Date   

Re: java vs java script (was regression with adobe flash

Gene
 

I should begin by saying that there may be new developments regarding Mozilla discontinuing Flash.  But that was the reasonably current material found with a Google search as a very early result.  I didn't look further because I believe it will likely create great confusion and discontent to completely block Flash.  But, as I said, there may be newer developments and I may be wrong.  Perhaps under pressure, the transition will occur more quickly than I think. 
 
Second, perhaps Google will completely block Flash near the end of next year.  We'll see.  If they do so, and many sites still use Flash and not HTML5, there may be many unhappy users.  II'm not convinced that the transition to HTML5 will proceed quickly enough for Google to do what it appears to say it will when it says it will.  We'll see.
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Saturday, December 03, 2016 7:47 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] java vs java script (was regression with adobe flash

And, speaking of trend micro, here's another article on their site talking about google, and how it plans to eliminate flash from chrome by the end of the year.

http://www.trendmicro.com/vinfo/us/security/news/vulnerabilities-and-exploits/google-chrome-to-kill-flash-for-new-version-of-chrome


On 12/3/2016 8:41 AM, Travis Siegel wrote:

You're talking about a browser plugin for java, not java the stand-alone programming language.  Oracle is phasing out support for browsers with this plugin (which a lot of browsers already removed), but this in no way impacts java the programming language itself.  Installing java the programming language is no more a security risk than installing c++ or pascal, or any number of other programming languages.

If you want more details, you can see this link:
http://www.trendmicro.com/vinfo/us/security/news/vulnerabilities-and-exploits/oracle-finally-kills-java-browser-plugin

On 12/3/2016 8:17 AM, Gene wrote:
That is not correct.  JAVA, the program, has been considered a security risk for quite some time if you leave the JAVA program plugin active that JAVA, the program, places in your browser.  I won't repeat the comments I made in another message but in case people aren't following the thread carefully, I'm commenting here again that JAVA, the program is a security threat.
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Saturday, December 03, 2016 6:11 AM
Subject: [nvda] java vs java script (was regression with adobe flash

Let me clear something up here.  The problems folks were having with
security related browser issues were related to javascript, not java. 
Java is not javascript, they're simply two things with similar names. 
Java is a programming language that is cross platform, and has very good
security, including java applets that can run in the browser.

On the other hand, javascript is simply a scripting language that runs
inside a browser (very similar to php, only php runs on the server, not
in the browser), that allows the web page to do all kinds of things.  In
the case of javascript, with some security exploits, folks were able to
get access to things they weren't supposed to have access to on your
machine.  That's why for a while, many sites were recommending turning
off java in your browser.  What they meant was to turn off javascript,
but some sites didn't make the distinction, and as a result, java got a
bad rap for something it had nothing at all to do with.

Don't confuse java (the programming language) with javascript (the
scripting language).

Turning off javascript in your browser is going to break a *lot* (and I
mean a lot) of sites, so it's not really recommended, especially since
most of the browsers have been updated to patch the security holes found
in javascript.

Just wanted to clarify this point, since it seems lots of folks are
still java shy, when it had nothing to do with the security exploits
that were reaking so much havoc a couple years ago.


On 12/3/2016 3:18 AM, nasrin khaksar wrote:
> hi.
> i recommend you not to use java and flash for there security problems.
> i never dont install and use them and i did not see any problem for this.
>








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This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
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This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
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Re: java vs java script (was regression with adobe flash

David <trailerdavid@...>
 

Or, let us have things really cleared up.


Java, and yes I mean the program, nothing else, is for long known to -
and according to computer security personal from upper level - have
severe security risks. For one example, I will tell you that all the
banks locally here, in the past used the JAVA routines for logging in to
your personal banking sites. They claimed it was necessary, for your
security. And, they used Java, namely to make their services
multi-platformed.


Today, absolutely none of them do use the JAVA routines any longer.
Reason? The security holes found in the software from Oracle or Sun, if
you want. Do a search on the net, and you will see clear evidence that
the JAVA has security holes, and has been discontinued for good reasons
with many developers. Even computer geek sites, do clearly warn against
even just having the Java installed on your computer, since some of the
software elements will pose the risk to your system, even if you do not
actively use Java at the moment.


Hope things got a bit clearer.


David

On 12/3/2016 1:11 PM, Travis Siegel wrote:
Let me clear something up here. The problems folks were having with
security related browser issues were related to javascript, not java.
Java is not javascript, they're simply two things with similar names.
Java is a programming language that is cross platform, and has very
good security, including java applets that can run in the browser.

On the other hand, javascript is simply a scripting language that runs
inside a browser (very similar to php, only php runs on the server,
not in the browser), that allows the web page to do all kinds of
things. In the case of javascript, with some security exploits, folks
were able to get access to things they weren't supposed to have access
to on your machine. That's why for a while, many sites were
recommending turning off java in your browser. What they meant was to
turn off javascript, but some sites didn't make the distinction, and
as a result, java got a bad rap for something it had nothing at all to
do with.

Don't confuse java (the programming language) with javascript (the
scripting language).

Turning off javascript in your browser is going to break a *lot* (and
I mean a lot) of sites, so it's not really recommended, especially
since most of the browsers have been updated to patch the security
holes found in javascript.

Just wanted to clarify this point, since it seems lots of folks are
still java shy, when it had nothing to do with the security exploits
that were reaking so much havoc a couple years ago.


On 12/3/2016 3:18 AM, nasrin khaksar wrote:
hi.
i recommend you not to use java and flash for there security problems.
i never dont install and use them and i did not see any problem for
this.




.


Re: regression with adobe flash

Brice Mijares
 

Now I'm confused, I don't remember if it was Adobe flash, or Java Script in that article stating one of the two was not going to work at all in FX by summer of 2017.

On 12/3/2016 5:36 AM, Brice Mijares wrote:
I read some where last week where FX will prevent adobe flash from
working by summer of 2017.

On 12/3/2016 12:18 AM, nasrin khaksar wrote:
hi.
i recommend you not to use java and flash for there security problems.
i never dont install and use them and i did not see any problem for this.

On 12/3/16, Sharni-Lee Ward <sharni-lee.ward@hotmail.com> wrote:
I think OP wants an answer to their problem. I will try this with Chrome
later, and I apologise for hijacking the thread.


OP is having an issue I had previously that was fixed by "Kill
Windowless
Flash", which was a useful script but no longer seems to be working with
current Firefox. NVDA doesn't let you into certain embedded objects
if you
don't have this script, instead saying "Embedded Object Unavailable." Is
there a fix for this that doesn't involve the apparently defunct "Kill
Windowless Flash" Greasemonkey script?

On 3/12/2016 4:41 PM, enes sarıbaş wrote:

hi,

let me clerify a point. Flash isn't crashing. Rather, nvda is failing to
access the object. A situation directly the fault of nvda.

