Can I still get it for free


Sakina
 

Hello gene and Friends,

 

I have got this passed down old laptop from a friend that has got window 7

Please forgive me for my terminology below

I wish to update or is called upgrade to window 10

Is it possible and can I still get the window 10 for free?

If yes, than please how do I go about.

I will be and always am grateful for your help and guidance.

Thanking you all again.

With best wishes

Sakina


Virus-free. www.avast.com


Gene
 

Is there a specific reason you want to use Windows 10?  You can upgrade for free but I don't know the procedure.  others, I expect, will advise you.  You say it's an old laptop.  There is a Microsoft site you can use to have your computer evaluated to see if it is able to be upgraded.  But unless there is a specific feature you want, I would advise leaving well enough alone. 
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
From: Sakina
Sent: Wednesday, March 08, 2017 6:53 AM
Subject: [nvda] Can I still get it for free

Hello gene and Friends,

 

I have got this passed down old laptop from a friend that has got window 7

Please forgive me for my terminology below

I wish to update or is called upgrade to window 10

Is it possible and can I still get the window 10 for free?

If yes, than please how do I go about.

I will be and always am grateful for your help and guidance.

Thanking you all again.

With best wishes

Sakina


Virus-free. www.avast.com


Michael Capelle <mcapelle@...>
 

i totally agree here.
 

From: Gene
Sent: Wednesday, March 08, 2017 7:04 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Can I still get it for free
 
Is there a specific reason you want to use Windows 10?  You can upgrade for free but I don't know the procedure.  others, I expect, will advise you.  You say it's an old laptop.  There is a Microsoft site you can use to have your computer evaluated to see if it is able to be upgraded.  But unless there is a specific feature you want, I would advise leaving well enough alone. 
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
From: Sakina
Sent: Wednesday, March 08, 2017 6:53 AM
Subject: [nvda] Can I still get it for free
 

Hello gene and Friends,

 

I have got this passed down old laptop from a friend that has got window 7

Please forgive me for my terminology below

I wish to update or is called upgrade to window 10

Is it possible and can I still get the window 10 for free?

If yes, than please how do I go about.

I will be and always am grateful for your help and guidance.

Thanking you all again.

With best wishes

Sakina


Virus-free. www.avast.com


enes sarıbaş
 

that is an extremely bad suggesstion. If you don't have a very good reason to not update, it is generally a good idea to update.


On 3/8/2017 4:04 PM, Gene wrote:
Is there a specific reason you want to use Windows 10?  You can upgrade for free but I don't know the procedure.  others, I expect, will advise you.  You say it's an old laptop.  There is a Microsoft site you can use to have your computer evaluated to see if it is able to be upgraded.  But unless there is a specific feature you want, I would advise leaving well enough alone. 
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
From: Sakina
Sent: Wednesday, March 08, 2017 6:53 AM
Subject: [nvda] Can I still get it for free

Hello gene and Friends,

 

I have got this passed down old laptop from a friend that has got window 7

Please forgive me for my terminology below

I wish to update or is called upgrade to window 10

Is it possible and can I still get the window 10 for free?

If yes, than please how do I go about.

I will be and always am grateful for your help and guidance.

Thanking you all again.

With best wishes

Sakina


Virus-free. www.avast.com


Gene
 

You have made a statement and not given any reasons supporting it.  That doesn't tell us anything except that you believe something.  People may have reasons to upgrade from Windows 7 and Microsoft has recently claimed that for security reasons, you should upgrade because Windows 7 is not secure enough anymore because it isn't a new enough operating system to incorporate newer security features.  I haven't seen any independent discussion concerning this.  But there are always problems that may occur when updating and in this case, the point was stated that this is an old computer.  You don't just upgrade.  While many upgrades from Windows 7 go well, you can't assume they will.  I don't think it’s a good idea to urge upgrading as a general practice.  Why is an upgrade being considered?  What features, if any, will be used or are desired by upgrading?  Has the computer been tested for compatibility of the upgrade?
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Wednesday, March 08, 2017 7:21 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Can I still get it for free

that is an extremely bad suggesstion. If you don't have a very good reason to not update, it is generally a good idea to update.


On 3/8/2017 4:04 PM, Gene wrote:
Is there a specific reason you want to use Windows 10?  You can upgrade for free but I don't know the procedure.  others, I expect, will advise you.  You say it's an old laptop.  There is a Microsoft site you can use to have your computer evaluated to see if it is able to be upgraded.  But unless there is a specific feature you want, I would advise leaving well enough alone. 
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
From: Sakina
Sent: Wednesday, March 08, 2017 6:53 AM
Subject: [nvda] Can I still get it for free

Hello gene and Friends,

 

I have got this passed down old laptop from a friend that has got window 7

Please forgive me for my terminology below

I wish to update or is called upgrade to window 10

Is it possible and can I still get the window 10 for free?

If yes, than please how do I go about.

I will be and always am grateful for your help and guidance.

Thanking you all again.

With best wishes

Sakina


Virus-free. www.avast.com


erik burggraaf <erik@...>
 

Gene,  Here is my reasonable take on this based on my more than 15 years of in depth experience not only of windows, but also other major operating systems.

First, windows is a terrible product in any itteration.  There isn't a single thing windows does better than other operating systems except for arketecture support.  It's the most expensive operating system to implement if you remove hardware from the equation.  Windows supports cheeper hardware than the competition but that doesn't negate the fact that windows itself is the highest priced operating system on the market.  Windows is also more expensive to maintain.  In fact, an upgrade from windows seven to windows 10 takes about two hours time.  If you have to fully patch windows seven sp1 it takes between 3 and 6 hours depending on connection speed.  If you're paying by the hour, which would you choose?

Windows is the least secure of all the major OS, further compounding the astronomical maintanence cost and driving down productivity.  I have not yet had to hack windows 10, but I have windows seven.  In windows seven it is common place for programs to allow themselves transparently through built in firewalling.  It is also common place for programs to run as administrator without requiring the administrator account to be enabled or requiring an administrator password.  It is possible for programs to sircomvent the notification system that works on the front line, and it's even possible and considered advisable by many people to turn the security notifications off altogether.  In fact, it is possible when sitting at the keyboard of a windows seven workstation to gain administrator access without logging in at all, to add, remove, or rename windows system files, to take command line control of a workstation, and to perform any command line function including enabling or disabling the administrator account and changing account credentials, all without logging in.  Litterally any improvement would be better than the attrocity that is windows seven security.

Microsoft interface design is terrible.  Ribbons and tiles are only two examples of design choices meant to set windows apart from competetors but had the effect of alienating users.  Windows 10 does the smart thing and returns the windows interface to a more desktop feel. 

Windows only gets a refresh every three years or so.  That means a lot happens in the computer world between releases.  Because the releases are alternately pretty decent over all come terrible to the point of uselessness, windows appeals to pundets who don't like change and want to hault progress.  Fine, but windows seven is coming up on 8 years old and we are still talking about support for windows xp being discontinued.  Nowhere else in the world of operating systems are we talking about support for 8 year old software, and 17 year old software isn't even available for download on pirate sites.  Computers that shipped with windows 7 at the time of the release of windows 8 are now end of lifed, and yet, I was still able to buy and install a windows seven a month ago.  The cost to developers of supporting four operating systems spanning 11 years: ten, eight, seven and vista, is astronomical, and you lucky end-user, get to pay the bill.  The cost of windows software over all is significantly higher than on any other operating system, and part of the reason is that windows users live in the past more than any other userbase.

Windows ten continues to be a free upgrade for current users of seven and eight, long after it was supposed to switch to a completely paid product.  The minimum and recommended hardware configurations are similar to those of windows seven.  Upgrading usually brings better plug and play hardware support and other items under the hood that users would miss if they were gone.

