that can easily be done with the Tab key or
the quick navigation keys k and shift+k, or even using links in the
elements list.

Throughout my ten years of using JAWS there was no choice in the matter,
there was no toggle, but with NVDA I’m glad we have a choice, between what
seems to me to be a more accurate view of the website and one which is
simply there because other screenreaders have it, so many blind people feel
it is normal or convenient.

It’s possible that my view is a minority one in the blind community, but
maybe I’m not the only one who finds nothing wrong with preserving screen
layout in web browsers. That’s why I like the toggle in NVDA: those who want
to arrow through links still have that option, but we’re not stuck with one
or the other;

Bye for now!

From Clare



From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Mary
Otten
Sent: jeudi 7 décembre 2017 01:50
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] links on single line



This brings up the question of why preserving screen layout is a good idea.
I mean, maybe that has to do with working with sighted colleagues? But if
that's the only reason, then I'm definitely turning it off as of little to
no use.



Mary



On 12/6/2017 4:43 PM, Gene wrote:

Just one more example of why having links read each link on a separate
line should be the default, as I said two or three days ago. The feature is
in browse mode settings. It's a check box that says use screen layout, if
supported. Uncheck this box and activate the ok button.



Gene

----- Original Message -----

From: Don H

Sent: Wednesday, December 06, 2017 6:25 PM

To: nvda@nvda.groups.io

Subject: [nvda] links on single line



I am running NVDA 2017-4 on a Win 10 64 bit machine. I have a web site
where there are multiple links on a single line thus NVDA reads them
together. If my memory is right there is a way to get NVDA to read this
multi link lines as if each link was separate. Looked everywhere but
can't find it.
Thanks a








--
we have not sent you but as a mercy to the entire creation.
holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
in the very authentic narration from prophet Mohammad is:
indeed, imam husayn is the beacon of guidance and the ark of salvation.
best website for studying islamic book in different languages
www.al-islam.org


Re: IMPORTANT COMMUNITY DIRECTIVE: to use NVDA 2017.4, Windows 7 SP1 or later is absolutely required

Brian's Mail list account <bglists@...>
 

Not necessarily, many of the ones that could have been pirates have allowed windows 10 on them, so I think this ias a pink herring. Its more likely they just turned them off then forgot. Also some of those machines tend to be second user hand me downs so they are probably unaware the updates had been turned off. You only tend to open the bonnet when things stop working!

Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk, putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Ron Canazzi" <aa2vm@roadrunner.com>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Thursday, December 07, 2017 2:33 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] IMPORTANT COMMUNITY DIRECTIVE: to use NVDA 2017.4, Windows 7 SP1 or later is absolutely required


I wonder if those who have such systems have pirate copies of Windows and have turned off auto update.



On 12/7/2017 4:58 AM, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io wrote:
Could I ask how people could end up without sp1, as I seem to recall from friends that this update some years back now was pushed automatically to existing systems and its not just nvda which relies on it either.

Also now, how would a user get it and install it, is it relatively simple on the Microsoft site or would you suggest going the whole way and going to 10 before 31st Dec while a free update is there. I'm assuming that the old version of 7 will still allow the update.
Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk, putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Joseph Lee" <joseph.lee22590@gmail.com>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Wednesday, December 06, 2017 6:18 PM
Subject: [nvda] IMPORTANT COMMUNITY DIRECTIVE: to use NVDA 2017.4, Windows 7 SP1 or later is absolutely required


Dear NVDA community,



It was brought to developers' attention that some people were having issues
upgrading to NVDA 2017.4, and turns out some were using Windows 7 RTM build.
Thus the following community directive:



In order to use NVDA 2017.4 or later, Windows 7 Service Pack 1 or later is
ABSOLUTELY required.



To find out which Windows release you've got:



1. Press Windows key to open Start menu.
2. Type "winver" without quotes and press Enter.
3. Check the build shown on About Windows dialog.



If the build number is 7601 or higher, you're all set. If it is lower than
that:



* If using Windows 7 RTM (build number is 7600), please use NVDA
2017.3, upgrade to Windows 7 SP1 first, then update to NVDA 2017.4.
* If using versions other than 7 (build number is less than 7600),
then NVDA 2017.3 is the last supported version for you.



