Date   
Re: Web Capture

David Goldfield
 

Rumola's extension did stop working with Firefox when Firefox switched to Quantum with version 57. For a while their link to the Chrome Web store may have been broken but it seems to be operational now.

David Goldfield,
Blindness Assistive Technology Specialist
JAWS Certified, 2019

WWW.DavidGoldfield.org
On 1/26/2020 8:05 PM, Gene wrote:

I thought Rumola had stopped operation.  Evidently, it is still in business.
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Sunday, January 26, 2020 6:45 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Web Capture

For Google Chrome and Chromium based browsers I use Rumola for solving captcha challenges. Signing up with a Rumola account is not the most intuitive process but it's well worth it. The service provides five free solves but the pricing for additional solves is very reasonable, something like $.99 for fifty and $1.99 for 100.

David Goldfield,
Blindness Assistive Technology Specialist
JAWS Certified, 2019

WWW.DavidGoldfield.org
On 1/26/2020 6:28 AM, Gene wrote:
The only one is for older versions of Firefox.  You can download it and see instructions for installing it on this page:
https://www.blindbargains.com/bargains.php?m=15142
 
As far as Firefox goes, if you use an old version of Firefox portable, you can continue to use your current version of Firefox for general browsing and use Firefox portable for sites you want to solve captchas with.  I know the last version you can use with Webvisum is Firefox 52ESR.  You can download the portable version here:
https://portableapps.com/downloading/?a=FirefoxPortableLegacy52&n=Mozilla%20Firefox,%20Portable%20Edition%20Legacy%20%2052&s=s&p=&d=pa&f=FirefoxPortableLegacy52_52.9.0_English.paf.exe
 
Run the installer.  It is a portable version so it won't put anything on your machine but the program.  Open the folder where the program is, and find the exe file.  Press enter and the program will run.  Make a shortcut on the desktop and assign a shortcut key for convenient running.
Probably just typing f once in the folder will take you to the exe file.
 
Before you use Webvisum, you will have to set up an account on the Webvisum site:
https://www.webvisum.com/
 
At some point, you will have to ask on list for an invitation.  The site isn't monitored by the developer any longer and you can't get an invitation there.
 
Gene
 

Sent: Sunday, January 26, 2020 5:20 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Web Capture

I need a n v d a. addon for captcha

On 1/26/20, Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:
> CAPTCHA Be Gone is no longer available.  Webvisum works with old versions of
> Firefox, if you want to try it.  I can provide more information if you are
> interested.  I don't know if it will work with the captchas you want to
> solve.  And the name is c a p t c h a, not capture.
>
> Gene
> ----- Original Message -----
>
> From: Chikodinaka mr. Oguledo
> Sent: Sunday, January 26, 2020 4:42 AM
> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
> Subject: Re: [nvda] Web Capture
>
>
> captcha begone nvdaNVDA. style or a addOn my viewpoint Please tell
> NVDA addon maniger josofe leee
>
> On 1/26/20, Stephen <whocrazy@...> wrote:
>> I've encountered something like this on the steam platform.  It's
>> horrible.
>> At 04:32 PM 1/26/2020, you wrote:
>>>Something that is NVDA friendly and will read those pesky things
>>>which you are expected to enter as a response on a webpage to prove
>>>you are a genuine person and not some form of robot.
>>>There was once something called Rumola or some such.
>>>One of the major probs is that the capture graphic or whatever it is
>>>only inhabits the screen for a short time.
>>>Any ideas?
>>>Andrea
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>
>


Re: Web Capture

Gene
 

I thought Rumola had stopped operation.  Evidently, it is still in business.
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Sunday, January 26, 2020 6:45 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Web Capture

For Google Chrome and Chromium based browsers I use Rumola for solving captcha challenges. Signing up with a Rumola account is not the most intuitive process but it's well worth it. The service provides five free solves but the pricing for additional solves is very reasonable, something like $.99 for fifty and $1.99 for 100.

David Goldfield,
Blindness Assistive Technology Specialist
JAWS Certified, 2019

WWW.DavidGoldfield.org
On 1/26/2020 6:28 AM, Gene wrote:
The only one is for older versions of Firefox.  You can download it and see instructions for installing it on this page:
https://www.blindbargains.com/bargains.php?m=15142
 
As far as Firefox goes, if you use an old version of Firefox portable, you can continue to use your current version of Firefox for general browsing and use Firefox portable for sites you want to solve captchas with.  I know the last version you can use with Webvisum is Firefox 52ESR.  You can download the portable version here:
https://portableapps.com/downloading/?a=FirefoxPortableLegacy52&n=Mozilla%20Firefox,%20Portable%20Edition%20Legacy%20%2052&s=s&p=&d=pa&f=FirefoxPortableLegacy52_52.9.0_English.paf.exe
 
Run the installer.  It is a portable version so it won't put anything on your machine but the program.  Open the folder where the program is, and find the exe file.  Press enter and the program will run.  Make a shortcut on the desktop and assign a shortcut key for convenient running.
Probably just typing f once in the folder will take you to the exe file.
 
