Problem With Submit Button On My Banking Site


Ron Canazzi
 

Hi Group,


I don't know quite what happened.  I had called the bank yesterday and they said they would refer it to their IT department and that the department would call me back.  They never did call me back, but this morning when I tried to log in, the submit button worked. I don't know whether they updated their architecture in the past few days and introduced some sort of coding violation or whatever and then it was brought to their attention and they

fixed it.  I guess I'm all right for now until the next change on the page.


BTW, I am wondering just where the information for this 2 step log-in is kept in the browser.  Whenever I uninstall, reinstall or refresh Firefox, I never lose log-in or password information as such.  I am wondering just where the second step log in information (the graphic and the self chosen captcha word) is stored in Firefox.  Or could it be in the registry?




On 9/26/2018 9:47 AM, Brian Vogel wrote:
On Wed, Sep 26, 2018 at 08:58 AM, Davy Cuppens wrote:
Simply told, the procedure is unaccessible so cal your bank and tel them.
Not that I don't think this is a good idea, because it is, but you also have to understand that accessibility will always be, to some extent, a game of catch up.

Web coding keeps changing at blinding speed, and that's not going to stop.  Sometimes it's a matter of the screen readers catching up to it, and particularly when the reason for doing a certain thing a certain way revolves around increased security.

It's really generally helpful to check to see if what doesn't work under one screen reader might work under another if you happen to have a system with two or more screen readers available.  That can help to tease out where the issue might lie.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1803, Build 17134  

    The psychology of adultery has been falsified by conventional morals, which assume, in monogamous countries, that attraction to one person cannot co-exist with a serious affection for another.  Everybody knows that this is untrue. . .

           ~ Bertrand Russell

 

 


-- 
They Ask Me If I'm Happy; I say Yes.
They ask: "How Happy are You?"
I Say: "I'm as happy as a stow away chimpanzee on a banana boat!"


 

On Wed, Sep 26, 2018 at 08:58 AM, Davy Cuppens wrote:
Simply told, the procedure is unaccessible so cal your bank and tel them.
Not that I don't think this is a good idea, because it is, but you also have to understand that accessibility will always be, to some extent, a game of catch up.

Web coding keeps changing at blinding speed, and that's not going to stop.  Sometimes it's a matter of the screen readers catching up to it, and particularly when the reason for doing a certain thing a certain way revolves around increased security.

It's really generally helpful to check to see if what doesn't work under one screen reader might work under another if you happen to have a system with two or more screen readers available.  That can help to tease out where the issue might lie.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1803, Build 17134  

    The psychology of adultery has been falsified by conventional morals, which assume, in monogamous countries, that attraction to one person cannot co-exist with a serious affection for another.  Everybody knows that this is untrue. . .

           ~ Bertrand Russell

 

 


Davy Cuppens
 

Simply told, the procedure is unaccessible so cal your bank and tel them.
Davy

2018-09-26 14:01 GMT+02:00, Ron Canazzi <aa2vm@roadrunner.com>:

I tried that already.  It did not work.



On 9/26/2018 2:00 AM, Gene wrote:
There is one more thing you can try.  I have no idea if it might
work.  Move to the button in the usual way.  Then, turn off browse
mode and press the space bar.  I doubt that will work but its one more
thing to try.
Gene
----- Original Message -----
*From:* Gene <mailto:gsasner@gmail.com>
*Sent:* Wednesday, September 26, 2018 12:58 AM
*To:* nvda@nvda.groups.io <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>
*Subject:* Re: [nvda] Problem With Submit Button On My Banking Site

Insert numpad minus has nothing to do with what you are doing.  the
first procedure you described is the way you move the mouse to the
current position and then left click it with numpad slash.  But
whether the golden Cursor might be any more successful, I don't know.
If you had a physical mouse, you might be able to click it after using
numpad insert slash to move the mouse to the button and that might
work.  Or you might have to actually move the physical mouse to the
correct position, then click it.  I don't know which of these might work.
Gene
----- Original message -----
*From:* Ron Canazzi <mailto:aa2vm@roadrunner.com>
*Sent:* Tuesday, September 25, 2018 11:51 PM
*To:* nvda@nvda.groups.io <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>
*Subject:* Re: [nvda] Problem With Submit Button On My Banking Site

Hi Gene,


I want to make sure I am understanding this correctly.  I have been
using the keystrokes insert + numpad slash when highlighting the
submit button and have then pressed the numpad slash by itself to try
to activate it.  I have also tried insert + numpad minus to highlight
the item and have then used numpad slash by itself to try to activate
it.  Am I missing something else?

