announcing end of lines in Scite editor


Jiří Fenz <jirifenz@...>
 

Helllo all,

i'm using Scite for coding in Autoit.

Accessibility of thys program is almost total, but when moving with right or left arrow betveen lines, nvda says Empty instead of New line.

Is here some option to set classic End of line character in scite to make it announce new line the same way as for example in notepad?

With best regards

Jiri Fenz


 

Well it depends I guess you have to look in the editer options it would have to do with how the symbon is rendered for nvda to read.

Simplest way would be if there was a dictenary for that program if you can have a spaciffic definition for a particular program I am not sure if thats possible, but you could define the word empty to end of line or do it for the global deffinition and when anything is empty it will be end of line instead.

Thats not going to really work that well.

We need to find what that symbol actually is that is generated.

Is it generating the standard carrage return or linefead, cr/lf symbol for example.

crlf symbols usually at least when I did communications and things back in dos usually mean, new line, line end, end of line or simply an empty space depending on the os, unix/linux, windows or dos.

In these days, windows/dos has almost the same charset with windows having more of them and linux has a few more.

However depending what this thing was developed for, ie unix that could explain the issue you are having, things are translated that symbol may not be translated as such so there may be that issue to worry about.

Ofcause if you can get a document with just that symbon in it and send it at whoever handles the symbol database then it should be ok.

What happens if you create a document with a few new lines or line breaks in them and view it in another text editor.

Ie notepad, if the symbol is still empty, then its a symbol issue but if the symbol is read correctly, it could simbly be what the editor is outputting to be translated in which case not much we can do.

If the symbol from scyte you get in notepad back is just utter crap then it could be an untranslated symbol probably from unix or something.

The next thing to do is send it back here and get someone to find out what that symbol comes from, latx for example has different symbols to text and other programs may have different symbols based on age to a point, etc.

So if you find that out then the symbol can be added and your issue is solved.

What I fear is that its just what the program outputs at nvda in which case nothing can be done really.

On 6/04/2018 8:45 p.m., Jiří Fenz wrote:
Helllo all,

i'm using Scite for coding in Autoit.

Accessibility of thys program is almost total, but when moving with right or left arrow betveen lines, nvda says Empty instead of New line.

Is here some option to set classic End of line character in scite to make it announce new line the same way as for example in notepad?

With best regards

Jiri Fenz


Jiří Fenz <jirifenz@...>
 

I think that it's only about gui element behaviour.

Announcing empty instead of New line is the same regardless on lf, cr or crlf end of line.

So i think that solving this is about advanced configuration of Scite to change how the eol symbol is viewed or forcing autoit to recognize that actual symbol as standart new line.

Here is link for portable version of Scite i'm using, if someone want to try it directly.

https://www.autoitscript.com/cgi-bin/getfile.pl?../autoit3/scite/download/SciTE4AutoIt3_Portable.zip

Jiri Fenz



Dne 06.04.2018 v 10:56 Shaun Everiss napsal(a):

Well it depends I guess you have to look in the editer options it would have to do with how the symbon is rendered for nvda to read.

Simplest way would be if there was a dictenary for that program if you can have a spaciffic definition for a particular program I am not sure if thats possible, but you could define the word empty to end of line or do it for the global deffinition and when anything is empty it will be end of line instead.

Thats not going to really work that well.

We need to find what that symbol actually is that is generated.

Is it generating the standard carrage return or linefead, cr/lf symbol for example.

crlf symbols usually at least when I did communications and things back in dos usually mean, new line, line end, end of line or simply an empty space depending on the os, unix/linux, windows or dos.

In these days, windows/dos has almost the same charset with windows having more of them and linux has a few more.

However depending what this thing was developed for, ie unix that could explain the issue you are having, things are translated that symbol may not be translated as such so there may be that issue to worry about.

Ofcause if you can get a document with just that symbon in it and send it at whoever handles the symbol database then it should be ok.

What happens if you create a document with a few new lines or line breaks in them and view it in another text editor.

Ie notepad, if the symbol is still empty, then its a symbol issue but if the symbol is read correctly, it could simbly be what the editor is outputting to be translated in which case not much we can do.

If the symbol from scyte you get in notepad back is just utter crap then it could be an untranslated symbol probably from unix or something.

The next thing to do is send it back here and get someone to find out what that symbol comes from, latx for example has different symbols to text and other programs may have different symbols based on age to a point, etc.

So if you find that out then the symbol can be added and your issue is solved.

What I fear is that its just what the program outputs at nvda in which case nothing can be done really.




On 6/04/2018 8:45 p.m., Jiří Fenz wrote:
Helllo all,

i'm using Scite for coding in Autoit.

Accessibility of thys program is almost total, but when moving with right or left arrow betveen lines, nvda says Empty instead of New line.

Is here some option to set classic End of line character in scite to make it announce new line the same way as for example in notepad?

With best regards

Jiri Fenz








Brian's Mail list account <bglists@...>
 

Hmm what I see is nothing is spoken when you hit return, and if you leave a line empty it just says blank, much like many editors. This tool behaves a bit like the editor used by Dolphins scripting system as I recall.


Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk, putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Jiří Fenz" <jirifenz@gmail.com>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Friday, April 06, 2018 10:27 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] announcing end of lines in Scite editor


I think that it's only about gui element behaviour.