There are features I like in windows ten such as it's minimalist email app and it's improved tts voices.  Then there are things I'm not too pleased with such as the loss of control over windows update and the increased relience on ribbons.  True, we don't really have enough information about this particular case to make a recommendation one way or the other, but in general, it is more than time to leave windows seven behind unlesss you have some substantial reason not to, such as loss of support for a crutial piece of hardware.

All upgrades on all systems require a bit of retraining for new features or fernature that moves, but that is part and parcel of computing.  Windows ten is market tested, reliable and functional at this point.  Staying with windows seven just because is fine for now if that's your personal choice, but if you're supporting or recommending on a pro or semipro basis, the recommendation has to be to upgrade at this point unless circomstances dictate otherwise.

Best,

Erik

Sent with AquaMail for Android
http://www.aqua-mail.com

On March 8, 2017 8:39:42 AM "Gene" <gsasner@...> wrote:

You have made a statement and not given any reasons supporting it.  That doesn't tell us anything except that you believe something.  People may have reasons to upgrade from Windows 7 and Microsoft has recently claimed that for security reasons, you should upgrade because Windows 7 is not secure enough anymore because it isn't a new enough operating system to incorporate newer security features.  I haven't seen any independent discussion concerning this.  But there are always problems that may occur when updating and in this case, the point was stated that this is an old computer.  You don't just upgrade.  While many upgrades from Windows 7 go well, you can't assume they will.  I don't think it’s a good idea to urge upgrading as a general practice.  Why is an upgrade being considered?  What features, if any, will be used or are desired by upgrading?  Has the computer been tested for compatibility of the upgrade?
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Wednesday, March 08, 2017 7:21 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Can I still get it for free

that is an extremely bad suggesstion. If you don't have a very good reason to not update, it is generally a good idea to update.


On 3/8/2017 4:04 PM, Gene wrote:
Is there a specific reason you want to use Windows 10?  You can upgrade for free but I don't know the procedure.  others, I expect, will advise you.  You say it's an old laptop.  There is a Microsoft site you can use to have your computer evaluated to see if it is able to be upgraded.  But unless there is a specific feature you want, I would advise leaving well enough alone. 
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
From: Sakina
Sent: Wednesday, March 08, 2017 6:53 AM
Subject: [nvda] Can I still get it for free

Hello gene and Friends,

 

I have got this passed down old laptop from a friend that has got window 7

Please forgive me for my terminology below

I wish to update or is called upgrade to window 10

Is it possible and can I still get the window 10 for free?

If yes, than please how do I go about.

I will be and always am grateful for your help and guidance.

Thanking you all again.

With best wishes

Sakina


Virus-free. www.avast.com


 

On Wed, Mar 8, 2017 at 07:04 am, erik burggraaf wrote:
Staying with windows seven just because is fine for now if that's your personal choice, but if you're supporting or recommending on a pro or semipro basis, the recommendation has to be to upgrade at this point unless circumstances dictate otherwise.

I'd go even further and say that if you are a user who plans on staying in the Windows ecosystem for the foreseeable future you should upgrade.

Operating systems have finite support lives and there are those who will cling to a give OS long past its end of support, but this is never a good idea in the long run.

Change is absolutely inevitable when it comes to computing hardware, OSes, and software.  While there are legitimate reasons (including financial) not to upgrade things some are more important to keep current than others, and an OS is at the very top of that list.  When the upgrade is free and it's known that the software you're using works on that OS upgrade the case is even stronger (though if some doesn't, that's a factor, too).

I have repeatedly said, because I have found it to be true again and again, that there is also an advantage of being a part of a large cohort that's "going through the same growing pains at the same time" because lots of the same esoteric questions get asked and the answers are more easily forthcoming.  That's not so true when you decide to upgrade 5 years later and a lot of that esoterica gets lost in the mists of time for the vast majority of other users.   I'm already experiencing that "lost in the mists" effect on aspects of Windows 10 that I could quote "chapter and verse" when I was dealing with certain issues early in its life after initial release but that no one's asked about for a long time now.
--
Brian

    I don't find an uninformed hatred a "principled position" that I need to respect in any way.

        ~ Ellen Evans, soc.motss, 11/6/2004



Jacques <lists4js@...>
 

Erik, you make valid points, none of which I have any problem with. Keep in mind though that the person who originally posted this question said that its an old laptop, which should be considered when deciding on a final verdict. One of my older machines here is a laptop dating back to 2009. Although quite a nice machine, it slowed down to a crawl after updating it to Win10, despite my best efforts to find the most appropriate drivers. I guess it was one of those boarder line situations, where the MS hardware validator gave it the green light, but for a power user it turned out to be shere frustration trying to use the machine after the upgrade. So yes, if the hardware leans itself towards 10, go for it, if it doesnt, stick to 7 for now and start saving for a new system, as to take advantage of the benefits of Windows 10.

 

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of erik burggraaf
Sent: Wednesday, 08 March 2017 17:04
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Can I still get it for free

 

Gene,  Here is my reasonable take on this based on my more than 15 years of in depth experience not only of windows, but also other major operating systems.

First, windows is a terrible product in any itteration.  There isn't a single thing windows does better than other operating systems except for arketecture support.  It's the most expensive operating system to implement if you remove hardware from the equation.  Windows supports cheeper hardware than the competition but that doesn't negate the fact that windows itself is the highest priced operating system on the market.  Windows is also more expensive to maintain.  In fact, an upgrade from windows seven to windows 10 takes about two hours time.  If you have to fully patch windows seven sp1 it takes between 3 and 6 hours depending on connection speed.  If you're paying by the hour, which would you choose?

Windows is the least secure of all the major OS, further compounding the astronomical maintanence cost and driving down productivity.  I have not yet had to hack windows 10, but I have windows seven.  In windows seven it is common place for programs to allow themselves transparently through built in firewalling.  It is also common place for programs to run as administrator without requiring the administrator account to be enabled or requiring an administrator password.  It is possible for programs to sircomvent the notification system that works on the front line, and it's even possible and considered advisable by many people to turn the security notifications off altogether.  In fact, it is possible when sitting at the keyboard of a windows seven workstation to gain administrator access without logging in at all, to add, remove, or rename windows system files, to take command line control of a workstation, and to perform any command line function including enabling or disabling the administrator account and changing account credentials, all without logging in.  Litterally any improvement would be better than the attrocity that is windows seven security.

Microsoft interface design is terrible.  Ribbons and tiles are only two examples of design choices meant to set windows apart from competetors but had the effect of alienating users.  Windows 10 does the smart thing and returns the windows interface to a more desktop feel. 

Windows only gets a refresh every three years or so.  That means a lot happens in the computer world between releases.  Because the releases are alternately pretty decent over all come terrible to the point of uselessness, windows appeals to pundets who don't like change and want to hault progress.  Fine, but windows seven is coming up on 8 years old and we are still talking about support for windows xp being discontinued.  Nowhere else in the world of operating systems are we talking about support for 8 year old software, and 17 year old software isn't even available for download on pirate sites.  Computers that shipped with windows 7 at the time of the release of windows 8 are now end of lifed, and yet, I was still able to buy and install a windows seven a month ago.  The cost to developers of supporting four operating systems spanning 11 years: ten, eight, seven and vista, is astronomical, and you lucky end-user, get to pay the bill.  The cost of windows software over all is significantly higher than on any other operating system, and part of the reason is that windows users live in the past more than any other userbase.

Windows ten continues to be a free upgrade for current users of seven and eight, long after it was supposed to switch to a completely paid product.  The minimum and recommended hardware configurations are similar to those of windows seven.  Upgrading usually brings better plug and play hardware support and other items under the hood that users would miss if they were gone.