Before you use Webvisum, you will have to set up an account on the Webvisum site:
https://www.webvisum.com/
 
At some point, you will have to ask on list for an invitation.  The site isn't monitored by the developer any longer and you can't get an invitation there.
 
Gene
 

Sent: Sunday, January 26, 2020 5:20 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Web Capture

I need a n v d a. addon for captcha

On 1/26/20, Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:
> CAPTCHA Be Gone is no longer available.  Webvisum works with old versions of
> Firefox, if you want to try it.  I can provide more information if you are
> interested.  I don't know if it will work with the captchas you want to
> solve.  And the name is c a p t c h a, not capture.
>
> Gene
> ----- Original Message -----
>
> From: Chikodinaka mr. Oguledo
> Sent: Sunday, January 26, 2020 4:42 AM
> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
> Subject: Re: [nvda] Web Capture
>
>
> captcha begone nvdaNVDA. style or a addOn my viewpoint Please tell
> NVDA addon maniger josofe leee
>
> On 1/26/20, Stephen <whocrazy@...> wrote:
>> I've encountered something like this on the steam platform.  It's
>> horrible.
>> At 04:32 PM 1/26/2020, you wrote:
>>>Something that is NVDA friendly and will read those pesky things
>>>which you are expected to enter as a response on a webpage to prove
>>>you are a genuine person and not some form of robot.
>>>There was once something called Rumola or some such.
>>>One of the major probs is that the capture graphic or whatever it is
>>>only inhabits the screen for a short time.
>>>Any ideas?
>>>Andrea
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>
>


Re: nvda in safe mode

 

On Sun, Jan 26, 2020 at 06:52 PM, Oriana wrote:
I apologize for contributing to the stray. I get focused on solving a problem and don't even realize it's not the right place for it.
S'alright.  It happens occasionally.  I'm just eternally grateful when participants realize it's happened and seek out other venues.

By the way, if you're a Linux geek who wants to do file recovery, even from a drive that was running under Windows, have a look at ddrescue.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

Power is being told you're not loved and not being destroyed by it.

       ~ Madonna

 

 

Re: Web Capture

David Goldfield
 

For Google Chrome and Chromium based browsers I use Rumola for solving captcha challenges. Signing up with a Rumola account is not the most intuitive process but it's well worth it. The service provides five free solves but the pricing for additional solves is very reasonable, something like $.99 for fifty and $1.99 for 100.

David Goldfield,
Blindness Assistive Technology Specialist
JAWS Certified, 2019

WWW.DavidGoldfield.org
On 1/26/2020 6:28 AM, Gene wrote:

The only one is for older versions of Firefox.  You can download it and see instructions for installing it on this page:
https://www.blindbargains.com/bargains.php?m=15142
 
As far as Firefox goes, if you use an old version of Firefox portable, you can continue to use your current version of Firefox for general browsing and use Firefox portable for sites you want to solve captchas with.  I know the last version you can use with Webvisum is Firefox 52ESR.  You can download the portable version here:
https://portableapps.com/downloading/?a=FirefoxPortableLegacy52&n=Mozilla%20Firefox,%20Portable%20Edition%20Legacy%20%2052&s=s&p=&d=pa&f=FirefoxPortableLegacy52_52.9.0_English.paf.exe
 
Run the installer.  It is a portable version so it won't put anything on your machine but the program.  Open the folder where the program is, and find the exe file.  Press enter and the program will run.  Make a shortcut on the desktop and assign a shortcut key for convenient running.
Probably just typing f once in the folder will take you to the exe file.
 
Before you use Webvisum, you will have to set up an account on the Webvisum site:
https://www.webvisum.com/
 
At some point, you will have to ask on list for an invitation.  The site isn't monitored by the developer any longer and you can't get an invitation there.
 
Gene
 

Sent: Sunday, January 26, 2020 5:20 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Web Capture

I need a n v d a. addon for captcha

On 1/26/20, Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:
> CAPTCHA Be Gone is no longer available.  Webvisum works with old versions of
> Firefox, if you want to try it.  I can provide more information if you are
> interested.  I don't know if it will work with the captchas you want to
> solve.  And the name is c a p t c h a, not capture.
>
> Gene
> ----- Original Message -----
>
> From: Chikodinaka mr. Oguledo
> Sent: Sunday, January 26, 2020 4:42 AM
> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
> Subject: Re: [nvda] Web Capture
>
>
> captcha begone nvdaNVDA. style or a addOn my viewpoint Please tell
> NVDA addon maniger josofe leee
>
> On 1/26/20, Stephen <whocrazy@...> wrote:
>> I've encountered something like this on the steam platform.  It's
>> horrible.
>> At 04:32 PM 1/26/2020, you wrote:
>>>Something that is NVDA friendly and will read those pesky things
>>>which you are expected to enter as a response on a webpage to prove
>>>you are a genuine person and not some form of robot.
>>>There was once something called Rumola or some such.
>>>One of the major probs is that the capture graphic or whatever it is
>>>only inhabits the screen for a short time.
>>>Any ideas?
>>>Andrea
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>
>


Re: nvda in safe mode

Gene
 

I want to clarify and explain a few points.  This will probably be my last message in the thread because I've probably said all I have to say on the subject.
 