Announcing empty instead of New line is the same regardless on lf, cr or
crlf end of line.

So i think that solving this is about advanced configuration of Scite to
change how the eol symbol is viewed or forcing autoit to recognize that
actual symbol as standart new line.

Here is link for portable version of Scite i'm using, if someone want to
try it directly.

https://www.autoitscript.com/cgi-bin/getfile.pl?../autoit3/scite/download/SciTE4AutoIt3_Portable.zip

Jiri Fenz



Dne 06.04.2018 v 10:56 Shaun Everiss napsal(a):
Well it depends I guess you have to look in the editer options it
would have to do with how the symbon is rendered for nvda to read.

Simplest way would be if there was a dictenary for that program if you
can have a spaciffic definition for a particular program I am not sure
if thats possible, but you could define the word empty to end of line
or do it for the global deffinition and when anything is empty it will
be end of line instead.

Thats not going to really work that well.

We need to find what that symbol actually is that is generated.

Is it generating the standard carrage return or linefead, cr/lf symbol
for example.

crlf symbols usually at least when I did communications and things
back in dos usually mean, new line, line end, end of line or simply an
empty space depending on the os, unix/linux, windows or dos.

In these days, windows/dos has almost the same charset with windows
having more of them and linux has a few more.

However depending what this thing was developed for, ie unix that
could explain the issue you are having, things are translated that
symbol may not be translated as such so there may be that issue to
worry about.

Ofcause if you can get a document with just that symbon in it and send
it at whoever handles the symbol database then it should be ok.

What happens if you create a document with a few new lines or line
breaks in them and view it in another text editor.

Ie notepad, if the symbol is still empty, then its a symbol issue but
if the symbol is read correctly, it could simbly be what the editor is
outputting to be translated in which case not much we can do.

If the symbol from scyte you get in notepad back is just utter crap
then it could be an untranslated symbol probably from unix or something.

The next thing to do is send it back here and get someone to find out
what that symbol comes from, latx for example has different symbols to
text and other programs may have different symbols based on age to a
point, etc.

So if you find that out then the symbol can be added and your issue is
solved.

What I fear is that its just what the program outputs at nvda in which
case nothing can be done really.




On 6/04/2018 8:45 p.m., Jiří Fenz wrote:
Helllo all,

i'm using Scite for coding in Autoit.

Accessibility of thys program is almost total, but when moving with
right or left arrow betveen lines, nvda says Empty instead of New line.

Is here some option to set classic End of line character in scite to
make it announce new line the same way as for example in notepad?

With best regards

Jiri Fenz




Jonathan COHN
 

Would it be possible to use review cursor's Say Character and see what the UNICODE is that is being spoken as "blank" and then add it to a dictionary as a different expression? I haven't played with NVDA enough to know. Or perhaps even just the regular expression .$ could be used in a dictionary?



On 4/6/18, 11:41 AM, "nvda@nvda.groups.io on behalf of Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io" <nvda@nvda.groups.io on behalf of bglists=blueyonder.co.uk@groups.io> wrote:

Hmm what I see is nothing is spoken when you hit return, and if you leave a
line empty it just says blank, much like many editors. This tool behaves a
bit like the editor used by Dolphins scripting system as I recall.


Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk, putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Jiří Fenz" <jirifenz@gmail.com>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Friday, April 06, 2018 10:27 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] announcing end of lines in Scite editor


>I think that it's only about gui element behaviour.
>
> Announcing empty instead of New line is the same regardless on lf, cr or
> crlf end of line.
>
> So i think that solving this is about advanced configuration of Scite to
> change how the eol symbol is viewed or forcing autoit to recognize that
> actual symbol as standart new line.
>
> Here is link for portable version of Scite i'm using, if someone want to
> try it directly.
>
> https://www.autoitscript.com/cgi-bin/getfile.pl?../autoit3/scite/download/SciTE4AutoIt3_Portable.zip
>
> Jiri Fenz
>
>
>
> Dne 06.04.2018 v 10:56 Shaun Everiss napsal(a):
>> Well it depends I guess you have to look in the editer options it
>> would have to do with how the symbon is rendered for nvda to read.
>>
>> Simplest way would be if there was a dictenary for that program if you
>> can have a spaciffic definition for a particular program I am not sure
>> if thats possible, but you could define the word empty to end of line
>> or do it for the global deffinition and when anything is empty it will
>> be end of line instead.
>>
>> Thats not going to really work that well.
>>
>> We need to find what that symbol actually is that is generated.
>>
>> Is it generating the standard carrage return or linefead, cr/lf symbol
>> for example.
>>
>> crlf symbols usually at least when I did communications and things
>> back in dos usually mean, new line, line end, end of line or simply an
>> empty space depending on the os, unix/linux, windows or dos.
>>
>> In these days, windows/dos has almost the same charset with windows
>> having more of them and linux has a few more.
>>
>> However depending what this thing was developed for, ie unix that
>> could explain the issue you are having, things are translated that
>> symbol may not be translated as such so there may be that issue to
>> worry about.
>>
>> Ofcause if you can get a document with just that symbon in it and send
>> it at whoever handles the symbol database then it should be ok.
>>
>> What happens if you create a document with a few new lines or line
>> breaks in them and view it in another text editor.
>>
>> Ie notepad, if the symbol is still empty, then its a symbol issue but
>> if the symbol is read correctly, it could simbly be what the editor is
>> outputting to be translated in which case not much we can do.
>>
>> If the symbol from scyte you get in notepad back is just utter crap
>> then it could be an untranslated symbol probably from unix or something.
>>
>> The next thing to do is send it back here and get someone to find out
>> what that symbol comes from, latx for example has different symbols to
>> text and other programs may have different symbols based on age to a
>> point, etc.
>>
>> So if you find that out then the symbol can be added and your issue is
>> solved.
>>
>> What I fear is that its just what the program outputs at nvda in which
>> case nothing can be done really.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On 6/04/2018 8:45 p.m., Jiří Fenz wrote:
>>> Helllo all,
>>>
>>> i'm using Scite for coding in Autoit.
>>>
>>> Accessibility of thys program is almost total, but when moving with
>>> right or left arrow betveen lines, nvda says Empty instead of New line.
>>>
>>> Is here some option to set classic End of line character in scite to
>>> make it announce new line the same way as for example in notepad?
>>>
>>> With best regards
>>>
>>> Jiri Fenz
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>


