Any suggestions for a really good beginner NVDA tutorial for someone new to the overall concept?  Thanks!

Any suggestions for a really good beginner NVDA tutorial for someone new to the overall concept? Thanks!

Any suggestions for a really good beginner NVDA tutorial for someone new to the overall concept?  Thanks!

Any suggestions for a really good beginner NVDA tutorial for someone new to the overall concept?  Thanks!

Any suggestions for a really good beginner NVDA tutorial for someone new to the overall concept?  Thanks!

30. 11. 2020 v 18:34, Joseph Lee <joseph.lee22590@gmail.com>:

Hi,
What I'm about to say is theoretical, but might be applicable in practice:
I expect NVDA to be slow in Windows 10 on ARM. As you may know, in
order to run x86 (32-bit) code, Windows 10 on ARM comes with an
emulator. But because NVDA is a Python-based software, it must go
through multiple layers (Python interpreter on x86, which in turn will
run on top of x86 emulator) just to get it to run. Thankfully, NVDA
does come with the same library for communicating with certain apps,
so it might be a bit fast (still slower than running on a 64-bit AMD
or Intel processor); for reference, the ARM version of NVDA Helper library

As for working with ARM apps, foundations are in place to fully
support them. The initial work was made in 2017, which was somewhat
enhanced in subsequent releases. In NVDA 2020.3, NVDA can tell you
what the target machine architecture for an app is, so using Python
Console, you can figure out if you're dealing with a 32-bit or 64-bit
x86 or ARM app. This will get a bit interesting (and slightly
complicated) soon when Windows 10 on ARM comes with an emulator for 64-bit

Cheers,
Joseph


-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Adam
Samec
Sent: Monday, November 30, 2020 7:59 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] Will NVDA work smoothly in Windows 10 on ARM?

Hello,

I am considering buying a notebook with an ARM-based processor, and I
am just wondering whether the x86 version of NVDA will work well in
the Windows
10 on ARM version of Windows. If not, are there plans for the
development of an ARM-based version of NVDA?

Thanks for your thoughts.

Best regards

Adam

30. 11. 2020 v 18:34, Joseph Lee <joseph.lee22590@gmail.com>:

Hi,
What I'm about to say is theoretical, but might be applicable in practice:
I expect NVDA to be slow in Windows 10 on ARM. As you may know, in order to
run x86 (32-bit) code, Windows 10 on ARM comes with an emulator. But because
NVDA is a Python-based software, it must go through multiple layers (Python
interpreter on x86, which in turn will run on top of x86 emulator) just to
get it to run. Thankfully, NVDA does come with the same library for
communicating with certain apps, so it might be a bit fast (still slower
than running on a 64-bit AMD or Intel processor); for reference, the ARM
version of NVDA Helper library is also compiled when compiling NVDA.
As for working with ARM apps, foundations are in place to fully support
them. The initial work was made in 2017, which was somewhat enhanced in
subsequent releases. In NVDA 2020.3, NVDA can tell you what the target
machine architecture for an app is, so using Python Console, you can figure
out if you're dealing with a 32-bit or 64-bit x86 or ARM app. This will get
a bit interesting (and slightly complicated) soon when Windows 10 on ARM
comes with an emulator for 64-bit x86 code.
Cheers,
Joseph


-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Adam Samec
Sent: Monday, November 30, 2020 7:59 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] Will NVDA work smoothly in Windows 10 on ARM?

Hello,

I am considering buying a notebook with an ARM-based processor, and I am
just wondering whether the x86 version of NVDA will work well in the Windows
10 on ARM version of Windows. If not, are there plans for the development of
an ARM-based version of NVDA?

Thanks for your thoughts.

Best regards

Adam

On Mon, Nov 30, 2020 at 11:59 AM, Melissa Jean wrote:

dell hung up on me twice.

-
That's something I would report, too, unless you were behaving in an
outrageously abusive way toward the support tech, which I highly doubt you
were.

This is clearly something that Dell needs to be in the center of resolving,
and they need to pick up the ball.

After having read Mr. Wong's saga elsewhere before this topic started,
coupled with what's been shared here, I would be raising holy hell with Dell
about this and not taking no for an answer. It's clearly not a coincidence,
and it's clearly something they need to be actively trying to resolve. End
users can't fix this, nor should they be expected to.

--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 20H2, Build 19042

*If you think that you can think about a thing, inextricably attached to
something else, without thinking of the thing it is attached to, then you
have a legal mind.*

~ Thomas Reed Powell

On Nov 30, 2020, at 6:17 AM, luke scholey via groups.io <l.scholey@...> wrote:



Hi all

 

Just to add to this:

 

There seems to be an issue with some (but not all) new Dell laptops that use a version of the Realtech audio driver and NVDA.