First, when you talk about System restore, are you talking about running a restore point or using previous versions?  I'm not advocating using previous versions first if you want to try to get back some files that are there and some that aren't.  In that case, you should use a file recovery program and then use Previous versions if the file recovery program doesn't recover some files that Previous versions has.  But considering how lax so many people are at backing things up, it is important that they know about it. 
 
Shadow copy can be valuable aside from restoring files. Let's say someone backs up files by making disk images.  You can't look at individual files in a disk image.  If the person wants to look at a previous version of something such as a document, but she has saved newer copies and no longer has the older version  in her current files, the person can look at it using previous versions.  You can open the file from current versions without restoring it.  So you can easily compare the two versions.  You can have both opened if you wish. 
 
Shadow copy shouldn't be used as a way to avoid backing things up.  it isn't a backup.  But it is one more feature that may be useful and that people should know about, though most people don't.
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
From-: Oriana
Sent: Sunday, January 26, 2020 5:34 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] nvda in safe mode

Gene,

This is definitely a ymmv situation. I've attempted to use system restore to recover files before, as you keep advising, and not only did it not work, it wrote over the data so i was unable to use any other non-hardware-based recovery option - the box was not checked by default on that PC. If you know shadow copies exist, then they might work for you, but if there is any uncertainty, do not attempt system restore or any method that requires downloads or hard drive writes until backup is complete. That is my personal experience.



On Sun, Jan 26, 2020, 5:56 PM Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:
Shadow copy isn't a backup, but it is a part of system restore and it does allow recovery of deleted files or access to earlier versions, if desired.  I can use Shadow Copy to open a file that is an earlier version without restoring it.  it can be opened directly from where it is in Shadow Copy. 
 
I am not advocating using it instead of a backup.  But it is a very useful feature.  I once deleted something the day after I recorded it because I didn't think I needed it any longer.  I found that I had been wrong and I was able to recover it with Shadow Copy because, fortunately, System Restore had made a restore point while it was on the disk.  I hadn't backed it up because I erroneously thought I had already edited it and saved and backed up the edited version.
 
Also, there may be times when you want to open an earlier version of something without restoring it from a backup. You may want to compare versions.
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Sunday, January 26, 2020 4:39 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] nvda in safe mode

To be clear, I am not proposing using volume shadow copies.

One should be taking full system image backups using the third-party tool of one's choosing, which is what Microsoft recommends, as well as parallel separate user data backups, which can be using that same third-party tool or Microsoft's own File History if running Windows 8.1 or 10.

System Protection (of which System Restore is a part) has never been intended as a full-recovery utility (which would include user data) and is notoriously flaky.  It's focus is allowing the system to be rolled back in the event that, for instance, a bad new driver were installed that breaks something.  It rolls back the state of the system registry and certain underlying support folders in the Windows hierarchy.  It, as Jackie has already noted, has never, ever been involved in user data backup or recovery. 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

Power is being told you're not loved and not being destroyed by it.

       ~ Madonna

 

 

Re: can't play an internet station using waterfox

Kwork
 

And Waterfox isn't patching as quickly as it used to so I've mostly moved on to more Chromium based browsers such as the new Microsoft Edge, Brave, and Google Chrome itself. Even Firefox is working better now on modern streams than Waterfox. Disney Plus and Netflix will no longer stream for me using Waterfox, but will provide errors instead.

Travis

On 1/26/2020 12:25 AM, Gene wrote:
Did you try another browser?  Sometimes, you just have to use something else for a reason you may never know.  No one program may meet every need in a certain category of use. 
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Saturday, January 25, 2020 10:31 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] can't play an internet station using waterfox

I don't have an android device.

 

 

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Oriana
Sent: Saturday, January 25, 2020 8:28 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] can't play an internet station using waterfox

 

That being said, the stream for Android works for my Android device.

 

On Sat, Jan 25, 2020, 11:27 PM Oriana Neulinger <o.neulinger@...> wrote:

This doesn't display on the html version of the website (typo on the closing bracket of the first horizontal rule, if anyone cares), but above the first line of the website it says "We are currently offline for software updates".