Gene
 

I don't have the technical knowledge to explain the different information you get and in what order without taking notes and transcribing the information NVDA provides.  I'll say that, if you turn input help on, then press numpad 2, you will hear a description of what happens when you press that key once, twice, or three times quickly.  You just have to press it once when input help is on and all three descriptions will be given.  Pressing the key three times gives you codes for the character you are on when you press that key.  It doesn't matter how you are reviewing the screen.  Any character that you are on will be described.
 
I'm giving desktop layout commands for input help and the current character command.  I don't use the laptop layout.
 
I just found something interesting.  It appears that such information may not be available for control characters.  It would be interesting to get an explanation of why.  I tried using the current character on a hard return.  I just heard blank, no matter how I used the command.  Evidently, control characters fall outside of the code NVDA reports.
 
\Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Friday, April 06, 2018 11:57 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] announcing end of lines in Scite editor

Would it be possible to use review cursor's Say Character and see what the UNICODE is that is being spoken as "blank" and then add it to a dictionary as a different expression? I haven't played with NVDA enough to know. Or perhaps even just the regular expression .$ could be used in a dictionary?



On 4/6/18, 11:41 AM, "nvda@nvda.groups.io on behalf of Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io" <nvda@nvda.groups.io on behalf of bglists@...> wrote:

    Hmm what I see is nothing is spoken when you hit return, and if you leave a
    line empty it just says blank, much like many editors. This tool behaves a
    bit like the editor used by Dolphins scripting system as I recall.
   
   
    Brian
   
    bglists@...
    Sent via blueyonder.
    Please address personal E-mail to:-
    briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
    in the display name field.
    ----- Original Message -----
    From: "Jiří Fenz" <jirifenz@...>
    To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
    Sent: Friday, April 06, 2018 10:27 AM
    Subject: Re: [nvda] announcing end of lines in Scite editor
   
   
    >I think that it's only about gui element behaviour.
    >
    > Announcing empty instead of New line is the same regardless on lf, cr or
    > crlf end of line.
    >
    > So i think that solving this is about advanced configuration of Scite to
    > change how the eol symbol is viewed or forcing autoit to recognize that
    > actual symbol as standart new line.
    >
    > Here is link for portable version of Scite i'm using, if someone want to
    > try it directly.
    >
    > https://www.autoitscript.com/cgi-bin/getfile.pl?../autoit3/scite/download/SciTE4AutoIt3_Portable.zip
    >
    > Jiri Fenz
    >
    >
    >
    > Dne 06.04.2018 v 10:56 Shaun Everiss napsal(a):
    >> Well it depends I guess you have to look in the editer options it
    >> would have to do with how the symbon is rendered for nvda to read.
    >>
    >> Simplest way would be if there was a dictenary for that program if you
    >> can have a spaciffic definition for a particular program I am not sure
    >> if thats possible, but you could define the word empty to end of line
    >> or do it for the global deffinition and when anything is empty it will
    >> be end of line instead.
    >>
    >> Thats not going to really work that well.
    >>
    >> We need to find what that symbol actually is that is generated.
    >>
    >> Is it generating the standard carrage return or linefead, cr/lf symbol
    >> for example.
    >>
    >> crlf symbols usually at least when I did communications and things
    >> back in dos usually mean, new line, line end, end of line or simply an
    >> empty space depending on the os, unix/linux, windows or dos.
    >>
    >> In these days, windows/dos has almost the same charset with windows
    >> having more of them and linux has a few more.
    >>
    >> However depending what this thing was developed for, ie unix that
    >> could explain the issue you are having, things are translated that
    >> symbol may not be translated as such so there may be that issue to
    >> worry about.
    >>
    >> Ofcause if you can get a document with just that symbon in it and send
    >> it at whoever handles the symbol database then it should be ok.
    >>
    >> What happens if you create a document with a few new lines or line
    >> breaks in them and view it in another text editor.
    >>
    >> Ie notepad, if the symbol is still empty, then its a symbol issue but
    >> if the symbol is read correctly, it could simbly be what the editor is
    >> outputting to be translated in which case not much we can do.
    >>
    >> If the symbol from scyte you get in notepad back is just utter crap
    >> then it could be an untranslated symbol probably from unix or something.
    >>
    >> The next thing to do is send it back here and get someone to find out
    >> what that symbol comes from, latx for example has different symbols to
    >> text and other programs may have different symbols based on age to a
    >> point, etc.
    >>
    >> So if you find that out then the symbol can be added and your issue is
    >> solved.
    >>
    >> What I fear is that its just what the program outputs at nvda in which
    >> case nothing can be done really.
    >>
    >>
    >>
    >>
    >> On 6/04/2018 8:45 p.m., Jiří Fenz wrote:
    >>> Helllo all,
    >>>
    >>> i'm using Scite for coding in Autoit.
    >>>
    >>> Accessibility of thys program is almost total, but when moving with
    >>> right or left arrow betveen lines, nvda says Empty instead of New line.
    >>>
    >>> Is here some option to set classic End of line character in scite to
    >>> make it announce new line the same way as for example in notepad?
    >>>
    >>> With best regards
    >>>
    >>> Jiri Fenz
    >>>
    >>>
    >>
    >>
    >>
    >>
    >
    >
   