There are features I like in windows ten such as it's minimalist email app and it's improved tts voices.  Then there are things I'm not too pleased with such as the loss of control over windows update and the increased relience on ribbons.  True, we don't really have enough information about this particular case to make a recommendation one way or the other, but in general, it is more than time to leave windows seven behind unlesss you have some substantial reason not to, such as loss of support for a crutial piece of hardware.

All upgrades on all systems require a bit of retraining for new features or fernature that moves, but that is part and parcel of computing.  Windows ten is market tested, reliable and functional at this point.  Staying with windows seven just because is fine for now if that's your personal choice, but if you're supporting or recommending on a pro or semipro basis, the recommendation has to be to upgrade at this point unless circomstances dictate otherwise.

Best,

Erik

Sent with AquaMail for Android
http://www.aqua-mail.com

On March 8, 2017 8:39:42 AM "Gene" <gsasner@...> wrote:

You have made a statement and not given any reasons supporting it.  That doesn't tell us anything except that you believe something.  People may have reasons to upgrade from Windows 7 and Microsoft has recently claimed that for security reasons, you should upgrade because Windows 7 is not secure enough anymore because it isn't a new enough operating system to incorporate newer security features.  I haven't seen any independent discussion concerning this.  But there are always problems that may occur when updating and in this case, the point was stated that this is an old computer.  You don't just upgrade.  While many upgrades from Windows 7 go well, you can't assume they will.  I don't think it’s a good idea to urge upgrading as a general practice.  Why is an upgrade being considered?  What features, if any, will be used or are desired by upgrading?  Has the computer been tested for compatibility of the upgrade?

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

Sent: Wednesday, March 08, 2017 7:21 AM

Subject: Re: [nvda] Can I still get it for free

 

that is an extremely bad suggesstion. If you don't have a very good reason to not update, it is generally a good idea to update.

 

On 3/8/2017 4:04 PM, Gene wrote:

Is there a specific reason you want to use Windows 10?  You can upgrade for free but I don't know the procedure.  others, I expect, will advise you.  You say it's an old laptop.  There is a Microsoft site you can use to have your computer evaluated to see if it is able to be upgraded.  But unless there is a specific feature you want, I would advise leaving well enough alone. 

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

From: Sakina

Sent: Wednesday, March 08, 2017 6:53 AM

Subject: [nvda] Can I still get it for free

 

Hello gene and Friends,

 

I have got this passed down old laptop from a friend that has got window 7

Please forgive me for my terminology below

I wish to update or is called upgrade to window 10

Is it possible and can I still get the window 10 for free?

If yes, than please how do I go about.

I will be and always am grateful for your help and guidance.

Thanking you all again.

With best wishes

Sakina

 

Virus-free. www.avast.com

 


David F.
 

This is why I wish I had the brains to learn Linux

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of erik burggraaf
Sent: Wednesday, March 08, 2017 9:04 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Can I still get it for free

 

Gene,  Here is my reasonable take on this based on my more than 15 years of in depth experience not only of windows, but also other major operating systems.

First, windows is a terrible product in any itteration.  There isn't a single thing windows does better than other operating systems except for arketecture support.  It's the most expensive operating system to implement if you remove hardware from the equation.  Windows supports cheeper hardware than the competition but that doesn't negate the fact that windows itself is the highest priced operating system on the market.  Windows is also more expensive to maintain.  In fact, an upgrade from windows seven to windows 10 takes about two hours time.  If you have to fully patch windows seven sp1 it takes between 3 and 6 hours depending on connection speed.  If you're paying by the hour, which would you choose?

Windows is the least secure of all the major OS, further compounding the astronomical maintanence cost and driving down productivity.  I have not yet had to hack windows 10, but I have windows seven.  In windows seven it is common place for programs to allow themselves transparently through built in firewalling.  It is also common place for programs to run as administrator without requiring the administrator account to be enabled or requiring an administrator password.  It is possible for programs to sircomvent the notification system that works on the front line, and it's even possible and considered advisable by many people to turn the security notifications off altogether.  In fact, it is possible when sitting at the keyboard of a windows seven workstation to gain administrator access without logging in at all, to add, remove, or rename windows system files, to take command line control of a workstation, and to perform any command line function including enabling or disabling the administrator account and changing account credentials, all without logging in.  Litterally any improvement would be better than the attrocity that is windows seven security.

Microsoft interface design is terrible.  Ribbons and tiles are only two examples of design choices meant to set windows apart from competetors but had the effect of alienating users.  Windows 10 does the smart thing and returns the windows interface to a more desktop feel. 

Windows only gets a refresh every three years or so.  That means a lot happens in the computer world between releases.  Because the releases are alternately pretty decent over all come terrible to the point of uselessness, windows appeals to pundets who don't like change and want to hault progress.  Fine, but windows seven is coming up on 8 years old and we are still talking about support for windows xp being discontinued.  Nowhere else in the world of operating systems are we talking about support for 8 year old software, and 17 year old software isn't even available for download on pirate sites.  Computers that shipped with windows 7 at the time of the release of windows 8 are now end of lifed, and yet, I was still able to buy and install a windows seven a month ago.  The cost to developers of supporting four operating systems spanning 11 years: ten, eight, seven and vista, is astronomical, and you lucky end-user, get to pay the bill.  The cost of windows software over all is significantly higher than on any other operating system, and part of the reason is that windows users live in the past more than any other userbase.

Windows ten continues to be a free upgrade for current users of seven and eight, long after it was supposed to switch to a completely paid product.  The minimum and recommended hardware configurations are similar to those of windows seven.  Upgrading usually brings better plug and play hardware support and other items under the hood that users would miss if they were gone.

There are features I like in windows ten such as it's minimalist email app and it's improved tts voices.  Then there are things I'm not too pleased with such as the loss of control over windows update and the increased relience on ribbons.  True, we don't really have enough information about this particular case to make a recommendation one way or the other, but in general, it is more than time to leave windows seven behind unlesss you have some substantial reason not to, such as loss of support for a crutial piece of hardware.

All upgrades on all systems require a bit of retraining for new features or fernature that moves, but that is part and parcel of computing.  Windows ten is market tested, reliable and functional at this point.  Staying with windows seven just because is fine for now if that's your personal choice, but if you're supporting or recommending on a pro or semipro basis, the recommendation has to be to upgrade at this point unless circomstances dictate otherwise.

Best,

Erik

Sent with AquaMail for Android
http://www.aqua-mail.com

On March 8, 2017 8:39:42 AM "Gene" <gsasner@...> wrote:

You have made a statement and not given any reasons supporting it.  That doesn't tell us anything except that you believe something.  People may have reasons to upgrade from Windows 7 and Microsoft has recently claimed that for security reasons, you should upgrade because Windows 7 is not secure enough anymore because it isn't a new enough operating system to incorporate newer security features.  I haven't seen any independent discussion concerning this.  But there are always problems that may occur when updating and in this case, the point was stated that this is an old computer.  You don't just upgrade.  While many upgrades from Windows 7 go well, you can't assume they will.  I don't think it’s a good idea to urge upgrading as a general practice.  Why is an upgrade being considered?  What features, if any, will be used or are desired by upgrading?  Has the computer been tested for compatibility of the upgrade?

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

Sent: Wednesday, March 08, 2017 7:21 AM

Subject: Re: [nvda] Can I still get it for free

 

that is an extremely bad suggesstion. If you don't have a very good reason to not update, it is generally a good idea to update.