In the next few weeks, some add-on authors will announce minimum supported
versions of NVDA and Windows. For example, if you are using StationPlaylist
Studio add-on, starting from version 17.12 stable, Windows 7 SP1 or higher
is absolutely required.



Thank you.

Cheers,

Joseph



--
They Ask Me If I'm Happy; I say Yes.
They ask: "How Happy are You?"
I Say: "I'm as happy as a stow away chimpanzee on a banana boat!"



Re: odd behavoior with NVDA

Brian's Mail list account <bglists@...>
 

What application?I've noticed this a bit, but its not something that has changed. I'd always assumed background anti virus scans etc.
If you are finding that you are losing just the voice and you are using espeak then temproraly use another synth to see if it continuees, in the mean time more details of haw when and in what is really needed.
Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk, putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Jessica D" <jldail13@gmail.com>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Thursday, December 07, 2017 2:54 PM
Subject: [nvda] odd behavoior with NVDA


Hi,
After installing NVDA 2017.4 last night, I’m experiencing odd behavior.

NVDA will become staticy while typing.
What can I do?



Sent from Mail for Windows 10


Re: links on single line

Gene
 

There are times when it is beneficial to use the arrow keys.  There are times when there are small amounts of text between links and you will miss them moving in all the ways you mention.  And there are times when there are two or three sentences between a lot of links such as on many newspaper sites.  When I look at the top news links on The New York Times page, I often let use read to end to hear for part of that section to hear the link, the headline, and the few senteences of text about the story that follow the link. 
At times, moving in other ways shows you convenient ways to find things that you would miss otherwise.  On the New York Times home page, there is a button that says all.  Links and text for the most important stories are under this all button.  If you only move by link, you won't know this.  I don't recall now how I found this button as the very convenient and reliable landmark that it is, but it wasn't by moving just by links. 
 
Also, an important reason I said that preserve screen layout shouldn't be on by default is for new or inexperienced Internet users.  I don't want a new or inexperienced user to worry about moving by line or tabbing or in some other way while moving through links.  I want the new or inexperienced user to have as much uniformity as possible.  Defaults are not set for experienced users.  If they were, no screen-reader would have their speech set nearly as slowly as it is.  Why is this rule not followed with the screen layout setting? 
 
Also, I'm quite sure I saw a similar setting choice in JAWS.  I don't recall if I checked in Window-eyes. 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
From: Chris
Sent: Thursday, December 07, 2017 8:52 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] links on single line

I am with you clare, 100% 😃

 

 

From: Clare Page
Sent: 07 December 2017 14:02
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] links on single line

 

Hi!

I always keep Preserve Screen layout on, not because I have sighted people looking at my screen, but because I don’t see any need to move between links with up and down arrows, when that can easily be done with the Tab key or the quick navigation keys k and shift+k, or even using links in the  elements list.

Throughout my ten years of using JAWS there was no choice in the matter, there was no toggle, but with NVDA I’m glad we have a choice, between what seems to me to be a more accurate view of the website and one which is simply there because other screenreaders have it, so many blind people feel it is normal or convenient.

It’s possible that my view is a minority one in the blind community, but maybe I’m not the only one who finds nothing wrong with preserving screen layout in web browsers. That’s why I like the toggle in NVDA: those who want to arrow through links still have that option, but we’re not stuck with one or the other;

Bye for now!

From Clare

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Mary Otten
Sent: jeudi 7 décembre 2017 01:50
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] links on single line

 

This brings up the question of why preserving screen layout is a good idea. I mean, maybe that has to do with working with sighted colleagues? But if that's the only reason, then I'm definitely turning it off as of little to no use.

 

Mary

 

On 12/6/2017 4:43 PM, Gene wrote:

Just one more example of why having links read each link on a separate line should be the default, as I said two or three days ago.  The feature is in browse mode settings.  It's a check box that says use screen layout, if supported.  Uncheck this box and activate the ok button.