   
   
   
   





Brian's Mail list account <bglists@...>
 

I ran that portable version and am not hearing what you are hearing here on windows 7.
Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk, putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Cohn, Jonathan" <jcohn@air.org>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Friday, April 06, 2018 5:57 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] announcing end of lines in Scite editor


Would it be possible to use review cursor's Say Character and see what the UNICODE is that is being spoken as "blank" and then add it to a dictionary as a different expression? I haven't played with NVDA enough to know. Or perhaps even just the regular expression .$ could be used in a dictionary?



On 4/6/18, 11:41 AM, "nvda@nvda.groups.io on behalf of Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io" <nvda@nvda.groups.io on behalf of bglists=blueyonder.co.uk@groups.io> wrote:

Hmm what I see is nothing is spoken when you hit return, and if you leave a
line empty it just says blank, much like many editors. This tool behaves a
bit like the editor used by Dolphins scripting system as I recall.


Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk, putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jiří Fenz" <jirifenz@gmail.com>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Friday, April 06, 2018 10:27 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] announcing end of lines in Scite editor


>I think that it's only about gui element behaviour.
>
> Announcing empty instead of New line is the same regardless on lf, cr
or
> crlf end of line.
>
> So i think that solving this is about advanced configuration of Scite
to
> change how the eol symbol is viewed or forcing autoit to recognize
that
> actual symbol as standart new line.
>
> Here is link for portable version of Scite i'm using, if someone want
to
> try it directly.
>
>
https://www.autoitscript.com/cgi-bin/getfile.pl?../autoit3/scite/download/SciTE4AutoIt3_Portable.zip
>
> Jiri Fenz
>
>
>
> Dne 06.04.2018 v 10:56 Shaun Everiss napsal(a):
>> Well it depends I guess you have to look in the editer options it
>> would have to do with how the symbon is rendered for nvda to read.
>>
>> Simplest way would be if there was a dictenary for that program if
you
>> can have a spaciffic definition for a particular program I am not
sure
>> if thats possible, but you could define the word empty to end of
line
>> or do it for the global deffinition and when anything is empty it
will
>> be end of line instead.
>>
>> Thats not going to really work that well.
>>
>> We need to find what that symbol actually is that is generated.
>>
>> Is it generating the standard carrage return or linefead, cr/lf
symbol
>> for example.
>>
>> crlf symbols usually at least when I did communications and things
>> back in dos usually mean, new line, line end, end of line or simply
an
>> empty space depending on the os, unix/linux, windows or dos.
>>
>> In these days, windows/dos has almost the same charset with windows
>> having more of them and linux has a few more.
>>
>> However depending what this thing was developed for, ie unix that
>> could explain the issue you are having, things are translated that
>> symbol may not be translated as such so there may be that issue to
>> worry about.
>>
>> Ofcause if you can get a document with just that symbon in it and
send
>> it at whoever handles the symbol database then it should be ok.
>>
>> What happens if you create a document with a few new lines or line
>> breaks in them and view it in another text editor.
>>
>> Ie notepad, if the symbol is still empty, then its a symbol issue
but
>> if the symbol is read correctly, it could simbly be what the editor
is
>> outputting to be translated in which case not much we can do.
>>
>> If the symbol from scyte you get in notepad back is just utter crap
>> then it could be an untranslated symbol probably from unix or
something.
>>
>> The next thing to do is send it back here and get someone to find
out
>> what that symbol comes from, latx for example has different symbols
to
>> text and other programs may have different symbols based on age to a
>> point, etc.
>>
>> So if you find that out then the symbol can be added and your issue
is
>> solved.
>>
>> What I fear is that its just what the program outputs at nvda in
which
>> case nothing can be done really.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On 6/04/2018 8:45 p.m., Jiří Fenz wrote:
>>> Helllo all,
>>>
>>> i'm using Scite for coding in Autoit.
>>>
>>> Accessibility of thys program is almost total, but when moving with
>>> right or left arrow betveen lines, nvda says Empty instead of New
line.
>>>
>>> Is here some option to set classic End of line character in scite
to
>>> make it announce new line the same way as for example in notepad?
>>>
>>> With best regards
>>>
>>> Jiri Fenz
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>









Jiří Fenz <jirifenz@...>
 

Ok, i have to better specify this think.

