Date   

Re: Some suggest for future nvda

Arlene
 

Can’t say I don’t blame you. If your computer is not failing on you. If you are happier with it. Then keep using windows 7.  That’s good you are good with the change should you ever have to face the music and buy a new one that already has ten in it. I’m with you. I want to control this 7 box and not have it controlled by MS. 

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: October-23-17 12:34 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Some suggest for future nvda

 

Despite all the hype about Windows 10, one reason I haven't upgraded my Windows 7 computer is because I want to control it, not cede control of it to Microsoft.  While there are arguments that can be made that people benefit in general by having forced updates, and maybe people in general do, that doesn't mean that I do as an individual and especially as an individual blind person.  I believe that security updates should probably be forced.  Other updates that aren't really necessary, should not be. 

 

At some point, when I buy a new computer, igt will come with Windows 10.  But I won't upgrade a computer that works well and gives me no problems that amount to anything and maybe have new and unanticipated problems and lose control over updates. 

Gene

----- original Message -----

Sent: Monday, October 23, 2017 2:20 PM

Subject: Re: [nvda] Some suggest for future nvda

 

I feel your pain. I think that xp is still viable but of course the old nvda
is fine for that as not much new stuff will work on it. Although I have a 64
bit win 7 machine I do find people looking down their nose at me for being
old fashioned a bit too much sometimes. Whose computer keeps working, and
whose does not, Exactly win ten users suddenly lose a working bit of
software due to changes in the latest version inadvertently screwing up
something else.
 I personally feel that while constant development is good, the current
model of using users as testers is not good if those users are working for a
living. I personally don't care too much, I'm retired but do some work for a
charity as well so I need one reliable machine, the rest well they can be
toys as somebody suggested but in my case the working one is what the  first
adopters call a toy, and vice versa!
 Who is the fool?
 Brian

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Please address personal email to:-
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----- Original Message -----
From: "Shaun Everiss" <sm.everiss@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Monday, October 23, 2017 10:28 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Some suggest for future nvda


> Well to be honest, I think older windows should be supported till they are
> no longer viable.
>
> Xp and vista are no longer viable.
>
> win7 still is supported at least for 3 years and after that till it
> becomes no longer viable well.
>
> The older systems should be supported till 32 bit oses actually die at any
> rate.
>
> A lot of 32 bit programs still exist, a lot of purely 64 bit ones exist
> to, a lot more.
>
> However 32 bit programs are being made still.
>
> Do it to slowly and well its a drag.
>
> Do it to quickly and it would be like me upgrading jaws from home to pro.
>
> You need to rebuy your jaws licence to use your next version of windows 10
> and we won'
>
> 't support windows 10 because its now updated.
>
> As a result people would pirate jaws and windows 10 to get the support.
>
> WHat I am trying to say there is a fine line from being secure and a line
> from driving people away from business.
>
> I have worked with several software packages and other systems touting
> that newer stuff would be support and either changing quickly or doing it
> in a rush.
>
> Usually it works mostly the users grumble but get used to it in a fashion.
>
> I have had it fail about 3 times in my life time.
>
> Once it was me, this new package worked but windows stopped working, I had
> to reformat a 3 computer network.
>
> In another time a friend got a virus and decided to use the recomended
> repair solution.
>
> Lets see, sure the virus was gone but 50 conflicting security programs and
> tools creating over 500gb of junk files slowed his system so much that I
> had to first remove all that security system, and reinstall something that
> worked, then have the system on for 2 days straight cleaning junk files.
>
> I then had to repair the dammage that was caused by said software and was
> lucky it was not a reformat though it was close.
>
> On another case of someone holding back, my cousin got infected with
> ransomware because he just let his antivirus subscription norton expire.
>
> He didn't mean to but he did.
>
> I was able to fix it, but in the end he needed everything including his
> bios refreshed and a new system installed.
>
> However after that experience he switched to avast because well things
> just didn't work.
>
> Even when things should work I have had a user after trying to update turn
> off his system or have a power cut during an update.
>
> He had to reformat and lost his files well some of them on win10 and he is
> back on xp now.
>
> Point is supporting older users doesn't promote a virus, we are not vfo be
> happy we are not.
>
>
>
>
> On 23/10/2017 9:51 p.m., Alexander Masic wrote:
>> Hi.
>>
>> Now When Jamie has change to another work, I hope there will be some
>> space for new thinking and redesign. Even if i really like nvda very
>> mutch, and you devs are doing a fantastic good jobb in general. However
>> there is a few things wich iritate my mutch. And most imprtant is how the
>> menu-system are organised. I would like to se menu scructure organized in
>> fleaks wich i can toggle betwean by arrow-keys. If i made an
>> reinstallation of NVDA then I am able to made all settings at once. As it
>> is today, you must do the settings in a one section, then press ok, opend
>> menu again and go to next and so on. This is a little old fasion.
>>
>> So I hope that new leadership for nvda will also bring some new thinking.
>> I am also glad to se that older windows longer will not be supported.
>> Because this older windows is virusmashin, and by supporting them, NVDA
>> is also encurage spread of virus.
>>
>> So i'll wish the new leader good luck, and looking forward to se little
>> new way thinking.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>



Re: Some suggest for future nvda

Arlene
 

Hi, what's the name of that addon?

