Date   

Re: Introducing the Quick Dictionary add-on #addonrelease

abdul muhamin
 

it should be editable via input gestures, remove all the shortcuts that you have added in the addon, and add a prompt which remind the user to set the shortcut key through input gestures

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 

From: Supanut Leepaisomboon
Sent: Tuesday, September 29, 2020 12:47 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Introducing the Quick Dictionary add-on #addonRelease

 

NVDA+x is free; I just tried that key combination and nothing happens so...yeah you can use that key combination for this addon.
But it would be nice, if users can change this hotkey in the input jestures dialog (correct me if this capability has been added already since my last post).

 


Re: Veracryp's SecureDesktop opt not usable latest trunk

Gene
 

Why do you sayy it isn't accessible? The secure desktop is what comes up when UAC runs and my installed copy of NVDA reads the UAC message.

As far as I recall, the question about why the portable version can't work with the secure desktop hasn't been addressed. Someone with far more technical knowledge will I hope address it. But when the secure desktop runs, the copy of the screen-reader that is running can't access it. I believe this is one of the main points of the secure desktop, to be isolated from a lot of processes and thus provide a much safer environment in case malware tries to do something that causes it to come up.

However, the installed version of NVDA can run a copy of itself that can work in the secure desktop. Technically, I don't know why it can and the portable version can't but that gives you some idea of why the portable copy cand and the installed copy can provide access in that environment.

Gene

-----Original Message-----
From: john doe
Sent: Tuesday, September 29, 2020 10:12 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Veracryp's SecureDesktop opt not usable latest trunk

Even with NVDA installed, the secureDesktop is not accessible.

--
John Doe


Re: Veracryp's SecureDesktop opt not usable latest trunk

john doe
 

Even with NVDA installed, the secureDesktop is not accessible.

--
John Doe


Re: Introducing the Quick Dictionary add-on #addonrelease

Oleksandr Gryshchenko
 

Hi guys! ;)

Ralf, I want to save your left hand, so I will choose the NVDA + Y version, which you wrote about earlier ;)
It was a good joke, thanks! ;)

Supanut wrote:
> But it would be nice, if users can change this hotkey in the input jestures dialog (correct me if this capability has been added already since my last post).
Hi Supanut,
such an opportunity was present from the beginning.
In the input jestures dialog, find and open "Quick Dictionary", than find and open "Switch to Quick Dictionary control mode".
Tab to Add button and press keyboard shortcut which you want to assign to this command. Tab to OK. Space. Done :)
This feature should work for you, as it is implemented the same way in many other add-ons.
Please write if you meant something else or I misunderstood you.

Good luck to all!


Re: running beta of nvda

Robert Doc Wright godfearer
 

Joseph do you know if any fixes were made concerning Bard Express. before
there last update we only needed to keep the program in standard mode in
order to hear the annotation of a book. Since the update that ability has
been taken away. Now we only get title, author and the first few words of
the annotation.
******
If we can't look at ourselves, and ask, why? then where does the learning
start?

Family times where there is fun for every ear!
http://stream.wrighthere.net:8000/stream.mp3

Or ask your A device to play Family times on tuneIn
You can also find us on your mobile device install OoTunes and search for
Family times

----- Original Message -----
From: "Joseph Lee" <joseph.lee22590@gmail.com>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Monday, September 28, 2020 2:10 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] running beta of nvda


Hi,
It is useful in alpha builds, but I do understand that it isn't so much for
beta releases. The bigger problem isn't swapping debug tone - rather,
instructing people as to how to spot these errors and reporting them using
appropriate methods. This is the reason why whenever I get bug reports about
add-ons (or in some cases, NVDA itself), I ask for a debug log offlist so it
can be reproduced and reported to NV Access; in some cases I do come back
and report additional findings and let folks know what will happen in a
follow-up action.
Perhaps the bigger issue would be teaching people about how to report bugs
appropriately. It isn't enough to simply state that you are hearing
descending tones. Users and developers would like to know possible steps
taken to arrive at a specific problem, including what NVDA did versus what
folks were expecting. Even though users might not be able to provide certain
details, discussions on this list and elsewhere may provide necessary info
for people to help debug and think about solutions (and in some cases,
implement them).
Although I do not say this a lot in public, but I feel it is time I say it:
I take lack of detailed bug reports and the atmosphere behind lack of
effective bug reporting instructions as a personal failure.
Cheers,
Joseph


-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Tyler Spivey
Sent: Monday, September 28, 2020 12:09 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] running beta of nvda

Maybe the solution here is to open issues for every single error we hear
that isn't a duplicate of something else, since these are obviously
important enough to get the user's attention.