 

As stated below, there’s a memory leak with the Windows Audio Device Graph Isolation (audiodg.exe) service. When using NVDA, especially for long periods of time, this service eats all available ram and then starts gobbling up virtual memory as well until the device blue screens. This is limited to when NVDA speaks, my testing has revealed that if you leave NVDA silent for a while, the memory slowly comes back down again. This leak also doesn’t happen when other audio is playing so it seems to be a problem with the way NVDA uses this service. But if you’re using one of these effected laptops in a 9 til 5  job, over a few hours, the machine would become slower and slower.

 

A temporary fix for this is to find the audio driver in use in the device manager from hardware and sound, navigate to the sounds video and game controllers category and update the audio driver. Instead of searching for updates on the internet automatically, choose the manual option and select the button that will allow the user to choose a driver from a compatible list of drivers in the same category. Usually there will only be two drivers in this list, the current Realtech driver and the default Windows 10 driver which is called HD Audio from Microsoft. Click this driver to update and the audio on the machine will stop. Restart the laptop to begin using the new updated driver. Using this HD Audio driver, the issue is no longer present.

 

I’m not saying NVDA is at fault here because I don’t know enough about this yet. It could be that the driver is the culprit, and NVDA is doing things correctly but the driver is not handling NVDA very well.

 

So far I’ve tested this on Dell Inspiron laptops from the 570 range and above, from Windows 10 1809 and above and NVDA 2019.1 and above.

 

Hope this helps.

 

Luke

 

 

From: William Wong
Sent: 30 November 2020 11:19
To: nvda@groups.io
Subject: [nvda] Ram problem and nvda

 

H

 

On 30 Nov 2020, at 15:39, Brian Vogel <britechguy@...> wrote:

Luke,

         In this situation, you've pretty much effectively eliminated NVDA from the equation.  If NVDA were the source of the problem it should occur regardless of the device drivers in place.  Memory leaks, much like fluid leaks, have sources, and if you patch a given source and the leaking stops entirely, you know the culprit.

         Also note that Melissa states that she has the issue with either JAWS or NVDA, which points even more toward something external to either one of those programs as being the root cause.

         I hope someone reports these findings to Dell.  Many manufacturers, and Dell is one of them, customize device drivers provided by the actual hardware manufacturers to their own liking.  I've got Realtek audio drivers on several machines and have never encountered this issue either with JAWS or NVDA.  The finger is pointing directly at Dell and some tweak(s) they've made to the audio drivers they supply with their machines.
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 20H2, Build 19042  

If you think that you can think about a thing, inextricably attached to something else, without thinking of the thing it is attached to, then you have a legal mind.

        ~ Thomas Reed Powell

 

On 30 Nov 2020, at 12:17, luke scholey via groups.io <l.scholey@...> wrote:



Hi all

 

Just to add to this:

 

There seems to be an issue with some (but not all) new Dell laptops that use a version of the Realtech audio driver and NVDA.

 

As stated below, there’s a memory leak with the Windows Audio Device Graph Isolation (audiodg.exe) service. When using NVDA, especially for long periods of time, this service eats all available ram and then starts gobbling up virtual memory as well until the device blue screens. This is limited to when NVDA speaks, my testing has revealed that if you leave NVDA silent for a while, the memory slowly comes back down again. This leak also doesn’t happen when other audio is playing so it seems to be a problem with the way NVDA uses this service. But if you’re using one of these effected laptops in a 9 til 5  job, over a few hours, the machine would become slower and slower.

 

A temporary fix for this is to find the audio driver in use in the device manager from hardware and sound, navigate to the sounds video and game controllers category and update the audio driver. Instead of searching for updates on the internet automatically, choose the manual option and select the button that will allow the user to choose a driver from a compatible list of drivers in the same category. Usually there will only be two drivers in this list, the current Realtech driver and the default Windows 10 driver which is called HD Audio from Microsoft. Click this driver to update and the audio on the machine will stop. Restart the laptop to begin using the new updated driver. Using this HD Audio driver, the issue is no longer present.

 

I’m not saying NVDA is at fault here because I don’t know enough about this yet. It could be that the driver is the culprit, and NVDA is doing things correctly but the driver is not handling NVDA very well.

 

So far I’ve tested this on Dell Inspiron laptops from the 570 range and above, from Windows 10 1809 and above and NVDA 2019.1 and above.

 

Hope this helps.

 

Luke

 

 

From: William Wong
Sent: 30 November 2020 11:19
To: nvda@groups.io
Subject: [nvda] Ram problem and nvda

 

H