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Michal Rada
Sent: October-23-17 5:06 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Some suggest for future nvda

Hi, there is special addon in which you can set all settings in one place, as Control center in Jaws. You may install it and enjoy it, its cool and verry usefull method of setting all.

Odesláno z iPhonu

23. 10. 2017 v 10:51, Alexander Masic <list@masic.se>:

Hi.

Now When Jamie has change to another work, I hope there will be some space for new thinking and redesign. Even if i really like nvda very mutch, and you devs are doing a fantastic good jobb in general. However there is a few things wich iritate my mutch. And most imprtant is how the menu-system are organised. I would like to se menu scructure organized in fleaks wich i can toggle betwean by arrow-keys. If i made an reinstallation of NVDA then I am able to made all settings at once. As it is today, you must do the settings in a one section, then press ok, opend menu again and go to next and so on. This is a little old fasion.

So I hope that new leadership for nvda will also bring some new thinking. I am also glad to se that older windows longer will not be supported. Because this older windows is virusmashin, and by supporting them, NVDA is also encurage spread of virus.

So i'll wish the new leader good luck, and looking forward to se little new way thinking.





Re: Tested working audio with win10 safe mode.

 

can I please get the attachment?

I am not seeing it

On 10/21/2017 3:43 PM, Hareth wrote:
Greetings,
I've tested the attached reg file it worked with my Lenovo laptop,
tested with both internal and USB SB sound cards.
It should work with any sound card.
Note, at least for first try have some sighted help nearby just in case.
file reg Source windows10 forums.

Enjoy


.


support for xp

 

Hi jean and all.

Personally I don't think people mind the new tech, but its simply we don't support xp because microsoft said so.

People really don't care about it.

A good reason maybe the security, or maybe even the performance, lets face it ms stuff is targeted by hackers.

I read a message saying someone got into dev servers on an apple company and well bad things happened.

Point is, I think users are getting tired ofpeople like ms saying you do this because we say you do, you send us your info for services which are or can be suddenly cut, users want a little choice is all.

The only service which at the moment has it right ish is google.

True you loose your privacy and probably all your personal info becomes part of the net but for the services about, its a small price to pay even when google changes things, well.

It would be different if google suddenly decided to cut mail or get all users to pay 20 bucks a month for it.


win10 apps

 

Hi.

Further to the message I sent, I think its wrong to make us the users use apps.

While on a smart phone I can see a reason the thing is we have grown up as blind people using desktop apps.

And I don't see bar a few reasons to use the universal crappy and inaccessible apps.

Even if their status changes there are vary few apps I find usefull that I have to use or something like store and settings.

Calendar, weather, knfb reader, usefull but knfb only because I got it cheap I'd never use them otherwise.

Ms lens I guess is ok but still.

Out of all those weather I can read online without the app and a calendar while nice I can do without.

Everything else is desktop but then I am a gamer and home user doing some freelance contracts so I don't need the blessings and curse of an office suite.

Jarte handles most things for me.


Re: Some suggest for future nvda

Gene
 

Support for XP was dropped because it made NVDA not able to take full advantages of features in newer versions of Windows.  I see no reason to remove the kinds of code you are talking about, such as Outlook Express or Windows Live Mail support.  it doesn't interfere with anything.  Also, I am not aware of a way that users can add modules to NVDA as users can add scripts to JAWS.  JAWS no longer includes support for Outlook Express but JAWS users can send scripts to each other that were used for this purpose and add them to JAWS.  I don't think support should have been removed because some people still use the program and support isn't interfering with anything else.  But I consider this to be even more the case in NVDA since NVDA is not user definable in this way. 
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, October 23, 2017 2:36 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Some suggest for future nvda

Joseph read my comments in the last post on the worries of this.
 I am not sure what you mean about the dropping of support. What I
personally do not want is for programs such as Outlook express to be dropped
as app modules. I and others value being able to use it in later windows and
although live mail is also a dead thing, many use it successfully and it
borrows a lot from Outlook express.
 So I'm saying don't throw the baby out with the bathwater. In my view, the
code overhead is probably worth it, and also in a program as complex as
nvda, many unexpected issues will suddenly pop out of the woodwork as the
assumption that a piece of code is redundant, might actually not be true.
Look at the  library that was removed when you did away with the nvda
Service for example. its tiny as code but may well be there for a reason.
 Many of us use older software on newer systems, particularly windows 7 as
it is enough like xp to cooperate well with them, or be easy to patch.
 I think its easy for people in the development side of a piece of software
to accidentally fall into the elitist trenches, when in fact there is no
need to go down that route as there are enough challenges going on trying to
keep up with Microsofts changes as it is. Focus on those and keeping it
reliable, leave removing bits until there is a quiet period or the
reliability might be jeopardised. in my view. I've seen it happen back when
I was a younger person!
 Not having a moan, just trying to give the benefit of hindsight as we were
all young once.
 Brian

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Please address personal email to:-
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----- Original Message -----
From: "Joseph Lee" <joseph.lee22590@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Monday, October 23, 2017 4:31 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Some suggest for future nvda


Hi,
Preferences dialog: someone in Europe is actually working on this as we
speak.
Old Windows versions: I am working on mapping out the plan to drop support
for old Windows releases (not just words, but in source code). As for
viruses and old Windows releases, in some ways, there is some correlation
but not much (it is up to users to stay vigilant).
As for new leadership: NV Access is here to stay. One noticeable change is
decentralization of the development expertise, with more third-party
contributions being integrated.
Cheers,
Joseph

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Michal
Rada
Sent: Monday, October 23, 2017 5:06 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Some suggest for future nvda

Hi, there is special addon in which you can set all settings in one place,
as Control center in Jaws. You may install it and enjoy it, its cool and
verry usefull method of setting all.