 

On Sat, Jan 25, 2020, 11:21 PM Rosemarie Chavarria <knitqueen2007@...> wrote:

www.thegridfm.com.

 

 

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Brian Vogel
Sent: Saturday, January 25, 2020 8:20 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] can't play an internet station using waterfox

 

There appear to be a number of URLs that get you to this station.  Could you please share the address you're using?

--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

Power is being told you're not loved and not being destroyed by it.

       ~ Madonna

 

 

Re: nvda in safe mode

Oriana
 

I apologize for contributing to the stray. I get focused on solving a problem and don't even realize it's not the right place for it. I'll stop.


On Sun, Jan 26, 2020, 6:20 PM Brian Vogel <britechguy@...> wrote:
Martin,

         Thanks much for your recognition that this topic has now strayed far, far away from NVDA.  Presuming you are using Windows 10, you could ask on the Windows 10 for Screen Reader Users group:

Even if it's not Windows 10, what you're seeking advice on predates Windows 10 itself, but is still pertinent there.

Re: nvda in safe mode

Oriana
 

Martin,

Unfortunately you will most likely have to use "forensic" methods of file recovery in order to recover the radio programming data. Similar to unix, using the command line to delete files in Windows bypasses the recycle bin. I don't think there's a security overwrite, however, unless you use a third-party program. The good news is that a live-boot forensic recovery program (or data recovery program as we've been referring to it) should also be able to restore the missing system files, although if that fails you will need to prepare to reinstall Windows.

File recovery software will work regardless of which drive the files are in, and it will recover whatever has not been overwritten, exactly the way it was at deletion, not at some point in the past during the last backup point. If there was any kind of "security overwrite", only a magnetic hard drive scanner would be able to recover the files, and those are too expensive for mainstream use - my original recommendation for a certified PC repair expert becomes the only option for recovery at that point, and even then, not every PC repair place will have such a device. The manufacturer would be another good point of reference, possibly able to recommend a third party repair even if the PC is not under warranty.

For programs that can be used to recover the files:

I've mentioned CCleaner's Recuva, but that's a windows program and I'm uncertain as to how to even live boot into a windows environment, regardless of accessibility. As you already have familiarity with unix, perhaps building a rescue drive using something like Vinux, Sonar, or Talking Arch flavors of Linux, which are optimized for screen-reading and braille displays, would be a good starting point for recovery, as you could then use any Linux industry standard file recovery programs, which are, to my understanding, more powerful than windows-based ones anyway.

On Sun, Jan 26, 2020, 6:04 PM Martin McCormick <martin.m@...> wrote:
        What I have read so far only mentions a special form of
del that is a security-oriented form which apparently destroys
the file and any file deleted that way is pretty much a goner but
whether or not it is done  one at a time or by batch file is never
mentioned.

        I really hope not to have to use Safe Mode.  The system
continued to run after my accident though I got some messages
from browsers that indicated I zapped data files in my home
directory which need to be brought back.

        I looked at further messages as I wrote this one and what
everybody is saying is valid but when files are deleted, they are
first moved to Recycle where they sit until either someone or process
empties the bin at which point, you really do make the job of
recovery much more difficult and dangerous or if you use the
Recycle Bin, the file just gets moved back from where it came.

        Fortunately, these are user files, not system files.

        Let 's make sure I am accessing the recycle bin correctly.

        It's a Tree View when you hit Enter on Recycle Bin.

        In a perfect world, there would be a Recovery engine that
would say "Where are the files to be recovered?" You might even
be given buttons that say "backup media, Recycle Bin" and you
pick 1 and probably should be given a recovery criteria in which
you can tell it everything that was deleted 24 or less hours ago.

        What I can't seem to find anywhere is actual file names
or anyway to copy them anywhere or do anything else for that
matter.

        All the articles say how easy this is which makes me
think that I'm looking in the wrong place or the absence of some
of those missing files is confusing the restore process.

        Is there a mailing list similar to this one only about
Windows, specifically?  I appreciate the knowledge and answers so
far, but NVDA is only tangentially related to this problem.

        As a unix command-line junky for 30 years, deleting files
does create a situation in which forensic methods are needed to
bring them back and the only unix-based platform I know of that
also has a trash bin does initially move deleted files to it
until you empty the bin and that's pretty much that.  That
platform is the Mac.

        If your deleted file is still in the bin, you can copy it
out but when it's gone from there, it isn't worth the risk and
possible trouble.

        Several articles I found on line say that Windows7 to 10
to first move deleted files to the bin.