Thanks again.



On 9/25/2018 11:02 PM, Gene wrote:
Developers may want to comment.
I call it the virtual mouse but technically, I'm not sure what it
should be called.  As I understand it, whether you route the mouse
with the NVDA numpad command or with the Golden Triangle, you are
routing the actual thing the physical mouse moves.  You can see what
you can do in this case but I wouldn't be surprised if you have to
use a physical mouse and click the physical mouse.  there are times,
I don't know why, when I can move the mouse with the numpad command
to the right place and clicking it does nothing.  I suspect I could
use a physical mouse and click it successfully instead.
Gene
----- Original Message -----
*From:* Brian Vogel <mailto:britechguy@gmail.com>
*Sent:* Tuesday, September 25, 2018 9:35 PM
*To:* nvda@nvda.groups.io <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>
*Subject:* Re: [nvda] Problem With Submit Button On My Banking Site

On Tue, Sep 25, 2018 at 10:22 PM, Gene wrote:

he golden cursor, I believe, works with the same virtual mouse as
NVDA does.

Well, whatever it works with it actually moves the physical mouse
pointer along with it.    The position is expressed based on the
actual screen resolution, which is why if you're sharing location
data you have to be sure that the screen resolution on both machines
is the same and that the window in question is maximized.

When I move the mouse using Golden Cursor it moves precisely as
though I were moving the mouse itself (but, of course, a bit more
orderly since arrow keys are being used).

--

Brian *-*Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1803, Build 17134

/The psychology of adultery has been falsified by conventional
morals, which //assume, in monogamous countries, that attraction to
one person cannot co-exist with //a serious affection for another.
Everybody knows that this is untrue. . ./

           ~ Bertrand Russell
--
They Ask Me If I'm Happy; I say Yes.
They ask: "How Happy are You?"
I Say: "I'm as happy as a stow away chimpanzee on a banana boat!"
--
They Ask Me If I'm Happy; I say Yes.
They ask: "How Happy are You?"
I Say: "I'm as happy as a stow away chimpanzee on a banana boat!"





Ron Canazzi
 

I tried that already.  It did not work.



On 9/26/2018 2:00 AM, Gene wrote:
There is one more thing you can try.  I have no idea if it might work.  Move to the button in the usual way.  Then, turn off browse mode and press the space bar.  I doubt that will work but its one more thing to try.
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
From: Gene
Sent: Wednesday, September 26, 2018 12:58 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Problem With Submit Button On My Banking Site

Insert numpad minus has nothing to do with what you are doing.  the first procedure you described is the way you move the mouse to the current position and then left click it with numpad slash.  But whether the golden Cursor might be any more successful, I don't know.  If you had a physical mouse, you might be able to click it after using numpad insert slash to move the mouse to the button and that might work.  Or you might have to actually move the physical mouse to the correct position, then click it.  I don't know which of these might work.
 
Gene
----- Original message -----
Sent: Tuesday, September 25, 2018 11:51 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Problem With Submit Button On My Banking Site

Hi Gene,


I want to make sure I am understanding this correctly.  I have been using the keystrokes insert + numpad slash when highlighting the submit button and have then pressed the numpad slash by itself to try to activate it.  I have also tried insert + numpad minus to highlight the item and have then used numpad slash by itself to try to activate it.  Am I missing something else?

Thanks again.



On 9/25/2018 11:02 PM, Gene wrote:
Developers may want to comment.
 