Odesláno z iPhonu

23. 10. 2017 v 10:51, Alexander Masic <list@...>:

> Hi.
>
> Now When Jamie has change to another work, I hope there will be some space
> for new thinking and redesign. Even if i really like nvda very mutch, and
> you devs are doing a fantastic good jobb in general. However there is a
> few things wich iritate my mutch. And most imprtant is how the menu-system
> are organised. I would like to se menu scructure organized in fleaks wich
> i can toggle betwean by arrow-keys. If i made an reinstallation of NVDA
> then I am able to made all settings at once. As it is today, you must do
> the settings in a one section, then press ok, opend menu again and go to
> next and so on. This is a little old fasion.
>
> So I hope that new leadership for nvda will also bring some new thinking.
> I am also glad to se that older windows longer will not be supported.
> Because this older windows is virusmashin, and by supporting them, NVDA is
> also encurage spread of virus.
>
> So i'll wish the new leader good luck, and looking forward to se little
> new way thinking.
>
>
>
>
>










Re: Some suggest for future nvda

 

Well I don't mind the control thing its the way of the cloud, at the same time with the closing of ms music which was a big reason of me having an ms account bar my purchaced apps ms has basically shot itself at least for me with their ms accounts.

I like the win7 shell, and I don't care for 10 like that.

Its progress I guess but to be honest xp was still a faster loading system by a long stretch.

Maybe not as good as 7 or some of the features in 10, but yeah its just hype.

In the last update on the systems I have  10 on, I disabled the stupid people apps in the task bar and once that was gone windows continued as normal.

I do think there should be a seperate user os and business os.

And I don't mean home where you have no control at all basically and can't connect to the network.

I mean a propper os.

A home user, plays games, music, does documents, and reads email, does the web.

A business user does the same but also connects to their network to do things, etc, etc, etc.

In xp even pro was for home even on 7 the system leaves you alone.

On 10, well you can make the system leave you alone for the most part but I have never figured how to make a shortcut for something from the ribbon, and it appears they are changing a lot.

I realise why xp is no more, security is one thing and the tech being just to old.

WHat really saddens me is how windows changed.

it was a shell over dos first up to 1998 then switched fully with win2k to its own os finnishing in xp.

Through the rocky vista patch then into 7.

And sadly thats where inovation stopped, after the disaster with 8 and now windows mobile they tried to comply with the app revolution in 10.

Sadly thats where its stopped, now its online services which are fine I use some of them like weather a lot.

But there is more than anyone of us meer mortals gear wise will ever be able to afford, stuff is put in because it looks cool not that its actually of any use.

If something crashes, you get a message saying an error has happened, tell microsoft.

I had actually got a problem once with a program and it gave all the info that ms was going to get.

The programmer couldn't read it till I turned error reporting off and it generated the actual crash message.

Things are a bit better now but still its not like microsoft care about all our problems they can't I don't think.

A home user should have a system that just works 7 is the new xp.

Sadly if we use 7 we need to have older systems before 6-7gen which means we will have to use older systems and well lets see, some drivers and hardware are not being updated much so as a gamer I do find issues from time to time.

For its day xp was really good.

The only thing for 7 is the search box and the hardware support and the only good thing and bad thing about 10 is it will find your stuff easy enough it does sometimes find the wrong stuff.

I'd like windows update to return to what it was though.

At least you can see what is being updated but still.

On 24/10/2017 8:33 a.m., Gene wrote:
Despite all the hype about Windows 10, one reason I haven't upgraded my Windows 7 computer is because I want to control it, not cede control of it to Microsoft. While there are arguments that can be made that people benefit in general by having forced updates, and maybe people in general do, that doesn't mean that I do as an individual and especially as an individual blind person. I believe that security updates should probably be forced. Other updates that aren't really necessary, should not be.

At some point, when I buy a new computer, igt will come with Windows 10. But I won't upgrade a computer that works well and gives me no problems that amount to anything and maybe have new and unanticipated problems and lose control over updates.
Gene
----- original Message -----

From: Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io
Sent: Monday, October 23, 2017 2:20 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Some suggest for future nvda


I feel your pain. I think that xp is still viable but of course the old nvda
is fine for that as not much new stuff will work on it. Although I have a 64
bit win 7 machine I do find people looking down their nose at me for being
old fashioned a bit too much sometimes. Whose computer keeps working, and
whose does not, Exactly win ten users suddenly lose a working bit of
software due to changes in the latest version inadvertently screwing up
something else.
I personally feel that while constant development is good, the current
model of using users as testers is not good if those users are working for a
living. I personally don't care too much, I'm retired but do some work for a
charity as well so I need one reliable machine, the rest well they can be
toys as somebody suggested but in my case the working one is what the first
adopters call a toy, and vice versa!
Who is the fool?
Brian

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----- Original Message -----
From: "Shaun Everiss" <sm.everiss@gmail.com>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Monday, October 23, 2017 10:28 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Some suggest for future nvda


Well to be honest, I think older windows should be supported till they are
no longer viable.