Almost everythink is ok in Scite with nvda.

Only when you moving with right arrow cross end of line, nvda says Blank instead of New line.

So this behaviour is dependend only on colors combination in Scite symbol for new line i think.




Dne 06.04.2018 v 19:17 Gene napsal(a):

I don't have the technical knowledge to explain the different information you get and in what order without taking notes and transcribing the information NVDA provides.  I'll say that, if you turn input help on, then press numpad 2, you will hear a description of what happens when you press that key once, twice, or three times quickly.  You just have to press it once when input help is on and all three descriptions will be given.  Pressing the key three times gives you codes for the character you are on when you press that key.  It doesn't matter how you are reviewing the screen.  Any character that you are on will be described.
 
I'm giving desktop layout commands for input help and the current character command.  I don't use the laptop layout.
 
I just found something interesting.  It appears that such information may not be available for control characters.  It would be interesting to get an explanation of why.  I tried using the current character on a hard return.  I just heard blank, no matter how I used the command.  Evidently, control characters fall outside of the code NVDA reports.
 
\Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Friday, April 06, 2018 11:57 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] announcing end of lines in Scite editor

Would it be possible to use review cursor's Say Character and see what the UNICODE is that is being spoken as "blank" and then add it to a dictionary as a different expression? I haven't played with NVDA enough to know. Or perhaps even just the regular expression .$ could be used in a dictionary?



On 4/6/18, 11:41 AM, "nvda@nvda.groups.io on behalf of Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io" <nvda@nvda.groups.io on behalf of bglists@...> wrote:

    Hmm what I see is nothing is spoken when you hit return, and if you leave a
    line empty it just says blank, much like many editors. This tool behaves a
    bit like the editor used by Dolphins scripting system as I recall.
   
   
    Brian
   
    bglists@...
    Sent via blueyonder.
    Please address personal E-mail to:-
    briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
    in the display name field.
    ----- Original Message -----
    From: "Jiří Fenz" <jirifenz@...>
    To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
    Sent: Friday, April 06, 2018 10:27 AM
    Subject: Re: [nvda] announcing end of lines in Scite editor
   
   
    >I think that it's only about gui element behaviour.
    >
    > Announcing empty instead of New line is the same regardless on lf, cr or
    > crlf end of line.
    >
    > So i think that solving this is about advanced configuration of Scite to
    > change how the eol symbol is viewed or forcing autoit to recognize that
    > actual symbol as standart new line.
    >
    > Here is link for portable version of Scite i'm using, if someone want to
    > try it directly.
    >
    > https://www.autoitscript.com/cgi-bin/getfile.pl?../autoit3/scite/download/SciTE4AutoIt3_Portable.zip
    >
    > Jiri Fenz
    >
    >
    >
    > Dne 06.04.2018 v 10:56 Shaun Everiss napsal(a):
    >> Well it depends I guess you have to look in the editer options it
    >> would have to do with how the symbon is rendered for nvda to read.
    >>
    >> Simplest way would be if there was a dictenary for that program if you
    >> can have a spaciffic definition for a particular program I am not sure
    >> if thats possible, but you could define the word empty to end of line
    >> or do it for the global deffinition and when anything is empty it will
    >> be end of line instead.
    >>
    >> Thats not going to really work that well.
    >>
    >> We need to find what that symbol actually is that is generated.
    >>
    >> Is it generating the standard carrage return or linefead, cr/lf symbol
    >> for example.
    >>
    >> crlf symbols usually at least when I did communications and things
    >> back in dos usually mean, new line, line end, end of line or simply an
    >> empty space depending on the os, unix/linux, windows or dos.
    >>
    >> In these days, windows/dos has almost the same charset with windows
    >> having more of them and linux has a few more.
    >>
    >> However depending what this thing was developed for, ie unix that
    >> could explain the issue you are having, things are translated that
    >> symbol may not be translated as such so there may be that issue to
    >> worry about.
    >>
    >> Ofcause if you can get a document with just that symbon in it and send
    >> it at whoever handles the symbol database then it should be ok.
    >>
    >> What happens if you create a document with a few new lines or line
    >> breaks in them and view it in another text editor.
    >>
    >> Ie notepad, if the symbol is still empty, then its a symbol issue but
    >> if the symbol is read correctly, it could simbly be what the editor is
    >> outputting to be translated in which case not much we can do.
    >>
    >> If the symbol from scyte you get in notepad back is just utter crap
    >> then it could be an untranslated symbol probably from unix or something.
    >>
    >> The next thing to do is send it back here and get someone to find out
    >> what that symbol comes from, latx for example has different symbols to
    >> text and other programs may have different symbols based on age to a
    >> point, etc.
    >>
    >> So if you find that out then the symbol can be added and your issue is
    >> solved.
    >>
    >> What I fear is that its just what the program outputs at nvda in which
    >> case nothing can be done really.
    >>
    >>
    >>
    >>
    >> On 6/04/2018 8:45 p.m., Jiří Fenz wrote:
    >>> Helllo all,
    >>>
    >>> i'm using Scite for coding in Autoit.
    >>>
    >>> Accessibility of thys program is almost total, but when moving with
    >>> right or left arrow betveen lines, nvda says Empty instead of New line.
    >>>
    >>> Is here some option to set classic End of line character in scite to
    >>> make it announce new line the same way as for example in notepad?
    >>>
    >>> With best regards
    >>>
    >>> Jiri Fenz
    >>>
    >>>
    >>
    >>
    >>
    >>
    >
    >
   
   
   
   
   






Jonathan COHN
 

What Gene and I were working on, is that often times NVDA will say blank for a character it has not been trained to recognize. In these cases if you click numpad 2 three times, NVDA will speak the underlying code associated with that character. 

