Date   

Re: Task Manager Alternatives

 

Try taking a look at the page:  https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/sysinternals/downloads/

I do not know how accessible it is, but Process Monitor is a frequently used alternative to Task Manager.  Give it a try and report back regarding accessibility.

--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1809, Build 17763  

Puritanism:  The haunting fear that someone, somewhere, may be happy.

        ~ H.L. Mencken

 

 


Keystrokes from other screenreaders NVDA does not have

Jacob Kruger
 

Gene, for example, if working with WAMP webserver's system tray icon, I generally need to route mouse cursor there with NVDA keystroke NVDA + numpad /, and then activate a left mouse button click, using just numpad /, or else it will not activate the primary activity-related context menu of sorts.


If, for example, you'd tried to either invoke context menu in normal ways, or if you'd hit enter on it, like some other icons require/prefer - it would still invoke a different context menu, but, not the one I generally want to make use of.


Not an issue for me since have been doing this for a few years now, with this specific icon - was just an example of one that I've made a mental note to work differently with.


Jacob Kruger
Blind Biker
"Resistance is futile...but, acceptance is versatile..."

On 2019-06-25 3:01 PM, Gene wrote:
I have reported here more than once and one or two other people agreed, that certain icons can't be activated when in the actual System Tray.  This is either one of the same people repeating this as before or its another person reporting the same thing.
 
I don't know what can and can't be worked with now in Windows 10 or if this is still true of the Drop Box icon.  I couldn't get it to activate in the system tray itself, at least at times. 
 
Also, in Windows 7, when you move around after entering the system tray for the first time in a session, if you move with the arrow keys to the network icon, it opens something you don't want to open and you have the annoyance of your moving through items in the system tray interrupted.  We'll see if other people report other problems.  it isn't a question of whether they are minor.  NVDA developers insist that there is no need for the system tray add-on to be incorporated into the program.  there is.  This is not just a question of a different way of doing something.  It is a question of providing a method that works properly in certain instances when the actual system tray doesn't. 
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Tuesday, June 25, 2019 7:19 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Keystrokes from other screenreaders NVDA does not have

Hi Ian,

If you prefer using the addon and NVDA+F11 that's fine - but I would be interested in exploring what doesn't work for you if you use Windows+B.

Is it that you can't get to all the icons with Windows+B?  If that is the case I think I have a solution.  If you press the WINDOWS key, then type "Select which icons appear on the taskbar" (or as much of that as brings up that option in "system settings" to open).  The first item in this settings window is "Always show all icons in the notification area".  If you have it set to "on", then it should show icons for any program running which has a system tray icon.  If you have it set to off, it will only show regularly used or new items and a "Notification chevron button".  To get to those extra icons, press space or enter on that to open the "Overflow notification area", then use the up and down arrows to navigate between all of the icons in both the regular and overflow notification areas.

If that isn't the problem you're having, I'd definitely be interested in learning more about the issue.

Kind regards

Quentin.

On Tue, Jun 25, 2019 at 8:02 PM Ian Blackburn <ianblackburn@...> wrote:
Hi all

I would like to explain why having different ways to access windows features can be useful.

I run Windows 10 latest build 1903

What I will explain is the system tray. Now windows + B goes to system tray. however, sometimes the icons there cannot be activated with NVDA (at least for my situation). The add on which allows NVDA+f11 allows activation of some system tray icons that I cannot access any other  sensible way.

Another example is the  use of the right mouse button. i am talking about the use of the various ways to activate it with the keyboard running NVDA.

The different ways of activating it sometimes produce different results.

The ways I know how to activate the right mouse button include: using the physical button on the mouse, using the function key on the right hand bottom of the QWERTY keyboard near the right CTRl key, using shift+f10 and using the NVDA right mouse klick on the numeric pad. Sometimes any one of these will produce different results on the object you are focused on.

So none of these ways is incorrect but sometimes a particular choice will produce a particular outcome. I am not a programmer and don’t understand the difference from the point of view of the operating system behind these and other commands we use as NVDA users.

i really appreciate the effort and time put in by all those who write NVDA and its adding  because for me on windows NVDA is my primary screen reader.

For whatever reason  Microsoft decided to abandon menus in favour of ribbons but other os’s use menus; including Mac OSX and Gnome on linux.

regards
Ian

On 25 Jun 2019, at 5:36 pm, Quentin Christensen <quentin@...> wrote:

Before anyone jumps on Peter's question on one side or the other, I'll just throw in for Peter's sake, that is basically where this thread arose from - a discussion in another thread (on drag and drop) around using WINDOWS+B to get to the system tray vs using INSERT+F11 (which some other screen readers offer and you can get in NVDA via an add-on).

I wasn't really looking for a discussion on that in this thread, more using that as an example where another screen reader provides its own keystroke which users feel is lacking in NVDA, and particularly where the reason NVDA doesn't follow suit, is that, like accessing the system tray, there is a built-in way to do it in Windows itself.

Regards

Quentin.

On Tue, Jun 25, 2019 at 7:30 PM Peter Beasley <pjbeasley23@...> wrote:
What’s wrong with windows key B which is that standard windows command for the system tray/notification area.



Sent from Mail for Windows 10



From: Quentin Christensen
Sent: 25 June 2019 05:37
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] Keystrokes from other screenreaders NVDA does not have



The discussion in the Drag and drop thread around the system tray has got me thinking:

- The NV Access philosophy is that if Windows includes functionality which is accessible, why re-invent the wheel

- Users who come from other screen readers get confused when they are encouraged to use the Windows keystrokes for functionality they are used to being provided by the screen reader.



I was going to mention the "Switching from Jaws to NVDA" document in that thread, but in reading it just now, I noted that it does NOT, in fact, include how to perform tasks such as access the system tray.



So, can anyone please give me examples of functionality that other screen readers provide (such as INSERT+F11 to access the system tray), that NVDA expects people to use the Windows keystroke (WINDOWS+B in the case of the system tray) for?



I'd like to collate them and update the relevant documents with them, and potentially even make a document all its own if needed.



Kind regards



Quentin.

--

Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager



NVDA 2019.2beta1 now available!