Xp and vista are no longer viable.

win7 still is supported at least for 3 years and after that till it
becomes no longer viable well.

The older systems should be supported till 32 bit oses actually die at any
rate.

A lot of 32 bit programs still exist, a lot of purely 64 bit ones exist
to, a lot more.

However 32 bit programs are being made still.

Do it to slowly and well its a drag.

Do it to quickly and it would be like me upgrading jaws from home to pro.

You need to rebuy your jaws licence to use your next version of windows 10
and we won'

't support windows 10 because its now updated.

As a result people would pirate jaws and windows 10 to get the support.

WHat I am trying to say there is a fine line from being secure and a line
from driving people away from business.

I have worked with several software packages and other systems touting
that newer stuff would be support and either changing quickly or doing it
in a rush.

Usually it works mostly the users grumble but get used to it in a fashion.

I have had it fail about 3 times in my life time.

Once it was me, this new package worked but windows stopped working, I had
to reformat a 3 computer network.

In another time a friend got a virus and decided to use the recomended
repair solution.

Lets see, sure the virus was gone but 50 conflicting security programs and
tools creating over 500gb of junk files slowed his system so much that I
had to first remove all that security system, and reinstall something that
worked, then have the system on for 2 days straight cleaning junk files.

I then had to repair the dammage that was caused by said software and was
lucky it was not a reformat though it was close.

On another case of someone holding back, my cousin got infected with
ransomware because he just let his antivirus subscription norton expire.

He didn't mean to but he did.

I was able to fix it, but in the end he needed everything including his
bios refreshed and a new system installed.

However after that experience he switched to avast because well things
just didn't work.

Even when things should work I have had a user after trying to update turn
off his system or have a power cut during an update.

He had to reformat and lost his files well some of them on win10 and he is
back on xp now.

Point is supporting older users doesn't promote a virus, we are not vfo be
happy we are not.




On 23/10/2017 9:51 p.m., Alexander Masic wrote:
Hi.

Now When Jamie has change to another work, I hope there will be some
space for new thinking and redesign. Even if i really like nvda very
mutch, and you devs are doing a fantastic good jobb in general. However
there is a few things wich iritate my mutch. And most imprtant is how the
menu-system are organised. I would like to se menu scructure organized in
fleaks wich i can toggle betwean by arrow-keys. If i made an
reinstallation of NVDA then I am able to made all settings at once. As it
is today, you must do the settings in a one section, then press ok, opend
menu again and go to next and so on. This is a little old fasion.

So I hope that new leadership for nvda will also bring some new thinking.
I am also glad to se that older windows longer will not be supported.
Because this older windows is virusmashin, and by supporting them, NVDA
is also encurage spread of virus.

So i'll wish the new leader good luck, and looking forward to se little
new way thinking.







people app question

Gary Metzler <gmtravel@...>
 

Hi All,

 

I want to start using the mail app and I have a question.  Can you easily put a new contact into the people app while in an e mail message?  I am using the latest nvda and win 10.  Thanks for any help.

 

Regards, Gary kn4ox

 


Re: safe mode

Brian's Mail list account <bglists@...>
 

I have disabled wireless on my pc as it has no hardware for bluetooth or wifi.
Brian

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----- Original Message -----
From: "Sarah k Alawami" <marrie12@gmail.com>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Monday, October 23, 2017 7:54 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] safe mode


Right, I forgot about that. I use a wireless dongle so I don't know if this would in fact work. It is a Logitech usb wireless headset.

Take care and be blessed all.

On Oct 23, 2017, at 11:50 AM, Adriani Botez <adriani.botez@gmail.com> wrote:

Here is a file which changes your registry in the way that sound driver is kept on in safe mode. It works in windows 10 and I have tested it in Windows 7 x86 and it works as well. There is also a discussion in this forum about it, it was some days ago. Several people tested it and in works.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/ebkqst6n393i6jk/Activate_Sound_in_Win10_Safe_Mode.zip?dl=1 <https://www.dropbox.com/s/ebkqst6n393i6jk/Activate_Sound_in_Win10_Safe_Mode.zip?dl=1>

Best <>
Adriani

Von: nvda@nvda.groups.io <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io> [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>] Im Auftrag von Sarah k Alawami
Gesendet: Montag, 23. Oktober 2017 19:31
An: nvda@nvda.groups.io <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Betreff: Re: [nvda] safe mode

No. And it will never work. No audo drivers can be loaded only display drivers.

Take care


On Oct 23, 2017, at 3:39 AM, Holger Fiallo <hfiallo@rcn.com <mailto:hfiallo@rcn.com>> wrote:

Does NVDA, narrator or jaws works in safe mode? Can not delete avast and the only way to uninstall it is by going to safe mode.


Holger Fiallo


Re: Some suggest for future nvda

Brian's Mail list account <bglists@...>
 

Each to their own, but of course when the hardware you use dies as in time it will, xp won't work on the new hardware as it won't have the drivers for it. At that time one has to move on.
I have several xp machines here and they work fine for what they are used for, and I'd keep them as long as I can get an anti virus to protect them of course, but allow me to say that there are speed advantages from later hardware and although some bits change many stay much the same or can be configured to be.
brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
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----- Original Message -----
From: "zahra" <nasrinkhaksar3@gmail.com>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Monday, October 23, 2017 7:33 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Some suggest for future nvda


i love everything that i have and i am grateful to Allah for his bounties.
i love my windows version, nvda, my softwares which are all 32bit and
the way that i use internet and computer!
God bless you all!

