Date   

Re: NVDA reading names of selected files in a file list

Quentin Christensen
 

Thanks Rui, that's handy!

And yes, all of these are workarounds for the original issue, which btw we do have an issue for: https://github.com/nvaccess/nvda/issues/5005


On Thu, Sep 17, 2020 at 8:20 PM Rui Fontes <rui.fontes@...> wrote:

Hello Quentin!


Ther is a add-on, develloped by me, that allows the reading of status bar in Windows 10 File explorer...

You can get it at:

https://www.tiflotecnia.net/ZExplorer.nvda-addon


The option that I think Janet wants does not exist in NVDA, meaning that NVDA have no way to read the name of selected files...


Rui Fontes

NVDA portuguese team



Às 09:16 de 17/09/2020, Quentin Christensen escreveu:
Normally, as Gene noted, you should be able to use NVDA+end / NVDA+shift+end to read the status bar, however there is a bug preventing that from Working in File Explorer in Windows 10 - https://github.com/nvaccess/nvda/issues/6769

One thing you can do, is use NVDA's next and previous object commands (NVDA+numpad 4 / NVDA+shift+left arrow for previous, NVDA+numpad 6 / NVDA+shift+right arrow for next).  That will move object navigation through the items in the list.  One quirk is it won't announce "selected" for items which are selected, but will announce "not selected" for items which are not selected.  (It's not so much a bug as, 99% of the time people are moving through the list one item at a time and don't want to hear every item as selected).

Quentin.

On Thu, Sep 17, 2020 at 12:39 PM Aravind R <aravind.andhrabank@...> wrote:
use tab and shift+tab to ensure you are in list view for selecting files.

On 17/09/2020, Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:
> I don't know what Windows 10 does, Windows 7 displays a status line you  can
>
> read that tells you the number of files selected.
>
> As I recall, the NVDA command to read what is selected only applies to
> text.
> Gene
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Janet Brandly
> Sent: Wednesday, September 16, 2020 9:27 PM
> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
> Subject: [nvda] Reading names of selected files
>
>
>
> Hello all,
>
> I’m using the latest NVDA (not the beta) with windows 10 I’m trying to move
>
> some files from my downloads folder into my documents folder and using the
> shift + down-arrow keys to select them, but NVDA isn’t confirming that
> they’re
> selected when I use the “read selected text” command. Is there a better
> command to use to confirm that files are selected for moving, copying, ect?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Janet
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>


--


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manager
Department of sales
bank of baroda specialised mortgage store, Chennai.
mobile no: +91 9940369593,
email id : aravind_069@..., aravind.andhrabank@....
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Training and Support Manager


Re: NVDA reading names of selected files in a file list

 

On Thu, Sep 17, 2020 at 06:52 PM, Janet Brandly wrote:
Window-Eyes used to do this.
-
Interesting.  While I did play with Window-Eyes, it was very, very briefly.  And once it was acquired by Freedom Scientific and deprecated I never touched it again.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 2004, Build 19041  

A gentleman is one who never hurts anyone's feelings unintentionally.

          ~ Oscar Wilde

 


Re: NVDA reading names of selected files in a file list

 

On Thu, Sep 17, 2020 at 07:27 PM, David Griffith wrote:
But Lucas has shown a method where  Jaws will announce  the 15th and 300th file if they are selected without  you having to arrow through.
-
Which is every bit as much a revelation to me as it was to you.  I could swear I've done what he instructed in the past, and it didn't do that.  This result is far more useful, that's for certain!
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 2004, Build 19041  

A gentleman is one who never hurts anyone's feelings unintentionally.

          ~ Oscar Wilde

 


NVDA and Zoom meetings with more than about 15 or 20 participants

Brian Moore
 

Hi all.  On saturday, I have to host a meeting with approximately 60 people.  I find that for some reason, the participant list in a zoom meeting doesn't scroll properly.  It will read the first 6 or 7 participants and then go silent.  Maximizing the window helps some but still if there are more than about 15 or 20 participants, it looses focus or something. Has anyone been able to work around this?  What if I have to mute the 40th participant because they have too much background noise which always seems to happen in larger groups?


Would be curious if anyone has found a way of dealing with this list when there are a lot of people.


Thanks.

Brian.