You (and others who are part of the project) don't seem to understand that
the sound is useless to most of us.
It comes up so often that it's just background noise. Let's take some simple
examples:

1. Restart with add-ons disabled, press control NVDA v, tab twice, hit
escape, press control NVDA s to switch synth then hit enter.
You'll most likely get:
RuntimeError: wrapped C/C++ object of type BoxSizer has been deleted

Does this matter to anyone? Probably not, since it's been there for a while.

Next one. Switch to a synth which is an addon, then restart with add-ons
disabled. You hear the startup sound, then the error sound.
When you look, you find out that it's just NVDA not being able to load the
synth, because addons are disabled, which is a completely expected case. But
this shouldn't produce the sound.

There are others, which come up when doing seemingly simple tasks. Alt
tabbing just now is a perfect example of something I would not expect to
fail:
Could not register for UIA events for element Why is that important? If it
can't register because of a COM Error, it should do something else, or tell
you if you debug.

Alt tabbing again, we get another error sound, this time for an unreachable
wave player.



On 9/28/2020 11:32 AM, Joseph Lee wrote:
Hi,

This behavior is intentional – beta is not really a stable build yet,
so NVDA developers are interested in fixing major errors if possible,
hence the debug tone.

Cheers,

Joseph



*From:* nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> *On Behalf Of *Don H
*Sent:* Monday, September 28, 2020 11:20 AM
*To:* nvda@nvda.groups.io
*Subject:* Re: [nvda] running beta of nvda



Yep running beta 2 of NVDA

On 9/28/2020 9:35 AM, Chris via groups.io wrote:

Are you sure you are running the beta and not the alpha?





*From: *Don H <mailto:lmddh50@adams.net>
*Sent: *28 September 2020 14:34
*To: *nvda@nvda.groups.io <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>
*Subject: *[nvda] running beta of nvda



Running the latest beta of NVDA on a Win 10 computer. Getting the
error

ding every time I go to a web page with Google Chrome. Also get a
error

ding when I close Google Chrome.
















Re: Testing

Robert Doc Wright godfearer
 

Dave, this message came through.
******
If we can't look at ourselves, and ask, why? then where does the learning
start?

Family times where there is fun for every ear!
http://stream.wrighthere.net:8000/stream.mp3

Or ask your A device to play Family times on tuneIn
You can also find us on your mobile device install OoTunes and search for
Family times

----- Original Message -----
From: "Dave Grossoehme" <dave@grossoehme.com>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Monday, September 28, 2020 4:59 PM
Subject: [nvda] Testing


Good day: This is a test to see if I can send and receive group messages.

Dave


Re: running beta of nvda

Jaffar Sidek <jaffar.sidek10@...>
 

Hi.  I have no qualms about error warnings with sound, except that The NVDA error warning sound sounds rather loud and, to a certain extent, too triumphant.  I wish the error warning could be made less glaring.  Encountering an error is already frustrating.  Hearing such a vulgar sound multiplies the frustration even more.  Cheers!

On 29/9/2020 8:15 am, Quentin Christensen wrote:
The error sound plays when NVDA encounters an error (and that will be written to the log).  In some (many?) cases, the program will pick this up, and try something else to do what it needs to do.  In some cases, it is able to work around the problem, do whatever it was trying to do, and an end user wouldn't normally notice any problem.  In Alpha and Beta builds, the error sound is played when that error is encountered, even if NVDA then goes on to work around it.  In RC and stable builds, the error sound is suppressed.  If you look in the log, you'll still find the error there, even if you didn't notice anything untoward while working normally.  Ideally the point of the error sound is to alert the tester to the error, so they can investigate further.

There has been discussion in the past about the idea of having this be configurable.  This is the only issue I can find on it though which was closed a couple of years ago: https://github.com/nvaccess/nvda/issues/6917.  If anyone feels like creating a new issue, I think a case can be argued for the inclusion of an option, perhaps on the "Advanced" settings screen and have error sounds automatically enabled for alpha / beta builds and automatically disabled for RC / release builds.

Quentin.


On Tue, Sep 29, 2020 at 8:14 AM Joseph Lee <joseph.lee22590@...> wrote:

Hi,

No, it doesn’t do that, although we came so close to it a while back with Crash Hero. The checkbox in question is about data to be sent when NVDA checks for updates for the purpose of gathering statistics on synthesizers, braille displays and such.

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Roger Stewart
Sent: Monday, September 28, 2020 3:03 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] running beta of nvda

 

Doesn't NVDA have an automatic bug reporting system?  I thought that is why we have that checkbox that says if you want to send info to the NVDA developers to make it better. Thought it sent back something if an error occurs or something but maybe it doesn't do that.