 

On 3/8/2017 4:04 PM, Gene wrote:

Is there a specific reason you want to use Windows 10?  You can upgrade for free but I don't know the procedure.  others, I expect, will advise you.  You say it's an old laptop.  There is a Microsoft site you can use to have your computer evaluated to see if it is able to be upgraded.  But unless there is a specific feature you want, I would advise leaving well enough alone. 

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

From: Sakina

Sent: Wednesday, March 08, 2017 6:53 AM

Subject: [nvda] Can I still get it for free

 

Hello gene and Friends,

 

I have got this passed down old laptop from a friend that has got window 7

Please forgive me for my terminology below

I wish to update or is called upgrade to window 10

Is it possible and can I still get the window 10 for free?

If yes, than please how do I go about.

I will be and always am grateful for your help and guidance.

Thanking you all again.

With best wishes

Sakina

 

Virus-free. www.avast.com

 


Mallard
 

Ok guys,


I ahve my own personal views on Operating Systems, but they're not requested here.

What was asked for, is the possibility to still upgrade for free.


Therefore, here's a quotation from an older message:


Quote


The link to the Windows 10 accessibility upgrade process is below - you may have to paste it into your browser.
The page which the link opens has an "Upgrade now" button near the bottom.

https://www.microsoft.com/en-gb/accessibility/windows10upgrade


End of quote


By clicking on this link, you should be able to upgrade for free, as an assistive technologies user.


hth,

Ciao,

Ollie

Il 08/03/2017 16:40, Brian Vogel ha scritto:
On Wed, Mar 8, 2017 at 07:04 am, erik burggraaf wrote:

Staying with windows seven just because is fine for now if that's
your personal choice, but if you're supporting or recommending on
a pro or semipro basis, the recommendation has to be to upgrade at
this point unless circumstances dictate otherwise.

I'd go even further and say that if you are a user who plans on staying in the Windows ecosystem for the foreseeable future you should upgrade.

Operating systems have finite support lives and there are those who will cling to a give OS long past its end of support, but this is never a good idea in the long run.

Change is absolutely inevitable when it comes to computing hardware, OSes, and software. While there are legitimate reasons (including financial) not to upgrade things some are more important to keep current than others, and an OS is at the very top of that list. When the upgrade is free and it's known that the software you're using works on that OS upgrade the case is even stronger (though if some doesn't, that's a factor, too).

I have repeatedly said, because I have found it to be true again and again, that there is also an advantage of being a part of a large cohort that's "going through the same growing pains at the same time" because lots of the same esoteric questions get asked and the answers are more easily forthcoming. That's not so true when you decide to upgrade 5 years later and a lot of that esoterica gets lost in the mists of time for the vast majority of other users. I'm already experiencing that "lost in the mists" effect on aspects of Windows 10 that I could quote "chapter and verse" when I was dealing with certain issues early in its life after initial release but that no one's asked about for a long time now.
--
*/Brian/*

/I don't find an uninformed hatred a "principled position" //that I need to respect in any way./

~ */Ellen Evans/*/, /soc.motss/, /11/6/2004



Gene
 

From what I've heard, accessibility isn't as good in Linux. I'm not saying Linux is less accessible.  But I've heard from more than one person on one or two lists that Linux screen-readers aren't as good.  I'd want to see more opinions on how horrible an operating system Windows is.  I remain skeptical. 
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
From: David F.
Sent: Wednesday, March 08, 2017 9:51 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Can I still get it for free

This is why I wish I had the brains to learn Linux

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of erik burggraaf
Sent: Wednesday, March 08, 2017 9:04 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Can I still get it for free

 

Gene,  Here is my reasonable take on this based on my more than 15 years of in depth experience not only of windows, but also other major operating systems.

First, windows is a terrible product in any itteration.  There isn't a single thing windows does better than other operating systems except for arketecture support.  It's the most expensive operating system to implement if you remove hardware from the equation.  Windows supports cheeper hardware than the competition but that doesn't negate the fact that windows itself is the highest priced operating system on the market.  Windows is also more expensive to maintain.  In fact, an upgrade from windows seven to windows 10 takes about two hours time.  If you have to fully patch windows seven sp1 it takes between 3 and 6 hours depending on connection speed.  If you're paying by the hour, which would you choose?

Windows is the least secure of all the major OS, further compounding the astronomical maintanence cost and driving down productivity.  I have not yet had to hack windows 10, but I have windows seven.  In windows seven it is common place for programs to allow themselves transparently through built in firewalling.  It is also common place for programs to run as administrator without requiring the administrator account to be enabled or requiring an administrator password.  It is possible for programs to sircomvent the notification system that works on the front line, and it's even possible and considered advisable by many people to turn the security notifications off altogether.  In fact, it is possible when sitting at the keyboard of a windows seven workstation to gain administrator access without logging in at all, to add, remove, or rename windows system files, to take command line control of a workstation, and to perform any command line function including enabling or disabling the administrator account and changing account credentials, all without logging in.  Litterally any improvement would be better than the attrocity that is windows seven security.

Microsoft interface design is terrible.  Ribbons and tiles are only two examples of design choices meant to set windows apart from competetors but had the effect of alienating users.  Windows 10 does the smart thing and returns the windows interface to a more desktop feel. 

Windows only gets a refresh every three years or so.  That means a lot happens in the computer world between releases.  Because the releases are alternately pretty decent over all come terrible to the point of uselessness, windows appeals to pundets who don't like change and want to hault progress.  Fine, but windows seven is coming up on 8 years old and we are still talking about support for windows xp being discontinued.  Nowhere else in the world of operating systems are we talking about support for 8 year old software, and 17 year old software isn't even available for download on pirate sites.  Computers that shipped with windows 7 at the time of the release of windows 8 are now end of lifed, and yet, I was still able to buy and install a windows seven a month ago.  The cost to developers of supporting four operating systems spanning 11 years: ten, eight, seven and vista, is astronomical, and you lucky end-user, get to pay the bill.  The cost of windows software over all is significantly higher than on any other operating system, and part of the reason is that windows users live in the past more than any other userbase.

Windows ten continues to be a free upgrade for current users of seven and eight, long after it was supposed to switch to a completely paid product.  The minimum and recommended hardware configurations are similar to those of windows seven.  Upgrading usually brings better plug and play hardware support and other items under the hood that users would miss if they were gone.

There are features I like in windows ten such as it's minimalist email app and it's improved tts voices.  Then there are things I'm not too pleased with such as the loss of control over windows update and the increased relience on ribbons.  True, we don't really have enough information about this particular case to make a recommendation one way or the other, but in general, it is more than time to leave windows seven behind unlesss you have some substantial reason not to, such as loss of support for a crutial piece of hardware.

All upgrades on all systems require a bit of retraining for new features or fernature that moves, but that is part and parcel of computing.  Windows ten is market tested, reliable and functional at this point.  Staying with windows seven just because is fine for now if that's your personal choice, but if you're supporting or recommending on a pro or semipro basis, the recommendation has to be to upgrade at this point unless circomstances dictate otherwise.

Best,

Erik

Sent with AquaMail for Android
http://www.aqua-mail.com

On March 8, 2017 8:39:42 AM "Gene" <gsasner@...> wrote:

You have made a statement and not given any reasons supporting it.  That doesn't tell us anything except that you believe something.  People may have reasons to upgrade from Windows 7 and Microsoft has recently claimed that for security reasons, you should upgrade because Windows 7 is not secure enough anymore because it isn't a new enough operating system to incorporate newer security features.  I haven't seen any independent discussion concerning this.  But there are always problems that may occur when updating and in this case, the point was stated that this is an old computer.  You don't just upgrade.  While many upgrades from Windows 7 go well, you can't assume they will.  I don't think it’s a good idea to urge upgrading as a general practice.  Why is an upgrade being considered?  What features, if any, will be used or are desired by upgrading?  Has the computer been tested for compatibility of the upgrade?