Web: www.nvaccess.org

Training: https://www.nvaccess.org/shop/

Certification: https://certification.nvaccess.org/

User group: https://nvda.groups.io/g/nvda

Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess
Twitter: @NVAccess







--
Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager

NVDA 2019.2beta1 now available!

Web: www.nvaccess.org
Training: https://www.nvaccess.org/shop/
Certification: https://certification.nvaccess.org/
User group: https://nvda.groups.io/g/nvda
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess
Twitter: @NVAccess







--
Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager

NVDA 2019.2beta1 now available!


Re: Keystrokes from other screenreaders NVDA does not have

Luke Davis
 

On Tue, 25 Jun 2019, Gene wrote:

I don't know what can and can't be worked with now in Windows 10 or if this is still true of the Drop Box icon.  I couldn't get it to activate in the system
tray itself, at least at times. 
I have never had a problem pressing enter on the dropbox icon in the systray, and getting the Dropbox menu in Win 10.
That's just me, so have others had this problem in Win 10? I have never used Dropbox on Win 7 so can't comment. But with Win 7 reaching end of life in less than six months, I'm not sure we should be overly concerned with it.

Also, in Windows 7, when you move around after entering the system tray for the first time in a session, if you move with the arrow keys to the network
icon, it opens something you don't want to open and you have the annoyance of your moving through items in the system tray interrupted.  We'll see if other
I have never had that problem in either Win 7 or Win 10.
What I have had though, is when selecting the network icon, NVDA seems to lose focus. You have to return to the systray and do it again, and usually the second time it works, although still sometimes tabbing around doesn't work so well in the network selector. Still, that is beyond the scope of the system tray.

people report other problems.  it isn't a question of whether they are minor.  NVDA developers insist that there is no need for the system tray add-on to be
incorporated into the program.  there is.  This is not just a question of a different way of doing something.  It is a question of providing a method that
works properly in certain instances when the actual system tray doesn't. 
Forgive me, but all I've heard so far are windows 7 examples. While granted those should probably be fixed if possible, and the add-on supposedly works to do that, I would argue that if identified they should be fixed in situ, not by changing the interface of the screenreader for that element, to a non-standard (non-windows-standard) mechanism that must be constantly updated and maintained..

If most of the systray was inaccessible, and that state persisted into Windows 10, I might have a different opinion. However it sounds like there are very few cases where systray items don't work, even in Windows 7, which outdated operating system is our only source of examples to date.

You are asking for a new interface to the system tray to be provided for Windows 10, with no evidence so far that one is technically necessary, other than to comfort those coming over from other screen readers.

Luke


Re: Keystrokes from other screenreaders NVDA does not have

Gene
 

I have reported here more than once and one or two other people agreed, that certain icons can't be activated when in the actual System Tray.  This is either one of the same people repeating this as before or its another person reporting the same thing.
 
I don't know what can and can't be worked with now in Windows 10 or if this is still true of the Drop Box icon.  I couldn't get it to activate in the system tray itself, at least at times. 
 
Also, in Windows 7, when you move around after entering the system tray for the first time in a session, if you move with the arrow keys to the network icon, it opens something you don't want to open and you have the annoyance of your moving through items in the system tray interrupted.  We'll see if other people report other problems.  it isn't a question of whether they are minor.  NVDA developers insist that there is no need for the system tray add-on to be incorporated into the program.  there is.  This is not just a question of a different way of doing something.  It is a question of providing a method that works properly in certain instances when the actual system tray doesn't. 
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Tuesday, June 25, 2019 7:19 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Keystrokes from other screenreaders NVDA does not have

Hi Ian,

If you prefer using the addon and NVDA+F11 that's fine - but I would be interested in exploring what doesn't work for you if you use Windows+B.

Is it that you can't get to all the icons with Windows+B?  If that is the case I think I have a solution.  If you press the WINDOWS key, then type "Select which icons appear on the taskbar" (or as much of that as brings up that option in "system settings" to open).  The first item in this settings window is "Always show all icons in the notification area".  If you have it set to "on", then it should show icons for any program running which has a system tray icon.  If you have it set to off, it will only show regularly used or new items and a "Notification chevron button".  To get to those extra icons, press space or enter on that to open the "Overflow notification area", then use the up and down arrows to navigate between all of the icons in both the regular and overflow notification areas.

If that isn't the problem you're having, I'd definitely be interested in learning more about the issue.

Kind regards

Quentin.

On Tue, Jun 25, 2019 at 8:02 PM Ian Blackburn <ianblackburn@...> wrote:
Hi all

I would like to explain why having different ways to access windows features can be useful.

I run Windows 10 latest build 1903

What I will explain is the system tray. Now windows + B goes to system tray. however, sometimes the icons there cannot be activated with NVDA (at least for my situation). The add on which allows NVDA+f11 allows activation of some system tray icons that I cannot access any other  sensible way.

Another example is the  use of the right mouse button. i am talking about the use of the various ways to activate it with the keyboard running NVDA.

The different ways of activating it sometimes produce different results.

The ways I know how to activate the right mouse button include: using the physical button on the mouse, using the function key on the right hand bottom of the QWERTY keyboard near the right CTRl key, using shift+f10 and using the NVDA right mouse klick on the numeric pad. Sometimes any one of these will produce different results on the object you are focused on.

So none of these ways is incorrect but sometimes a particular choice will produce a particular outcome. I am not a programmer and don’t understand the difference from the point of view of the operating system behind these and other commands we use as NVDA users.

i really appreciate the effort and time put in by all those who write NVDA and its adding  because for me on windows NVDA is my primary screen reader.

For whatever reason  Microsoft decided to abandon menus in favour of ribbons but other os’s use menus; including Mac OSX and Gnome on linux.

regards
Ian

On 25 Jun 2019, at 5:36 pm, Quentin Christensen <quentin@...> wrote:

Before anyone jumps on Peter's question on one side or the other, I'll just throw in for Peter's sake, that is basically where this thread arose from - a discussion in another thread (on drag and drop) around using WINDOWS+B to get to the system tray vs using INSERT+F11 (which some other screen readers offer and you can get in NVDA via an add-on).

I wasn't really looking for a discussion on that in this thread, more using that as an example where another screen reader provides its own keystroke which users feel is lacking in NVDA, and particularly where the reason NVDA doesn't follow suit, is that, like accessing the system tray, there is a built-in way to do it in Windows itself.