I call it the virtual mouse but technically, I'm not sure what it should be called.  As I understand it, whether you route the mouse with the NVDA numpad command or with the Golden Triangle, you are routing the actual thing the physical mouse moves.  You can see what you can do in this case but I wouldn't be surprised if you have to use a physical mouse and click the physical mouse.  there are times, I don't know why, when I can move the mouse with the numpad command to the right place and clicking it does nothing.  I suspect I could use a physical mouse and click it successfully instead.
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Tuesday, September 25, 2018 9:35 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Problem With Submit Button On My Banking Site

On Tue, Sep 25, 2018 at 10:22 PM, Gene wrote:
he golden cursor, I believe, works with the same virtual mouse as NVDA does.
Well, whatever it works with it actually moves the physical mouse pointer along with it.    The position is expressed based on the actual screen resolution, which is why if you're sharing location data you have to be sure that the screen resolution on both machines is the same and that the window in question is maximized.

When I move the mouse using Golden Cursor it moves precisely as though I were moving the mouse itself (but, of course, a bit more orderly since arrow keys are being used).
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1803, Build 17134  

    The psychology of adultery has been falsified by conventional morals, which assume, in monogamous countries, that attraction to one person cannot co-exist with a serious affection for another.  Everybody knows that this is untrue. . .

           ~ Bertrand Russell

 

 


-- 
They Ask Me If I'm Happy; I say Yes.
They ask: "How Happy are You?"
I Say: "I'm as happy as a stow away chimpanzee on a banana boat!"

-- 
They Ask Me If I'm Happy; I say Yes.
They ask: "How Happy are You?"
I Say: "I'm as happy as a stow away chimpanzee on a banana boat!"


Brian's Mail list account <bglists@...>
 

Now the last time I ran into this one it was an invisible item on the screen that had to have something filled in before the submit button was available. I know this might not be helpful, but when I finally got to the bottom of it its was a graphic tat said in the picture. spammers should not click this item or was it the other way around. Its was something like that, something only visible to eyes that had to be interacted with in some odd way, one supposes to stop bots trying to log in.
If that is the reason for this, you need to contact the web team and point out they also exclude blind users.
Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk, putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Ron Canazzi" <aa2vm@roadrunner.com>
To: "NVDA Official Group" <nvda@groups.io>
Sent: Wednesday, September 26, 2018 1:41 AM
Subject: [nvda] Problem With Submit Button On My Banking Site


Hi Group,


I have been using my bank's online services for a number of years now. They have a double security set up. When you first log in, you must pick a captcha word or expression and save it and remember it and also a graphical image. Every time Windows gets a major update or sometimes it's an architectural change to the website/security of the bank (whatever that is) you have to reset the security settings.


It happened again this week. I tried logging in and instead of just the nromal user name and password, I had to reset the security settings. Actually this hasn't been as bad as it could be because each of the images (there are a choice of 20 in all) is defined by NVDA as image 200.jpg, image 201.jpg image 202.jpg and so on. These images are consistently associated with the same images, so that isn't the problem. This time however, when I had made my choices and move down to the submit button and try to click it with the space bar, the enter key, the routing/mouse keystrokes, nothing happens. I tried this with NVDA, Narrator and JAWS. Nothing works.


I seem to remember that on this list, there is some sort of aid for such instances where you can actually take control over the mouse with keystrokes and click it in this way. Am I wrong about this? It might have been called something like Golden Cursor or something. I am using a desktop PC with Windows ten latest builds.


if anyone nows what I am talking about, I would greatly appreciate some advice.


Thanks in advance for anyhelp.


--
They Ask Me If I'm Happy; I say Yes.
They ask: "How Happy are You?"
I Say: "I'm as happy as a stow away chimpanzee on a banana boat!"



Gene
 

There is one more thing you can try.  I have no idea if it might work.  Move to the button in the usual way.  Then, turn off browse mode and press the space bar.  I doubt that will work but its one more thing to try.
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
From: Gene
Sent: Wednesday, September 26, 2018 12:58 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Problem With Submit Button On My Banking Site

Insert numpad minus has nothing to do with what you are doing.  the first procedure you described is the way you move the mouse to the current position and then left click it with numpad slash.  But whether the golden Cursor might be any more successful, I don't know.  If you had a physical mouse, you might be able to click it after using numpad insert slash to move the mouse to the button and that might work.  Or you might have to actually move the physical mouse to the correct position, then click it.  I don't know which of these might work.
 