 

Roger

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

On 9/28/2020 4:58 PM, Brian Vogel wrote:

Joseph,

          The lack of detailed bug reporting is hardly limited to NVDA, and you know that as well as anyone.

           But as I've said before, and Tyler confirms in other instances (but at least where something shows up), getting error tones when there is no observable error makes it impossible for someone to even write a bug report.  What would it say, "Everything worked just fine, but I got an error tone?."  That's why the use of such when real errors have not actually occurred, or are at a level that the end user could never hope to document or influence, they're a terrible idea.

            I'd also hope that NVDA, like most modern software, includes telemetry to report "silent error" conditions.
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 2004, Build 19041  

It’s hard waking up and realizing it’s not always black and white.

     ~ Kelley Boorn

 

 



--
Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager


Re: Introducing the Quick Dictionary add-on #addonrelease

 

NVDA+x is free; I just tried that key combination and nothing happens so...yeah you can use that key combination for this addon.
But it would be nice, if users can change this hotkey in the input jestures dialog (correct me if this capability has been added already since my last post).


Re: Veracryp's SecureDesktop opt not usable latest trunk

john doe
 

What are the limitations preventing the portable version of NVDA from
accessing the secure desktop?


When NVDA gets that prompt, NVDA is lost and I couldn't find anyway out
of it.
For veracrypt I can work around this, it is an annoying issue when
working on computers that are not mine.
I took veracrypt to illustrate the issue but I'm also facing the issue
elsewhere.

--
John Doe


Re: A more intelligent NVDA OCR?

Larry Wang
 

It is only available in Windows 10, it is also limited by your system language. For ocr on lower version of windows you can try this addon written by me.

https://github.com/larry801/online_ocr/releases/download/0.19.5-dev/onlineOCR-0.19-dev.nvda-addon

在 2020/9/29 5:39, Hope Williamson 写道:

Ok nope it really doesn't. I guess that's the one thing I'll keep the
other screen reader for.




Re: A more intelligent NVDA OCR?

rowen brian <manchen0528@...>
 

Hi,  Rob Hudson.
I think, Lion OCR with automatic recognition can do this.
 


Re: A more intelligent NVDA OCR?

 

I actually have not try the OCR function with games that involves fast movement of texts, or requires constant realtime interaction with texts, so I can't say how well OCR would work in that kind of situation.


Re: A more intelligent NVDA OCR?

Rob Hudson
 

Games move pretty fast though. Are you able to OCR and read and act with real speed?

----- Original Message -----
From: "Supanut Leepaisomboon" <supanut2000@outlook.com>
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2020 18:55:51 -0700
Subject: Re: [nvda] A more intelligent NVDA OCR?

I think I totally agree with the original post.
NVDA OCR, in the current form, is quite good already but I think this could be improved further, if technology allows it.
From my tests, OCR seems to work even with games such as Sims 3, thus allowing me to read in-game texts without the use of Windows Magnifier (well, at least for most of the time).







Re: A more intelligent NVDA OCR?

 

I think I totally agree with the original post.
NVDA OCR, in the current form, is quite good already but I think this could be improved further, if technology allows it.
From my tests, OCR seems to work even with games such as Sims 3, thus allowing me to read in-game texts without the use of Windows Magnifier (well, at least for most of the time).


Re: running beta of nvda

Quentin Christensen
 

The error sound plays when NVDA encounters an error (and that will be written to the log).  In some (many?) cases, the program will pick this up, and try something else to do what it needs to do.  In some cases, it is able to work around the problem, do whatever it was trying to do, and an end user wouldn't normally notice any problem.  In Alpha and Beta builds, the error sound is played when that error is encountered, even if NVDA then goes on to work around it.  In RC and stable builds, the error sound is suppressed.  If you look in the log, you'll still find the error there, even if you didn't notice anything untoward while working normally.  Ideally the point of the error sound is to alert the tester to the error, so they can investigate further.

There has been discussion in the past about the idea of having this be configurable.  This is the only issue I can find on it though which was closed a couple of years ago: https://github.com/nvaccess/nvda/issues/6917.  If anyone feels like creating a new issue, I think a case can be argued for the inclusion of an option, perhaps on the "Advanced" settings screen and have error sounds automatically enabled for alpha / beta builds and automatically disabled for RC / release builds.

Quentin.


On Tue, Sep 29, 2020 at 8:14 AM Joseph Lee <joseph.lee22590@...> wrote:

Hi,

No, it doesn’t do that, although we came so close to it a while back with Crash Hero. The checkbox in question is about data to be sent when NVDA checks for updates for the purpose of gathering statistics on synthesizers, braille displays and such.