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

From: Don H

Sent: Wednesday, December 06, 2017 6:25 PM

Subject: [nvda] links on single line

 

I am running NVDA 2017-4 on a Win 10 64 bit machine.  I have a web site
where there are multiple links on a single line thus NVDA reads them
together.  If my memory is right there is a way to get NVDA to read this
multi link lines as if each link was separate.  Looked everywhere but
can't find it.
Thanks a

 

 


Re: IMPORTANT COMMUNITY DIRECTIVE: to use NVDA 2017.4, Windows 7 SP1 or later is absolutely required

Brian's Mail list account <bglists@...>
 

In windows 7 though you have the opportunity to allow them to download and then only install them when yyou want to. In this case I'd always allow service packs as otherwise you are taking a chance on vulnerabilities not being patched.
Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk, putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Gene" <gsasner@ripco.com>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Thursday, December 07, 2017 3:33 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] IMPORTANT COMMUNITY DIRECTIVE: to use NVDA 2017.4, Windows 7 SP1 or later is absolutely required


Many people turn off automatic updates who have legitimate copies of Windows. They want control over what updates they receive.

Gene
----- Original Message -----

From: Ron Canazzi
Sent: Thursday, December 07, 2017 8:33 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] IMPORTANT COMMUNITY DIRECTIVE: to use NVDA 2017.4, Windows 7 SP1 or later is absolutely required


I wonder if those who have such systems have pirate copies of Windows
and have turned off auto update.



On 12/7/2017 4:58 AM, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io wrote:
Could I ask how people could end up without sp1, as I seem to recall
from friends that this update some years back now was pushed
automatically to existing systems and its not just nvda which relies
on it either.

Also now, how would a user get it and install it, is it relatively
simple on the Microsoft site or would you suggest going the whole way
and going to 10 before 31st Dec while a free update is there. I'm
assuming that the old version of 7 will still allow the update.
Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk, putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Joseph Lee"
<joseph.lee22590@gmail.com>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Wednesday, December 06, 2017 6:18 PM
Subject: [nvda] IMPORTANT COMMUNITY DIRECTIVE: to use NVDA 2017.4,
Windows 7 SP1 or later is absolutely required


Dear NVDA community,



It was brought to developers' attention that some people were having
issues
upgrading to NVDA 2017.4, and turns out some were using Windows 7 RTM
build.
Thus the following community directive:



In order to use NVDA 2017.4 or later, Windows 7 Service Pack 1 or
later is
ABSOLUTELY required.



To find out which Windows release you've got:



1. Press Windows key to open Start menu.
2. Type "winver" without quotes and press Enter.
3. Check the build shown on About Windows dialog.



If the build number is 7601 or higher, you're all set. If it is lower
than
that:



* If using Windows 7 RTM (build number is 7600), please use NVDA
2017.3, upgrade to Windows 7 SP1 first, then update to NVDA 2017.4.
* If using versions other than 7 (build number is less than 7600),
then NVDA 2017.3 is the last supported version for you.



In the next few weeks, some add-on authors will announce minimum
supported
versions of NVDA and Windows. For example, if you are using
StationPlaylist
Studio add-on, starting from version 17.12 stable, Windows 7 SP1 or
higher
is absolutely required.



Thank you.

Cheers,

Joseph




--
They Ask Me If I'm Happy; I say Yes.
They ask: "How Happy are You?"
I Say: "I'm as happy as a stow away chimpanzee on a banana boat!"


Re: Button labeling question

Peter Beasley
 

No there isn’t.
 

Sent: Thursday, December 07, 2017 3:23 PM
Subject: [nvda] Button labeling question
 

Hi all,

 

                I am wondering if there is a hotkey command or process for labeling buttons using NVDA. Have been hunting about in the manual and Google, but so far no joy. Any wisdom? Thanks.

 

George McDermith

Adaptive Technology Specialist

Phone:  303-866-4999

 

2211 West Evans Avenue Bldg A

Denver, CO  80223

Please click here to tell us how we’re doing.

 


Re: JAWS User Looking for Guidance in Getting Started with NVDA.

Gene
 

There is no setting to use the equivalent of the JAWS cursor with standard movement keys such as up and down arrow.  There is an equivalent to the JAWS cursor, screen review and you navigate mostly using the numpad in that mode.  It's somewhat similar to Window-eyes in that you can still use the arrow keys on the main keyboard and the main navigation commands for screen review are on the numpad.  This is for the desktop layout.  I don't know what the navigation commands are for the laptop layout. 
 