On 12/3/2016 7:42 AM, Gene wrote:
Proof of what? I think it's likely that Flash would run properly in
Chrome
on the machine. I won't have proof unless it is tried. We don't
know if
Flash is crashing because Flash is crashing or if Flash is crashing
because
of some sort of problem when it is run with Firefox. Chrome isn't
perfectly
accessible but it is reasonably so and should serve quite well when
used on
sites with flash. Chrome has quirks when working with settings and
I'm not
sure if it reads all structures on web pages as well as Firefox but when
used on web pages, it is nearly as accessible, if not as accessible, as
Chrome. And for this very limited use, there may be no need to work
with
settings.

Of course, working on why flash is crashing with the browser
currently being
used could be investigated on a technical list of blind users or on a
site
like Bleeping Computer. It would probably be faster and easier to
just try
Chrome.

Gene

From: enes sarıbaş<mailto:enes.saribas@gmail.com>
Sent: Friday, December 02, 2016 10:10 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io<mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [nvda] regression with adobe flash


hi,

do you have actual proof of this? Since adobe flash, is the same
flash used
in chrome, I would asume the same problems exist. Also, chrome had
accessibility issues last I remember.

On 12/3/2016 7:06 AM, Gene wrote:
I'm not sure but this is a very good example of why you should use
more than
one browser. If you use Chrome for sites where you want to use
Flash, you
will probably have no problem. Flash is built into Chrome so you
don't have
to install or update it. It updates itself automatically within Chrome.

Gene
----- Original Message -----
From: Sharni-Lee Ward<mailto:sharni-lee.ward@hotmail.com>
Sent: Friday, December 02, 2016 9:18 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io<mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [nvda] regression with adobe flash

I haven't been able to use the Adobe Flash plugin for years now. It
always crashes

if I load a page in Firefox that happens to have Flash content. I've
long since given up trying and am just happy that YouTube has an
alternate player.

If anyone could tell me why my flash player isn't working I'd also be
very grateful.
On 3/12/2016 1:56 PM, enes sarıbaş wrote:
hi,

The kill windowless flash script seems to no longer be working.
Whenever I encounter a flash object, nvda anounces it as unavailable.
Is there anything I can do about this?












Re: java vs java script (was regression with adobe flash

David <trailerdavid@...>
 

To automatically block things like JavaScript on certain pages, while allowing it on others, the Add-on for Firefox, named NoScript, will be your friend.


It even clears you from a load of cookies and their related behavior, that are known to cause trouble with the screen readers. I am not going to dive into a prolonged discussion about the Cookies issue, being new to the list, I may not know if this is a general problem to NVDA. but for one, the Window-Eyes screen reader is known to behave strangely when certain Cookies are around. Cookies do openup for the owner, to get onto your system. A bit off-topic, but wanted to at least tell you about the add-on.


David
On 12/3/2016 2:30 PM, Gene wrote:

If you indescriminately don't allow JAVA script for all or almost all sites, you won't be able to hear most audio.  And that includes sites that USE HTML5, not just Flash.  You won't be able to submit some, perhaps many, forms.  You won't be able to do various other things as well.  I don't know what you are reading.  JAVA and JAVA script have no connection to each other. 
 
If you want to do something on a site that requires JAVA scripts, you can allow them and then not allow them on the same site when you are not using that feature of the site.  there is one site, for example, where I must have JAVA scripts enabled to submit comments.  But just for reading news items, which is what I usually do, JAVA script is not needed.  I don't allow JAVA scripts most of the time when using that site.  But there are times when I do.
 
There are security advantages for not allowing JAVA scripts to run except on sites where they are needed to do something you want to do.  Pages may load faster, you are safer, and you will see far less advertising without using an ad blocker.  But not using JAVA scripts on legitimate sites is letting misinformation and fear keep you from using a lot of what is available on the Internet. 
 
I hope some list members provide sources of reliable information about security matters. 
Gene

Sent: Saturday, December 03, 2016 6:22 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] java vs java script (was regression with adobe flash

thanks so much.
and i read that both java and javascript are for the same company and
for example: hackers can use javascript to completely gain access to
there victims computer and control it completely.
i try to always turn off javascript except for gmail and microsoft site.
in these cases, i turn it on temporarily and after that, deactivate it again.
i am sure that both have security issues and dont use them.

On 12/3/16, Travis Siegel <tsiegel@...> wrote:
> Let me clear something up here.  The problems folks were having with
> security related browser issues were related to javascript, not java.
> Java is not javascript, they're simply two things with similar names.
> Java is a programming language that is cross platform, and has very good
> security, including java applets that can run in the browser.
>
> On the other hand, javascript is simply a scripting language that runs
> inside a browser (very similar to php, only php runs on the server, not
> in the browser), that allows the web page to do all kinds of things.  In
> the case of javascript, with some security exploits, folks were able to
> get access to things they weren't supposed to have access to on your
> machine.  That's why for a while, many sites were recommending turning
> off java in your browser.  What they meant was to turn off javascript,
> but some sites didn't make the distinction, and as a result, java got a
> bad rap for something it had nothing at all to do with.
>
> Don't confuse java (the programming language) with javascript (the
> scripting language).
>
> Turning off javascript in your browser is going to break a *lot* (and I
> mean a lot) of sites, so it's not really recommended, especially since
> most of the browsers have been updated to patch the security holes found
> in javascript.
>
> Just wanted to clarify this point, since it seems lots of folks are
> still java shy, when it had nothing to do with the security exploits
> that were reaking so much havoc a couple years ago.
>
>
> On 12/3/2016 3:18 AM, nasrin khaksar wrote:
>> hi.
>> i recommend you not to use java and flash for there security problems.
>> i never dont install and use them and i did not see any problem for this.
>>
>
>
>
>
>
>


--
we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
in the very authentic narration is:
imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
best website for studying islamic book in different languages
al-islam.org




Re: java vs java script (was regression with adobe flash

Gene
 

That may be but not discussing this initially leads to confusion and misunderstanding. 
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Saturday, December 03, 2016 7:41 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] java vs java script (was regression with adobe flash

You're talking about a browser plugin for java, not java the stand-alone programming language.  Oracle is phasing out support for browsers with this plugin (which a lot of browsers already removed), but this in no way impacts java the programming language itself.  Installing java the programming language is no more a security risk than installing c++ or pascal, or any number of other programming languages.

If you want more details, you can see this link:
http://www.trendmicro.com/vinfo/us/security/news/vulnerabilities-and-exploits/oracle-finally-kills-java-browser-plugin

On 12/3/2016 8:17 AM, Gene wrote:
That is not correct.  JAVA, the program, has been considered a security risk for quite some time if you leave the JAVA program plugin active that JAVA, the program, places in your browser.  I won't repeat the comments I made in another message but in case people aren't following the thread carefully, I'm commenting here again that JAVA, the program is a security threat.
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Saturday, December 03, 2016 6:11 AM
Subject: [nvda] java vs java script (was regression with adobe flash

Let me clear something up here.  The problems folks were having with
security related browser issues were related to javascript, not java. 
Java is not javascript, they're simply two things with similar names. 
Java is a programming language that is cross platform, and has very good
security, including java applets that can run in the browser.