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

Sent: Wednesday, March 08, 2017 7:21 AM

Subject: Re: [nvda] Can I still get it for free

 

that is an extremely bad suggesstion. If you don't have a very good reason to not update, it is generally a good idea to update.

 

On 3/8/2017 4:04 PM, Gene wrote:

Is there a specific reason you want to use Windows 10?  You can upgrade for free but I don't know the procedure.  others, I expect, will advise you.  You say it's an old laptop.  There is a Microsoft site you can use to have your computer evaluated to see if it is able to be upgraded.  But unless there is a specific feature you want, I would advise leaving well enough alone. 

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

From: Sakina

Sent: Wednesday, March 08, 2017 6:53 AM

Subject: [nvda] Can I still get it for free

 

Hello gene and Friends,

 

I have got this passed down old laptop from a friend that has got window 7

Please forgive me for my terminology below

I wish to update or is called upgrade to window 10

Is it possible and can I still get the window 10 for free?

If yes, than please how do I go about.

I will be and always am grateful for your help and guidance.

Thanking you all again.

With best wishes

Sakina

 

Virus-free. www.avast.com

 


Nimer Jaber
 

Hello,

This is a gentle suggestion that this thread be dropped or, at least, be taken off-list as it was not originally related to NVDA, and certainly the suggestions on both sides about the advisability or inadvisability of upgrading is not related to NVDA. If it continues, I will consider dawning my Admin hat.

Thanks.

On Wed, Mar 8, 2017 at 10:01 AM Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:
From what I've heard, accessibility isn't as good in Linux. I'm not saying Linux is less accessible.  But I've heard from more than one person on one or two lists that Linux screen-readers aren't as good.  I'd want to see more opinions on how horrible an operating system Windows is.  I remain skeptical. 
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
From: David F.
Sent: Wednesday, March 08, 2017 9:51 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Can I still get it for free

This is why I wish I had the brains to learn Linux

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of erik burggraaf
Sent: Wednesday, March 08, 2017 9:04 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Can I still get it for free

 

Gene,  Here is my reasonable take on this based on my more than 15 years of in depth experience not only of windows, but also other major operating systems.

First, windows is a terrible product in any itteration.  There isn't a single thing windows does better than other operating systems except for arketecture support.  It's the most expensive operating system to implement if you remove hardware from the equation.  Windows supports cheeper hardware than the competition but that doesn't negate the fact that windows itself is the highest priced operating system on the market.  Windows is also more expensive to maintain.  In fact, an upgrade from windows seven to windows 10 takes about two hours time.  If you have to fully patch windows seven sp1 it takes between 3 and 6 hours depending on connection speed.  If you're paying by the hour, which would you choose?

Windows is the least secure of all the major OS, further compounding the astronomical maintanence cost and driving down productivity.  I have not yet had to hack windows 10, but I have windows seven.  In windows seven it is common place for programs to allow themselves transparently through built in firewalling.  It is also common place for programs to run as administrator without requiring the administrator account to be enabled or requiring an administrator password.  It is possible for programs to sircomvent the notification system that works on the front line, and it's even possible and considered advisable by many people to turn the security notifications off altogether.  In fact, it is possible when sitting at the keyboard of a windows seven workstation to gain administrator access without logging in at all, to add, remove, or rename windows system files, to take command line control of a workstation, and to perform any command line function including enabling or disabling the administrator account and changing account credentials, all without logging in.  Litterally any improvement would be better than the attrocity that is windows seven security.

Microsoft interface design is terrible.  Ribbons and tiles are only two examples of design choices meant to set windows apart from competetors but had the effect of alienating users.  Windows 10 does the smart thing and returns the windows interface to a more desktop feel. 

Windows only gets a refresh every three years or so.  That means a lot happens in the computer world between releases.  Because the releases are alternately pretty decent over all come terrible to the point of uselessness, windows appeals to pundets who don't like change and want to hault progress.  Fine, but windows seven is coming up on 8 years old and we are still talking about support for windows xp being discontinued.  Nowhere else in the world of operating systems are we talking about support for 8 year old software, and 17 year old software isn't even available for download on pirate sites.  Computers that shipped with windows 7 at the time of the release of windows 8 are now end of lifed, and yet, I was still able to buy and install a windows seven a month ago.  The cost to developers of supporting four operating systems spanning 11 years: ten, eight, seven and vista, is astronomical, and you lucky end-user, get to pay the bill.  The cost of windows software over all is significantly higher than on any other operating system, and part of the reason is that windows users live in the past more than any other userbase.

Windows ten continues to be a free upgrade for current users of seven and eight, long after it was supposed to switch to a completely paid product.  The minimum and recommended hardware configurations are similar to those of windows seven.  Upgrading usually brings better plug and play hardware support and other items under the hood that users would miss if they were gone.

There are features I like in windows ten such as it's minimalist email app and it's improved tts voices.  Then there are things I'm not too pleased with such as the loss of control over windows update and the increased relience on ribbons.  True, we don't really have enough information about this particular case to make a recommendation one way or the other, but in general, it is more than time to leave windows seven behind unlesss you have some substantial reason not to, such as loss of support for a crutial piece of hardware.

All upgrades on all systems require a bit of retraining for new features or fernature that moves, but that is part and parcel of computing.  Windows ten is market tested, reliable and functional at this point.  Staying with windows seven just because is fine for now if that's your personal choice, but if you're supporting or recommending on a pro or semipro basis, the recommendation has to be to upgrade at this point unless circomstances dictate otherwise.

Best,

Erik

Sent with AquaMail for Android
http://www.aqua-mail.com

On March 8, 2017 8:39:42 AM "Gene" <gsasner@...> wrote:

You have made a statement and not given any reasons supporting it.  That doesn't tell us anything except that you believe something.  People may have reasons to upgrade from Windows 7 and Microsoft has recently claimed that for security reasons, you should upgrade because Windows 7 is not secure enough anymore because it isn't a new enough operating system to incorporate newer security features.  I haven't seen any independent discussion concerning this.  But there are always problems that may occur when updating and in this case, the point was stated that this is an old computer.  You don't just upgrade.  While many upgrades from Windows 7 go well, you can't assume they will.  I don't think it’s a good idea to urge upgrading as a general practice.  Why is an upgrade being considered?  What features, if any, will be used or are desired by upgrading?  Has the computer been tested for compatibility of the upgrade?

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

Sent: Wednesday, March 08, 2017 7:21 AM

Subject: Re: [nvda] Can I still get it for free

 

that is an extremely bad suggesstion. If you don't have a very good reason to not update, it is generally a good idea to update.

 

On 3/8/2017 4:04 PM, Gene wrote:

Is there a specific reason you want to use Windows 10?  You can upgrade for free but I don't know the procedure.  others, I expect, will advise you.  You say it's an old laptop.  There is a Microsoft site you can use to have your computer evaluated to see if it is able to be upgraded.  But unless there is a specific feature you want, I would advise leaving well enough alone. 

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

From: Sakina

Sent: Wednesday, March 08, 2017 6:53 AM

Subject: [nvda] Can I still get it for free

 

Hello gene and Friends,

 

I have got this passed down old laptop from a friend that has got window 7

Please forgive me for my terminology below

I wish to update or is called upgrade to window 10

Is it possible and can I still get the window 10 for free?

If yes, than please how do I go about.

I will be and always am grateful for your help and guidance.

Thanking you all again.

With best wishes

Sakina

 

Image removed by sender.

Virus-free. www.avast.com

 

--
Cordially,

Nimer Jaber

Please take the time to read this signature completely as it contains
some information about the email you have just read and all
attachments contained within as well as some valuable resources and
methods for contacting me if you have any questions or wish to talk.