On 10/23/17, Rosemarie Chavarria <knitqueen2007@gmail.com> wrote:
I like the NVDA menu the way it is. Like the old saying goes, if it ain't
broke, don't fix it.



-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
Alexander Masic
Sent: Monday, October 23, 2017 1:51 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] Some suggest for future nvda

Hi.

Now When Jamie has change to another work, I hope there will be some space
for new thinking and redesign. Even if i really like nvda very mutch, and
you devs are doing a fantastic good jobb in general. However there is a few
things wich iritate my mutch. And most imprtant is how the menu-system are
organised. I would like to se menu scructure organized in fleaks wich i can
toggle betwean by arrow-keys. If i made an reinstallation of NVDA then I am
able to made all settings at once.
As it is today, you must do the settings in a one section, then press ok,
opend menu again and go to next and so on. This is a little old fasion.

So I hope that new leadership for nvda will also bring some new thinking. I
am also glad to se that older windows longer will not be supported. Because
this older windows is virusmashin, and by supporting them, NVDA is also
encurage spread of virus.

So i'll wish the new leader good luck, and looking forward to se little new
way thinking.









--
we have not sent you but as a mercy to the entire creation.
holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
in the very authentic narration from prophet Mohammad is:
indeed, imam husayn is the beacon of guidance and the ark of salvation.
best website for studying islamic book in different languages
www.al-islam.org


Re: Some suggest for future nvda

Adriani Botez
 

I’ve used that feature in jaws and it helped me a lot. I think though that this feature should be available in the menu rather than in the installation wizard. Well, both options would make sense anyway.

 

Best

Adriani

 

 

Von: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] Im Auftrag von Florian Iona?cu
Gesendet: Montag, 23. Oktober 2017 21:30
An: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Betreff: Re: [nvda] Some suggest for future nvda

 

Hello, I also have a suggestion for future NVDA releases. A repair option in the installation process might be useful, I'll tell you why. Someone has one or more problems with NVDA and wants to fix them without uninstalling.

Someone wrote in the Romanian community that NVDA does lag when he's typing something. I told him to return to the default configuration and this worked for him But, another person contacted me privately to ttell me that NVDA has a strange behavior. When navigating on Skype or browsers with tab, it says "unknown" instead of reading the content. He reseted the configuration, uninstalled the add-ons, restarted NVDA several times, but no result. I told him to reinstall NVDA.

So, a repair option is required in this case. As I remember, JAWS has this option in the installation wizard. I haven't used it for a long time.

That's over for now. What do you think about my suggestion?

Cheers,

Florian


Re: Some suggest for future nvda

Brian's Mail list account <bglists@...>
 

Yews but many years ago I suggested an alternative way, that ran like tabs on many other programs do. This would have been my choice. It should not stop the keyboard shortcuts from bringing up the dialogue with that selected sheet to the focus, but might make it easier then to move to other sheets from that one for those who want to work that way.
I see very few down sides to it myself, as long as you protect the hottkeys already defined.
Brian

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----- Original Message -----
From: "Rosemarie Chavarria" <knitqueen2007@gmail.com>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Monday, October 23, 2017 6:39 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Some suggest for future nvda


I like the NVDA menu the way it is. Like the old saying goes, if it ain't
broke, don't fix it.



-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of
Alexander Masic
Sent: Monday, October 23, 2017 1:51 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] Some suggest for future nvda

Hi.

Now When Jamie has change to another work, I hope there will be some space
for new thinking and redesign. Even if i really like nvda very mutch, and
you devs are doing a fantastic good jobb in general. However there is a few
things wich iritate my mutch. And most imprtant is how the menu-system are
organised. I would like to se menu scructure organized in fleaks wich i can
toggle betwean by arrow-keys. If i made an reinstallation of NVDA then I am
able to made all settings at once.
As it is today, you must do the settings in a one section, then press ok,
opend menu again and go to next and so on. This is a little old fasion.

So I hope that new leadership for nvda will also bring some new thinking. I
am also glad to se that older windows longer will not be supported. Because
this older windows is virusmashin, and by supporting them, NVDA is also
encurage spread of virus.

So i'll wish the new leader good luck, and looking forward to se little new
way thinking.







Re: safe mode

Brian's Mail list account <bglists@...>
 

I think it could be done, but as I said in the last thread on this, only about a week back (note please read back before starting a new thread) the more you patch the registry of safe mode to load drivers the less of a safe mode it actually is!
Brian

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----- Original Message -----
From: "Sarah k Alawami" <marrie12@gmail.com>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Monday, October 23, 2017 6:31 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] safe mode


No. And it will never work. No audo drivers can be loaded only display drivers.

Take care

On Oct 23, 2017, at 3:39 AM, Holger Fiallo <hfiallo@rcn.com> wrote:

Does NVDA, narrator or jaws works in safe mode? Can not delete avast and the only way to uninstall it is by going to safe mode.