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Roger Stewart
Sent: Monday, September 28, 2020 3:03 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] running beta of nvda

 

Doesn't NVDA have an automatic bug reporting system?  I thought that is why we have that checkbox that says if you want to send info to the NVDA developers to make it better. Thought it sent back something if an error occurs or something but maybe it doesn't do that.

 

Roger

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

On 9/28/2020 4:58 PM, Brian Vogel wrote:

Joseph,

          The lack of detailed bug reporting is hardly limited to NVDA, and you know that as well as anyone.

           But as I've said before, and Tyler confirms in other instances (but at least where something shows up), getting error tones when there is no observable error makes it impossible for someone to even write a bug report.  What would it say, "Everything worked just fine, but I got an error tone?."  That's why the use of such when real errors have not actually occurred, or are at a level that the end user could never hope to document or influence, they're a terrible idea.

            I'd also hope that NVDA, like most modern software, includes telemetry to report "silent error" conditions.
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 2004, Build 19041  

It’s hard waking up and realizing it’s not always black and white.

     ~ Kelley Boorn

 

 



--
Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager


Re: A more intelligent NVDA OCR?

Quentin Christensen
 

It should work with image PDF files.  A couple of things to bear in mind:
- It will recognise printed or typed text, but not so much handwritten text (a limitation of basically every OCR).
- It works, as Rob noted, with what is currently visible on screen.  If you are zoomed in such that only 1/10th of the page is visible, that's all it will be able to run OCR on.  If, however, you zoom out so you can fit 100 pages on screen, that won't work either, as the text will be too small to recognise.  One page should work well though.

Regards

Quentin.

On Tue, Sep 29, 2020 at 8:05 AM Rob Hudson <rob_hudson3182@...> wrote:
It works with content immediately visible on the screen.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Hope Williamson" <webspinner@...>
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2020 14:36:25 -0700
Subject: Re: [nvda] A more intelligent NVDA OCR?

> OK will do. Does this work with image PDF documents?
>
>
>
>
>
>







--
Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager


Testing

Dave Grossoehme
 

Good day:  This is a test to see if I can send and receive group messages.

Dave


Re: running beta of nvda

 

Hi,

No, it doesn’t do that, although we came so close to it a while back with Crash Hero. The checkbox in question is about data to be sent when NVDA checks for updates for the purpose of gathering statistics on synthesizers, braille displays and such.

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Roger Stewart
Sent: Monday, September 28, 2020 3:03 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] running beta of nvda

 

Doesn't NVDA have an automatic bug reporting system?  I thought that is why we have that checkbox that says if you want to send info to the NVDA developers to make it better. Thought it sent back something if an error occurs or something but maybe it doesn't do that.

 

Roger

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

On 9/28/2020 4:58 PM, Brian Vogel wrote:

Joseph,

          The lack of detailed bug reporting is hardly limited to NVDA, and you know that as well as anyone.

           But as I've said before, and Tyler confirms in other instances (but at least where something shows up), getting error tones when there is no observable error makes it impossible for someone to even write a bug report.  What would it say, "Everything worked just fine, but I got an error tone?."  That's why the use of such when real errors have not actually occurred, or are at a level that the end user could never hope to document or influence, they're a terrible idea.

            I'd also hope that NVDA, like most modern software, includes telemetry to report "silent error" conditions.
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 2004, Build 19041  

It’s hard waking up and realizing it’s not always black and white.

     ~ Kelley Boorn

 

 


Re: A more intelligent NVDA OCR?

Rob Hudson
 

It works with content immediately visible on the screen.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Hope Williamson" <webspinner@mail.com>
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2020 14:36:25 -0700
Subject: Re: [nvda] A more intelligent NVDA OCR?

OK will do. Does this work with image PDF documents?






Re: running beta of nvda

Roger Stewart
 

Doesn't NVDA have an automatic bug reporting system?  I thought that is why we have that checkbox that says if you want to send info to the NVDA developers to make it better. Thought it sent back something if an error occurs or something but maybe it doesn't do that.

Roger










On 9/28/2020 4:58 PM, Brian Vogel wrote:
Joseph,

          The lack of detailed bug reporting is hardly limited to NVDA, and you know that as well as anyone.

           But as I've said before, and Tyler confirms in other instances (but at least where something shows up), getting error tones when there is no observable error makes it impossible for someone to even write a bug report.  What would it say, "Everything worked just fine, but I got an error tone?."  That's why the use of such when real errors have not actually occurred, or are at a level that the end user could never hope to document or influence, they're a terrible idea.

            I'd also hope that NVDA, like most modern software, includes telemetry to report "silent error" conditions.
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 2004, Build 19041  

It’s hard waking up and realizing it’s not always black and white.

     ~ Kelley Boorn

 


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