 

So please enter the program, move to where NVDA says blank and then hit the number 2 three times, if you do this correctly NVDA should say something like 1392 provide that code back to the list. Then we may be able to help you. When Gene attempted to get this code though, it didn’t seem to work so in that case you might have to just live with knowning that blank might be a new line or a Chinese character. (LOL)

Have a great weekend,

Jonathan

 

 

From: <nvda@nvda.groups.io> on behalf of Jiří Fenz <jirifenz@...>
Reply-To: "nvda@nvda.groups.io" <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Date: Sunday, April 8, 2018 at 9:20 AM
To: "nvda@nvda.groups.io" <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [nvda] announcing end of lines in Scite editor

 

Ok, i have to better specify this think.

Almost everythink is ok in Scite with nvda.

Only when you moving with right arrow cross end of line, nvda says Blank instead of New line.

So this behaviour is dependend only on colors combination in Scite symbol for new line i think.

 

 

 

Dne 06.04.2018 v 19:17 Gene napsal(a):

I don't have the technical knowledge to explain the different information you get and in what order without taking notes and transcribing the information NVDA provides.  I'll say that, if you turn input help on, then press numpad 2, you will hear a description of what happens when you press that key once, twice, or three times quickly.  You just have to press it once when input help is on and all three descriptions will be given.  Pressing the key three times gives you codes for the character you are on when you press that key.  It doesn't matter how you are reviewing the screen.  Any character that you are on will be described.

 

I'm giving desktop layout commands for input help and the current character command.  I don't use the laptop layout.

 

I just found something interesting.  It appears that such information may not be available for control characters.  It would be interesting to get an explanation of why.  I tried using the current character on a hard return.  I just heard blank, no matter how I used the command.  Evidently, control characters fall outside of the code NVDA reports.

 

\Gene

----- Original Message -----

Sent: Friday, April 06, 2018 11:57 AM

Subject: Re: [nvda] announcing end of lines in Scite editor

 

Would it be possible to use review cursor's Say Character and see what the UNICODE is that is being spoken as "blank" and then add it to a dictionary as a different expression? I haven't played with NVDA enough to know. Or perhaps even just the regular expression .$ could be used in a dictionary?



On 4/6/18, 11:41 AM, "
nvda@nvda.groups.io on behalf of Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io" <nvda@nvda.groups.io on behalf of bglists@...> wrote:

    Hmm what I see is nothing is spoken when you hit return, and if you leave a
    line empty it just says blank, much like many editors. This tool behaves a
    bit like the editor used by Dolphins scripting system as I recall.
   
   
    Brian
   
   
bglists@...
    Sent via blueyonder.
    Please address personal E-mail to:-
   
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
    in the display name field.
    ----- Original Message -----
    From: "Jiří Fenz" <
jirifenz@...>
    To: <
nvda@nvda.groups.io>
    Sent: Friday, April 06, 2018 10:27 AM
    Subject: Re: [nvda] announcing end of lines in Scite editor
   
   
    >I think that it's only about gui element behaviour.
    >
    > Announcing empty instead of New line is the same regardless on lf, cr or
    > crlf end of line.
    >
    > So i think that solving this is about advanced configuration of Scite to
    > change how the eol symbol is viewed or forcing autoit to recognize that
    > actual symbol as standart new line.
    >
    > Here is link for portable version of Scite i'm using, if someone want to
    > try it directly.
    >
    >
https://www.autoitscript.com/cgi-bin/getfile.pl?../autoit3/scite/download/SciTE4AutoIt3_Portable.zip
    >
    > Jiri Fenz
    >
    >
    >
    > Dne 06.04.2018 v 10:56 Shaun Everiss napsal(a):
    >> Well it depends I guess you have to look in the editer options it
    >> would have to do with how the symbon is rendered for nvda to read.
    >>
    >> Simplest way would be if there was a dictenary for that program if you
    >> can have a spaciffic definition for a particular program I am not sure
    >> if thats possible, but you could define the word empty to end of line
    >> or do it for the global deffinition and when anything is empty it will
    >> be end of line instead.
    >>
    >> Thats not going to really work that well.
    >>
    >> We need to find what that symbol actually is that is generated.
    >>
    >> Is it generating the standard carrage return or linefead, cr/lf symbol
    >> for example.
    >>
    >> crlf symbols usually at least when I did communications and things
    >> back in dos usually mean, new line, line end, end of line or simply an
    >> empty space depending on the os, unix/linux, windows or dos.
    >>
    >> In these days, windows/dos has almost the same charset with windows
    >> having more of them and linux has a few more.
    >>
    >> However depending what this thing was developed for, ie unix that
    >> could explain the issue you are having, things are translated that
    >> symbol may not be translated as such so there may be that issue to
    >> worry about.
    >>
    >> Ofcause if you can get a document with just that symbon in it and send
    >> it at whoever handles the symbol database then it should be ok.
    >>
    >> What happens if you create a document with a few new lines or line
    >> breaks in them and view it in another text editor.
    >>
    >> Ie notepad, if the symbol is still empty, then its a symbol issue but
    >> if the symbol is read correctly, it could simbly be what the editor is
    >> outputting to be translated in which case not much we can do.
    >>
    >> If the symbol from scyte you get in notepad back is just utter crap
    >> then it could be an untranslated symbol probably from unix or something.
    >>
    >> The next thing to do is send it back here and get someone to find out
    >> what that symbol comes from, latx for example has different symbols to
    >> text and other programs may have different symbols based on age to a
    >> point, etc.
    >>
    >> So if you find that out then the symbol can be added and your issue is
    >> solved.
    >>
    >> What I fear is that its just what the program outputs at nvda in which
    >> case nothing can be done really.
    >>
    >>
    >>
    >>
    >> On 6/04/2018 8:45 p.m., Jiří Fenz wrote:
    >>> Helllo all,
    >>>
    >>> i'm using Scite for coding in Autoit.
    >>>
    >>> Accessibility of thys program is almost total, but when moving with
    >>> right or left arrow betveen lines, nvda says Empty instead of New line.
    >>>
    >>> Is here some option to set classic End of line character in scite to
    >>> make it announce new line the same way as for example in notepad?
    >>>
    >>> With best regards
    >>>
    >>> Jiri Fenz
    >>>
    >>>
    >>
    >>
    >>
    >>
    >
    >
   