After using screen review, you should return to object navigation.  If you do, certain review commands you may want to use won't work correctly. For example I don't like using the read current line command NVDA uses.  I use numpad 8 which reads the current object, which acts the same as read current line.
 
Gene 

----- Original Message -----
From: JM Casey
Sent: Thursday, December 07, 2017 8:51 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] JAWS User Looking for Guidance in Getting Started with NVDA.

I started using NVDA recently, and I really was surprised at how similar the default keyboard layout is to that of JAWS. I’m sure this wasn’t done by accident. The only thing is, that navigation and focus does work a little differently. And of ourse, ther’es no “JAWS cursor”, but that particular JFW feature is growing less and less useful as times goes on (though I still use it a fair bit in certain older applications that don’t have screen-reader support built in or any add-ons).

 

NVDA’s web support is great, and while I happen to only have Office 2010 on this Windows 10 machine, Outlook and Word both function pretty much as well as they do with JFW. Others have reported issues with office 2016/365, but, well, this isn’t unique to nVDA users so far as I can tell.

 

 

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Kenny
Sent: December 7, 2017 8:06 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] JAWS User Looking for Guidance in Getting Started with NVDA.

 

Yes the reading navigation keys.

I've been using JAWS for 20+ years. It's like my fingers have a mind of their own. Will be very difficult to change my habits from wanting to use the numpad keys for navigation.

Will definitely take some time.

At 11:27 PM 12/6/2017, you wrote:


Hi


Do you mean by keyboard navigation the usual?


Like using the arrow keys tab etc etc.


You would find it quite easy to pick up.


Depending if you install nvda to your pc you will have the choice of the desktop layout or a lap top layout for your keyboard.


If you install nvda to your pc it is the alt key + ctrl key + letter N to start nvda.

To get into your preferences is the nvda key + the letter N

To quit your copy of nvda is the nvda key + the letter Q


Where i refer to the nvda key this is a modifier key and can be the insert key the extended insert key or the caps lock key. You would use one of the with a key to turn off nvda. for example if the insert key is chosen you would use the insert key + letter Q to turn off nvda.


NVDA comes default with the e speak synth but you can use other free or paid synths.


The synth you are talking about is a commercial one and can come as a add on or a sapi 5 version  at a cost.


There are keys combo that are simular to jaws and plus you can change them if needed.

The following link may help you to answer some of your questions at https://github.com/nvaccess/nvda-community/wiki/FAQ

Gene nz




On 12/7/2017 3:41 PM, Kenny wrote:

Hello,

I'm a current user of the latest build of JAWS 2018. Using Eloquence as my software synth.

Well the time has come that I can no longer afford to pay the Freedom Scientific SMA JAWS upgrades (Been using JAWS for over 20 years), so I'm turning to NVDA.

My first two questions:

Does NVDA use a keyboard navigation system similar to JAWS? If not, is there a way I can configure it to work this way?

Also can I configure NVDA to use the Eloquence module currently installed on my PC (Thanks to JAWS?) If not, is there a NVDA software synth available that's just as good to use?

Thanks for any help.



--
 
Check out my website for NVDA tutorials and other blindness related material at http://www.accessibilitycentral.net Regardless of where you are in New Zealand if you are near one of the APNK sites you can use a copy of the NVDA screen reader on one of their computers. To find out which locations (or location) is near to you please visit http://www.aotearoapeoplesnetwork.org/content/partner-libraries (Aotearoa People's Network Kaharoa). To find an NVDA certified expert near you, please visit the following link https://certification.nvaccess.org/. The certification page contains the official list of NVDA certified individuals from around the world, who have sat and successfully passed the NVDA expert exam.


Re: IMPORTANT COMMUNITY DIRECTIVE: to use NVDA 2017.4, Windows 7 SP1 or later is absolutely required

Gene
 

Many people turn off automatic updates who have legitimate copies of Windows.  They want control over what updates they receive. 
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Thursday, December 07, 2017 8:33 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] IMPORTANT COMMUNITY DIRECTIVE: to use NVDA 2017.4, Windows 7 SP1 or later is absolutely required

I wonder if those who have such systems have pirate copies of Windows
and have turned off auto update.