The message above is intended for the recipient to whom it was
addressed. If you believe that you are not the intended recipient,
please notify me via reply email and destroy all copies of this
correspondence. Action taken as a result of this email or its contents
by anyone other than the intended recipient(s) may result in civil or
criminal charges. I have checked this email and all corresponding
attachments for security threats. However, security of your machine is
up to you. Thanks.

Registered Linux User 529141.
http://counter.li.org/

To find out about a free and versatile screen reader for windows XP
and above, please click here:
http://www.nvda-project.org

You can follow @nimerjaber on Twitter for the latest technology news.

To contact me, you can reply to this email or you may call me at (218-693-9271) and I will do my best to respond to you promptly. Thank
you, and have a great day!


Brian's Mail list account <bglists@...>
 

I'd be very careful, Sakina. Laptops have often got specific drivers for their unusual hardware, and these may not be in windows 10. Personally, I'd leave well alone unless there is some specific reason you want to try it.
Also of course. I think even the special VI offer has ended now, at least nobody has mentioned it recently to me.

If you know the model of the machine, talk to the makers and see if they will support it with drivers in Windows 10 before you change anything.
Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk, putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Sakina" <sakina.gable@gmail.com>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Wednesday, March 08, 2017 12:53 PM
Subject: [nvda] Can I still get it for free


Hello gene and Friends,



I have got this passed down old laptop from a friend that has got window 7

Please forgive me for my terminology below

I wish to update or is called upgrade to window 10

Is it possible and can I still get the window 10 for free?

If yes, than please how do I go about.

I will be and always am grateful for your help and guidance.

Thanking you all again.

With best wishes

Sakina




Angelo Sonnesso
 

You can certainly run Linux with a Windows like interface.

There are some differences, but they are not bad.

You do have the command line is you want to get geeky, but you don’t have to these days.

I personally like Vinux, designed for the Blind.

I must confess I am usually running Debian, or Ubuntu Linux.

Maybe you can give it a try in a virtual computer, and see what you think.

I ran a CP/m machine for years, and you talk about a learning curve, but you make do with what is available.

Having said all of that, once you get Windows 10 setup it is much more secure than ever.

It does get the job done.

 

73 N2DYN Angelo

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of David F.
Sent: Wednesday, March 08, 2017 10:52 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Can I still get it for free

 

This is why I wish I had the brains to learn Linux

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of erik burggraaf
Sent: Wednesday, March 08, 2017 9:04 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Can I still get it for free

 

Gene,  Here is my reasonable take on this based on my more than 15 years of in depth experience not only of windows, but also other major operating systems.

First, windows is a terrible product in any itteration.  There isn't a single thing windows does better than other operating systems except for arketecture support.  It's the most expensive operating system to implement if you remove hardware from the equation.  Windows supports cheeper hardware than the competition but that doesn't negate the fact that windows itself is the highest priced operating system on the market.  Windows is also more expensive to maintain.  In fact, an upgrade from windows seven to windows 10 takes about two hours time.  If you have to fully patch windows seven sp1 it takes between 3 and 6 hours depending on connection speed.  If you're paying by the hour, which would you choose?

Windows is the least secure of all the major OS, further compounding the astronomical maintanence cost and driving down productivity.  I have not yet had to hack windows 10, but I have windows seven.  In windows seven it is common place for programs to allow themselves transparently through built in firewalling.  It is also common place for programs to run as administrator without requiring the administrator account to be enabled or requiring an administrator password.  It is possible for programs to sircomvent the notification system that works on the front line, and it's even possible and considered advisable by many people to turn the security notifications off altogether.  In fact, it is possible when sitting at the keyboard of a windows seven workstation to gain administrator access without logging in at all, to add, remove, or rename windows system files, to take command line control of a workstation, and to perform any command line function including enabling or disabling the administrator account and changing account credentials, all without logging in.  Litterally any improvement would be better than the attrocity that is windows seven security.

Microsoft interface design is terrible.  Ribbons and tiles are only two examples of design choices meant to set windows apart from competetors but had the effect of alienating users.  Windows 10 does the smart thing and returns the windows interface to a more desktop feel. 

Windows only gets a refresh every three years or so.  That means a lot happens in the computer world between releases.  Because the releases are alternately pretty decent over all come terrible to the point of uselessness, windows appeals to pundets who don't like change and want to hault progress.  Fine, but windows seven is coming up on 8 years old and we are still talking about support for windows xp being discontinued.  Nowhere else in the world of operating systems are we talking about support for 8 year old software, and 17 year old software isn't even available for download on pirate sites.  Computers that shipped with windows 7 at the time of the release of windows 8 are now end of lifed, and yet, I was still able to buy and install a windows seven a month ago.  The cost to developers of supporting four operating systems spanning 11 years: ten, eight, seven and vista, is astronomical, and you lucky end-user, get to pay the bill.  The cost of windows software over all is significantly higher than on any other operating system, and part of the reason is that windows users live in the past more than any other userbase.

Windows ten continues to be a free upgrade for current users of seven and eight, long after it was supposed to switch to a completely paid product.  The minimum and recommended hardware configurations are similar to those of windows seven.  Upgrading usually brings better plug and play hardware support and other items under the hood that users would miss if they were gone.

There are features I like in windows ten such as it's minimalist email app and it's improved tts voices.  Then there are things I'm not too pleased with such as the loss of control over windows update and the increased relience on ribbons.  True, we don't really have enough information about this particular case to make a recommendation one way or the other, but in general, it is more than time to leave windows seven behind unlesss you have some substantial reason not to, such as loss of support for a crutial piece of hardware.

All upgrades on all systems require a bit of retraining for new features or fernature that moves, but that is part and parcel of computing.  Windows ten is market tested, reliable and functional at this point.  Staying with windows seven just because is fine for now if that's your personal choice, but if you're supporting or recommending on a pro or semipro basis, the recommendation has to be to upgrade at this point unless circomstances dictate otherwise.

Best,

Erik

Sent with AquaMail for Android
http://www.aqua-mail.com

On March 8, 2017 8:39:42 AM "Gene" <gsasner@...> wrote:

You have made a statement and not given any reasons supporting it.  That doesn't tell us anything except that you believe something.  People may have reasons to upgrade from Windows 7 and Microsoft has recently claimed that for security reasons, you should upgrade because Windows 7 is not secure enough anymore because it isn't a new enough operating system to incorporate newer security features.  I haven't seen any independent discussion concerning this.  But there are always problems that may occur when updating and in this case, the point was stated that this is an old computer.  You don't just upgrade.  While many upgrades from Windows 7 go well, you can't assume they will.  I don't think it’s a good idea to urge upgrading as a general practice.  Why is an upgrade being considered?  What features, if any, will be used or are desired by upgrading?  Has the computer been tested for compatibility of the upgrade?

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

Sent: Wednesday, March 08, 2017 7:21 AM

Subject: Re: [nvda] Can I still get it for free

 

that is an extremely bad suggesstion. If you don't have a very good reason to not update, it is generally a good idea to update.

 

On 3/8/2017 4:04 PM, Gene wrote:

Is there a specific reason you want to use Windows 10?  You can upgrade for free but I don't know the procedure.  others, I expect, will advise you.  You say it's an old laptop.  There is a Microsoft site you can use to have your computer evaluated to see if it is able to be upgraded.  But unless there is a specific feature you want, I would advise leaving well enough alone. 

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

From: Sakina

Sent: Wednesday, March 08, 2017 6:53 AM

Subject: [nvda] Can I still get it for free

 

Hello gene and Friends,

 

I have got this passed down old laptop from a friend that has got window 7

Please forgive me for my terminology below

I wish to update or is called upgrade to window 10

Is it possible and can I still get the window 10 for free?