   
   
   
   



 


Dave Grossoehme
 

Good Morning:  If you aren't receiving a line return or line feed at the end of the line, then it possible your editor uses a backslash chacter for the end of line chacter.  Without knowing which program you are using it's hard to answer your question.

Insider Dave

On 4/6/2018 1:56 AM, Shaun Everiss wrote:
Well it depends I guess you have to look in the editer options it would have to do with how the symbon is rendered for nvda to read.

Simplest way would be if there was a dictenary for that program if you can have a spaciffic definition for a particular program I am not sure if thats possible, but you could define the word empty to end of line or do it for the global deffinition and when anything is empty it will be end of line instead.

Thats not going to really work that well.

We need to find what that symbol actually is that is generated.

Is it generating the standard carrage return or linefead, cr/lf symbol for example.

crlf symbols usually at least when I did communications and things back in dos usually mean, new line, line end, end of line or simply an empty space depending on the os, unix/linux, windows or dos.

In these days, windows/dos has almost the same charset with windows having more of them and linux has a few more.

However depending what this thing was developed for, ie unix that could explain the issue you are having, things are translated that symbol may not be translated as such so there may be that issue to worry about.

Ofcause if you can get a document with just that symbon in it and send it at whoever handles the symbol database then it should be ok.

What happens if you create a document with a few new lines or line breaks in them and view it in another text editor.

Ie notepad, if the symbol is still empty, then its a symbol issue but if the symbol is read correctly, it could simbly be what the editor is outputting to be translated in which case not much we can do.

If the symbol from scyte you get in notepad back is just utter crap then it could be an untranslated symbol probably from unix or something.

The next thing to do is send it back here and get someone to find out what that symbol comes from, latx for example has different symbols to text and other programs may have different symbols based on age to a point, etc.

So if you find that out then the symbol can be added and your issue is solved.

What I fear is that its just what the program outputs at nvda in which case nothing can be done really.




On 6/04/2018 8:45 p.m., Jiří Fenz wrote:
Helllo all,

i'm using Scite for coding in Autoit.

Accessibility of thys program is almost total, but when moving with right or left arrow betveen lines, nvda says Empty instead of New line.

Is here some option to set classic End of line character in scite to make it announce new line the same way as for example in notepad?

With best regards

Jiri Fenz



Jiří Fenz <jirifenz@...>
 

It's strange.:)

When i press num 2 three times, it says correctly End of line. So character is OK. But when i move cursor on it, nvda says Blank...

Jiri


Dne 08.04.2018 v 15:33 Cohn, Jonathan napsal(a):

What Gene and I were working on, is that often times NVDA will say blank for a character it has not been trained to recognize. In these cases if you click numpad 2 three times, NVDA will speak the underlying code associated with that character. 

 

So please enter the program, move to where NVDA says blank and then hit the number 2 three times, if you do this correctly NVDA should say something like 1392 provide that code back to the list. Then we may be able to help you. When Gene attempted to get this code though, it didn’t seem to work so in that case you might have to just live with knowning that blank might be a new line or a Chinese character. (LOL)

Have a great weekend,

Jonathan

 

 

From: <nvda@nvda.groups.io> on behalf of Jiří Fenz <jirifenz@...>
Reply-To: "nvda@nvda.groups.io" <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Date: Sunday, April 8, 2018 at 9:20 AM
To: "nvda@nvda.groups.io" <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [nvda] announcing end of lines in Scite editor

 

Ok, i have to better specify this think.

Almost everythink is ok in Scite with nvda.

Only when you moving with right arrow cross end of line, nvda says Blank instead of New line.

So this behaviour is dependend only on colors combination in Scite symbol for new line i think.