On 12/7/2017 4:58 AM, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io wrote:
> Could I ask how people could end up without sp1, as I seem to recall
> from friends that this update some years back now was pushed
> automatically to existing systems and its not just nvda which relies
> on it either.
>
> Also now, how would a user get it and install it, is it relatively
> simple on the Microsoft site or would you suggest going the whole way
> and going to 10 before 31st Dec while a free update is there. I'm
> assuming that the old version of 7 will still allow the update.
> Brian
>
> bglists@...
> Sent via blueyonder.
> Please address personal email to:-
> briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
> in the display name field.
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Joseph Lee"
> <joseph.lee22590@...>
> To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
> Sent: Wednesday, December 06, 2017 6:18 PM
> Subject: [nvda] IMPORTANT COMMUNITY DIRECTIVE: to use NVDA 2017.4,
> Windows 7 SP1 or later is absolutely required
>
>
>> Dear NVDA community,
>>
>>
>>
>> It was brought to developers' attention that some people were having
>> issues
>> upgrading to NVDA 2017.4, and turns out some were using Windows 7 RTM
>> build.
>> Thus the following community directive:
>>
>>
>>
>> In order to use NVDA 2017.4 or later, Windows 7 Service Pack 1 or
>> later is
>> ABSOLUTELY required.
>>
>>
>>
>> To find out which Windows release you've got:
>>
>>
>>
>> 1. Press Windows key to open Start menu.
>> 2. Type "winver" without quotes and press Enter.
>> 3. Check the build shown on About Windows dialog.
>>
>>
>>
>> If the build number is 7601 or higher, you're all set. If it is lower
>> than
>> that:
>>
>>
>>
>> * If using Windows 7 RTM (build number is 7600), please use NVDA
>> 2017.3, upgrade to Windows 7 SP1 first, then update to NVDA 2017.4.
>> * If using versions other than 7 (build number is less than 7600),
>> then NVDA 2017.3 is the last supported version for you.
>>
>>
>>
>> In the next few weeks, some add-on authors will announce minimum
>> supported
>> versions of NVDA and Windows. For example, if you are using
>> StationPlaylist
>> Studio add-on, starting from version 17.12 stable, Windows 7 SP1 or
>> higher
>> is absolutely required.
>>
>>
>>
>> Thank you.
>>
>> Cheers,
>>
>> Joseph
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>

--
They Ask Me If I'm Happy; I say Yes.
They ask: "How Happy are You?"
I Say: "I'm as happy as a stow away chimpanzee on a banana boat!"




Re: Chrome

Sally Kiebdaj
 

Glad it helped! I find having that screen reader a keystroke away is sometimes helpful for providing a different take on a webpage or control that seems funny.


Cheers,
Sally

On 12/7/2017 8:20 AM, David Griffith wrote:

Many thanks for this.

It is probably my hearing but when I tried to look up this command  through keyboard help it seemed to say  Chrome Vox plus a plus o.

This obviously did not work.

However Chrome vox plus a plus a does do the trick nicely.

 

 

My Blind Access and Guide dog Blog
http://dgriffithblog.wordpress.com/
My Blind hammer Blog
https://www.westhamtillidie.com/authors/blind-hammer/posts

 

From: Sally Kiebdaj
Sent: 06 December 2017 20:50
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Chrome

 

In Windows and Mac OSX systems running chrome and the chromevox extension, the hotkey for disabling chromevox is Chromevox+a+a where the Chromevox keys are the modifiers that precede all commands for that extension.

 

On windows the default Chromevox keys are alt+shift.

 

Hence, to disable Chromevox extension you would press alt+shift+a+a.

 

The same keystrokes will reenable Chromevox.

 

If this is not what you were looking for, please let me know.

 

Thank you,

Sally

 

On 12/6/2017 1:34 PM, David Griffith wrote:

If this is possible via a key toggle I too would dearly  like to know.

As far as I can tell the key toggle only exists  on chrome OS for some reason and you have to< I thinkg  go into chrome tools  and extensions menu and from there disable chrome Vox from there.

I really hope that somebody tells me that I am wrong however.

David Griffith

My Blind Access and Guide dog Blog
http://dgriffithblog.wordpress.com/
My Blind hammer Blog
https://www.westhamtillidie.com/authors/blind-hammer/posts

 

From: Rayn Darren
Sent: 06 December 2017 00:52
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] Chrome

 

Hi group,

 

Forgive me if this has been asked already, but how do I turn the voice off for chrome? It’s interfering with NVDA and causing me no end of trouble.