--
Contact me on skype: brian.moore
follow me on twitter:
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Re: NVDA reading names of selected files in a file list

Janet Brandly
 

Hi Gene,
I'll give that a try. Hopefully this is something that can be looked into soon since I'm not the only one with this issue.
Thanks all,
Janet

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: September 17, 2020 7:17 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Reading names of selected files

Meantime, here is how you can tell which files are selected using NVDA.
After you select the files, hold control and go backk to the first one you selected. You can go farther up if you want, just keep holding control.
Keep holding control and move down. Any files that are unselected will say unselected after the name is announced. Any files that are selected won't say anything after the name. They don't say selected. But since you hear unselected, you will know if you didn't select anything you intended to or selected things you didn't intend to. If you come across a file that is selected or unselected by mistake, while on the filename, press the space bar while continuing to hold control. The file state will be changed and you will hear the current state announced..

Gene
-----Original Message-----
From: David Griffith
Sent: Thursday, September 17, 2020 6:24 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Reading names of selected files

Dear Lucas

I have just tried this with Jaws and you are entirely correct.
I selected 6 non contiguous files, that is with control space to make sure that they were not adjacent to each other, and following your instructions of pressing Jaws plus shift plus down arrow Jaws did indeed read out a list of the files which had been selected, omitting all of the files which were not selected. I had no idea Jaws could do this even though I have used it for over 20 years so many thanks for educating me here.
I can see how this would be a useful feature in NVDA.

David G.
-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Lukasz Golonka
Sent: 17 September 2020 23:52
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Reading names of selected files

Hello,

I believe, though may be wrong about this since I haven't been using VoiceOver for a few years now that it is in deed possible to report what items are selected on a list after selection is done. On Windows JAWS can certainly report selected items on Windows Explorer list when pressing
JAWS+Shift_+Down arrow. For NVDA the same can be accomplished with an
JAWS+add-on
called Columns Review in this case the command to report selected items is
NVDA+Shift+Up arrow. This add-on is available from the official add-ons
website in the section for add-onns under development.

--
Regards
Lukasz


Re: NVDA reading names of selected files in a file list

Gene
 

Meantime, here is how you can tell which files are selected using NVDA. After you select the files, hold control and go backk to the first one you selected. You can go farther up if you want, just keep holding control.
Keep holding control and move down. Any files that are unselected will say unselected after the name is announced. Any files that are selected won't say anything after the name. They don't say selected. But since you hear unselected, you will know if you didn't select anything you intended to or selected things you didn't intend to. If you come across a file that is selected or unselected by mistake, while on the filename, press the space bar while continuing to hold control. The file state will be changed and you will hear the current state announced..

Gene

-----Original Message-----
From: David Griffith
Sent: Thursday, September 17, 2020 6:24 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Reading names of selected files

Dear Lucas

I have just tried this with Jaws and you are entirely correct.
I selected 6 non contiguous files, that is with control space to make sure that they were not adjacent to each other, and following your instructions of pressing Jaws plus shift plus down arrow Jaws did indeed read out a list of the files which had been selected, omitting all of the files which were not selected. I had no idea Jaws could do this even though I have used it for over 20 years so many thanks for educating me here.
I can see how this would be a useful feature in NVDA.

David G.
-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Lukasz Golonka
Sent: 17 September 2020 23:52
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Reading names of selected files

Hello,

I believe, though may be wrong about this since I haven't been using VoiceOver for a few years now that it is in deed possible to report what items are selected on a list after selection is done. On Windows JAWS can certainly report selected items on Windows Explorer list when pressing JAWS+Shift_+Down arrow. For NVDA the same can be accomplished with an add-on called Columns Review in this case the command to report selected items is NVDA+Shift+Up arrow. This add-on is available from the official add-ons website in the section for add-onns under development.

--
Regards
Lukasz


Re: NVDA reading names of selected files in a file list

David Griffith
 

 

But Lucas has shown a method where  Jaws will announce  the 15th and 300th file if they are selected without  you having to arrow through.

David G

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Brian Vogel
Sent: 18 September 2020 00:13
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Reading names of selected files

 

Lukasz,

           I don't know of a single screen reader that won't report an item as selected or unselected if you are actually arrowing through a list.  But that's not what appears to be being asked for here.  Can you imagine a File Explorer window where you selected the 15th file and the 363rd file and had to manually traverse them listening to whether each is selected or not?