Regards

Quentin.

On Tue, Jun 25, 2019 at 7:30 PM Peter Beasley <pjbeasley23@...> wrote:
What’s wrong with windows key B which is that standard windows command for the system tray/notification area.



Sent from Mail for Windows 10



From: Quentin Christensen
Sent: 25 June 2019 05:37
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] Keystrokes from other screenreaders NVDA does not have



The discussion in the Drag and drop thread around the system tray has got me thinking:

- The NV Access philosophy is that if Windows includes functionality which is accessible, why re-invent the wheel

- Users who come from other screen readers get confused when they are encouraged to use the Windows keystrokes for functionality they are used to being provided by the screen reader.



I was going to mention the "Switching from Jaws to NVDA" document in that thread, but in reading it just now, I noted that it does NOT, in fact, include how to perform tasks such as access the system tray.



So, can anyone please give me examples of functionality that other screen readers provide (such as INSERT+F11 to access the system tray), that NVDA expects people to use the Windows keystroke (WINDOWS+B in the case of the system tray) for?



I'd like to collate them and update the relevant documents with them, and potentially even make a document all its own if needed.



Kind regards



Quentin.

--

Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager



NVDA 2019.2beta1 now available!



Web: www.nvaccess.org

Training: https://www.nvaccess.org/shop/

Certification: https://certification.nvaccess.org/

User group: https://nvda.groups.io/g/nvda

Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess
Twitter: @NVAccess







--
Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager

NVDA 2019.2beta1 now available!

Web: www.nvaccess.org
Training: https://www.nvaccess.org/shop/
Certification: https://certification.nvaccess.org/
User group: https://nvda.groups.io/g/nvda
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess
Twitter: @NVAccess







--
Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager

NVDA 2019.2beta1 now available!


Re: Drag and Drop with NVDA

Luke Davis
 

On Tue, 25 Jun 2019, Quentin Christensen wrote:

On Sun, Jun 23, 2019 at 11:16 PM Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:
And at times, you can't work with a system tray icon properly without working with the system tray dialog so I consider this a necessary feature, not
just a question of there being a Windows and a screen-reader way to do things.  Others have reported the same thing, that they have found instances
where the system tray dialog is necessary to work with an icon.
Gene, can you provide any examples of this?

I have found system notifications I can not work with, and for which there seems to be no icon in the systray (the one that comes to mind is the notification about a dirty file system on a USB drive, with the option to repair it), but I can't think of any standard systray items that can not be accessed in some way.

Luke


Re: Keystrokes from other screenreaders NVDA does not have

Quentin Christensen
 

Hi Ian,

If you prefer using the addon and NVDA+F11 that's fine - but I would be interested in exploring what doesn't work for you if you use Windows+B.

Is it that you can't get to all the icons with Windows+B?  If that is the case I think I have a solution.  If you press the WINDOWS key, then type "Select which icons appear on the taskbar" (or as much of that as brings up that option in "system settings" to open).  The first item in this settings window is "Always show all icons in the notification area".  If you have it set to "on", then it should show icons for any program running which has a system tray icon.  If you have it set to off, it will only show regularly used or new items and a "Notification chevron button".  To get to those extra icons, press space or enter on that to open the "Overflow notification area", then use the up and down arrows to navigate between all of the icons in both the regular and overflow notification areas.

If that isn't the problem you're having, I'd definitely be interested in learning more about the issue.

Kind regards

Quentin.

On Tue, Jun 25, 2019 at 8:02 PM Ian Blackburn <ianblackburn@...> wrote:
Hi all

I would like to explain why having different ways to access windows features can be useful.

I run Windows 10 latest build 1903

What I will explain is the system tray. Now windows + B goes to system tray. however, sometimes the icons there cannot be activated with NVDA (at least for my situation). The add on which allows NVDA+f11 allows activation of some system tray icons that I cannot access any other  sensible way.

Another example is the  use of the right mouse button. i am talking about the use of the various ways to activate it with the keyboard running NVDA.

The different ways of activating it sometimes produce different results.

The ways I know how to activate the right mouse button include: using the physical button on the mouse, using the function key on the right hand bottom of the QWERTY keyboard near the right CTRl key, using shift+f10 and using the NVDA right mouse klick on the numeric pad. Sometimes any one of these will produce different results on the object you are focused on.

So none of these ways is incorrect but sometimes a particular choice will produce a particular outcome. I am not a programmer and don’t understand the difference from the point of view of the operating system behind these and other commands we use as NVDA users.

i really appreciate the effort and time put in by all those who write NVDA and its adding  because for me on windows NVDA is my primary screen reader.

For whatever reason  Microsoft decided to abandon menus in favour of ribbons but other os’s use menus; including Mac OSX and Gnome on linux.

regards
Ian

On 25 Jun 2019, at 5:36 pm, Quentin Christensen <quentin@...> wrote:

Before anyone jumps on Peter's question on one side or the other, I'll just throw in for Peter's sake, that is basically where this thread arose from - a discussion in another thread (on drag and drop) around using WINDOWS+B to get to the system tray vs using INSERT+F11 (which some other screen readers offer and you can get in NVDA via an add-on).

I wasn't really looking for a discussion on that in this thread, more using that as an example where another screen reader provides its own keystroke which users feel is lacking in NVDA, and particularly where the reason NVDA doesn't follow suit, is that, like accessing the system tray, there is a built-in way to do it in Windows itself.

Regards

Quentin.

On Tue, Jun 25, 2019 at 7:30 PM Peter Beasley <pjbeasley23@...> wrote:
What’s wrong with windows key B which is that standard windows command for the system tray/notification area.



Sent from Mail for Windows 10



From: Quentin Christensen
Sent: 25 June 2019 05:37
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] Keystrokes from other screenreaders NVDA does not have



The discussion in the Drag and drop thread around the system tray has got me thinking:

- The NV Access philosophy is that if Windows includes functionality which is accessible, why re-invent the wheel

- Users who come from other screen readers get confused when they are encouraged to use the Windows keystrokes for functionality they are used to being provided by the screen reader.



I was going to mention the "Switching from Jaws to NVDA" document in that thread, but in reading it just now, I noted that it does NOT, in fact, include how to perform tasks such as access the system tray.