Holger Fiallo


Re: Some suggest for future nvda

Brian's Mail list account <bglists@...>
 

Joseph read my comments in the last post on the worries of this.
I am not sure what you mean about the dropping of support. What I personally do not want is for programs such as Outlook express to be dropped as app modules. I and others value being able to use it in later windows and although live mail is also a dead thing, many use it successfully and it borrows a lot from Outlook express.
So I'm saying don't throw the baby out with the bathwater. In my view, the code overhead is probably worth it, and also in a program as complex as nvda, many unexpected issues will suddenly pop out of the woodwork as the assumption that a piece of code is redundant, might actually not be true. Look at the library that was removed when you did away with the nvda Service for example. its tiny as code but may well be there for a reason.
Many of us use older software on newer systems, particularly windows 7 as it is enough like xp to cooperate well with them, or be easy to patch.
I think its easy for people in the development side of a piece of software to accidentally fall into the elitist trenches, when in fact there is no need to go down that route as there are enough challenges going on trying to keep up with Microsofts changes as it is. Focus on those and keeping it reliable, leave removing bits until there is a quiet period or the reliability might be jeopardised. in my view. I've seen it happen back when I was a younger person!
Not having a moan, just trying to give the benefit of hindsight as we were all young once.
Brian

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----- Original Message -----
From: "Joseph Lee" <joseph.lee22590@gmail.com>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Monday, October 23, 2017 4:31 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Some suggest for future nvda


Hi,
Preferences dialog: someone in Europe is actually working on this as we speak.
Old Windows versions: I am working on mapping out the plan to drop support for old Windows releases (not just words, but in source code). As for viruses and old Windows releases, in some ways, there is some correlation but not much (it is up to users to stay vigilant).
As for new leadership: NV Access is here to stay. One noticeable change is decentralization of the development expertise, with more third-party contributions being integrated.
Cheers,
Joseph

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Michal Rada
Sent: Monday, October 23, 2017 5:06 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Some suggest for future nvda

Hi, there is special addon in which you can set all settings in one place, as Control center in Jaws. You may install it and enjoy it, its cool and verry usefull method of setting all.

Odesláno z iPhonu

23. 10. 2017 v 10:51, Alexander Masic <list@masic.se>:

Hi.

Now When Jamie has change to another work, I hope there will be some space for new thinking and redesign. Even if i really like nvda very mutch, and you devs are doing a fantastic good jobb in general. However there is a few things wich iritate my mutch. And most imprtant is how the menu-system are organised. I would like to se menu scructure organized in fleaks wich i can toggle betwean by arrow-keys. If i made an reinstallation of NVDA then I am able to made all settings at once. As it is today, you must do the settings in a one section, then press ok, opend menu again and go to next and so on. This is a little old fasion.

So I hope that new leadership for nvda will also bring some new thinking. I am also glad to se that older windows longer will not be supported. Because this older windows is virusmashin, and by supporting them, NVDA is also encurage spread of virus.

So i'll wish the new leader good luck, and looking forward to se little new way thinking.





Re: Some suggest for future nvda

Gene
 

Despite all the hype about Windows 10, one reason I haven't upgraded my Windows 7 computer is because I want to control it, not cede control of it to Microsoft.  While there are arguments that can be made that people benefit in general by having forced updates, and maybe people in general do, that doesn't mean that I do as an individual and especially as an individual blind person.  I believe that security updates should probably be forced.  Other updates that aren't really necessary, should not be. 
 
At some point, when I buy a new computer, igt will come with Windows 10.  But I won't upgrade a computer that works well and gives me no problems that amount to anything and maybe have new and unanticipated problems and lose control over updates. 
Gene
----- original Message -----

Sent: Monday, October 23, 2017 2:20 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Some suggest for future nvda

I feel your pain. I think that xp is still viable but of course the old nvda
is fine for that as not much new stuff will work on it. Although I have a 64
bit win 7 machine I do find people looking down their nose at me for being
old fashioned a bit too much sometimes. Whose computer keeps working, and
whose does not, Exactly win ten users suddenly lose a working bit of
software due to changes in the latest version inadvertently screwing up
something else.
 I personally feel that while constant development is good, the current
model of using users as testers is not good if those users are working for a
living. I personally don't care too much, I'm retired but do some work for a
charity as well so I need one reliable machine, the rest well they can be
toys as somebody suggested but in my case the working one is what the  first
adopters call a toy, and vice versa!
 Who is the fool?
 Brian

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Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
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----- Original Message -----
From: "Shaun Everiss" <sm.everiss@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Monday, October 23, 2017 10:28 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Some suggest for future nvda