            If you can tell me a JAWS, or NVDA command, whether from the screen reader itself or from an script or add-on, that allows you to get the screen reader to say the number of items selected followed by reading their names I'd like to hear about it, as that's what's being asked for (or, if it isn't, then Janet needs to clarify).
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 2004, Build 19041  

A gentleman is one who never hurts anyone's feelings unintentionally.

          ~ Oscar Wilde

 


Re: NVDA reading names of selected files in a file list

David Griffith
 

Dear Lucas

I have just tried this with Jaws and you are entirely correct.
I selected 6 non contiguous files, that is with control space to make sure that they were not adjacent to each other, and following your instructions of pressing Jaws plus shift plus down arrow Jaws did indeed read out a list of the files which had been selected, omitting all of the files which were not selected. I had no idea Jaws could do this even though I have used it for over 20 years so many thanks for educating me here.
I can see how this would be a useful feature in NVDA.

David G.

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Lukasz Golonka
Sent: 17 September 2020 23:52
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Reading names of selected files

Hello,

I believe, though may be wrong about this since I haven't been using VoiceOver for a few years now that it is in deed possible to report what items are selected on a list after selection is done. On Windows JAWS can certainly report selected items on Windows Explorer list when pressing JAWS+Shift_+Down arrow. For NVDA the same can be accomplished with an add-on called Columns Review in this case the command to report selected items is NVDA+Shift+Up arrow. This add-on is available from the official add-ons website in the section for add-onns under development.

--
Regards
Lukasz


Re: NVDA reading names of selected files in a file list

Lukasz Golonka
 

The command for JAWS and add-on for NVDA which I've mentioned in my
previous message both do exactly that.

--
Regards
Lukasz

On Thu, 17 Sep 2020 16:13:09 -0700
"Brian Vogel" <britechguy@gmail.com> wrote:

Lukasz,

           I don't know of a single screen reader that won't report an item as selected or unselected if you are actually arrowing through a list.  But that's not what appears to be being asked for here.  Can you imagine a File Explorer window where you selected the 15th file and the 363rd file and had to manually traverse them listening to whether each is selected or not?

            If you can tell me a JAWS, or NVDA command, whether from the screen reader itself or from an script or add-on, that allows you to get the screen reader to say the number of items selected followed by reading their names I'd like to hear about it, as that's what's being asked for (or, if it isn't, then Janet needs to clarify).
--
Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 2004, Build 19041  
A gentleman is one who never hurts anyone's feelings unintentionally.
          ~ Oscar Wilde
 


Re: NVDA reading names of selected files in a file list

 

Lukasz,

           I don't know of a single screen reader that won't report an item as selected or unselected if you are actually arrowing through a list.  But that's not what appears to be being asked for here.  Can you imagine a File Explorer window where you selected the 15th file and the 363rd file and had to manually traverse them listening to whether each is selected or not?

            If you can tell me a JAWS, or NVDA command, whether from the screen reader itself or from an script or add-on, that allows you to get the screen reader to say the number of items selected followed by reading their names I'd like to hear about it, as that's what's being asked for (or, if it isn't, then Janet needs to clarify).
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 2004, Build 19041  

A gentleman is one who never hurts anyone's feelings unintentionally.

          ~ Oscar Wilde

 


Re: NVDA reading names of selected files in a file list

Lukasz Golonka
 

Hello,

I believe, though may be wrong about this since I haven't been using
VoiceOver for a few years now that it is in deed possible to report what
items are selected on a list after selection is done. On Windows JAWS
can certainly report selected items on Windows Explorer list when
pressing JAWS+Shift_+Down arrow. For NVDA the same can be accomplished
with an add-on called Columns Review in this case the command to report
selected items is NVDA+Shift+Up arrow. This add-on is available from the
official add-ons website in the section for add-onns under development.

--
Regards
Lukasz


Re: NVDA reading names of selected files in a file list

Janet Brandly
 

Window-Eyes used to do this. I could select files from a list, confirm that they were in fact selected, then do what I wanted with them … print, copy, move, etc.

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Brian Vogel
Sent: September 17, 2020 4:29 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Reading names of selected files

 

Sarah,

           I am not clear about what you're saying.  I know that VoiceOver announces the name of each selected item as it's added to the collection of things selected, but so do most screen readers.  But I have never seen VoiceOver have the ability, after you've created that collection of selected items, read the names in that collection "all at once" after selection is complete.