Gene
----- Original message -----
Sent: Tuesday, September 25, 2018 11:51 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Problem With Submit Button On My Banking Site

Hi Gene,


I want to make sure I am understanding this correctly.  I have been using the keystrokes insert + numpad slash when highlighting the submit button and have then pressed the numpad slash by itself to try to activate it.  I have also tried insert + numpad minus to highlight the item and have then used numpad slash by itself to try to activate it.  Am I missing something else?

Thanks again.



On 9/25/2018 11:02 PM, Gene wrote:
Developers may want to comment.
 
I call it the virtual mouse but technically, I'm not sure what it should be called.  As I understand it, whether you route the mouse with the NVDA numpad command or with the Golden Triangle, you are routing the actual thing the physical mouse moves.  You can see what you can do in this case but I wouldn't be surprised if you have to use a physical mouse and click the physical mouse.  there are times, I don't know why, when I can move the mouse with the numpad command to the right place and clicking it does nothing.  I suspect I could use a physical mouse and click it successfully instead.
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Tuesday, September 25, 2018 9:35 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Problem With Submit Button On My Banking Site

On Tue, Sep 25, 2018 at 10:22 PM, Gene wrote:
he golden cursor, I believe, works with the same virtual mouse as NVDA does.
Well, whatever it works with it actually moves the physical mouse pointer along with it.    The position is expressed based on the actual screen resolution, which is why if you're sharing location data you have to be sure that the screen resolution on both machines is the same and that the window in question is maximized.

When I move the mouse using Golden Cursor it moves precisely as though I were moving the mouse itself (but, of course, a bit more orderly since arrow keys are being used).
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1803, Build 17134  

    The psychology of adultery has been falsified by conventional morals, which assume, in monogamous countries, that attraction to one person cannot co-exist with a serious affection for another.  Everybody knows that this is untrue. . .

           ~ Bertrand Russell

 

 


-- 
They Ask Me If I'm Happy; I say Yes.
They ask: "How Happy are You?"
I Say: "I'm as happy as a stow away chimpanzee on a banana boat!"


Gene
 

Insert numpad minus has nothing to do with what you are doing.  the first procedure you described is the way you move the mouse to the current position and then left click it with numpad slash.  But whether the golden Cursor might be any more successful, I don't know.  If you had a physical mouse, you might be able to click it after using numpad insert slash to move the mouse to the button and that might work.  Or you might have to actually move the physical mouse to the correct position, then click it.  I don't know which of these might work.
 
Gene

----- Original message -----
Sent: Tuesday, September 25, 2018 11:51 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Problem With Submit Button On My Banking Site

Hi Gene,


I want to make sure I am understanding this correctly.  I have been using the keystrokes insert + numpad slash when highlighting the submit button and have then pressed the numpad slash by itself to try to activate it.  I have also tried insert + numpad minus to highlight the item and have then used numpad slash by itself to try to activate it.  Am I missing something else?

Thanks again.



On 9/25/2018 11:02 PM, Gene wrote:
Developers may want to comment.
 
I call it the virtual mouse but technically, I'm not sure what it should be called.  As I understand it, whether you route the mouse with the NVDA numpad command or with the Golden Triangle, you are routing the actual thing the physical mouse moves.  You can see what you can do in this case but I wouldn't be surprised if you have to use a physical mouse and click the physical mouse.  there are times, I don't know why, when I can move the mouse with the numpad command to the right place and clicking it does nothing.  I suspect I could use a physical mouse and click it successfully instead.
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Tuesday, September 25, 2018 9:35 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Problem With Submit Button On My Banking Site

On Tue, Sep 25, 2018 at 10:22 PM, Gene wrote:
he golden cursor, I believe, works with the same virtual mouse as NVDA does.
Well, whatever it works with it actually moves the physical mouse pointer along with it.    The position is expressed based on the actual screen resolution, which is why if you're sharing location data you have to be sure that the screen resolution on both machines is the same and that the window in question is maximized.