On the other hand, javascript is simply a scripting language that runs
inside a browser (very similar to php, only php runs on the server, not
in the browser), that allows the web page to do all kinds of things.  In
the case of javascript, with some security exploits, folks were able to
get access to things they weren't supposed to have access to on your
machine.  That's why for a while, many sites were recommending turning
off java in your browser.  What they meant was to turn off javascript,
but some sites didn't make the distinction, and as a result, java got a
bad rap for something it had nothing at all to do with.

Don't confuse java (the programming language) with javascript (the
scripting language).

Turning off javascript in your browser is going to break a *lot* (and I
mean a lot) of sites, so it's not really recommended, especially since
most of the browsers have been updated to patch the security holes found
in javascript.

Just wanted to clarify this point, since it seems lots of folks are
still java shy, when it had nothing to do with the security exploits
that were reaking so much havoc a couple years ago.


On 12/3/2016 3:18 AM, nasrin khaksar wrote:
> hi.
> i recommend you not to use java and flash for there security problems.
> i never dont install and use them and i did not see any problem for this.
>








Avast logo

This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
www.avast.com



Re: regression with adobe flash

Gene
 

According to a Mozilla blog, this is not correct.
 
Mozilla will not allow nonessential use of Flash such as in advertising.  It will, at some point in 2017, require that something be clicked on to allow Flash content to run but it is not blocking Flash content such as audio from web sites.  The transition from Flash to HTML will take awhile.  Firefox won't prevent access to Flash where it provides content such as audio.  That would be commiting browser suicide.
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----

Sent: Saturday, December 03, 2016 7:36 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] regression with adobe flash

I read some where last week where FX will prevent adobe flash from
working by summer of 2017.

On 12/3/2016 12:18 AM, nasrin khaksar wrote:
> hi.
> i recommend you not to use java and flash for there security problems.
> i never dont install and use them and i did not see any problem for this.
>
> On 12/3/16, Sharni-Lee Ward <sharni-lee.ward@...> wrote:
>> I think OP wants an answer to their problem. I will try this with Chrome
>> later, and I apologise for hijacking the thread.
>>
>>
>> OP is having an issue I had previously that was fixed by "Kill Windowless
>> Flash", which was a useful script but no longer seems to be working with
>> current Firefox. NVDA doesn't let you into certain embedded objects if you
>> don't have this script, instead saying "Embedded Object Unavailable." Is
>> there a fix for this that doesn't involve the apparently defunct "Kill
>> Windowless Flash" Greasemonkey script?
>>
>> On 3/12/2016 4:41 PM, enes sarıbaş wrote:
>>
>> hi,
>>
>> let me clerify a point. Flash isn't crashing. Rather, nvda is failing to
>> access the object. A situation directly the fault of nvda.
>>
>> On 12/3/2016 7:42 AM, Gene wrote:
>> Proof of what?  I think it's likely that Flash would run properly in Chrome
>> on the machine.  I won't have proof unless it is tried.  We don't know if
>> Flash is crashing because Flash is crashing or if Flash is crashing because
>> of some sort of problem when it is run with Firefox.  Chrome isn't perfectly
>> accessible but it is reasonably so and should serve quite well when used on
>> sites with flash.  Chrome has quirks when working with settings and I'm not
>> sure if it reads all structures on web pages as well as Firefox but when
>> used on web pages, it is nearly as accessible, if not as accessible, as
>> Chrome.  And for this very limited use, there may be no need to work with
>> settings.
>>
>> Of course, working on why flash is crashing with the browser currently being
>> used could be investigated on a technical list of blind users or on a site
>> like Bleeping Computer.  It would probably be faster and easier to just try
>> Chrome.
>>
>> Gene
>>
>> From: enes sarıbaş<mailto:enes.saribas@...>
>> Sent: Friday, December 02, 2016 10:10 PM
>> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io<mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>
>> Subject: Re: [nvda] regression with adobe flash
>>
>>
>> hi,
>>
>> do you have actual proof of this? Since adobe flash, is the same flash used
>> in chrome, I would asume  the same problems exist.  Also, chrome had
>> accessibility issues last I remember.
>>
>> On 12/3/2016 7:06 AM, Gene wrote:
>> I'm not sure but this is a very good example of why you should use more than
>> one browser.  If you use Chrome for sites where you want to use Flash, you
>> will probably have no problem.  Flash is built into Chrome so you don't have
>> to install or update it.  It updates itself automatically within Chrome.
>>
>> Gene
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: Sharni-Lee Ward<mailto:sharni-lee.ward@...>
>> Sent: Friday, December 02, 2016 9:18 PM
>> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io<mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>
>> Subject: Re: [nvda] regression with adobe flash
>>
>> I haven't been able to use the Adobe Flash plugin for years now. It
>> always crashes
>>
>> if I load a page in Firefox that happens to have Flash content. I've
>> long since given up trying and am just happy that YouTube has an
>> alternate player.
>>
>> If anyone could tell me why my flash player isn't working I'd also be
>> very grateful.
>> On 3/12/2016 1:56 PM, enes sarıbaş wrote:
>>> hi,
>>>
>>> The kill windowless flash script seems to no longer be working.
>>> Whenever I encounter a flash object, nvda anounces it as unavailable.
>>> Is there anything I can do about this?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>



Re: regression with adobe flash

 

hi gene.
thanks for your useful information.
i never dont install java program but i am afraid always that is it
possible that java plugin works in the browser without installing java
program?
if its no, whats the reason that i see java plugin in firefox
about:config and i change plugin.state.java to 0?
i use windows xp and the newer versions of java and also firefox 53
and later, dont support xp.
which version of windows, do you use?
thanks and God bless you for your help.

On 12/3/16, Brice Mijares <bricemijares@att.net> wrote:
I read some where last week where FX will prevent adobe flash from
working by summer of 2017.

On 12/3/2016 12:18 AM, nasrin khaksar wrote:
hi.
i recommend you not to use java and flash for there security problems.
i never dont install and use them and i did not see any problem for this.

On 12/3/16, Sharni-Lee Ward <sharni-lee.ward@hotmail.com> wrote:
I think OP wants an answer to their problem. I will try this with Chrome
later, and I apologise for hijacking the thread.


OP is having an issue I had previously that was fixed by "Kill
Windowless
Flash", which was a useful script but no longer seems to be working with
current Firefox. NVDA doesn't let you into certain embedded objects if
you
don't have this script, instead saying "Embedded Object Unavailable." Is
there a fix for this that doesn't involve the apparently defunct "Kill
Windowless Flash" Greasemonkey script?