So, can anyone please give me examples of functionality that other screen readers provide (such as INSERT+F11 to access the system tray), that NVDA expects people to use the Windows keystroke (WINDOWS+B in the case of the system tray) for?



I'd like to collate them and update the relevant documents with them, and potentially even make a document all its own if needed.



Kind regards



Quentin.

--

Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager



NVDA 2019.2beta1 now available!



Web: www.nvaccess.org

Training: https://www.nvaccess.org/shop/

Certification: https://certification.nvaccess.org/

User group: https://nvda.groups.io/g/nvda

Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess
Twitter: @NVAccess







--
Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager

NVDA 2019.2beta1 now available!

Web: www.nvaccess.org
Training: https://www.nvaccess.org/shop/
Certification: https://certification.nvaccess.org/
User group: https://nvda.groups.io/g/nvda
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess
Twitter: @NVAccess







--
Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager

NVDA 2019.2beta1 now available!


Task Manager Alternatives

Bhavya shah
 

Dear all,

I use NVDA on a Windows 8.1 laptop, and require to monitor resource
consumption - how much CPU and RAM certain apps and processes are
taking up. I find Task Manager inadequate for this purpose, mostly for
reasons such as a clunky and partly inaccessible/inconvenient
interface, and significant resource consumption of its own. Hence, I
am looking for an alternative program or software of this very nature.

I would greatly appreciate any inputs or suggestions that are known to
be accessible software for the above described purpose.

Thanks.

--
Best Regards
Bhavya Shah

Blogger at Hiking Across Horizons: https://bhavyashah125.wordpress.com/
E-mail Address: bhavya.shah125@...
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/bhavyashah125/


Re: Keystrokes from other screenreaders NVDA does not have

 

Sile,
The keystroke I was looking for the other day was the one to place a URL on the desktop. Right now you have to find an empty space on the desktop using the mouse before you can drop a shortcut to a URL.
Hmmm, not quite. If I got it right you want to create a new shortcut.
All you need to do is make sure that nothing is selected when you land on your Desktop window. For this you can use CTRL+Spacebar until you hear not selected.
Then you activate the Context Menu et all (if you aren't familiarized with the process from this point let me know and I'll give more details).

Cheers,
Marcio AKA Starboy

Sent from a galaxy far, far away.

--
Are you a Thunderbird user? Then join the Thunderbird mailing list to help and be helped with all Thunderbird things - questions, features, add-ons and much more!


Re: Keystrokes from other screenreaders NVDA does not have

Sile
 

The keystroke I was looking for the other day was the one to place a URL on the desktop. Right now you have to find an empty space on the desktop using the mouse before you can drop a shortcut to a URL. I don’t think there’s even a windows command for this.


Sile

On Jun 24, 2019, at 10:36 PM, Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:

That is an example of a proprietary interface that makes people dependent on JAWS and doesn't work as well as real ribbons. 
 
I don't know if something that extensive would want to be discussed in whatever material is being contemplated, but I created a ribbon tutorial that you may want to refer people to.  if you want to see it, I'll send it in another message.  I'd have to upload it to my Drop Box account if you want to provide a link.  I improved it a little.  It was previously a part of a short Windows 7 tutorial I did but I never uploaded it separately.
Gene
----- Original message -----
From: zahra
Sent: Tuesday, June 25, 2019 12:21 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Keystrokes from other screenreaders NVDA does not have

hi quentin.
the only amazing aspect of jaws that unfortunately nvda does not
support, its virtual ribbon menu that we can navigate between ribbons
as we used to use in classic menus.

On 6/25/19, Quentin Christensen <quentin@...> wrote:
> The discussion in the Drag and drop thread around the system tray has got
> me thinking:
> - The NV Access philosophy is that if Windows includes functionality which
> is accessible, why re-invent the wheel
> - Users who come from other screen readers get confused when they are
> encouraged to use the Windows keystrokes for functionality they are used to
> being provided by the screen reader.
>
> I was going to mention the "Switching from Jaws to NVDA" document in that
> thread, but in reading it just now, I noted that it does NOT, in fact,
> include how to perform tasks such as access the system tray.
>
> So, can anyone please give me examples of functionality that other screen
> readers provide (such as INSERT+F11 to access the system tray), that NVDA
> expects people to use the Windows keystroke (WINDOWS+B in the case of the
> system tray) for?
>
> I'd like to collate them and update the relevant documents with them, and
> potentially even make a document all its own if needed.
>
> Kind regards
>
> Quentin.
> --
> Quentin Christensen
> Training and Support Manager
>
> NVDA 2019.2beta1 <https://www.nvaccess.org/post/nvda-2019-2beta1-released/>
> now available!
>
> Web: www.nvaccess.org
> Training: https://www.nvaccess.org/shop/
> Certification: https://certification.nvaccess.org/
> User group: https://nvda.groups.io/g/nvda
> Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess
> Twitter: @NVAccess <https://twitter.com/NVAccess>
>
>
>
>


--
By God,
were I given all the seven heavens
with all they contain
in order that
I may disobey God
by depriving an ant
from the husk of a grain of barley,
I would not do it.
imam ali



Re: Keystrokes from other screenreaders NVDA does not have

Ian Blackburn
 

Hi all

I would like to explain why having different ways to access windows features can be useful.

I run Windows 10 latest build 1903

What I will explain is the system tray. Now windows + B goes to system tray. however, sometimes the icons there cannot be activated with NVDA (at least for my situation). The add on which allows NVDA+f11 allows activation of some system tray icons that I cannot access any other sensible way.

Another example is the use of the right mouse button. i am talking about the use of the various ways to activate it with the keyboard running NVDA.

The different ways of activating it sometimes produce different results.

The ways I know how to activate the right mouse button include: using the physical button on the mouse, using the function key on the right hand bottom of the QWERTY keyboard near the right CTRl key, using shift+f10 and using the NVDA right mouse klick on the numeric pad. Sometimes any one of these will produce different results on the object you are focused on.

So none of these ways is incorrect but sometimes a particular choice will produce a particular outcome. I am not a programmer and don’t understand the difference from the point of view of the operating system behind these and other commands we use as NVDA users.

i really appreciate the effort and time put in by all those who write NVDA and its adding because for me on windows NVDA is my primary screen reader.