 

 

 

Dne 06.04.2018 v 19:17 Gene napsal(a):

I don't have the technical knowledge to explain the different information you get and in what order without taking notes and transcribing the information NVDA provides.  I'll say that, if you turn input help on, then press numpad 2, you will hear a description of what happens when you press that key once, twice, or three times quickly.  You just have to press it once when input help is on and all three descriptions will be given.  Pressing the key three times gives you codes for the character you are on when you press that key.  It doesn't matter how you are reviewing the screen.  Any character that you are on will be described.

 

I'm giving desktop layout commands for input help and the current character command.  I don't use the laptop layout.

 

I just found something interesting.  It appears that such information may not be available for control characters.  It would be interesting to get an explanation of why.  I tried using the current character on a hard return.  I just heard blank, no matter how I used the command.  Evidently, control characters fall outside of the code NVDA reports.

 

\Gene

----- Original Message -----

Sent: Friday, April 06, 2018 11:57 AM

Subject: Re: [nvda] announcing end of lines in Scite editor

 

Would it be possible to use review cursor's Say Character and see what the UNICODE is that is being spoken as "blank" and then add it to a dictionary as a different expression? I haven't played with NVDA enough to know. Or perhaps even just the regular expression .$ could be used in a dictionary?



On 4/6/18, 11:41 AM, "
nvda@nvda.groups.io on behalf of Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io" <nvda@nvda.groups.io on behalf of bglists@...> wrote:

    Hmm what I see is nothing is spoken when you hit return, and if you leave a
    line empty it just says blank, much like many editors. This tool behaves a
    bit like the editor used by Dolphins scripting system as I recall.
   
   
    Brian
   
   
bglists@...
    Sent via blueyonder.
    Please address personal E-mail to:-
   
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
    in the display name field.
    ----- Original Message -----
    From: "Jiří Fenz" <
jirifenz@...>
    To: <
nvda@nvda.groups.io>
    Sent: Friday, April 06, 2018 10:27 AM
    Subject: Re: [nvda] announcing end of lines in Scite editor
   
   
    >I think that it's only about gui element behaviour.
    >
    > Announcing empty instead of New line is the same regardless on lf, cr or
    > crlf end of line.
    >
    > So i think that solving this is about advanced configuration of Scite to
    > change how the eol symbol is viewed or forcing autoit to recognize that
    > actual symbol as standart new line.
    >
    > Here is link for portable version of Scite i'm using, if someone want to
    > try it directly.
    >
    >
https://www.autoitscript.com/cgi-bin/getfile.pl?../autoit3/scite/download/SciTE4AutoIt3_Portable.zip
    >
    > Jiri Fenz
    >
    >
    >
    > Dne 06.04.2018 v 10:56 Shaun Everiss napsal(a):
    >> Well it depends I guess you have to look in the editer options it
    >> would have to do with how the symbon is rendered for nvda to read.
    >>
    >> Simplest way would be if there was a dictenary for that program if you
    >> can have a spaciffic definition for a particular program I am not sure
    >> if thats possible, but you could define the word empty to end of line
    >> or do it for the global deffinition and when anything is empty it will
    >> be end of line instead.
    >>
    >> Thats not going to really work that well.
    >>
    >> We need to find what that symbol actually is that is generated.
    >>
    >> Is it generating the standard carrage return or linefead, cr/lf symbol
    >> for example.
    >>
    >> crlf symbols usually at least when I did communications and things
    >> back in dos usually mean, new line, line end, end of line or simply an
    >> empty space depending on the os, unix/linux, windows or dos.
    >>
    >> In these days, windows/dos has almost the same charset with windows
    >> having more of them and linux has a few more.
    >>
    >> However depending what this thing was developed for, ie unix that
    >> could explain the issue you are having, things are translated that
    >> symbol may not be translated as such so there may be that issue to
    >> worry about.
    >>
    >> Ofcause if you can get a document with just that symbon in it and send
    >> it at whoever handles the symbol database then it should be ok.
    >>
    >> What happens if you create a document with a few new lines or line
    >> breaks in them and view it in another text editor.
    >>
    >> Ie notepad, if the symbol is still empty, then its a symbol issue but
    >> if the symbol is read correctly, it could simbly be what the editor is
    >> outputting to be translated in which case not much we can do.
    >>
    >> If the symbol from scyte you get in notepad back is just utter crap
    >> then it could be an untranslated symbol probably from unix or something.
    >>
    >> The next thing to do is send it back here and get someone to find out
    >> what that symbol comes from, latx for example has different symbols to
    >> text and other programs may have different symbols based on age to a
    >> point, etc.
    >>
    >> So if you find that out then the symbol can be added and your issue is
    >> solved.
    >>
    >> What I fear is that its just what the program outputs at nvda in which
    >> case nothing can be done really.
    >>
    >>
    >>
    >>
    >> On 6/04/2018 8:45 p.m., Jiří Fenz wrote:
    >>> Helllo all,
    >>>
    >>> i'm using Scite for coding in Autoit.
    >>>
    >>> Accessibility of thys program is almost total, but when moving with
    >>> right or left arrow betveen lines, nvda says Empty instead of New line.
    >>>
    >>> Is here some option to set classic End of line character in scite to
    >>> make it announce new line the same way as for example in notepad?
    >>>
    >>> With best regards
    >>>
    >>> Jiri Fenz
    >>>
    >>>
    >>
    >>
    >>
    >>
    >
    >