When I move the mouse using Golden Cursor it moves precisely as though I were moving the mouse itself (but, of course, a bit more orderly since arrow keys are being used).
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1803, Build 17134  

    The psychology of adultery has been falsified by conventional morals, which assume, in monogamous countries, that attraction to one person cannot co-exist with a serious affection for another.  Everybody knows that this is untrue. . .

           ~ Bertrand Russell

 

 


-- 
They Ask Me If I'm Happy; I say Yes.
They ask: "How Happy are You?"
I Say: "I'm as happy as a stow away chimpanzee on a banana boat!"


Gene
 

I don't know.  I don't know if the problem is that you can't move to the button now or if the button can't be clicked with the mouse click in your screen-reader.  I suspect it’s the second reason but I don't know.  I think you could likely click it with a physical mouse but you may want to try the Golden Cursor first.  I haven't used it so I can't discuss how to work with it.
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Tuesday, September 25, 2018 11:46 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Problem With Submit Button On My Banking Site

Hi Brian, Gene and group,


So would I benefit from the use of Golden Cursor?  Would it perhaps precisely locate the button and actually activate it?

Thanks.



On 9/25/2018 10:35 PM, Brian Vogel wrote:
On Tue, Sep 25, 2018 at 10:22 PM, Gene wrote:
he golden cursor, I believe, works with the same virtual mouse as NVDA does.
Well, whatever it works with it actually moves the physical mouse pointer along with it.    The position is expressed based on the actual screen resolution, which is why if you're sharing location data you have to be sure that the screen resolution on both machines is the same and that the window in question is maximized.

When I move the mouse using Golden Cursor it moves precisely as though I were moving the mouse itself (but, of course, a bit more orderly since arrow keys are being used).
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1803, Build 17134  

    The psychology of adultery has been falsified by conventional morals, which assume, in monogamous countries, that attraction to one person cannot co-exist with a serious affection for another.  Everybody knows that this is untrue. . .

           ~ Bertrand Russell

 

 


-- 
They Ask Me If I'm Happy; I say Yes.
They ask: "How Happy are You?"
I Say: "I'm as happy as a stow away chimpanzee on a banana boat!"


Ron Canazzi
 

Hi Jen,


It actually says: 'submit button.'



On 9/26/2018 12:55 AM, hurrikennyandopo ... wrote:

Hi


Out of curiosity could the button be a graphic.


The reason i ask this I have seen even on my own banking website where they have used a graphic for the button and it will state graphic but acts as a button.


Or does it actually say button?


Gene nz



On 26/09/2018 2:46 PM, Brian Vogel wrote:
By the way, I just experimented with moving the mouse using Golden Cursor, and whether I left click using an actual left click on my mouse pad or number pad slash when I'm positioned over the "Reply" link to bring up the reply composition for Groups.io, or the "Reply to Group" button to send the message, both work.

The visual mouse position is the same as though I had moved it via the actual mouse pad. 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1803, Build 17134  

    The psychology of adultery has been falsified by conventional morals, which assume, in monogamous countries, that attraction to one person cannot co-exist with a serious affection for another.  Everybody knows that this is untrue. . .

           ~ Bertrand Russell

 

 



-- 
They Ask Me If I'm Happy; I say Yes.
They ask: "How Happy are You?"
I Say: "I'm as happy as a stow away chimpanzee on a banana boat!"


hurrikennyandopo ...
 

Hi


Out of curiosity could the button be a graphic.


The reason i ask this I have seen even on my own banking website where they have used a graphic for the button and it will state graphic but acts as a button.


Or does it actually say button?


Gene nz



On 26/09/2018 2:46 PM, Brian Vogel wrote:
By the way, I just experimented with moving the mouse using Golden Cursor, and whether I left click using an actual left click on my mouse pad or number pad slash when I'm positioned over the "Reply" link to bring up the reply composition for Groups.io, or the "Reply to Group" button to send the message, both work.