For whatever reason Microsoft decided to abandon menus in favour of ribbons but other os’s use menus; including Mac OSX and Gnome on linux.

regards
Ian

On 25 Jun 2019, at 5:36 pm, Quentin Christensen <quentin@...> wrote:

Before anyone jumps on Peter's question on one side or the other, I'll just throw in for Peter's sake, that is basically where this thread arose from - a discussion in another thread (on drag and drop) around using WINDOWS+B to get to the system tray vs using INSERT+F11 (which some other screen readers offer and you can get in NVDA via an add-on).

I wasn't really looking for a discussion on that in this thread, more using that as an example where another screen reader provides its own keystroke which users feel is lacking in NVDA, and particularly where the reason NVDA doesn't follow suit, is that, like accessing the system tray, there is a built-in way to do it in Windows itself.

Regards

Quentin.

On Tue, Jun 25, 2019 at 7:30 PM Peter Beasley <pjbeasley23@...> wrote:
What’s wrong with windows key B which is that standard windows command for the system tray/notification area.



Sent from Mail for Windows 10



From: Quentin Christensen
Sent: 25 June 2019 05:37
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] Keystrokes from other screenreaders NVDA does not have



The discussion in the Drag and drop thread around the system tray has got me thinking:

- The NV Access philosophy is that if Windows includes functionality which is accessible, why re-invent the wheel

- Users who come from other screen readers get confused when they are encouraged to use the Windows keystrokes for functionality they are used to being provided by the screen reader.



I was going to mention the "Switching from Jaws to NVDA" document in that thread, but in reading it just now, I noted that it does NOT, in fact, include how to perform tasks such as access the system tray.



So, can anyone please give me examples of functionality that other screen readers provide (such as INSERT+F11 to access the system tray), that NVDA expects people to use the Windows keystroke (WINDOWS+B in the case of the system tray) for?



I'd like to collate them and update the relevant documents with them, and potentially even make a document all its own if needed.



Kind regards



Quentin.

--

Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager



NVDA 2019.2beta1 now available!



Web: www.nvaccess.org

Training: https://www.nvaccess.org/shop/

Certification: https://certification.nvaccess.org/

User group: https://nvda.groups.io/g/nvda

Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess
Twitter: @NVAccess







--
Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager

NVDA 2019.2beta1 now available!

Web: www.nvaccess.org
Training: https://www.nvaccess.org/shop/
Certification: https://certification.nvaccess.org/
User group: https://nvda.groups.io/g/nvda
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess
Twitter: @NVAccess


Re: Keystrokes from other screenreaders NVDA does not have

Quentin Christensen
 

Before anyone jumps on Peter's question on one side or the other, I'll just throw in for Peter's sake, that is basically where this thread arose from - a discussion in another thread (on drag and drop) around using WINDOWS+B to get to the system tray vs using INSERT+F11 (which some other screen readers offer and you can get in NVDA via an add-on).

I wasn't really looking for a discussion on that in this thread, more using that as an example where another screen reader provides its own keystroke which users feel is lacking in NVDA, and particularly where the reason NVDA doesn't follow suit, is that, like accessing the system tray, there is a built-in way to do it in Windows itself.

Regards

Quentin.

On Tue, Jun 25, 2019 at 7:30 PM Peter Beasley <pjbeasley23@...> wrote:

What’s wrong with windows key B which is that standard windows command for the system tray/notification area.

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 

From: Quentin Christensen
Sent: 25 June 2019 05:37
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] Keystrokes from other screenreaders NVDA does not have

 

The discussion in the Drag and drop thread around the system tray has got me thinking:

- The NV Access philosophy is that if Windows includes functionality which is accessible, why re-invent the wheel

- Users who come from other screen readers get confused when they are encouraged to use the Windows keystrokes for functionality they are used to being provided by the screen reader.

 

I was going to mention the "Switching from Jaws to NVDA" document in that thread, but in reading it just now, I noted that it does NOT, in fact, include how to perform tasks such as access the system tray.

 

So, can anyone please give me examples of functionality that other screen readers provide (such as INSERT+F11 to access the system tray), that NVDA expects people to use the Windows keystroke (WINDOWS+B in the case of the system tray) for?

 

I'd like to collate them and update the relevant documents with them, and potentially even make a document all its own if needed.

 

Kind regards

 

Quentin.

--

Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager

 

NVDA 2019.2beta1 now available!

 

 



--
Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager

NVDA 2019.2beta1 now available!


Re: Keystrokes from other screenreaders NVDA does not have

Ralf Kefferpuetz
 

Hi Quentin,

 

In Window-Eyes we had the hotkey control-insert-b to check the status of the progress bars in the focussed window. This was used very often, for example when copying large files.

NVDA doesn’t have such a feature, in NVDA you have to use object navigation to get the current percentage, or you have to wait until NVDA does its autoannouncement, if enabled.

 

Best regards,

  Ralf

 

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Quentin Christensen
Sent: Dienstag, 25. Juni 2019 06:37
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] Keystrokes from other screenreaders NVDA does not have

 

The discussion in the Drag and drop thread around the system tray has got me thinking:

- The NV Access philosophy is that if Windows includes functionality which is accessible, why re-invent the wheel

- Users who come from other screen readers get confused when they are encouraged to use the Windows keystrokes for functionality they are used to being provided by the screen reader.

 

I was going to mention the "Switching from Jaws to NVDA" document in that thread, but in reading it just now, I noted that it does NOT, in fact, include how to perform tasks such as access the system tray.

 

So, can anyone please give me examples of functionality that other screen readers provide (such as INSERT+F11 to access the system tray), that NVDA expects people to use the Windows keystroke (WINDOWS+B in the case of the system tray) for?

 

I'd like to collate them and update the relevant documents with them, and potentially even make a document all its own if needed.

 

Kind regards

 

Quentin.

--

Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager

 

NVDA 2019.2beta1 now available!

 


Re: Keystrokes from other screenreaders NVDA does not have

Peter Beasley
 

What’s wrong with windows key B which is that standard windows command for the system tray/notification area.