           The way I'm reading the initial request, and it would be under Windows, is that if Janet is selecting Janet.doc, Brandly.pdf, Group.txt, and Spreadsheet.xlsx, that afterward there should be a way to trigger what amounts to a "read all for selected items only," where the screen reader would say something like, "Selected, 4 files, Janet.doc, Brandly.pdf, Group.txt, Spreadsheet.xlsx."

            I have never worked with a screen reader that does this.  It will announce each as it's added to the selection collection, but there's no post-selection way to have the screen reader give you a file-by-file list of what's been collected.

--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 2004, Build 19041  

A gentleman is one who never hurts anyone's feelings unintentionally.

          ~ Oscar Wilde

 


Re: NVDA reading names of selected files in a file list

 

Hi,

A bit tricky, as it’ll require asking the list control how many items are there and selection count based on state.

In case of Janet’s request, part of this has to do with not being able to read status bar information in File Explorer. It is possible to do this easily in more recent NVDA – all that needs to be done is locating the status bar control.

As for how VoiceOver can read names of selected items, one important thing to remember is that this is a completely different operating system.

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Brian Vogel
Sent: Thursday, September 17, 2020 3:29 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Reading names of selected files

 

Sarah,

           I am not clear about what you're saying.  I know that VoiceOver announces the name of each selected item as it's added to the collection of things selected, but so do most screen readers.  But I have never seen VoiceOver have the ability, after you've created that collection of selected items, read the names in that collection "all at once" after selection is complete.

           The way I'm reading the initial request, and it would be under Windows, is that if Janet is selecting Janet.doc, Brandly.pdf, Group.txt, and Spreadsheet.xlsx, that afterward there should be a way to trigger what amounts to a "read all for selected items only," where the screen reader would say something like, "Selected, 4 files, Janet.doc, Brandly.pdf, Group.txt, Spreadsheet.xlsx."

            I have never worked with a screen reader that does this.  It will announce each as it's added to the selection collection, but there's no post-selection way to have the screen reader give you a file-by-file list of what's been collected.

--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 2004, Build 19041  

A gentleman is one who never hurts anyone's feelings unintentionally.

          ~ Oscar Wilde

 


Re: NVDA reading names of selected files in a file list

 

Sarah,

           I am not clear about what you're saying.  I know that VoiceOver announces the name of each selected item as it's added to the collection of things selected, but so do most screen readers.  But I have never seen VoiceOver have the ability, after you've created that collection of selected items, read the names in that collection "all at once" after selection is complete.

           The way I'm reading the initial request, and it would be under Windows, is that if Janet is selecting Janet.doc, Brandly.pdf, Group.txt, and Spreadsheet.xlsx, that afterward there should be a way to trigger what amounts to a "read all for selected items only," where the screen reader would say something like, "Selected, 4 files, Janet.doc, Brandly.pdf, Group.txt, Spreadsheet.xlsx."

            I have never worked with a screen reader that does this.  It will announce each as it's added to the selection collection, but there's no post-selection way to have the screen reader give you a file-by-file list of what's been collected.

--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 2004, Build 19041  

A gentleman is one who never hurts anyone's feelings unintentionally.

          ~ Oscar Wilde

 


Re: Navigating to a specific link when there are many on a webpage

Luke Robinett <blindgroupsluke@...>
 

Oh, another suggestion. If that is the only link you visit on that page, or if it’s one of only a small number of links you visit, you can press the V key on your keyboard while in browse mode to cycle through previously visited links. That might be worth a shot as well.

On Sep 17, 2020, at 9:26 AM, Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:



The find command is one of the most underused and most powerful ways of web page navigation.  Often, four letters is adequate to allow you to find something on the first search or on repeating the search. 


Be at the top of the page and search for what you are looking for.  For example, if the link says opinion, search for opin.  It doesn't have to be the first word or part of it.  If it is common and you will have to search many times, use a different word or part of it in the link. 


If that link is the first link you have gone to in the navigation links and remains the first, you can also go to the top of the page and type v for move by visited links.


Gene

On 9/17/2020 2:50 AM, Andy Jobben wrote:
Hi there NVDA users

I'm a WordPress user and i got a queation if there is a quicker way to help me work.

Let's say you have a website with many links. All those links are a navigation and have sub link aswell. Well the thing is that i need one of the links that are almost in the middle. I can tab till my finters breaks or use the element list NVDA plus F7, But i'm curious if there is a way that i can jump to that specific link/button by making a short key or with a addon.

Hope someone can help in this.