On 3/12/2016 4:41 PM, enes sarıbaş wrote:

hi,

let me clerify a point. Flash isn't crashing. Rather, nvda is failing to
access the object. A situation directly the fault of nvda.

On 12/3/2016 7:42 AM, Gene wrote:
Proof of what? I think it's likely that Flash would run properly in
Chrome
on the machine. I won't have proof unless it is tried. We don't know
if
Flash is crashing because Flash is crashing or if Flash is crashing
because
of some sort of problem when it is run with Firefox. Chrome isn't
perfectly
accessible but it is reasonably so and should serve quite well when used
on
sites with flash. Chrome has quirks when working with settings and I'm
not
sure if it reads all structures on web pages as well as Firefox but when
used on web pages, it is nearly as accessible, if not as accessible, as
Chrome. And for this very limited use, there may be no need to work
with
settings.

Of course, working on why flash is crashing with the browser currently
being
used could be investigated on a technical list of blind users or on a
site
like Bleeping Computer. It would probably be faster and easier to just
try
Chrome.

Gene

From: enes sarıbaş<mailto:enes.saribas@gmail.com>
Sent: Friday, December 02, 2016 10:10 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io<mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [nvda] regression with adobe flash


hi,

do you have actual proof of this? Since adobe flash, is the same flash
used
in chrome, I would asume the same problems exist. Also, chrome had
accessibility issues last I remember.

On 12/3/2016 7:06 AM, Gene wrote:
I'm not sure but this is a very good example of why you should use more
than
one browser. If you use Chrome for sites where you want to use Flash,
you
will probably have no problem. Flash is built into Chrome so you don't
have
to install or update it. It updates itself automatically within Chrome.

Gene
----- Original Message -----
From: Sharni-Lee Ward<mailto:sharni-lee.ward@hotmail.com>
Sent: Friday, December 02, 2016 9:18 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io<mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [nvda] regression with adobe flash

I haven't been able to use the Adobe Flash plugin for years now. It
always crashes

if I load a page in Firefox that happens to have Flash content. I've
long since given up trying and am just happy that YouTube has an
alternate player.

If anyone could tell me why my flash player isn't working I'd also be
very grateful.
On 3/12/2016 1:56 PM, enes sarıbaş wrote:
hi,

The kill windowless flash script seems to no longer be working.
Whenever I encounter a flash object, nvda anounces it as unavailable.
Is there anything I can do about this?












--
we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
in the very authentic narration is:
imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
best website for studying islamic book in different languages
al-islam.org


Re: java vs java script (was regression with adobe flash

Travis Siegel <tsiegel@...>
 

And, speaking of trend micro, here's another article on their site talking about google, and how it plans to eliminate flash from chrome by the end of the year.

http://www.trendmicro.com/vinfo/us/security/news/vulnerabilities-and-exploits/google-chrome-to-kill-flash-for-new-version-of-chrome


On 12/3/2016 8:41 AM, Travis Siegel wrote:

You're talking about a browser plugin for java, not java the stand-alone programming language.  Oracle is phasing out support for browsers with this plugin (which a lot of browsers already removed), but this in no way impacts java the programming language itself.  Installing java the programming language is no more a security risk than installing c++ or pascal, or any number of other programming languages.

If you want more details, you can see this link:
http://www.trendmicro.com/vinfo/us/security/news/vulnerabilities-and-exploits/oracle-finally-kills-java-browser-plugin

On 12/3/2016 8:17 AM, Gene wrote:
That is not correct.  JAVA, the program, has been considered a security risk for quite some time if you leave the JAVA program plugin active that JAVA, the program, places in your browser.  I won't repeat the comments I made in another message but in case people aren't following the thread carefully, I'm commenting here again that JAVA, the program is a security threat.
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Saturday, December 03, 2016 6:11 AM
Subject: [nvda] java vs java script (was regression with adobe flash

Let me clear something up here.  The problems folks were having with
security related browser issues were related to javascript, not java. 
Java is not javascript, they're simply two things with similar names. 
Java is a programming language that is cross platform, and has very good
security, including java applets that can run in the browser.

On the other hand, javascript is simply a scripting language that runs
inside a browser (very similar to php, only php runs on the server, not
in the browser), that allows the web page to do all kinds of things.  In
the case of javascript, with some security exploits, folks were able to
get access to things they weren't supposed to have access to on your
machine.  That's why for a while, many sites were recommending turning
off java in your browser.  What they meant was to turn off javascript,
but some sites didn't make the distinction, and as a result, java got a
bad rap for something it had nothing at all to do with.

Don't confuse java (the programming language) with javascript (the
scripting language).

Turning off javascript in your browser is going to break a *lot* (and I
mean a lot) of sites, so it's not really recommended, especially since
most of the browsers have been updated to patch the security holes found
in javascript.

Just wanted to clarify this point, since it seems lots of folks are
still java shy, when it had nothing to do with the security exploits
that were reaking so much havoc a couple years ago.


On 12/3/2016 3:18 AM, nasrin khaksar wrote:
> hi.
> i recommend you not to use java and flash for there security problems.
> i never dont install and use them and i did not see any problem for this.
>








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Re: java vs java script (was regression with adobe flash

Travis Siegel <tsiegel@...>
 

You're talking about a browser plugin for java, not java the stand-alone programming language.  Oracle is phasing out support for browsers with this plugin (which a lot of browsers already removed), but this in no way impacts java the programming language itself.  Installing java the programming language is no more a security risk than installing c++ or pascal, or any number of other programming languages.

If you want more details, you can see this link:
http://www.trendmicro.com/vinfo/us/security/news/vulnerabilities-and-exploits/oracle-finally-kills-java-browser-plugin

On 12/3/2016 8:17 AM, Gene wrote:
That is not correct.  JAVA, the program, has been considered a security risk for quite some time if you leave the JAVA program plugin active that JAVA, the program, places in your browser.  I won't repeat the comments I made in another message but in case people aren't following the thread carefully, I'm commenting here again that JAVA, the program is a security threat.
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Saturday, December 03, 2016 6:11 AM
Subject: [nvda] java vs java script (was regression with adobe flash

Let me clear something up here.  The problems folks were having with
security related browser issues were related to javascript, not java. 
Java is not javascript, they're simply two things with similar names. 
Java is a programming language that is cross platform, and has very good
security, including java applets that can run in the browser.

On the other hand, javascript is simply a scripting language that runs
inside a browser (very similar to php, only php runs on the server, not
in the browser), that allows the web page to do all kinds of things.  In
the case of javascript, with some security exploits, folks were able to
get access to things they weren't supposed to have access to on your
machine.  That's why for a while, many sites were recommending turning
off java in your browser.  What they meant was to turn off javascript,
but some sites didn't make the distinction, and as a result, java got a
bad rap for something it had nothing at all to do with.

Don't confuse java (the programming language) with javascript (the
scripting language).

Turning off javascript in your browser is going to break a *lot* (and I
mean a lot) of sites, so it's not really recommended, especially since
most of the browsers have been updated to patch the security holes found
in javascript.