The visual mouse position is the same as though I had moved it via the actual mouse pad. 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1803, Build 17134  

    The psychology of adultery has been falsified by conventional morals, which assume, in monogamous countries, that attraction to one person cannot co-exist with a serious affection for another.  Everybody knows that this is untrue. . .

           ~ Bertrand Russell

 

 



Ron Canazzi
 

Hi Gene,


I want to make sure I am understanding this correctly.  I have been using the keystrokes insert + numpad slash when highlighting the submit button and have then pressed the numpad slash by itself to try to activate it.  I have also tried insert + numpad minus to highlight the item and have then used numpad slash by itself to try to activate it.  Am I missing something else?

Thanks again.



On 9/25/2018 11:02 PM, Gene wrote:
Developers may want to comment.
 
I call it the virtual mouse but technically, I'm not sure what it should be called.  As I understand it, whether you route the mouse with the NVDA numpad command or with the Golden Triangle, you are routing the actual thing the physical mouse moves.  You can see what you can do in this case but I wouldn't be surprised if you have to use a physical mouse and click the physical mouse.  there are times, I don't know why, when I can move the mouse with the numpad command to the right place and clicking it does nothing.  I suspect I could use a physical mouse and click it successfully instead.
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Tuesday, September 25, 2018 9:35 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Problem With Submit Button On My Banking Site

On Tue, Sep 25, 2018 at 10:22 PM, Gene wrote:
he golden cursor, I believe, works with the same virtual mouse as NVDA does.
Well, whatever it works with it actually moves the physical mouse pointer along with it.    The position is expressed based on the actual screen resolution, which is why if you're sharing location data you have to be sure that the screen resolution on both machines is the same and that the window in question is maximized.

When I move the mouse using Golden Cursor it moves precisely as though I were moving the mouse itself (but, of course, a bit more orderly since arrow keys are being used).
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1803, Build 17134  

    The psychology of adultery has been falsified by conventional morals, which assume, in monogamous countries, that attraction to one person cannot co-exist with a serious affection for another.  Everybody knows that this is untrue. . .

           ~ Bertrand Russell

 

 


-- 
They Ask Me If I'm Happy; I say Yes.
They ask: "How Happy are You?"
I Say: "I'm as happy as a stow away chimpanzee on a banana boat!"


Ron Canazzi
 

Hi Brian, Gene and group,


So would I benefit from the use of Golden Cursor?  Would it perhaps precisely locate the button and actually activate it?

Thanks.



On 9/25/2018 10:35 PM, Brian Vogel wrote:
On Tue, Sep 25, 2018 at 10:22 PM, Gene wrote:
he golden cursor, I believe, works with the same virtual mouse as NVDA does.
Well, whatever it works with it actually moves the physical mouse pointer along with it.    The position is expressed based on the actual screen resolution, which is why if you're sharing location data you have to be sure that the screen resolution on both machines is the same and that the window in question is maximized.

When I move the mouse using Golden Cursor it moves precisely as though I were moving the mouse itself (but, of course, a bit more orderly since arrow keys are being used).
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1803, Build 17134  

    The psychology of adultery has been falsified by conventional morals, which assume, in monogamous countries, that attraction to one person cannot co-exist with a serious affection for another.  Everybody knows that this is untrue. . .

           ~ Bertrand Russell

 

 


-- 
They Ask Me If I'm Happy; I say Yes.
They ask: "How Happy are You?"
I Say: "I'm as happy as a stow away chimpanzee on a banana boat!"


 

On Tue, Sep 25, 2018 at 11:04 PM, Gene wrote:
I hadn't considered using NVDA to move the mouse and then clicking the actual mouse.
This is a trick I try to teach everyone I work with, as there are just too many occasions when, for whatever reason, the screen reader left and/or right click functions simply will not work.  It's not like it's many times daily, not anything like that, but it always seems to happen at the most inconvenient times.

On laptops this is a cinch, as you have the left and right click hard buttons, and so long as the mouse pad is isolated from being touched they're easier to use than any of their functional equivalents.  For "real mice" you can either block the scanning light on an optical mouse or, if the mouse has a removable ball when it's a mechanical mouse, just remove it and moving the mouse doesn't move the pointer.