If yes, than please how do I go about.

I will be and always am grateful for your help and guidance.

Thanking you all again.

With best wishes

Sakina

 

Virus-free. www.avast.com

 


Mallard
 

Gene,


Orca is very good, and getting better and better. The problem is that there are lots of distros in Linux. I could describe it as the same difference there is between IOS and Android, where IOS is one and the same, while android has a lot of different Os's, depending on the device manufacturers, plus custom roms...


But I'd say Linux is more than usable; many blind researchers and devs use it all the time, in universities and the like...


Ciao,

Ollie

Il 08/03/2017 17:01, Gene ha scritto:
From what I've heard, accessibility isn't as good in Linux. I'm not saying Linux is less accessible. But I've heard from more than one person on one or two lists that Linux screen-readers aren't as good.
I'd want to see more opinions on how horrible an operating system Windows is. I remain skeptical.
Gene
----- Original Message -----
*From:* David F. <mailto:scopist65@gmail.com>
*Sent:* Wednesday, March 08, 2017 9:51 AM
*To:* nvda@nvda.groups.io <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>
*Subject:* Re: [nvda] Can I still get it for free

This is why I wish I had the brains to learn Linux

*From:*nvda@nvda.groups.io <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io> [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] *On Behalf Of *erik burggraaf
*Sent:* Wednesday, March 08, 2017 9:04 AM
*To:* nvda@nvda.groups.io <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>
*Subject:* Re: [nvda] Can I still get it for free

Gene, Here is my reasonable take on this based on my more than 15 years of in depth experience not only of windows, but also other major operating systems.

First, windows is a terrible product in any itteration. There isn't a single thing windows does better than other operating systems except for arketecture support. It's the most expensive operating system to implement if you remove hardware from the equation. Windows supports cheeper hardware than the competition but that doesn't negate the fact that windows itself is the highest priced operating system on the market. Windows is also more expensive to maintain. In fact, an upgrade from windows seven to windows 10 takes about two hours time.
If you have to fully patch windows seven sp1 it takes between 3 and 6 hours depending on connection speed. If you're paying by the hour, which would you choose?

Windows is the least secure of all the major OS, further compounding the astronomical maintanence cost and driving down productivity. I have not yet had to hack windows 10, but I have windows seven. In windows seven it is common place for programs to allow themselves transparently through built in firewalling. It is also common place for programs to run as administrator without requiring the administrator account to be enabled or requiring an administrator password. It is possible for programs to sircomvent the notification system that works on the front line, and it's even possible and considered advisable by many people to turn the security notifications off altogether. In fact, it is possible when sitting at the keyboard of a windows seven workstation to gain administrator access without logging in at all, to add, remove, or rename windows system files, to take command line control of a workstation, and to perform any command line function including enabling or disabling the administrator account and changing account credentials, all without logging in.
Litterally any improvement would be better than the attrocity that is windows seven security.

Microsoft interface design is terrible. Ribbons and tiles are only two examples of design choices meant to set windows apart from competetors but had the effect of alienating users. Windows 10 does the smart thing and returns the windows interface to a more desktop feel.

Windows only gets a refresh every three years or so. That means a lot happens in the computer world between releases. Because the releases are alternately pretty decent over all come terrible to the point of uselessness, windows appeals to pundets who don't like change and want to hault progress. Fine, but windows seven is coming up on 8 years old and we are still talking about support for windows xp being discontinued. Nowhere else in the world of operating systems are we talking about support for 8 year old software, and 17 year old software isn't even available for download on pirate sites. Computers that shipped with windows 7 at the time of the release of windows 8 are now end of lifed, and yet, I was still able to buy and install a windows seven a month ago. The cost to developers of supporting four operating systems spanning 11 years: ten, eight, seven and vista, is astronomical, and you lucky end-user, get to pay the bill. The cost of windows software over all is significantly higher than on any other operating system, and part of the reason is that windows users live in the past more than any other userbase.

Windows ten continues to be a free upgrade for current users of seven and eight, long after it was supposed to switch to a completely paid product. The minimum and recommended hardware configurations are similar to those of windows seven. Upgrading usually brings better plug and play hardware support and other items under the hood that users would miss if they were gone.

There are features I like in windows ten such as it's minimalist email app and it's improved tts voices. Then there are things I'm not too pleased with such as the loss of control over windows update and the increased relience on ribbons. True, we don't really have enough information about this particular case to make a recommendation one way or the other, but in general, it is more than time to leave windows seven behind unlesss you have some substantial reason not to, such as loss of support for a crutial piece of hardware.

All upgrades on all systems require a bit of retraining for new features or fernature that moves, but that is part and parcel of computing. Windows ten is market tested, reliable and functional at this point. Staying with windows seven just because is fine for now if that's your personal choice, but if you're supporting or recommending on a pro or semipro basis, the recommendation has to be to upgrade at this point unless circomstances dictate otherwise.

Best,

Erik

Sent with AquaMail for Android
http://www.aqua-mail.com

On March 8, 2017 8:39:42 AM "Gene" <gsasner@ripco.com> wrote:

You have made a statement and not given any reasons supporting
it. That doesn't tell us anything except that you believe
something. People may have reasons to upgrade from Windows 7 and
Microsoft has recently claimed that for security reasons, you
should upgrade because Windows 7 is not secure enough anymore
because it isn't a new enough operating system to incorporate
newer security features. I haven't seen any independent
discussion concerning this. But there are always problems that
may occur when updating and in this case, the point was stated
that this is an old computer. You don't just upgrade. While many
upgrades from Windows 7 go well, you can't assume they will. I
don't think it’s a good idea to urge upgrading as a general
practice. Why is an upgrade being considered? What features, if
any, will be used or are desired by upgrading? Has the computer
been tested for compatibility of the upgrade?

Gene

----- Original Message -----

*From:*enes sarıbaş <mailto:enes.saribas@gmail.com>

*Sent:*Wednesday, March 08, 2017 7:21 AM

*To:*nvda@nvda.groups.io <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>

*Subject:*Re: [nvda] Can I still get it for free

that is an extremely bad suggesstion. If you don't have a very
good reason to not update, it is generally a good idea to update.

On 3/8/2017 4:04 PM, Gene wrote:

Is there a specific reason you want to use Windows 10? You
can upgrade for free but I don't know the procedure. others,
I expect, will advise you. You say it's an old laptop. There
is a Microsoft site you can use to have your computer
evaluated to see if it is able to be upgraded. But unless
there is a specific feature you want, I would advise leaving
well enough alone.

Gene

----- Original Message -----

*From:*Sakina <mailto:sakina.gable@gmail.com>

*Sent:*Wednesday, March 08, 2017 6:53 AM

*To:*nvda@nvda.groups.io <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>

*Subject:*[nvda] Can I still get it for free

Hello gene and Friends,

I have got this passed down old laptop from a friend that has
got window 7

Please forgive me for my terminology below

I wish to update or is called upgrade to window 10

Is it possible and can I still get the window 10 for free?

If yes, than please how do I go about.

I will be and always am grateful for your help and guidance.

Thanking you all again.

With best wishes

Sakina

Image removed by sender.
<https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient>



Virus-free. www.avast.com
<https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient>



erik burggraaf <erik@...>
 

A couple of things strike me about this.

First, a laptop from 2009 that has been under regular use should not perform well in 2016, even if it was a high end name brand system.  They just don't live as long as people.  Windows ten on what you are describing to me as a warn out system might rejuvinate the system, or it may have just the opposit effect as you discovered.