 

Thanks,

Rayn

 

Virus-free. www.avast.com

 

 

 



Re: JAWS User Looking for Guidance in Getting Started with NVDA.

Martin O'Sullivan
 

you can try out the following free training course.

Learn NVDA:  http://www.afb.org/info/living-with-vision-loss/using-technology/assistive-technology-videos/learn-nvda/1234
There are also training courses here. http://www.nvaccess.org/shop/
And there is a book  Windows Screen Reader Keystroke Compendium: Covering JAWS, NVDA, and Narrator (SCREEN) http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/SCREEN.html
SwitchingFromJawsToNVDA https://github.com/nvaccess/nvda-community/wiki/SwitchingFromJawsToNVDA
NVDA Frequently Asked Questions(FAQ) https://github.com/nvaccess/nvda-community/wiki/FAQ
Hope this helps.


Design Help, Please

tonea.ctr.morrow@...
 

Hello,

 

I’m in the United States, Central time, so it just turned 8 a.m. I’ll be available until 3 p.m.

 

My problem is this, I design help files that accompany software. I want to make sure what I design is readable to screen readers.

 

Having no sensory input problems, I designed the help system for such as myself. Many pages of the help system have a copy of the home screen at the top. It has hot hyperlinks over the image. Thus the viewer can see a typical home screen and select the text or button with which they want help. This enables them to quickly jump to that help page.

 

Now I’m going back and making these things friendly to screen readers. I know they read alt text, which means I need to break apart the image and reassemble it so each text area (which has a hyperlink on top) has its own alt text.

 

Not knowing how screen readers work, is that the best method? I need something that will work with the most common screen readers. If they read hyperlink text, does breaking the image apart just create more reading? Am I cluttering the audible page with this approach? Or, should I have my hyperlinks have their own tooltips? The maker of the software I use, Help and Manual, has made the offer:

 

Begin Quote: It's important to remember that every graphic can only have one tooltip. You can add additional tooltips with hotspot links, but they currently only have the tip in a title= attribute, not in an alt= attribute (let us know if screen readers need that as well and we'll add it). However, if you add hotspot tooltips the hotspots are not really part of the image. They are in a special "image map" that positions their clickable areas over the image. If you are going to use hotspots to implement multiple tooltips in a single graphic it would be important to test it out with current screen readers first to see how they handle them -- they would need to read the image maps in the "correct" order and respond accordingly.

 

--Tim Green, Monday, November 27, 2017, 5:29 p.m. End Quote

 

So, H&M is willing to add alt=attribute support, if it will help the screen readers process an image map better than a tiled image.

 

I thought I’d ask experts, since I don’t know. What do you think?

 

Tonea Morrow

 

Tonea Morrow

Technical Writer

MCSG/SAIC | Desk: 405-954-7152

MMAC: Base Maintenance Building 15

Enterprise Services Center (ESC)

6500 S. MacArthur Blvd, OKC, OK  73169

tonea.ctr.morrow@... | www.esc.gov

Availability (appointments outside these)

Mo

7a – 5 p

If I take a lunch, I’ll be here later. If I take a kid to a doctor, I’ll be here later on Friday.

Tu

7:30 a – 3:30p

We

7:30 a – 3p

Th

7:30 a – 3:30p

Fr

7:30 a – 2p

 

 


Re: links on single line

Mary Otten
 

The toggle is great.  But I agree with Gene that the default should be set tnot to preserve screen layout For people coming from other screen readers, that is just one more thing to get use to. And after you've been using enough different systems over the course of 2 or 3 decades, lessening the cognitive load in the betinning is a big deal imho.


On 12/7/2017 6:02 AM, Clare Page wrote:

Hi!

I always keep Preserve Screen layout on, not because I have sighted people looking at my screen, but because I don’t see any need to move between links with up and down arrows, when that can easily be done with the Tab key or the quick navigation keys k and shift+k, or even using links in the  elements list.

Throughout my ten years of using JAWS there was no choice in the matter, there was no toggle, but with NVDA I’m glad we have a choice, between what seems to me to be a more accurate view of the website and one which is simply there because other screenreaders have it, so many blind people feel it is normal or convenient.