When it comes to accessibility the whole affair is, when it comes right down to it, a huge collection of workarounds.  Sometimes there are a few additional ones that can be put into the mix.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1803, Build 17134  

    The psychology of adultery has been falsified by conventional morals, which assume, in monogamous countries, that attraction to one person cannot co-exist with a serious affection for another.  Everybody knows that this is untrue. . .

           ~ Bertrand Russell

 

 


Gene
 

That sounds like another way to do what I had in mind.  I hadn't considered using NVDA to move the mouse and then clicking the actual mouse.
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Tuesday, September 25, 2018 9:43 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Problem With Submit Button On My Banking Site

Ron,

           If  the number pad slash is not working as a left mouse click when you have the mouse pointer positioned where it should be with Golden Cursor, you can also use the "immobile mouse" trick.  This is much easier to do if your system has an optical mouse, which you can tape over the laser source on the bottom that reads movement and still be able to move the mouse without it thinking it's moved.  If it's an older mouse with a ball you can tape the mouse into place on your desktop out of the way somewhere, but be able to hit the actual left click and right click button when needed.

--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1803, Build 17134  

    The psychology of adultery has been falsified by conventional morals, which assume, in monogamous countries, that attraction to one person cannot co-exist with a serious affection for another.  Everybody knows that this is untrue. . .

           ~ Bertrand Russell

 

 


Gene
 

Developers may want to comment.
 
I call it the virtual mouse but technically, I'm not sure what it should be called.  As I understand it, whether you route the mouse with the NVDA numpad command or with the Golden Triangle, you are routing the actual thing the physical mouse moves.  You can see what you can do in this case but I wouldn't be surprised if you have to use a physical mouse and click the physical mouse.  there are times, I don't know why, when I can move the mouse with the numpad command to the right place and clicking it does nothing.  I suspect I could use a physical mouse and click it successfully instead.
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Tuesday, September 25, 2018 9:35 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Problem With Submit Button On My Banking Site

On Tue, Sep 25, 2018 at 10:22 PM, Gene wrote:
he golden cursor, I believe, works with the same virtual mouse as NVDA does.
Well, whatever it works with it actually moves the physical mouse pointer along with it.    The position is expressed based on the actual screen resolution, which is why if you're sharing location data you have to be sure that the screen resolution on both machines is the same and that the window in question is maximized.

When I move the mouse using Golden Cursor it moves precisely as though I were moving the mouse itself (but, of course, a bit more orderly since arrow keys are being used).
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1803, Build 17134  

    The psychology of adultery has been falsified by conventional morals, which assume, in monogamous countries, that attraction to one person cannot co-exist with a serious affection for another.  Everybody knows that this is untrue. . .

           ~ Bertrand Russell

 

 


 

By the way, I just experimented with moving the mouse using Golden Cursor, and whether I left click using an actual left click on my mouse pad or number pad slash when I'm positioned over the "Reply" link to bring up the reply composition for Groups.io, or the "Reply to Group" button to send the message, both work.

The visual mouse position is the same as though I had moved it via the actual mouse pad. 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1803, Build 17134  

    The psychology of adultery has been falsified by conventional morals, which assume, in monogamous countries, that attraction to one person cannot co-exist with a serious affection for another.  Everybody knows that this is untrue. . .

           ~ Bertrand Russell

 

 


 

Ron,

           If  the number pad slash is not working as a left mouse click when you have the mouse pointer positioned where it should be with Golden Cursor, you can also use the "immobile mouse" trick.  This is much easier to do if your system has an optical mouse, which you can tape over the laser source on the bottom that reads movement and still be able to move the mouse without it thinking it's moved.  If it's an older mouse with a ball you can tape the mouse into place on your desktop out of the way somewhere, but be able to hit the actual left click and right click button when needed.

--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1803, Build 17134  

    The psychology of adultery has been falsified by conventional morals, which assume, in monogamous countries, that attraction to one person cannot co-exist with a serious affection for another.  Everybody knows that this is untrue. . .