"Gene" <gsasner@...> writes:
> I just did a little looking online.  I found information relating to
> using cmd in XP but in the small amount of searching I did, nothing that
> discussed Windows 10.  But I don't see why this would have changed.  The
> del command in XP doesn't send files to the recycle bin.  it just deletes
> them.  I read parts of one or two discussions about how to have files
> sent to the recycle bin when using cmd but they were for XP, and other
> old versions of Windows.  What is discussed may apply to Windows 10 but I
> don't know.
>
> Evidently it isn't the use of a batch file that causes this behavior, as
> I thought, but use of the del command either manually entered or in a
> batch file, if nothing is done to change this behavior.
>
> Gene



Re: nvda in safe mode

Oriana
 

Gene,

This is definitely a ymmv situation. I've attempted to use system restore to recover files before, as you keep advising, and not only did it not work, it wrote over the data so i was unable to use any other non-hardware-based recovery option - the box was not checked by default on that PC. If you know shadow copies exist, then they might work for you, but if there is any uncertainty, do not attempt system restore or any method that requires downloads or hard drive writes until backup is complete. That is my personal experience.



On Sun, Jan 26, 2020, 5:56 PM Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:
Shadow copy isn't a backup, but it is a part of system restore and it does allow recovery of deleted files or access to earlier versions, if desired.  I can use Shadow Copy to open a file that is an earlier version without restoring it.  it can be opened directly from where it is in Shadow Copy. 
 
I am not advocating using it instead of a backup.  But it is a very useful feature.  I once deleted something the day after I recorded it because I didn't think I needed it any longer.  I found that I had been wrong and I was able to recover it with Shadow Copy because, fortunately, System Restore had made a restore point while it was on the disk.  I hadn't backed it up because I erroneously thought I had already edited it and saved and backed up the edited version.
 
Also, there may be times when you want to open an earlier version of something without restoring it from a backup. You may want to compare versions.
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Sunday, January 26, 2020 4:39 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] nvda in safe mode

To be clear, I am not proposing using volume shadow copies.

One should be taking full system image backups using the third-party tool of one's choosing, which is what Microsoft recommends, as well as parallel separate user data backups, which can be using that same third-party tool or Microsoft's own File History if running Windows 8.1 or 10.

System Protection (of which System Restore is a part) has never been intended as a full-recovery utility (which would include user data) and is notoriously flaky.  It's focus is allowing the system to be rolled back in the event that, for instance, a bad new driver were installed that breaks something.  It rolls back the state of the system registry and certain underlying support folders in the Windows hierarchy.  It, as Jackie has already noted, has never, ever been involved in user data backup or recovery. 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

Power is being told you're not loved and not being destroyed by it.

       ~ Madonna

 

 

Re: nvda in safe mode

 

Martin,

         Thanks much for your recognition that this topic has now strayed far, far away from NVDA.  Presuming you are using Windows 10, you could ask on the Windows 10 for Screen Reader Users group:

Even if it's not Windows 10, what you're seeking advice on predates Windows 10 itself, but is still pertinent there.

Re: nvda in safe mode

Martin McCormick
 

What I have read so far only mentions a special form of
del that is a security-oriented form which apparently destroys
the file and any file deleted that way is pretty much a goner but
whether or not it is done one at a time or by batch file is never
mentioned.

I really hope not to have to use Safe Mode. The system
continued to run after my accident though I got some messages
from browsers that indicated I zapped data files in my home
directory which need to be brought back.

I looked at further messages as I wrote this one and what
everybody is saying is valid but when files are deleted, they are
first moved to Recycle where they sit until either someone or process
empties the bin at which point, you really do make the job of
recovery much more difficult and dangerous or if you use the
Recycle Bin, the file just gets moved back from where it came.

Fortunately, these are user files, not system files.

Let 's make sure I am accessing the recycle bin correctly.

It's a Tree View when you hit Enter on Recycle Bin.

In a perfect world, there would be a Recovery engine that
would say "Where are the files to be recovered?" You might even
be given buttons that say "backup media, Recycle Bin" and you
pick 1 and probably should be given a recovery criteria in which
you can tell it everything that was deleted 24 or less hours ago.

What I can't seem to find anywhere is actual file names
or anyway to copy them anywhere or do anything else for that
matter.

All the articles say how easy this is which makes me
think that I'm looking in the wrong place or the absence of some
of those missing files is confusing the restore process.

Is there a mailing list similar to this one only about
Windows, specifically? I appreciate the knowledge and answers so
far, but NVDA is only tangentially related to this problem.

As a unix command-line junky for 30 years, deleting files
does create a situation in which forensic methods are needed to
bring them back and the only unix-based platform I know of that
also has a trash bin does initially move deleted files to it
until you empty the bin and that's pretty much that. That
platform is the Mac.

If your deleted file is still in the bin, you can copy it
out but when it's gone from there, it isn't worth the risk and
possible trouble.

Several articles I found on line say that Windows7 to 10
to first move deleted files to the bin.