Just wanted to clarify this point, since it seems lots of folks are
still java shy, when it had nothing to do with the security exploits
that were reaking so much havoc a couple years ago.


On 12/3/2016 3:18 AM, nasrin khaksar wrote:
> hi.
> i recommend you not to use java and flash for there security problems.
> i never dont install and use them and i did not see any problem for this.
>








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This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
www.avast.com



Re: regression with adobe flash

Brice Mijares
 

I read some where last week where FX will prevent adobe flash from working by summer of 2017.

On 12/3/2016 12:18 AM, nasrin khaksar wrote:
hi.
i recommend you not to use java and flash for there security problems.
i never dont install and use them and i did not see any problem for this.

On 12/3/16, Sharni-Lee Ward <sharni-lee.ward@hotmail.com> wrote:
I think OP wants an answer to their problem. I will try this with Chrome
later, and I apologise for hijacking the thread.


OP is having an issue I had previously that was fixed by "Kill Windowless
Flash", which was a useful script but no longer seems to be working with
current Firefox. NVDA doesn't let you into certain embedded objects if you
don't have this script, instead saying "Embedded Object Unavailable." Is
there a fix for this that doesn't involve the apparently defunct "Kill
Windowless Flash" Greasemonkey script?

On 3/12/2016 4:41 PM, enes sarıbaş wrote:

hi,

let me clerify a point. Flash isn't crashing. Rather, nvda is failing to
access the object. A situation directly the fault of nvda.

On 12/3/2016 7:42 AM, Gene wrote:
Proof of what? I think it's likely that Flash would run properly in Chrome
on the machine. I won't have proof unless it is tried. We don't know if
Flash is crashing because Flash is crashing or if Flash is crashing because
of some sort of problem when it is run with Firefox. Chrome isn't perfectly
accessible but it is reasonably so and should serve quite well when used on
sites with flash. Chrome has quirks when working with settings and I'm not
sure if it reads all structures on web pages as well as Firefox but when
used on web pages, it is nearly as accessible, if not as accessible, as
Chrome. And for this very limited use, there may be no need to work with
settings.

Of course, working on why flash is crashing with the browser currently being
used could be investigated on a technical list of blind users or on a site
like Bleeping Computer. It would probably be faster and easier to just try
Chrome.

Gene

From: enes sarıbaş<mailto:enes.saribas@gmail.com>
Sent: Friday, December 02, 2016 10:10 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io<mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [nvda] regression with adobe flash


hi,

do you have actual proof of this? Since adobe flash, is the same flash used
in chrome, I would asume the same problems exist. Also, chrome had
accessibility issues last I remember.

On 12/3/2016 7:06 AM, Gene wrote:
I'm not sure but this is a very good example of why you should use more than
one browser. If you use Chrome for sites where you want to use Flash, you
will probably have no problem. Flash is built into Chrome so you don't have
to install or update it. It updates itself automatically within Chrome.

Gene
----- Original Message -----
From: Sharni-Lee Ward<mailto:sharni-lee.ward@hotmail.com>
Sent: Friday, December 02, 2016 9:18 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io<mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [nvda] regression with adobe flash

I haven't been able to use the Adobe Flash plugin for years now. It
always crashes

if I load a page in Firefox that happens to have Flash content. I've
long since given up trying and am just happy that YouTube has an
alternate player.

If anyone could tell me why my flash player isn't working I'd also be
very grateful.
On 3/12/2016 1:56 PM, enes sarıbaş wrote:
hi,

The kill windowless flash script seems to no longer be working.
Whenever I encounter a flash object, nvda anounces it as unavailable.
Is there anything I can do about this?











Re: java vs java script (was regression with adobe flash

Gene
 

If you indescriminately don't allow JAVA script for all or almost all sites, you won't be able to hear most audio.  And that includes sites that USE HTML5, not just Flash.  You won't be able to submit some, perhaps many, forms.  You won't be able to do various other things as well.  I don't know what you are reading.  JAVA and JAVA script have no connection to each other. 
 
If you want to do something on a site that requires JAVA scripts, you can allow them and then not allow them on the same site when you are not using that feature of the site.  there is one site, for example, where I must have JAVA scripts enabled to submit comments.  But just for reading news items, which is what I usually do, JAVA script is not needed.  I don't allow JAVA scripts most of the time when using that site.  But there are times when I do.
 
There are security advantages for not allowing JAVA scripts to run except on sites where they are needed to do something you want to do.  Pages may load faster, you are safer, and you will see far less advertising without using an ad blocker.  But not using JAVA scripts on legitimate sites is letting misinformation and fear keep you from using a lot of what is available on the Internet. 
 
I hope some list members provide sources of reliable information about security matters. 
Gene

Sent: Saturday, December 03, 2016 6:22 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] java vs java script (was regression with adobe flash

thanks so much.
and i read that both java and javascript are for the same company and
for example: hackers can use javascript to completely gain access to
there victims computer and control it completely.
i try to always turn off javascript except for gmail and microsoft site.
in these cases, i turn it on temporarily and after that, deactivate it again.
i am sure that both have security issues and dont use them.

On 12/3/16, Travis Siegel <tsiegel@...> wrote:
> Let me clear something up here.  The problems folks were having with
> security related browser issues were related to javascript, not java.
> Java is not javascript, they're simply two things with similar names.
> Java is a programming language that is cross platform, and has very good
> security, including java applets that can run in the browser.
>
> On the other hand, javascript is simply a scripting language that runs
> inside a browser (very similar to php, only php runs on the server, not
> in the browser), that allows the web page to do all kinds of things.  In
> the case of javascript, with some security exploits, folks were able to
> get access to things they weren't supposed to have access to on your
> machine.  That's why for a while, many sites were recommending turning
> off java in your browser.  What they meant was to turn off javascript,
> but some sites didn't make the distinction, and as a result, java got a
> bad rap for something it had nothing at all to do with.
>
> Don't confuse java (the programming language) with javascript (the
> scripting language).
>
> Turning off javascript in your browser is going to break a *lot* (and I
> mean a lot) of sites, so it's not really recommended, especially since
> most of the browsers have been updated to patch the security holes found
> in javascript.
>
> Just wanted to clarify this point, since it seems lots of folks are
> still java shy, when it had nothing to do with the security exploits
> that were reaking so much havoc a couple years ago.
>
>
> On 12/3/2016 3:18 AM, nasrin khaksar wrote:
>> hi.
>> i recommend you not to use java and flash for there security problems.
>> i never dont install and use them and i did not see any problem for this.
>>
>
>
>
>
>
>


--
we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
in the very authentic narration is:
imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
best website for studying islamic book in different languages
al-islam.org



Re: java vs java script (was regression with adobe flash

Gene
 

That is not correct.  JAVA, the program, has been considered a security risk for quite some time if you leave the JAVA program plugin active that JAVA, the program, places in your browser.  I won't repeat the comments I made in another message but in case people aren't following the thread carefully, I'm commenting here again that JAVA, the program is a security threat.
 

Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Saturday, December 03, 2016 6:11 AM
Subject: [nvda] java vs java script (was regression with adobe flash

Let me clear something up here.  The problems folks were having with
security related browser issues were related to javascript, not java. 
Java is not javascript, they're simply two things with similar names. 
Java is a programming language that is cross platform, and has very good
security, including java applets that can run in the browser.

On the other hand, javascript is simply a scripting language that runs
inside a browser (very similar to php, only php runs on the server, not
in the browser), that allows the web page to do all kinds of things.  In
the case of javascript, with some security exploits, folks were able to
get access to things they weren't supposed to have access to on your
machine.  That's why for a while, many sites were recommending turning
off java in your browser.  What they meant was to turn off javascript,
but some sites didn't make the distinction, and as a result, java got a
bad rap for something it had nothing at all to do with.

Don't confuse java (the programming language) with javascript (the
scripting language).

Turning off javascript in your browser is going to break a *lot* (and I
mean a lot) of sites, so it's not really recommended, especially since
most of the browsers have been updated to patch the security holes found
in javascript.

Just wanted to clarify this point, since it seems lots of folks are
still java shy, when it had nothing to do with the security exploits
that were reaking so much havoc a couple years ago.


On 12/3/2016 3:18 AM, nasrin khaksar wrote:
> hi.
> i recommend you not to use java and flash for there security problems.
> i never dont install and use them and i did not see any problem for this.
>





My NVDA Screen reader not working properly

Ibrahim Ajayi
 

Hi good people:
I'm having teething problems with my NVDA screenreader. The problem
happens when I am on the internet. Firstly, my web browser, does not
launch quickly. Before NVDA launches with the browser, it takes a
very long time. Secondly, it can be very difficult to navigate a web
page. The screenreader responds very slowly. Sometimes, I have to
relaunch the NVDA from the desktop, to get it working properly.
Thirdly, sometimes, when I am working on a site, I am taking off the
site totally, and I have to go through the painful process of
relaunching the site again.
Please has anyone had these problems at any time, how did you go about
resolving them. It's terrible, and I don't know what to do.
Looking forward to reading from you.
From Ibrahim in Nigeria.


Automatic recognition of braille displays

Afik Sofir <afik.sofir@...>
 

 

Hello,

 

When connecting a braille display to the laptop, NVDA isn’t recognize the braille display. I need to go to braille settings and press OK to activate again

 

Why it should be like this?

Afik.

 

 

 

 

 

בברכה,

אפיק סופיר

רכז במרכז לחיים עצמאיים ברשת

Makshivim Net

afik@...

0505782208

 


Re: regression with adobe flash

Gene
 

Flash may not be as secure as it should be.  There are many times when Flash is updated, even out of cycle, to correct some problem.  But license agreements tell you nothing.  Every license agreement has language in it that tries to protect the program owner from liability.  The nature and extent of such language tells us nothing about security, just how good the lawyers may be who wrote the agreement. 
 
It's not just a question of how insecure Flash may be.  I doubt most people will have problems if they keep their browsers current, keep Flash current, use good antimalware protection, and try not to use sites that have a higher probability of not being safe from a security standpoint.  Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Saturday, December 03, 2016 2:57 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] regression with adobe flash

i studied many articles and also license agreement of flash and i am
sure that its not secure.

On 12/3/16, Brian's Mail list account <bglists@...> wrote:
> Actually there is an issue and has been for some time in Firefox where it
> seems at least to nvda, that there is no flash embedded object on a page
> such as the bbc I player after  answering the question that you have a tv
> licence. My feeling on this is that there is something ofdd in Firefox, but
>
> after a few refreshes it can be found.
>  Isthis the sort of thing you mean?
>  Brian
>
> bglists@...
> Sent via blueyonder.
> Please address personal email to:-
> briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
> in the display name field.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "enes sarıbaş" <enes.saribas@...>
> To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
> Sent: Saturday, December 03, 2016 5:41 AM
> Subject: Re: [nvda] regression with adobe flash
>
>
>> hi,
>>
>> let me clerify a point. Flash isn't crashing. Rather, nvda is failing to
>> access the object. A situation directly the fault of nvda.
>>
>>
>> On 12/3/2016 7:42 AM, Gene wrote:
>>> Proof of what?  I think it's likely that Flash would run properly in
>>> Chrome on the machine.  I won't have proof unless it is tried.  We
>>> don't know if Flash is crashing because Flash is crashing or if Flash
>>> is crashing because of some sort of problem when it is run with
>>> Firefox.  Chrome isn't perfectly accessible but it is reasonably so
>>> and should serve quite well when used on sites with flash.  Chrome has
>>> quirks when working with settings and I'm not sure if it reads all
>>> structures on web pages as well as Firefox but when used on web pages,
>>> it is nearly as accessible, if not as accessible, as Chrome.  And for
>>> this very limited use, there may be no need to work with settings.
>>> Of course, working on why flash is crashing with the browser currently
>>> being used could be investigated on a technical list of blind users or
>>> on a site like Bleeping Computer.  It would probably be faster and
>>> easier to just try Chrome.
>>> Gene
>>>
>>> *From:* enes sarıbaş <mailto:enes.saribas@...>
>>> *Sent:* Friday, December 02, 2016 10:10 PM
>>> *To:* nvda@nvda.groups.io <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>
>>> *Subject:* Re: [nvda] regression with adobe flash
>>>
>>> hi,
>>>
>>> do you have actual proof of this? Since adobe flash, is the same flash
>>> used in chrome, I would asume  the same problems exist.  Also, chrome
>>> had accessibility issues last I remember.
>>>
>>>
>>> On 12/3/2016 7:06 AM, Gene wrote:
>>>> I'm not sure but this is a very good example of why you should use
>>>> more than one browser. If you use Chrome for sites where you want to
>>>> use Flash, you will probably have no problem.  Flash is built into
>>>> Chrome so you don't have to install or update it.  It updates itself
>>>> automatically within Chrome.
>>>> Gene
>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>> *From:* Sharni-Lee Ward <mailto:sharni-lee.ward@...>
>>>> *Sent:* Friday, December 02, 2016 9:18 PM
>>>> *To:* nvda@nvda.groups.io <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>
>>>> *Subject:* Re: [nvda] regression with adobe flash
>>>>
>>>> I haven't been able to use the Adobe Flash plugin for years now. It
>>>> always crashes
>>>>
>>>> if I load a page in Firefox that happens to have Flash content. I've
>>>> long since given up trying and am just happy that YouTube has an
>>>> alternate player.
>>>>
>>>> If anyone could tell me why my flash player isn't working I'd also be
>>>> very grateful.
>>>> On 3/12/2016 1:56 PM, enes sarıbaş wrote:
>>>> > hi,
>>>> >
>>>> > The kill windowless flash script seems to no longer be working.
>>>> > Whenever I encounter a flash object, nvda anounces it as unavailable.
>>>> > Is there anything I can do about this?
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>