Re: Navigating to a specific link when there are many on a webpage

Luke Robinett <blindgroupsluke@...>
 

You mentioned the NVDA object browser and I would say that’s your best bet. It has a search filter that allows you to decide what object type – form fields, links, headings etc. you want and you can type in a specific search term. I can’t think of anything much faster than this, myself. I use this tool frequently


Re: NVDA reading names of selected files in a file list

Sarah k Alawami
 

Actually voiceover can infact do this. I hear the names of the itmes selected and or the number of items selected when I hit a command. So it can in theory be possible.

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On 17 Sep 2020, at 13:10, Brian Vogel wrote:

On Thu, Sep 17, 2020 at 01:08 PM, Janet Brandly wrote:
I’m disappointed that NVDA cannot do this
-
To my knowledge, no screen reader can do this.  You're talking about a situation where multi-select is in use, and a screen reader can only have focus in one place at one time.

It's not like a collection of file names in File Explorer is a always a chunk of text that's contiguous, though it can be.  But even when it is, what the screen reader has focus on when the selection is complete is the last item selected.

I imagine it would be conceptually possible to write something that would go through the File Explorer file list and read only those things currently selected.  The need for same has been infrequent enough that it hasn't been asked for and if the list of selected items were long it very quickly becomes beyond the human ability to hold information in mind.   In searching GitHub this issue has been under discussion for several years because there is really no "good way" that anyone can figure out for NVDA to handle all the issues involved gracefully.  See:  https://github.com/nvaccess/nvda/issues/5005 

I could swear there is a way in NVDA now to read the status bar that tells you how many items are selected in File Explorer.  I need to dig some on that.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 2004, Build 19041  

A gentleman is one who never hurts anyone's feelings unintentionally.

          ~ Oscar Wilde

 


Re: NVDA 2020.3 beta 1 is now available

 

Hi,

It will override (replace) existing installation if file names are the same.

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Brian Vogel
Sent: Thursday, September 17, 2020 1:27 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA 2020.3 beta 1 is now available

 

As a side question, and this applies beyond the beta, but just came up when I was installing it.

When you already have an existing installed version of NVDA running, the installer tells you that it will update the existing installation (or something similar).  What I'm wondering is whether this actually means that some of the existing code is retained and added to?  A lot of installers, once they detect an existing installed version, will uninstall that version and then install the latest, and tell you so.

What is the NVDA installer actually doing in the case of an update to an existing installed version?

--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 2004, Build 19041  

A gentleman is one who never hurts anyone's feelings unintentionally.

          ~ Oscar Wilde

 


Re: NVDA 2020.3 beta 1 is now available

 

As a side question, and this applies beyond the beta, but just came up when I was installing it.

When you already have an existing installed version of NVDA running, the installer tells you that it will update the existing installation (or something similar).  What I'm wondering is whether this actually means that some of the existing code is retained and added to?  A lot of installers, once they detect an existing installed version, will uninstall that version and then install the latest, and tell you so.

What is the NVDA installer actually doing in the case of an update to an existing installed version?

--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 2004, Build 19041  

A gentleman is one who never hurts anyone's feelings unintentionally.

          ~ Oscar Wilde

 


Re: NVDA reading names of selected files in a file list

 

On Thu, Sep 17, 2020 at 01:08 PM, Janet Brandly wrote:
I’m disappointed that NVDA cannot do this
-
To my knowledge, no screen reader can do this.  You're talking about a situation where multi-select is in use, and a screen reader can only have focus in one place at one time.

It's not like a collection of file names in File Explorer is a always a chunk of text that's contiguous, though it can be.  But even when it is, what the screen reader has focus on when the selection is complete is the last item selected.

I imagine it would be conceptually possible to write something that would go through the File Explorer file list and read only those things currently selected.  The need for same has been infrequent enough that it hasn't been asked for and if the list of selected items were long it very quickly becomes beyond the human ability to hold information in mind.   In searching GitHub this issue has been under discussion for several years because there is really no "good way" that anyone can figure out for NVDA to handle all the issues involved gracefully.  See:  https://github.com/nvaccess/nvda/issues/5005 

I could swear there is a way in NVDA now to read the status bar that tells you how many items are selected in File Explorer.  I need to dig some on that.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 2004, Build 19041  

A gentleman is one who never hurts anyone's feelings unintentionally.

          ~ Oscar Wilde

 

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