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 

From: Quentin Christensen
Sent: 25 June 2019 05:37
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] Keystrokes from other screenreaders NVDA does not have

 

The discussion in the Drag and drop thread around the system tray has got me thinking:

- The NV Access philosophy is that if Windows includes functionality which is accessible, why re-invent the wheel

- Users who come from other screen readers get confused when they are encouraged to use the Windows keystrokes for functionality they are used to being provided by the screen reader.

 

I was going to mention the "Switching from Jaws to NVDA" document in that thread, but in reading it just now, I noted that it does NOT, in fact, include how to perform tasks such as access the system tray.

 

So, can anyone please give me examples of functionality that other screen readers provide (such as INSERT+F11 to access the system tray), that NVDA expects people to use the Windows keystroke (WINDOWS+B in the case of the system tray) for?

 

I'd like to collate them and update the relevant documents with them, and potentially even make a document all its own if needed.

 

Kind regards

 

Quentin.

--

Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager

 

NVDA 2019.2beta1 now available!

 

 


Re: Keystrokes from other screenreaders NVDA does not have

Quentin Christensen
 

Thank you as always Zahra!

Gene, I must admit, I was waiting to see what this thread throws up before deciding what to put where.  So, virtual ribbons are on the list.

Please, keep sending ideas :)

Regards

Quentin.

On Tue, Jun 25, 2019 at 3:44 PM zahra <nasrinkhaksar3@...> wrote:
i appreciate you if you send your material for me.
but i never learnt ribbon and i was hating changing just for changing!
and without my control that i can use technologies in the manner that
i wish.

On 6/25/19, Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:
> That is an example of a proprietary interface that makes people dependent on
> JAWS and doesn't work as well as real ribbons.
>
> I don't know if something that extensive would want to be discussed in
> whatever material is being contemplated, but I created a ribbon tutorial
> that you may want to refer people to.  if you want to see it, I'll send it
> in another message.  I'd have to upload it to my Drop Box account if you
> want to provide a link.  I improved it a little.  It was previously a part
> of a short Windows 7 tutorial I did but I never uploaded it separately.
>
> Gene
> ----- Original message -----
> From: zahra
> Sent: Tuesday, June 25, 2019 12:21 AM
> To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
> Subject: Re: [nvda] Keystrokes from other screenreaders NVDA does not have
>
>
> hi quentin.
> the only amazing aspect of jaws that unfortunately nvda does not
> support, its virtual ribbon menu that we can navigate between ribbons
> as we used to use in classic menus.
>
> On 6/25/19, Quentin Christensen <quentin@...> wrote:
>> The discussion in the Drag and drop thread around the system tray has got
>> me thinking:
>> - The NV Access philosophy is that if Windows includes functionality
>> which
>> is accessible, why re-invent the wheel
>> - Users who come from other screen readers get confused when they are
>> encouraged to use the Windows keystrokes for functionality they are used
>> to
>> being provided by the screen reader.
>>
>> I was going to mention the "Switching from Jaws to NVDA" document in that
>> thread, but in reading it just now, I noted that it does NOT, in fact,
>> include how to perform tasks such as access the system tray.
>>
>> So, can anyone please give me examples of functionality that other screen
>> readers provide (such as INSERT+F11 to access the system tray), that NVDA
>> expects people to use the Windows keystroke (WINDOWS+B in the case of the
>> system tray) for?
>>
>> I'd like to collate them and update the relevant documents with them, and
>> potentially even make a document all its own if needed.
>>
>> Kind regards
>>
>> Quentin.
>> --
>> Quentin Christensen
>> Training and Support Manager
>>
>> NVDA 2019.2beta1
>> <https://www.nvaccess.org/post/nvda-2019-2beta1-released/>
>> now available!
>>
>> Web: www.nvaccess.org
>> Training: https://www.nvaccess.org/shop/
>> Certification: https://certification.nvaccess.org/
>> User group: https://nvda.groups.io/g/nvda
>> Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess
>> Twitter: @NVAccess <https://twitter.com/NVAccess>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> By God,
> were I given all the seven heavens
> with all they contain
> in order that
> I may disobey God
> by depriving an ant
> from the husk of a grain of barley,
> I would not do it.
> imam ali
>
>
>
>
>
>


--
By God,
were I given all the seven heavens
with all they contain
in order that
I may disobey God
by depriving an ant
from the husk of a grain of barley,
I would not do it.
imam ali





--
Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager

NVDA 2019.2beta1 now available!


Re: Keystrokes from other screenreaders NVDA does not have

 

i appreciate you if you send your material for me.
but i never learnt ribbon and i was hating changing just for changing!
and without my control that i can use technologies in the manner that
i wish.

On 6/25/19, Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:
That is an example of a proprietary interface that makes people dependent on
JAWS and doesn't work as well as real ribbons.

I don't know if something that extensive would want to be discussed in
whatever material is being contemplated, but I created a ribbon tutorial
that you may want to refer people to. if you want to see it, I'll send it
in another message. I'd have to upload it to my Drop Box account if you
want to provide a link. I improved it a little. It was previously a part
of a short Windows 7 tutorial I did but I never uploaded it separately.

Gene
----- Original message -----
From: zahra
Sent: Tuesday, June 25, 2019 12:21 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Keystrokes from other screenreaders NVDA does not have


hi quentin.
the only amazing aspect of jaws that unfortunately nvda does not
support, its virtual ribbon menu that we can navigate between ribbons
as we used to use in classic menus.

On 6/25/19, Quentin Christensen <quentin@...> wrote:
The discussion in the Drag and drop thread around the system tray has got
me thinking:
- The NV Access philosophy is that if Windows includes functionality
which
is accessible, why re-invent the wheel
- Users who come from other screen readers get confused when they are
encouraged to use the Windows keystrokes for functionality they are used
to
being provided by the screen reader.

I was going to mention the "Switching from Jaws to NVDA" document in that
thread, but in reading it just now, I noted that it does NOT, in fact,
include how to perform tasks such as access the system tray.

So, can anyone please give me examples of functionality that other screen
readers provide (such as INSERT+F11 to access the system tray), that NVDA
expects people to use the Windows keystroke (WINDOWS+B in the case of the
system tray) for?

I'd like to collate them and update the relevant documents with them, and
potentially even make a document all its own if needed.

Kind regards

Quentin.
--
Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager

NVDA 2019.2beta1
<https://www.nvaccess.org/post/nvda-2019-2beta1-released/>
now available!