--
we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
in the very authentic narration is:
imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
best website for studying islamic book in different languages
al-islam.org




Re: regression with adobe flash

Gene
 

JAVA is not JAVA scripts.  I believe the poster was discussing JAVA, the program, but this is not clear. 
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Saturday, December 03, 2016 2:46 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] regression with adobe flash

The problem with not using Java seems to be that sites like those which have
radio s you can tune on them do seem to rely a lot on Java. I see no reason
why they do of course, but one has to use sites as they are.As for flash. I
believe that the latest  flash plug in is no less safe than other code,
given the  recent issues in firefox itself. I guess I'm just pragmatic about
things. if you are the first one to get something nasty through a piece of
code then you are unlucky, but if you go around the web  just cliking
without thinking, then you deserve to catch some malware, sooner or later.
 Brian

bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message -----
From: "nasrin khaksar" <nasrinkhaksar3@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Saturday, December 03, 2016 8:18 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] regression with adobe flash


hi.
i recommend you not to use java and flash for there security problems.
i never dont install and use them and i did not see any problem for this.

On 12/3/16, Sharni-Lee Ward <sharni-lee.ward@...> wrote:
> I think OP wants an answer to their problem. I will try this with Chrome
> later, and I apologise for hijacking the thread.
>
>
> OP is having an issue I had previously that was fixed by "Kill Windowless
> Flash", which was a useful script but no longer seems to be working with
> current Firefox. NVDA doesn't let you into certain embedded objects if you
> don't have this script, instead saying "Embedded Object Unavailable." Is
> there a fix for this that doesn't involve the apparently defunct "Kill
> Windowless Flash" Greasemonkey script?
>
> On 3/12/2016 4:41 PM, enes sarıbaş wrote:
>
> hi,
>
> let me clerify a point. Flash isn't crashing. Rather, nvda is failing to
> access the object. A situation directly the fault of nvda.
>
> On 12/3/2016 7:42 AM, Gene wrote:
> Proof of what?  I think it's likely that Flash would run properly in
> Chrome
> on the machine.  I won't have proof unless it is tried.  We don't know if
> Flash is crashing because Flash is crashing or if Flash is crashing
> because
> of some sort of problem when it is run with Firefox.  Chrome isn't
> perfectly
> accessible but it is reasonably so and should serve quite well when used
> on
> sites with flash.  Chrome has quirks when working with settings and I'm
> not
> sure if it reads all structures on web pages as well as Firefox but when
> used on web pages, it is nearly as accessible, if not as accessible, as
> Chrome.  And for this very limited use, there may be no need to work with
> settings.
>
> Of course, working on why flash is crashing with the browser currently
> being
> used could be investigated on a technical list of blind users or on a site
> like Bleeping Computer.  It would probably be faster and easier to just
> try
> Chrome.
>
> Gene
>
> From: enes sarıbaş<mailto:enes.saribas@...>
> Sent: Friday, December 02, 2016 10:10 PM
> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io<mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>
> Subject: Re: [nvda] regression with adobe flash
>
>
> hi,
>
> do you have actual proof of this? Since adobe flash, is the same flash
> used
> in chrome, I would asume  the same problems exist.  Also, chrome had
> accessibility issues last I remember.
>
> On 12/3/2016 7:06 AM, Gene wrote:
> I'm not sure but this is a very good example of why you should use more
> than
> one browser.  If you use Chrome for sites where you want to use Flash, you
> will probably have no problem.  Flash is built into Chrome so you don't
> have
> to install or update it.  It updates itself automatically within Chrome.
>
> Gene
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Sharni-Lee Ward<mailto:sharni-lee.ward@...>
> Sent: Friday, December 02, 2016 9:18 PM
> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io<mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>
> Subject: Re: [nvda] regression with adobe flash
>
> I haven't been able to use the Adobe Flash plugin for years now. It
> always crashes
>
> if I load a page in Firefox that happens to have Flash content. I've
> long since given up trying and am just happy that YouTube has an
> alternate player.
>
> If anyone could tell me why my flash player isn't working I'd also be
> very grateful.
> On 3/12/2016 1:56 PM, enes sarıbaş wrote:
>> hi,
>>
>> The kill windowless flash script seems to no longer be working.
>> Whenever I encounter a flash object, nvda anounces it as unavailable.
>> Is there anything I can do about this?
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>


--
we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
in the very authentic narration is:
imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
best website for studying islamic book in different languages
al-islam.org






Re: regression with adobe flash

Gene
 

Many sites use Flash and don't use HTML5 yet.  The trend is to replace Flash with HTML5.  If you use a current version of Flash and a version of a browser that is receiving current security updates, with a little care and common sense, you will probably not be at a lot of risk.  At least, that's my opinion. There is a difference between being careful and letting fear paralyze you on the Internet. 
 
As far as JAVA the program is concerned, not JAVA scripts is concerned, it's better not to have it active on the Internet unless you need it.  Most people don't need or use it.  But you don't have to remove it if you need it for a program on your computer but don't need it for anything on the Internet.  The security danger comes from having the JAVA plugin active in your browser when JAVA is installed.  You can remove or disable the JAVA plugin in your browser or browsers and JAVA won't be able to run from your browser.
 
As far as JAVA scripts are concerned, it is better to not allow them unless you are on a site where you need them.  I won't go into the ways to do that here. 
 
This may be a discussion that should be taken to a list such as Tech Talk. 
 
I would advise those interested in keeping up with security matters to find a good technology news site or technology     news aggregator or newsletter or blog from a reputable source.  It's all too easy to get incorrect or incomplete information and to be needlessly afraid about something.  That's not to say that there aren't legitimate reasons to be careful and some things to keep away from or not do.  But it is important to get good complete information about such things.
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Saturday, December 03, 2016 2:18 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] regression with adobe flash

hi.
i recommend you not to use java and flash for there security problems.
i never dont install and use them and i did not see any problem for this.