It’s possible that my view is a minority one in the blind community, but maybe I’m not the only one who finds nothing wrong with preserving screen layout in web browsers. That’s why I like the toggle in NVDA: those who want to arrow through links still have that option, but we’re not stuck with one or the other;

Bye for now!

From Clare

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Mary Otten
Sent: jeudi 7 décembre 2017 01:50
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] links on single line

 

This brings up the question of why preserving screen layout is a good idea. I mean, maybe that has to do with working with sighted colleagues? But if that's the only reason, then I'm definitely turning it off as of little to no use.

 

Mary

 

On 12/6/2017 4:43 PM, Gene wrote:

Just one more example of why having links read each link on a separate line should be the default, as I said two or three days ago.  The feature is in browse mode settings.  It's a check box that says use screen layout, if supported.  Uncheck this box and activate the ok button.

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

From: Don H

Sent: Wednesday, December 06, 2017 6:25 PM

Subject: [nvda] links on single line

 

I am running NVDA 2017-4 on a Win 10 64 bit machine.  I have a web site
where there are multiple links on a single line thus NVDA reads them
together.  If my memory is right there is a way to get NVDA to read this
multi link lines as if each link was separate.  Looked everywhere but
can't find it.
Thanks a


 



Button labeling question

George McDermith - CDLE
 

Hi all,

 

                I am wondering if there is a hotkey command or process for labeling buttons using NVDA. Have been hunting about in the manual and Google, but so far no joy. Any wisdom? Thanks.

 

George McDermith

Adaptive Technology Specialist

Phone:  303-866-4999

 

2211 West Evans Avenue Bldg A

Denver, CO  80223

Please click here to tell us how we’re doing.

 


Re: JAWS User Looking for Guidance in Getting Started with NVDA.

JM Casey <crystallogic@...>
 

Hi.
The NVDA documentation (user guide) is very concise and clear and I think it
will answer all of your questions. When I first ran nVDA, the default eSpeak
voice put me off so much that I almost didn't want to go back there.
However, you can pick a synth, and as already mentioned, there are Eloquence
add-ons, though I guess you won't find them exactly the same as your JAWS
experience. The other software synth that's licensed to jAWS, Vocalizer
Expressive, is also available. You have to pay for both of these, but it's
certainly less than the cost of a JAWS SMA. :)

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Kenny
Sent: December 6, 2017 9:42 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] JAWS User Looking for Guidance in Getting Started with NVDA.

Hello,

I'm a current user of the latest build of JAWS 2018. Using Eloquence as my
software synth.

Well the time has come that I can no longer afford to pay the Freedom
Scientific SMA JAWS upgrades (Been using JAWS for over 20 years), so I'm
turning to NVDA.

My first two questions:

Does NVDA use a keyboard navigation system similar to JAWS? If not, is there
a way I can configure it to work this way?

Also can I configure NVDA to use the Eloquence module currently installed on
my PC (Thanks to JAWS?) If not, is there a NVDA software synth available
that's just as good to use?

Thanks for any help.


Re: IMPORTANT COMMUNITY DIRECTIVE: to use NVDA 2017.4, Windows 7 SP1 or later is absolutely required

Chris
 

                Probably because they don’t know how to check for updates or wouldn’t know what to do if there was any, or windows update was broken a long time ago

 

 

 

From: Ron Canazzi
Sent: 07 December 2017 14:33
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] IMPORTANT COMMUNITY DIRECTIVE: to use NVDA 2017.4, Windows 7 SP1 or later is absolutely required

 

I wonder if those who have such systems have pirate copies of Windows

and have turned off auto update.

 

 

 

On 12/7/2017 4:58 AM, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io wrote:

> Could I ask how people could end up without sp1, as I seem to recall

> from friends that this update some years back now was pushed

> automatically to existing systems and its not just nvda which relies

> on it either.

> Also now, how would a user get it and install it, is it relatively

> simple on the Microsoft site or would you suggest going the whole way

> and going to 10 before 31st Dec while a free update is there. I'm

> assuming that the old version of 7 will still allow the update.

> Brian

> bglists@...

> Sent via blueyonder.