Web: www.nvaccess.org
Training: https://www.nvaccess.org/shop/
Certification: https://certification.nvaccess.org/
User group: https://nvda.groups.io/g/nvda
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess
Twitter: @NVAccess <https://twitter.com/NVAccess>




--
By God,
were I given all the seven heavens
with all they contain
in order that
I may disobey God
by depriving an ant
from the husk of a grain of barley,
I would not do it.
imam ali





--
By God,
were I given all the seven heavens
with all they contain
in order that
I may disobey God
by depriving an ant
from the husk of a grain of barley,
I would not do it.
imam ali


Re: Keystrokes from other screenreaders NVDA does not have

Gene
 

That is an example of a proprietary interface that makes people dependent on JAWS and doesn't work as well as real ribbons. 
 
I don't know if something that extensive would want to be discussed in whatever material is being contemplated, but I created a ribbon tutorial that you may want to refer people to.  if you want to see it, I'll send it in another message.  I'd have to upload it to my Drop Box account if you want to provide a link.  I improved it a little.  It was previously a part of a short Windows 7 tutorial I did but I never uploaded it separately.
Gene

----- Original message -----
From: zahra
Sent: Tuesday, June 25, 2019 12:21 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Keystrokes from other screenreaders NVDA does not have

hi quentin.
the only amazing aspect of jaws that unfortunately nvda does not
support, its virtual ribbon menu that we can navigate between ribbons
as we used to use in classic menus.

On 6/25/19, Quentin Christensen <quentin@...> wrote:
> The discussion in the Drag and drop thread around the system tray has got
> me thinking:
> - The NV Access philosophy is that if Windows includes functionality which
> is accessible, why re-invent the wheel
> - Users who come from other screen readers get confused when they are
> encouraged to use the Windows keystrokes for functionality they are used to
> being provided by the screen reader.
>
> I was going to mention the "Switching from Jaws to NVDA" document in that
> thread, but in reading it just now, I noted that it does NOT, in fact,
> include how to perform tasks such as access the system tray.
>
> So, can anyone please give me examples of functionality that other screen
> readers provide (such as INSERT+F11 to access the system tray), that NVDA
> expects people to use the Windows keystroke (WINDOWS+B in the case of the
> system tray) for?
>
> I'd like to collate them and update the relevant documents with them, and
> potentially even make a document all its own if needed.
>
> Kind regards
>
> Quentin.
> --
> Quentin Christensen
> Training and Support Manager
>
> NVDA 2019.2beta1 <https://www.nvaccess.org/post/nvda-2019-2beta1-released/>
> now available!
>
> Web: www.nvaccess.org
> Training: https://www.nvaccess.org/shop/
> Certification: https://certification.nvaccess.org/
> User group: https://nvda.groups.io/g/nvda
> Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess
> Twitter: @NVAccess <https://twitter.com/NVAccess>
>
>
>
>


--
By God,
were I given all the seven heavens
with all they contain
in order that
I may disobey God
by depriving an ant
from the husk of a grain of barley,
I would not do it.
imam ali



Re: Keystrokes from other screenreaders NVDA does not have

 

hi quentin.
the only amazing aspect of jaws that unfortunately nvda does not
support, its virtual ribbon menu that we can navigate between ribbons
as we used to use in classic menus.

On 6/25/19, Quentin Christensen <quentin@...> wrote:
The discussion in the Drag and drop thread around the system tray has got
me thinking:
- The NV Access philosophy is that if Windows includes functionality which
is accessible, why re-invent the wheel
- Users who come from other screen readers get confused when they are
encouraged to use the Windows keystrokes for functionality they are used to
being provided by the screen reader.

I was going to mention the "Switching from Jaws to NVDA" document in that
thread, but in reading it just now, I noted that it does NOT, in fact,
include how to perform tasks such as access the system tray.

So, can anyone please give me examples of functionality that other screen
readers provide (such as INSERT+F11 to access the system tray), that NVDA
expects people to use the Windows keystroke (WINDOWS+B in the case of the
system tray) for?

I'd like to collate them and update the relevant documents with them, and
potentially even make a document all its own if needed.

Kind regards

Quentin.
--
Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager

NVDA 2019.2beta1 <https://www.nvaccess.org/post/nvda-2019-2beta1-released/>
now available!

Web: www.nvaccess.org
Training: https://www.nvaccess.org/shop/
Certification: https://certification.nvaccess.org/
User group: https://nvda.groups.io/g/nvda
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess
Twitter: @NVAccess <https://twitter.com/NVAccess>



--
By God,
were I given all the seven heavens
with all they contain
in order that
I may disobey God
by depriving an ant
from the husk of a grain of barley,
I would not do it.
imam ali


Re: Drag and Drop with NVDA

Quentin Christensen
 

Accessing the system tray is the one I'm most familiar with, but I know there are other features that could be argued for in the documentation.  Rather than continue this part of the thread here, I've created a new topic.  I'd like to collate information on what keystrokes other screen readers have that NVDA expects you to use the built-in system functionality for.  Please answer in the new thread, to keep it all in one place.

Regards

Quentin.

On Tue, Jun 25, 2019 at 1:27 PM Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:
Are you talking about the quick key reference?  I am talking about the full user guide and it is that which should contain the commands for working with the system tray and an explanation of how to work with it, such as that you can use first letter navigation as well as move with the arrow keys. 
 
As I said, you can't have it both ways, not include a system tray dialog, which has been standard in screen-readers since about 2000 or a little before, while not giving the commands and explaining how to use the Windows system tray.  Most people were routinely taught to use the dialog and not the actual system tray for about two decades. 
 
While I'm glad to know the instructional material available for purchase contains this information, the User Guide should contain such information also.
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, June 24, 2019 10:15 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Drag and Drop with NVDA

Hi everyone,

The NVDA User Guide is designed to be a quick reference to cover the keystrokes for NVDA, not the keystrokes for Windows.  The "Basic Training for NVDA" does teach how to get to the notification area / system tray and interact with icons.  I would highly recommend that training for anyone not familiar with how to access features of Windows / NVDA: https://www.nvaccess.org/product/basic-training-for-nvda-ebook/

The SysTrayList add-on is available for anyone who wants to interact with the system tray in that way: https://addons.nvda-project.org/addons/systrayList.en.html The reason we haven't included it in NVDA itself, is simply that it replicates functionality already provided by Windows itself.