"Gene" <gsasner@...> writes:

I just did a little looking online. I found information relating to
using cmd in XP but in the small amount of searching I did, nothing that
discussed Windows 10. But I don't see why this would have changed. The
del command in XP doesn't send files to the recycle bin. it just deletes
them. I read parts of one or two discussions about how to have files
sent to the recycle bin when using cmd but they were for XP, and other
old versions of Windows. What is discussed may apply to Windows 10 but I
don't know.

Evidently it isn't the use of a batch file that causes this behavior, as
I thought, but use of the del command either manually entered or in a
batch file, if nothing is done to change this behavior.

Gene

Re: NVDA and audible

Abbie Taylor <abbietaylor945@...>
 

Val, in my opinion, this is definitely an appropriate question and a good one. As far as I know, there's no add-on for the Audible app, but the Audible website works pretty well with NVDA. I hope that answers your question.
--
Abbie Johnson Taylor, Author
http://www.abbiejohnsontaylor.com
http://abbiescorner.wordpress.com
abbietaylor945@...

Re: nvda in safe mode

Gene
 

Shadow copy isn't a backup, but it is a part of system restore and it does allow recovery of deleted files or access to earlier versions, if desired.  I can use Shadow Copy to open a file that is an earlier version without restoring it.  it can be opened directly from where it is in Shadow Copy. 
 
I am not advocating using it instead of a backup.  But it is a very useful feature.  I once deleted something the day after I recorded it because I didn't think I needed it any longer.  I found that I had been wrong and I was able to recover it with Shadow Copy because, fortunately, System Restore had made a restore point while it was on the disk.  I hadn't backed it up because I erroneously thought I had already edited it and saved and backed up the edited version.
 
Also, there may be times when you want to open an earlier version of something without restoring it from a backup. You may want to compare versions.
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Sunday, January 26, 2020 4:39 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] nvda in safe mode

To be clear, I am not proposing using volume shadow copies.

One should be taking full system image backups using the third-party tool of one's choosing, which is what Microsoft recommends, as well as parallel separate user data backups, which can be using that same third-party tool or Microsoft's own File History if running Windows 8.1 or 10.

System Protection (of which System Restore is a part) has never been intended as a full-recovery utility (which would include user data) and is notoriously flaky.  It's focus is allowing the system to be rolled back in the event that, for instance, a bad new driver were installed that breaks something.  It rolls back the state of the system registry and certain underlying support folders in the Windows hierarchy.  It, as Jackie has already noted, has never, ever been involved in user data backup or recovery. 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

Power is being told you're not loved and not being destroyed by it.

       ~ Madonna

 

 

Re: nvda in safe mode

Oriana
 

Brian,

I agree: "at least some" file recovery using "non-damaging" live-boot data recovery software onto removable media is the safest option in OPs case, and third-party backups onto dedicated removable media is always the best option in the long-term. And after recovering most of the 60GB of radio programming data, a "damaging" method such as system restore might help resolve/recreate the user path.

My reference post regarding VSS was to clarify Gene's proposal for same-hard-drive recovery, which might have uses between full backups or if no removable media is available. As a standard feature, it seems that VSS is used primarily for server-style or networked windows systems, which i am very unfamiliar with, but these systems typically cannot be taken offline for weekly backups, they typically contain redundant hard drives in order to prevent complete loss due to hardware failure, and they often have dedicated and experienced caretakers who can transfer the shadow copies to removable media, as needed. It doesn't seem well-implemented for home users.


On Sun, Jan 26, 2020, 5:39 PM Brian Vogel <britechguy@...> wrote:
To be clear, I am not proposing using volume shadow copies.

One should be taking full system image backups using the third-party tool of one's choosing, which is what Microsoft recommends, as well as parallel separate user data backups, which can be using that same third-party tool or Microsoft's own File History if running Windows 8.1 or 10.

System Protection (of which System Restore is a part) has never been intended as a full-recovery utility (which would include user data) and is notoriously flaky.  It's focus is allowing the system to be rolled back in the event that, for instance, a bad new driver were installed that breaks something.  It rolls back the state of the system registry and certain underlying support folders in the Windows hierarchy.  It, as Jackie has already noted, has never, ever been involved in user data backup or recovery. 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

Power is being told you're not loved and not being destroyed by it.

       ~ Madonna

 

 

Re: nvda in safe mode

Gene
 

From the article you linked to:
Every time a system restore point is created, you will have a valid shadow copy. 
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Sunday, January 26, 2020 4:37 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] nvda in safe mode

Have you looked in folder or drive properties to see if previous versions is in the properties dialog? 
 
In Windows 7, unless something causes System Restore to create a restore point more frequently, it creates one once a week.  the check box you mention is on by default.  And Shadow copy makes a backup of files when System Restore automatically runs once a week.  I haven't checked to see if restore points have previous versions available if one is made as the result of installing a program or for some other reason.  it doesn't seem plausible, however, that Shadow Copy would distinguish between how a restore point is made, though I am telling you what makes sense to me, I have no way of checking in Windows 10 and I would have to do something like install a program to check in Windows 7.
 