> Well to be honest, I think older windows should be supported till they are
> no longer viable.
>
> Xp and vista are no longer viable.
>
> win7 still is supported at least for 3 years and after that till it
> becomes no longer viable well.
>
> The older systems should be supported till 32 bit oses actually die at any
> rate.
>
> A lot of 32 bit programs still exist, a lot of purely 64 bit ones exist
> to, a lot more.
>
> However 32 bit programs are being made still.
>
> Do it to slowly and well its a drag.
>
> Do it to quickly and it would be like me upgrading jaws from home to pro.
>
> You need to rebuy your jaws licence to use your next version of windows 10
> and we won'
>
> 't support windows 10 because its now updated.
>
> As a result people would pirate jaws and windows 10 to get the support.
>
> WHat I am trying to say there is a fine line from being secure and a line
> from driving people away from business.
>
> I have worked with several software packages and other systems touting
> that newer stuff would be support and either changing quickly or doing it
> in a rush.
>
> Usually it works mostly the users grumble but get used to it in a fashion.
>
> I have had it fail about 3 times in my life time.
>
> Once it was me, this new package worked but windows stopped working, I had
> to reformat a 3 computer network.
>
> In another time a friend got a virus and decided to use the recomended
> repair solution.
>
> Lets see, sure the virus was gone but 50 conflicting security programs and
> tools creating over 500gb of junk files slowed his system so much that I
> had to first remove all that security system, and reinstall something that
> worked, then have the system on for 2 days straight cleaning junk files.
>
> I then had to repair the dammage that was caused by said software and was
> lucky it was not a reformat though it was close.
>
> On another case of someone holding back, my cousin got infected with
> ransomware because he just let his antivirus subscription norton expire.
>
> He didn't mean to but he did.
>
> I was able to fix it, but in the end he needed everything including his
> bios refreshed and a new system installed.
>
> However after that experience he switched to avast because well things
> just didn't work.
>
> Even when things should work I have had a user after trying to update turn
> off his system or have a power cut during an update.
>
> He had to reformat and lost his files well some of them on win10 and he is
> back on xp now.
>
> Point is supporting older users doesn't promote a virus, we are not vfo be
> happy we are not.
>
>
>
>
> On 23/10/2017 9:51 p.m., Alexander Masic wrote:
>> Hi.
>>
>> Now When Jamie has change to another work, I hope there will be some
>> space for new thinking and redesign. Even if i really like nvda very
>> mutch, and you devs are doing a fantastic good jobb in general. However
>> there is a few things wich iritate my mutch. And most imprtant is how the
>> menu-system are organised. I would like to se menu scructure organized in
>> fleaks wich i can toggle betwean by arrow-keys. If i made an
>> reinstallation of NVDA then I am able to made all settings at once. As it
>> is today, you must do the settings in a one section, then press ok, opend
>> menu again and go to next and so on. This is a little old fasion.
>>
>> So I hope that new leadership for nvda will also bring some new thinking.
>> I am also glad to se that older windows longer will not be supported.
>> Because this older windows is virusmashin, and by supporting them, NVDA
>> is also encurage spread of virus.
>>
>> So i'll wish the new leader good luck, and looking forward to se little
>> new way thinking.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>




Re: Some suggest for future nvda

 

Hello, I also have a suggestion for future NVDA releases. A repair option in the installation process might be useful, I'll tell you why. Someone has one or more problems with NVDA and wants to fix them without uninstalling.
Someone wrote in the Romanian community that NVDA does lag when he's typing something. I told him to return to the default configuration and this worked for him But, another person contacted me privately to ttell me that NVDA has a strange behavior. When navigating on Skype or browsers with tab, it says "unknown" instead of reading the content. He reseted the configuration, uninstalled the add-ons, restarted NVDA several times, but no result. I told him to reinstall NVDA.
So, a repair option is required in this case. As I remember, JAWS has this option in the installation wizard. I haven't used it for a long time.
That's over for now. What do you think about my suggestion?
Cheers,
Florian


Re: safe mode

Brian's Mail list account <bglists@...>
 

Not unless you modify the registry to load generic sound drivers for your chosen sound method, like a usb headset for example.
To be honest. Get a sighted person in to do it. and never lit Avast darken your doors again.
Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
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Please address personal email to:-
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----- Original Message -----
From: "Holger Fiallo" <hfiallo@rcn.com>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Monday, October 23, 2017 11:39 AM
Subject: [nvda] safe mode


Does NVDA, narrator or jaws works in safe mode? Can not delete avast and the only way to uninstall it is by going to safe mode.


Holger Fiallo


Re: Some suggest for future nvda

Brian's Mail list account <bglists@...>
 

I feel your pain. I think that xp is still viable but of course the old nvda is fine for that as not much new stuff will work on it. Although I have a 64 bit win 7 machine I do find people looking down their nose at me for being old fashioned a bit too much sometimes. Whose computer keeps working, and whose does not, Exactly win ten users suddenly lose a working bit of software due to changes in the latest version inadvertently screwing up something else.
I personally feel that while constant development is good, the current model of using users as testers is not good if those users are working for a living. I personally don't care too much, I'm retired but do some work for a charity as well so I need one reliable machine, the rest well they can be toys as somebody suggested but in my case the working one is what the first adopters call a toy, and vice versa!
Who is the fool?
Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk, putting 'Brian Gaff'
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----- Original Message -----
From: "Shaun Everiss" <sm.everiss@gmail.com>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Monday, October 23, 2017 10:28 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Some suggest for future nvda


Well to be honest, I think older windows should be supported till they are no longer viable.

Xp and vista are no longer viable.

win7 still is supported at least for 3 years and after that till it becomes no longer viable well.

The older systems should be supported till 32 bit oses actually die at any rate.

A lot of 32 bit programs still exist, a lot of purely 64 bit ones exist to, a lot more.

However 32 bit programs are being made still.

Do it to slowly and well its a drag.

Do it to quickly and it would be like me upgrading jaws from home to pro.

You need to rebuy your jaws licence to use your next version of windows 10 and we won'

't support windows 10 because its now updated.