Kind regards

Quentin.

On Sun, Jun 23, 2019 at 11:16 PM Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:
There is an add-on for using the system tray in the way other screen-readers provide.  That is, a dialog.  Long before the system tray became accessible, screen-readers provided the dialog because the system tray itself wasn't accessible.  Most blind people who started using other screen-readers know that method and don't know the windows method.  NVDA both refuses to incorporate the system tray dialog, nor does whomever makes such decisions incorporate instructions for using the system tray without the dialog.
And at times, you can't work with a system tray icon properly without working with the system tray dialog so I consider this a necessary feature, not just a question of there being a Windows and a screen-reader way to do things.  Others have reported the same thing, that they have found instances where the system tray dialog is necessary to work with an icon.
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2019 6:10 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Drag and Drop with NVDA

Gene,
Too bad the manual doesn't say more.  It should, just as it should describe the commands for using the system tray, since NVDA doesn't include a system tray dialog.
Oh wait. Is there any other way of using the systray besides pressing Win+B?
I know it's not on topic for what I asked but now you got me curious.

Now back to my question:
there are various things you need to know, for example, that when dragging and dropping files, both folders have to be and remain opened simultaneously.
But this is something that everyone should know, I guess. After all you are... well dragging from an open folder and dropping on another open folder :)

Anyway, I'm still a bit confused about this procedure. I hope I'll understand and learn it sooner or later.

Oh and as always, thanks for your help. I appreciate how you are always willing to help with questions on lists we are on, including this one.

Cheers,
Marcio AKA Starboy

Sent from a galaxy far, far away.

--
Are you a Thunderbird user? Then join the Thunderbird mailing list to help and be helped with all Thunderbird things - questions, features, add-ons and much more!



--
Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager

NVDA 2019.2beta1 now available!



--
Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager

NVDA 2019.2beta1 now available!


Keystrokes from other screenreaders NVDA does not have

Quentin Christensen
 

The discussion in the Drag and drop thread around the system tray has got me thinking:
- The NV Access philosophy is that if Windows includes functionality which is accessible, why re-invent the wheel
- Users who come from other screen readers get confused when they are encouraged to use the Windows keystrokes for functionality they are used to being provided by the screen reader.

I was going to mention the "Switching from Jaws to NVDA" document in that thread, but in reading it just now, I noted that it does NOT, in fact, include how to perform tasks such as access the system tray.

So, can anyone please give me examples of functionality that other screen readers provide (such as INSERT+F11 to access the system tray), that NVDA expects people to use the Windows keystroke (WINDOWS+B in the case of the system tray) for?

I'd like to collate them and update the relevant documents with them, and potentially even make a document all its own if needed.

Kind regards

Quentin.
--
Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager

NVDA 2019.2beta1 now available!


Re: Drag and Drop with NVDA

Gene
 

also, the system tray dialog was introduced because the system tray wasn't accessible at the time.  It is not a case of screen-readers having duplicative commands or provisions.  I don't know about every screen-reader of course, but JAWS, Window-eyes and System Access all have a system tray dialog.  I can't comment on others. 
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, June 24, 2019 10:27 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Drag and Drop with NVDA

Are you talking about the quick key reference?  I am talking about the full user guide and it is that which should contain the commands for working with the system tray and an explanation of how to work with it, such as that you can use first letter navigation as well as move with the arrow keys. 
 
As I said, you can't have it both ways, not include a system tray dialog, which has been standard in screen-readers since about 2000 or a little before, while not giving the commands and explaining how to use the Windows system tray.  Most people were routinely taught to use the dialog and not the actual system tray for about two decades. 
 
While I'm glad to know the instructional material available for purchase contains this information, the User Guide should contain such information also.
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, June 24, 2019 10:15 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Drag and Drop with NVDA

Hi everyone,

The NVDA User Guide is designed to be a quick reference to cover the keystrokes for NVDA, not the keystrokes for Windows.  The "Basic Training for NVDA" does teach how to get to the notification area / system tray and interact with icons.  I would highly recommend that training for anyone not familiar with how to access features of Windows / NVDA: https://www.nvaccess.org/product/basic-training-for-nvda-ebook/

The SysTrayList add-on is available for anyone who wants to interact with the system tray in that way: https://addons.nvda-project.org/addons/systrayList.en.html The reason we haven't included it in NVDA itself, is simply that it replicates functionality already provided by Windows itself.

Kind regards

Quentin.

On Sun, Jun 23, 2019 at 11:16 PM Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:
There is an add-on for using the system tray in the way other screen-readers provide.  That is, a dialog.  Long before the system tray became accessible, screen-readers provided the dialog because the system tray itself wasn't accessible.  Most blind people who started using other screen-readers know that method and don't know the windows method.  NVDA both refuses to incorporate the system tray dialog, nor does whomever makes such decisions incorporate instructions for using the system tray without the dialog.
And at times, you can't work with a system tray icon properly without working with the system tray dialog so I consider this a necessary feature, not just a question of there being a Windows and a screen-reader way to do things.  Others have reported the same thing, that they have found instances where the system tray dialog is necessary to work with an icon.
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2019 6:10 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Drag and Drop with NVDA

Gene,
Too bad the manual doesn't say more.  It should, just as it should describe the commands for using the system tray, since NVDA doesn't include a system tray dialog.
Oh wait. Is there any other way of using the systray besides pressing Win+B?
I know it's not on topic for what I asked but now you got me curious.

Now back to my question:
there are various things you need to know, for example, that when dragging and dropping files, both folders have to be and remain opened simultaneously.
But this is something that everyone should know, I guess. After all you are... well dragging from an open folder and dropping on another open folder :)

Anyway, I'm still a bit confused about this procedure. I hope I'll understand and learn it sooner or later.

Oh and as always, thanks for your help. I appreciate how you are always willing to help with questions on lists we are on, including this one.

Cheers,
Marcio AKA Starboy

Sent from a galaxy far, far away.

--
Are you a Thunderbird user? Then join the Thunderbird mailing list to help and be helped with all Thunderbird things - questions, features, add-ons and much more!



--
Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager

NVDA 2019.2beta1 now available!