I have never seen anything in discussions of Shadow copy distinguishing between how a restore point is made.
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
From: Oriana
Sent: Sunday, January 26, 2020 4:30 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] nvda in safe mode

For future reference, volume shadow copy seems to be what happens when you run a manual or manually scheduled backup using Windows Backup where you've checked the box that says "save user files", and it only succeeds if the Volume Shadow Copy Service (VSS) is running at the time of the backup. The automatic Windows Backup/Restore run during patches and upgrades does not include user files, which is why i was unaware of this extra backup service at all. It also seems that restoring a shadow copy cannot be done through Windows Restore as Windows removed the GUI in Windows 8, although i may be mistaken as to the usage, or it may have been reimplemented in Windows 10. Here is a link describing two methods of recovering deleted files using shadow copies - but again, this only works if you know you've been creating shadow copies to begin with.


On Sun, Jan 26, 2020, 5:14 PM Brian Vogel <britechguy@...> wrote:
One would absolutely need to use a file recovery utility to get data back under these circumstances.  And when one is doing file recovery you never, ever, ever, attempt to recover to the same drive that you originally had the data on.  It's always recovered to a second drive to prevent the need to write anything to the drive being recovered from.  Ideally, in an instance like this, the recovery would be booted from USB or DVD-ROM so that absolutely no write activity is needed on the original drive.

And not to rub salt in an open wound, but this is a teachable moment:  this is but one of the myriad ways in which data can be lost on any given drive.  The only thing that comes close to an assurance of having data be "un-losable" is having a external backup drive and a regular, cyclic backup routine - with on-demand backups when you have any unusual high number of new files created in a very short period of time, e.g., uploading thousands of photos or ripping many CDs at one time.  If one has really, really critical and precious data, then one should be taking two backups to two different drives (whether one is physical and the other on the cloud, or both physical).  And one of those two backups should not be in the same physical location as either the computer being backed up or the other backup media.  Were you to have a flood, fire, or the like if all your data is in one physical location then it's all likely lost.

--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

Power is being told you're not loved and not being destroyed by it.

       ~ Madonna

 

 

Re: nvda in safe mode

 

To be clear, I am not proposing using volume shadow copies.

One should be taking full system image backups using the third-party tool of one's choosing, which is what Microsoft recommends, as well as parallel separate user data backups, which can be using that same third-party tool or Microsoft's own File History if running Windows 8.1 or 10.

System Protection (of which System Restore is a part) has never been intended as a full-recovery utility (which would include user data) and is notoriously flaky.  It's focus is allowing the system to be rolled back in the event that, for instance, a bad new driver were installed that breaks something.  It rolls back the state of the system registry and certain underlying support folders in the Windows hierarchy.  It, as Jackie has already noted, has never, ever been involved in user data backup or recovery. 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

Power is being told you're not loved and not being destroyed by it.

       ~ Madonna

 

 

Re: nvda in safe mode

Gene
 

Have you looked in folder or drive properties to see if previous versions is in the properties dialog? 
 
In Windows 7, unless something causes System Restore to create a restore point more frequently, it creates one once a week.  the check box you mention is on by default.  And Shadow copy makes a backup of files when System Restore automatically runs once a week.  I haven't checked to see if restore points have previous versions available if one is made as the result of installing a program or for some other reason.  it doesn't seem plausible, however, that Shadow Copy would distinguish between how a restore point is made, though I am telling you what makes sense to me, I have no way of checking in Windows 10 and I would have to do something like install a program to check in Windows 7.
 
I have never seen anything in discussions of Shadow copy distinguishing between how a restore point is made.
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
From: Oriana
Sent: Sunday, January 26, 2020 4:30 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] nvda in safe mode

For future reference, volume shadow copy seems to be what happens when you run a manual or manually scheduled backup using Windows Backup where you've checked the box that says "save user files", and it only succeeds if the Volume Shadow Copy Service (VSS) is running at the time of the backup. The automatic Windows Backup/Restore run during patches and upgrades does not include user files, which is why i was unaware of this extra backup service at all. It also seems that restoring a shadow copy cannot be done through Windows Restore as Windows removed the GUI in Windows 8, although i may be mistaken as to the usage, or it may have been reimplemented in Windows 10. Here is a link describing two methods of recovering deleted files using shadow copies - but again, this only works if you know you've been creating shadow copies to begin with.


On Sun, Jan 26, 2020, 5:14 PM Brian Vogel <britechguy@...> wrote:
One would absolutely need to use a file recovery utility to get data back under these circumstances.  And when one is doing file recovery you never, ever, ever, attempt to recover to the same drive that you originally had the data on.  It's always recovered to a second drive to prevent the need to write anything to the drive being recovered from.  Ideally, in an instance like this, the recovery would be booted from USB or DVD-ROM so that absolutely no write activity is needed on the original drive.