As a result people would pirate jaws and windows 10 to get the support.

WHat I am trying to say there is a fine line from being secure and a line from driving people away from business.

I have worked with several software packages and other systems touting that newer stuff would be support and either changing quickly or doing it in a rush.

Usually it works mostly the users grumble but get used to it in a fashion.

I have had it fail about 3 times in my life time.

Once it was me, this new package worked but windows stopped working, I had to reformat a 3 computer network.

In another time a friend got a virus and decided to use the recomended repair solution.

Lets see, sure the virus was gone but 50 conflicting security programs and tools creating over 500gb of junk files slowed his system so much that I had to first remove all that security system, and reinstall something that worked, then have the system on for 2 days straight cleaning junk files.

I then had to repair the dammage that was caused by said software and was lucky it was not a reformat though it was close.

On another case of someone holding back, my cousin got infected with ransomware because he just let his antivirus subscription norton expire.

He didn't mean to but he did.

I was able to fix it, but in the end he needed everything including his bios refreshed and a new system installed.

However after that experience he switched to avast because well things just didn't work.

Even when things should work I have had a user after trying to update turn off his system or have a power cut during an update.

He had to reformat and lost his files well some of them on win10 and he is back on xp now.

Point is supporting older users doesn't promote a virus, we are not vfo be happy we are not.




On 23/10/2017 9:51 p.m., Alexander Masic wrote:
Hi.

Now When Jamie has change to another work, I hope there will be some space for new thinking and redesign. Even if i really like nvda very mutch, and you devs are doing a fantastic good jobb in general. However there is a few things wich iritate my mutch. And most imprtant is how the menu-system are organised. I would like to se menu scructure organized in fleaks wich i can toggle betwean by arrow-keys. If i made an reinstallation of NVDA then I am able to made all settings at once. As it is today, you must do the settings in a one section, then press ok, opend menu again and go to next and so on. This is a little old fasion.

So I hope that new leadership for nvda will also bring some new thinking. I am also glad to se that older windows longer will not be supported. Because this older windows is virusmashin, and by supporting them, NVDA is also encurage spread of virus.

So i'll wish the new leader good luck, and looking forward to se little new way thinking.






Re: Some suggest for future nvda

Brian's Mail list account <bglists@...>
 

There has been work going on for some time to put all the settings property sheets on one tabbed page.
its not a trivial thing to do, as some interact with others, such as the synths and voices for example, but it is progressing but I'd suspect this may well only really be viable when the next generation of Python is in use for the main code.


Just saying what I've seen going on from messages.
I'm sure the developers will come along and make it more clear.
My one main worry since Jamie went is the division of work and who is checking whose work. Work is going on in a lot of areas and merely viewing from the sidelines as I am, I am just a bit worried that the number of changes occurring at once from different authors may outstrip the current paid team to check them all in a timely manner for the next release.

I'd for example like to see the ability to allow sharing of files like dictionaries and symbols, so we can benefit from others customisation and of course put the originals back if we do not like the changes.

It would aid a lot of people who cannot figure out Regular Expressions, if a merge was available so others findings cold be simply imported to your own copy of nvda.
I see updates of add ons being worked on as well as updates for the latest version of windows 10, Sadly what I do not see is Microsoft stopping mucking up working features when they change or 'improve ' things. it must make screenreader writers go prematurely bald. its as if the authors of Skype were now writing Windows!

OK tongue in cheek but well......
Brian

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----- Original Message -----
From: "Alexander Masic" <list@masic.se>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Monday, October 23, 2017 9:51 AM
Subject: [nvda] Some suggest for future nvda


Hi.

Now When Jamie has change to another work, I hope there will be some space for new thinking and redesign. Even if i really like nvda very mutch, and you devs are doing a fantastic good jobb in general. However there is a few things wich iritate my mutch. And most imprtant is how the menu-system are organised. I would like to se menu scructure organized in fleaks wich i can toggle betwean by arrow-keys. If i made an reinstallation of NVDA then I am able to made all settings at once. As it is today, you must do the settings in a one section, then press ok, opend menu again and go to next and so on. This is a little old fasion.

So I hope that new leadership for nvda will also bring some new thinking. I am also glad to se that older windows longer will not be supported. Because this older windows is virusmashin, and by supporting them, NVDA is also encurage spread of virus.

So i'll wish the new leader good luck, and looking forward to se little new way thinking.




Re: safe mode

Adriani Botez
 

It works if you use this file:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/ebkqst6n393i6jk/Activate_Sound_in_Win10_Safe_Mode.
zip?dl=1


Best
Adriani

-----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----
Von: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] Im Auftrag von Don H
Gesendet: Montag, 23. Oktober 2017 21:02
An: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Betreff: Re: [nvda] safe mode

maybe in the future NVDA could make this possible as it worked well in
Window Eyes. If GW could do it I am sure the fine developers of NVDA could
do it as well.

On 10/23/2017 12:31 PM, Sarah k Alawami wrote:
No. And it will never work. No audo drivers can be loaded only display
drivers.

Take care

On Oct 23, 2017, at 3:39 AM, Holger Fiallo <hfiallo@rcn.com
<mailto:hfiallo@rcn.com>> wrote:

Does NVDA, narrator or jaws works in safe mode? Can not delete avast
and the only way to uninstall it is by going to safe mode.


Holger Fiallo