> Please address personal email to:-

> briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'

> in the display name field.

> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Joseph Lee"

> <joseph.lee22590@...>

> To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>

> Sent: Wednesday, December 06, 2017 6:18 PM

> Subject: [nvda] IMPORTANT COMMUNITY DIRECTIVE: to use NVDA 2017.4,

> Windows 7 SP1 or later is absolutely required

>> Dear NVDA community,

>> 

>> 

>> 

>> It was brought to developers' attention that some people were having

>> issues

>> upgrading to NVDA 2017.4, and turns out some were using Windows 7 RTM

>> build.

>> Thus the following community directive:

>> 

>> 

>> 

>> In order to use NVDA 2017.4 or later, Windows 7 Service Pack 1 or

>> later is

>> ABSOLUTELY required.

>> 

>> 

>> 

>> To find out which Windows release you've got:

>> 

>> 

>> 

>> 1. Press Windows key to open Start menu.

>> 2. Type "winver" without quotes and press Enter.

>> 3. Check the build shown on About Windows dialog.

>> 

>> 

>> 

>> If the build number is 7601 or higher, you're all set. If it is lower

>> than

>> that:

>> 

>> 

>> 

>> * If using Windows 7 RTM (build number is 7600), please use NVDA

>> 2017.3, upgrade to Windows 7 SP1 first, then update to NVDA 2017.4.

>> * If using versions other than 7 (build number is less than 7600),

>> then NVDA 2017.3 is the last supported version for you.

>> 

>> 

>> 

>> In the next few weeks, some add-on authors will announce minimum

>> supported

>> versions of NVDA and Windows. For example, if you are using

>> StationPlaylist

>> Studio add-on, starting from version 17.12 stable, Windows 7 SP1 or

>> higher

>> is absolutely required.

>> 

>> 

>> 

>> Thank you.

>> 

>> Cheers,

>> 

>> Joseph

>> 

>> 

>

 

--

They Ask Me If I'm Happy; I say Yes.

They ask: "How Happy are You?"

I Say: "I'm as happy as a stow away chimpanzee on a banana boat!"

 

 

 

 


odd behavoior with NVDA

Jessica D <jldail13@...>
 

Hi,

After installing NVDA 2017.4 last night, I’m experiencing odd behavior.

 

NVDA will become staticy while typing.

What can I do?

 

 

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 


Re: links on single line

Chris
 

I am with you clare, 100% 😃

 

 

From: Clare Page
Sent: 07 December 2017 14:02
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] links on single line

 

Hi!

I always keep Preserve Screen layout on, not because I have sighted people looking at my screen, but because I don’t see any need to move between links with up and down arrows, when that can easily be done with the Tab key or the quick navigation keys k and shift+k, or even using links in the  elements list.

Throughout my ten years of using JAWS there was no choice in the matter, there was no toggle, but with NVDA I’m glad we have a choice, between what seems to me to be a more accurate view of the website and one which is simply there because other screenreaders have it, so many blind people feel it is normal or convenient.

It’s possible that my view is a minority one in the blind community, but maybe I’m not the only one who finds nothing wrong with preserving screen layout in web browsers. That’s why I like the toggle in NVDA: those who want to arrow through links still have that option, but we’re not stuck with one or the other;

Bye for now!

From Clare

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Mary Otten
Sent: jeudi 7 décembre 2017 01:50
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] links on single line

 

This brings up the question of why preserving screen layout is a good idea. I mean, maybe that has to do with working with sighted colleagues? But if that's the only reason, then I'm definitely turning it off as of little to no use.

 

Mary

 

On 12/6/2017 4:43 PM, Gene wrote:

Just one more example of why having links read each link on a separate line should be the default, as I said two or three days ago.  The feature is in browse mode settings.  It's a check box that says use screen layout, if supported.  Uncheck this box and activate the ok button.

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

From: Don H

Sent: Wednesday, December 06, 2017 6:25 PM

Subject: [nvda] links on single line

 

I am running NVDA 2017-4 on a Win 10 64 bit machine.  I have a web site
where there are multiple links on a single line thus NVDA reads them
together.  If my memory is right there is a way to get NVDA to read this
multi link lines as if each link was separate.  Looked everywhere but
can't find it.
Thanks a