And not to rub salt in an open wound, but this is a teachable moment:  this is but one of the myriad ways in which data can be lost on any given drive.  The only thing that comes close to an assurance of having data be "un-losable" is having a external backup drive and a regular, cyclic backup routine - with on-demand backups when you have any unusual high number of new files created in a very short period of time, e.g., uploading thousands of photos or ripping many CDs at one time.  If one has really, really critical and precious data, then one should be taking two backups to two different drives (whether one is physical and the other on the cloud, or both physical).  And one of those two backups should not be in the same physical location as either the computer being backed up or the other backup media.  Were you to have a flood, fire, or the like if all your data is in one physical location then it's all likely lost.

--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

Power is being told you're not loved and not being destroyed by it.

       ~ Madonna

 

 

Re: nvda in safe mode

Oriana
 

For future reference, volume shadow copy seems to be what happens when you run a manual or manually scheduled backup using Windows Backup where you've checked the box that says "save user files", and it only succeeds if the Volume Shadow Copy Service (VSS) is running at the time of the backup. The automatic Windows Backup/Restore run during patches and upgrades does not include user files, which is why i was unaware of this extra backup service at all. It also seems that restoring a shadow copy cannot be done through Windows Restore as Windows removed the GUI in Windows 8, although i may be mistaken as to the usage, or it may have been reimplemented in Windows 10. Here is a link describing two methods of recovering deleted files using shadow copies - but again, this only works if you know you've been creating shadow copies to begin with.


On Sun, Jan 26, 2020, 5:14 PM Brian Vogel <britechguy@...> wrote:
One would absolutely need to use a file recovery utility to get data back under these circumstances.  And when one is doing file recovery you never, ever, ever, attempt to recover to the same drive that you originally had the data on.  It's always recovered to a second drive to prevent the need to write anything to the drive being recovered from.  Ideally, in an instance like this, the recovery would be booted from USB or DVD-ROM so that absolutely no write activity is needed on the original drive.

And not to rub salt in an open wound, but this is a teachable moment:  this is but one of the myriad ways in which data can be lost on any given drive.  The only thing that comes close to an assurance of having data be "un-losable" is having a external backup drive and a regular, cyclic backup routine - with on-demand backups when you have any unusual high number of new files created in a very short period of time, e.g., uploading thousands of photos or ripping many CDs at one time.  If one has really, really critical and precious data, then one should be taking two backups to two different drives (whether one is physical and the other on the cloud, or both physical).  And one of those two backups should not be in the same physical location as either the computer being backed up or the other backup media.  Were you to have a flood, fire, or the like if all your data is in one physical location then it's all likely lost.

--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

Power is being told you're not loved and not being destroyed by it.

       ~ Madonna

 

 

Re: Using Open audible

Val Temp <val.paul2005@...>
 

Hi David!

Many thanks for all the information.


Val.

On 26/01/2020 18:30, David Griffith wrote:
That is very helpful.
Many thanks.
David Griffith

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Pele West
Sent: 26 January 2020 18:20
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Using Open audible

Hi David and Everyone

Below are the instructions for installing Open Audible. I did not make a note of who originally posted this information, but I have modified the format of the text slightly.

Pele West

To install using defaults assuming the installation is on the first screen:

1. Run the Open Audible Install File

2. Press <Enter> 3 times after the screen reader has finished reading out a progress bar

3. Press <Tab> 3 times

4. Press <Enter>

5. Wait a minute or so for the files to be copied, then pres <Tab> twice

6. Press <Enter>

OpenAudible should start up.








Re: nvda in safe mode

 

One would absolutely need to use a file recovery utility to get data back under these circumstances.  And when one is doing file recovery you never, ever, ever, attempt to recover to the same drive that you originally had the data on.  It's always recovered to a second drive to prevent the need to write anything to the drive being recovered from.  Ideally, in an instance like this, the recovery would be booted from USB or DVD-ROM so that absolutely no write activity is needed on the original drive.

And not to rub salt in an open wound, but this is a teachable moment:  this is but one of the myriad ways in which data can be lost on any given drive.  The only thing that comes close to an assurance of having data be "un-losable" is having a external backup drive and a regular, cyclic backup routine - with on-demand backups when you have any unusual high number of new files created in a very short period of time, e.g., uploading thousands of photos or ripping many CDs at one time.  If one has really, really critical and precious data, then one should be taking two backups to two different drives (whether one is physical and the other on the cloud, or both physical).  And one of those two backups should not be in the same physical location as either the computer being backed up or the other backup media.  Were you to have a flood, fire, or the like if all your data is in one physical location then it's all likely lost.

--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

Power is being told you're not loved and not being destroyed by it.

       ~ Madonna