On 12/3/16, Sharni-Lee Ward <sharni-lee.ward@...> wrote:
> I think OP wants an answer to their problem. I will try this with Chrome
> later, and I apologise for hijacking the thread.
>
>
> OP is having an issue I had previously that was fixed by "Kill Windowless
> Flash", which was a useful script but no longer seems to be working with
> current Firefox. NVDA doesn't let you into certain embedded objects if you
> don't have this script, instead saying "Embedded Object Unavailable." Is
> there a fix for this that doesn't involve the apparently defunct "Kill
> Windowless Flash" Greasemonkey script?
>
> On 3/12/2016 4:41 PM, enes sarıbaş wrote:
>
> hi,
>
> let me clerify a point. Flash isn't crashing. Rather, nvda is failing to
> access the object. A situation directly the fault of nvda.
>
> On 12/3/2016 7:42 AM, Gene wrote:
> Proof of what?  I think it's likely that Flash would run properly in Chrome
> on the machine.  I won't have proof unless it is tried.  We don't know if
> Flash is crashing because Flash is crashing or if Flash is crashing because
> of some sort of problem when it is run with Firefox.  Chrome isn't perfectly
> accessible but it is reasonably so and should serve quite well when used on
> sites with flash.  Chrome has quirks when working with settings and I'm not
> sure if it reads all structures on web pages as well as Firefox but when
> used on web pages, it is nearly as accessible, if not as accessible, as
> Chrome.  And for this very limited use, there may be no need to work with
> settings.
>
> Of course, working on why flash is crashing with the browser currently being
> used could be investigated on a technical list of blind users or on a site
> like Bleeping Computer.  It would probably be faster and easier to just try
> Chrome.
>
> Gene
>
> From: enes sarıbaş<mailto:enes.saribas@...>
> Sent: Friday, December 02, 2016 10:10 PM
> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io<mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>
> Subject: Re: [nvda] regression with adobe flash
>
>
> hi,
>
> do you have actual proof of this? Since adobe flash, is the same flash used
> in chrome, I would asume  the same problems exist.  Also, chrome had
> accessibility issues last I remember.
>
> On 12/3/2016 7:06 AM, Gene wrote:
> I'm not sure but this is a very good example of why you should use more than
> one browser.  If you use Chrome for sites where you want to use Flash, you
> will probably have no problem.  Flash is built into Chrome so you don't have
> to install or update it.  It updates itself automatically within Chrome.
>
> Gene
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Sharni-Lee Ward<mailto:sharni-lee.ward@...>
> Sent: Friday, December 02, 2016 9:18 PM
> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io<mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>
> Subject: Re: [nvda] regression with adobe flash
>
> I haven't been able to use the Adobe Flash plugin for years now. It
> always crashes
>
> if I load a page in Firefox that happens to have Flash content. I've
> long since given up trying and am just happy that YouTube has an
> alternate player.
>
> If anyone could tell me why my flash player isn't working I'd also be
> very grateful.
> On 3/12/2016 1:56 PM, enes sarıbaş wrote:
>> hi,
>>
>> The kill windowless flash script seems to no longer be working.
>> Whenever I encounter a flash object, nvda anounces it as unavailable.
>> Is there anything I can do about this?
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>


--
we have not sent you but as a mercy to the creation.
holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
in the very authentic narration is:
imam hosein is the beacon of light and the ark of salvation.
best website for studying islamic book in different languages
al-islam.org




wiki contribution?

 

How would I contribute to the wiki? I would like to make a page for blind developers who make programs accessible to NVDA and update some suggested programs.



Re: regression with adobe flash

Gene
 

You might try Internet Explorer in such cases.  I haven't investigated this to any extent but there were one or two instances where I experimented and I was able to use the Flash on a site with Internet Explorer where I couldn't in Firefox if I wasn't using the Windowless Flash plugin.Or you might try an older version of Firefox portable.  You won't be protected from new exploits if you use an older version of Firefox portable on those specific sites but depending on what the sites are, you still may not be taking much risk.  I'm not knowledgeable enough to give an authoritative answer to that question.  Other knowledgeable technical people may have ideas.
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----

Sent: Saturday, December 03, 2016 12:53 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] regression with adobe flash

I think OP wants an answer to their problem. I will try this with Chrome later, and I apologise for hijacking the thread.


OP is having an issue I had previously that was fixed by "Kill Windowless Flash", which was a useful script but no longer seems to be working with current Firefox. NVDA doesn't let you into certain embedded objects if you don't have this script, instead saying "Embedded Object Unavailable." Is there a fix for this that doesn't involve the apparently defunct "Kill Windowless Flash" Greasemonkey script?


On 3/12/2016 4:41 PM, enes sarıbaş wrote:

hi,

let me clerify a point. Flash isn't crashing. Rather, nvda is failing to access the object. A situation directly the fault of nvda.


On 12/3/2016 7:42 AM, Gene wrote:
Proof of what?  I think it's likely that Flash would run properly in Chrome on the machine.  I won't have proof unless it is tried.  We don't know if Flash is crashing because Flash is crashing or if Flash is crashing because of some sort of problem when it is run with Firefox.  Chrome isn't perfectly accessible but it is reasonably so and should serve quite well when used on sites with flash.  Chrome has quirks when working with settings and I'm not sure if it reads all structures on web pages as well as Firefox but when used on web pages, it is nearly as accessible, if not as accessible, as Chrome.  And for this very limited use, there may be no need to work with settings.
 
Of course, working on why flash is crashing with the browser currently being used could be investigated on a technical list of blind users or on a site like Bleeping Computer.  It would probably be faster and easier to just try Chrome. 
 
Gene

Sent: Friday, December 02, 2016 10:10 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] regression with adobe flash

hi,

do you have actual proof of this? Since adobe flash, is the same flash used in chrome, I would asume  the same problems exist.  Also, chrome had accessibility issues last I remember.


On 12/3/2016 7:06 AM, Gene wrote:
I'm not sure but this is a very good example of why you should use more than one browser.  If you use Chrome for sites where you want to use Flash, you will probably have no problem.  Flash is built into Chrome so you don't have to install or update it.  It updates itself automatically within Chrome.
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Friday, December 02, 2016 9:18 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] regression with adobe flash

I haven't been able to use the Adobe Flash plugin for years now. It
always crashes

if I load a page in Firefox that happens to have Flash content. I've
long since given up trying and am just happy that YouTube has an
alternate player.

If anyone could tell me why my flash player isn't working I'd also be
very grateful.
On 3/12/2016 1:56 PM, enes sarıbaş wrote:
> hi,
>
> The kill windowless flash script seems to no longer be working.
> Whenever I encounter a flash object, nvda anounces it as unavailable.
> Is there anything I can do about this?
>
>
>
>








Re: ESpeak sounds drastically different at 100 % speed compared to 99 %

Felix G.
 

Thank you for the clarification. So it's an expected artifact of Sonic increasing rate while preserving pitch, and not something weird going on with my sound card. Good to know.
Kind regards,
Felix Grützmacher

Tyler Spivey <tspivey@...> schrieb am Fr., 2. Dez. 2016 um 10:58 Uhr:

eSpeak's rate boost used to activate at 451, now it activates at 450. I
don't know why.

Here's the relevant espeak-ng issue:
https://github.com/espeak-ng/espeak-ng/issues/131

On 12/2/2016 1:43 AM, Felix G. wrote:
> Hello list,
> has anyone else noticed that ESpeak sounds very different upward of a
> certain rate? The exact values are greater than 99 % in normal
> operation, and greater than 18 % with rate boost.
> Is this an intentional effect to improve intelligibility, or is it a
> known bug?
> Kind regards,
> Felix Grützmacher
>