           ~ Bertrand Russell

 

 


 

On Tue, Sep 25, 2018 at 10:22 PM, Gene wrote:
he golden cursor, I believe, works with the same virtual mouse as NVDA does.
Well, whatever it works with it actually moves the physical mouse pointer along with it.    The position is expressed based on the actual screen resolution, which is why if you're sharing location data you have to be sure that the screen resolution on both machines is the same and that the window in question is maximized.

When I move the mouse using Golden Cursor it moves precisely as though I were moving the mouse itself (but, of course, a bit more orderly since arrow keys are being used).
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1803, Build 17134  

    The psychology of adultery has been falsified by conventional morals, which assume, in monogamous countries, that attraction to one person cannot co-exist with a serious affection for another.  Everybody knows that this is untrue. . .

           ~ Bertrand Russell

 

 


Gene
 

You may have to use a physical mouse.  As I understand it, NVDA announces what is under the physical mouse when you move it.  The golden cursor, I believe, works with the same virtual mouse as NVDA does.  it is not different in what it works with, rather it adds ways to move it or assign a location to move it to when you want to move it to a location.
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Tuesday, September 25, 2018 7:41 PM
Subject: [nvda] Problem With Submit Button On My Banking Site

Hi Group,


I have been using my bank's online services for a number of years now. 
They have a double security set up. When you first log in, you must pick
a captcha word or expression and save it and remember it and also a
graphical image.  Every time Windows gets a major update or sometimes
it's an architectural change to the website/security of the bank
(whatever that is) you have to reset the security settings.


It happened again this week.  I tried logging in and instead of just the
nromal user name and password, I had to reset the security settings.
Actually this hasn't been as bad as it could be because each of the
images (there are a choice of 20 in all) is defined by NVDA as image
200.jpg, image 201.jpg image 202.jpg and so on.  These images are
consistently associated with the same images, so that isn't the
problem.  This time however, when I had made my choices and move down to
the submit button and try to click it with the space bar, the enter key,
the routing/mouse keystrokes, nothing happens.  I tried this with NVDA,
Narrator and JAWS.  Nothing works.


I seem to remember that on this list, there is some sort of aid for such
instances where you can actually take control over the mouse with
keystrokes and click it in this way.  Am I wrong about this?  It might
have been called something like Golden Cursor or something.  I am using
a desktop PC with Windows ten latest builds.


if anyone nows what I am talking about, I would greatly appreciate some
advice.


Thanks in advance for anyhelp.


--
They Ask Me If I'm Happy; I say Yes.
They ask: "How Happy are You?"
I Say: "I'm as happy as a stow away chimpanzee on a banana boat!"




Ron Canazzi
 

Hi Group,


I have been using my bank's online services for a number of years now.  They have a double security set up. When you first log in, you must pick a captcha word or expression and save it and remember it and also a graphical image.  Every time Windows gets a major update or sometimes it's an architectural change to the website/security of the bank (whatever that is) you have to reset the security settings.


It happened again this week.  I tried logging in and instead of just the nromal user name and password, I had to reset the security settings. Actually this hasn't been as bad as it could be because each of the images (there are a choice of 20 in all) is defined by NVDA as image 200.jpg, image 201.jpg image 202.jpg and so on.  These images are consistently associated with the same images, so that isn't the problem.  This time however, when I had made my choices and move down to the submit button and try to click it with the space bar, the enter key, the routing/mouse keystrokes, nothing happens.  I tried this with NVDA, Narrator and JAWS.  Nothing works.


I seem to remember that on this list, there is some sort of aid for such instances where you can actually take control over the mouse with keystrokes and click it in this way.  Am I wrong about this?  It might have been called something like Golden Cursor or something.  I am using a desktop PC with Windows ten latest builds.


if anyone nows what I am talking about, I would greatly appreciate some advice.


Thanks in advance for anyhelp.


--
They Ask Me If I'm Happy; I say Yes.
They ask: "How Happy are You?"
I Say: "I'm as happy as a stow away chimpanzee on a banana boat!"