The other thing that strikes me is that operating system upgrades are a bit notorious.  I have upgraded several more modern systems to windows 10 and haven't seen any performance breaks, but remember the hassle of yure installing upgrades of 98 to ME, or 2000 to XP.  I've even experienced glitches upgrading my android devices that were serious showstopper issues which went away after a clean install.  It could be you were inadvertantly bitten by the upgrade bug.

Best,

Erik

Sent with AquaMail for Android
http://www.aqua-mail.com

On March 8, 2017 10:44:29 AM "Jacques" <lists4js@...> wrote:

Erik, you make valid points, none of which I have any problem with. Keep in mind though that the person who originally posted this question said that its an old laptop, which should be considered when deciding on a final verdict. One of my older machines here is a laptop dating back to 2009. Although quite a nice machine, it slowed down to a crawl after updating it to Win10, despite my best efforts to find the most appropriate drivers. I guess it was one of those boarder line situations, where the MS hardware validator gave it the green light, but for a power user it turned out to be shere frustration trying to use the machine after the upgrade. So yes, if the hardware leans itself towards 10, go for it, if it doesnt, stick to 7 for now and start saving for a new system, as to take advantage of the benefits of Windows 10.

 

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of erik burggraaf
Sent: Wednesday, 08 March 2017 17:04
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Can I still get it for free

 

Gene,  Here is my reasonable take on this based on my more than 15 years of in depth experience not only of windows, but also other major operating systems.

First, windows is a terrible product in any itteration.  There isn't a single thing windows does better than other operating systems except for arketecture support.  It's the most expensive operating system to implement if you remove hardware from the equation.  Windows supports cheeper hardware than the competition but that doesn't negate the fact that windows itself is the highest priced operating system on the market.  Windows is also more expensive to maintain.  In fact, an upgrade from windows seven to windows 10 takes about two hours time.  If you have to fully patch windows seven sp1 it takes between 3 and 6 hours depending on connection speed.  If you're paying by the hour, which would you choose?

Windows is the least secure of all the major OS, further compounding the astronomical maintanence cost and driving down productivity.  I have not yet had to hack windows 10, but I have windows seven.  In windows seven it is common place for programs to allow themselves transparently through built in firewalling.  It is also common place for programs to run as administrator without requiring the administrator account to be enabled or requiring an administrator password.  It is possible for programs to sircomvent the notification system that works on the front line, and it's even possible and considered advisable by many people to turn the security notifications off altogether.  In fact, it is possible when sitting at the keyboard of a windows seven workstation to gain administrator access without logging in at all, to add, remove, or rename windows system files, to take command line control of a workstation, and to perform any command line function including enabling or disabling the administrator account and changing account credentials, all without logging in.  Litterally any improvement would be better than the attrocity that is windows seven security.

Microsoft interface design is terrible.  Ribbons and tiles are only two examples of design choices meant to set windows apart from competetors but had the effect of alienating users.  Windows 10 does the smart thing and returns the windows interface to a more desktop feel. 

Windows only gets a refresh every three years or so.  That means a lot happens in the computer world between releases.  Because the releases are alternately pretty decent over all come terrible to the point of uselessness, windows appeals to pundets who don't like change and want to hault progress.  Fine, but windows seven is coming up on 8 years old and we are still talking about support for windows xp being discontinued.  Nowhere else in the world of operating systems are we talking about support for 8 year old software, and 17 year old software isn't even available for download on pirate sites.  Computers that shipped with windows 7 at the time of the release of windows 8 are now end of lifed, and yet, I was still able to buy and install a windows seven a month ago.  The cost to developers of supporting four operating systems spanning 11 years: ten, eight, seven and vista, is astronomical, and you lucky end-user, get to pay the bill.  The cost of windows software over all is significantly higher than on any other operating system, and part of the reason is that windows users live in the past more than any other userbase.

Windows ten continues to be a free upgrade for current users of seven and eight, long after it was supposed to switch to a completely paid product.  The minimum and recommended hardware configurations are similar to those of windows seven.  Upgrading usually brings better plug and play hardware support and other items under the hood that users would miss if they were gone.

There are features I like in windows ten such as it's minimalist email app and it's improved tts voices.  Then there are things I'm not too pleased with such as the loss of control over windows update and the increased relience on ribbons.  True, we don't really have enough information about this particular case to make a recommendation one way or the other, but in general, it is more than time to leave windows seven behind unlesss you have some substantial reason not to, such as loss of support for a crutial piece of hardware.

All upgrades on all systems require a bit of retraining for new features or fernature that moves, but that is part and parcel of computing.  Windows ten is market tested, reliable and functional at this point.  Staying with windows seven just because is fine for now if that's your personal choice, but if you're supporting or recommending on a pro or semipro basis, the recommendation has to be to upgrade at this point unless circomstances dictate otherwise.

Best,

Erik

Sent with AquaMail for Android
http://www.aqua-mail.com

On March 8, 2017 8:39:42 AM "Gene" <gsasner@...> wrote:

You have made a statement and not given any reasons supporting it.  That doesn't tell us anything except that you believe something.  People may have reasons to upgrade from Windows 7 and Microsoft has recently claimed that for security reasons, you should upgrade because Windows 7 is not secure enough anymore because it isn't a new enough operating system to incorporate newer security features.  I haven't seen any independent discussion concerning this.  But there are always problems that may occur when updating and in this case, the point was stated that this is an old computer.  You don't just upgrade.  While many upgrades from Windows 7 go well, you can't assume they will.  I don't think it’s a good idea to urge upgrading as a general practice.  Why is an upgrade being considered?  What features, if any, will be used or are desired by upgrading?  Has the computer been tested for compatibility of the upgrade?

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

Sent: Wednesday, March 08, 2017 7:21 AM

Subject: Re: [nvda] Can I still get it for free

 

that is an extremely bad suggesstion. If you don't have a very good reason to not update, it is generally a good idea to update.

 

On 3/8/2017 4:04 PM, Gene wrote:

Is there a specific reason you want to use Windows 10?  You can upgrade for free but I don't know the procedure.  others, I expect, will advise you.  You say it's an old laptop.  There is a Microsoft site you can use to have your computer evaluated to see if it is able to be upgraded.  But unless there is a specific feature you want, I would advise leaving well enough alone. 

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

From: Sakina

Sent: Wednesday, March 08, 2017 6:53 AM

Subject: [nvda] Can I still get it for free

 

Hello gene and Friends,

 

I have got this passed down old laptop from a friend that has got window 7

Please forgive me for my terminology below

I wish to update or is called upgrade to window 10

Is it possible and can I still get the window 10 for free?

If yes, than please how do I go about.

I will be and always am grateful for your help and guidance.

Thanking you all again.

With best wishes

Sakina

 

Virus-free. www.avast.com

 


Jacques <lists4js@...>
 

The old beast runs perfectly fine after I did a clean install of Win7 on it, so it does not appear to be warn out at all. I think the hardware was just a tad old and not fully compatible with 10, especially the graphics adapter, the latter which I think was the big culprit. Its now used as a media centre in the lounge, so at least not lost altogether. Anyway, theres been some clearing of throats on continuing this thread, so let me do my bit by signing off.

 

Cheers.

 

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of erik burggraaf
Sent: Wednesday, 08 March 2017 19:29
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Can I still get it for free

 

A couple of things strike me about this.

First, a laptop from 2009 that has been under regular use should not perform well in 2016, even if it was a high end name brand system.  They just don't live as long as people.  Windows ten on what you are describing to me as a warn out system might rejuvinate the system, or it may have just the opposit effect as you discovered.

The other thing that strikes me is that operating system upgrades are a bit notorious.  I have upgraded several more modern systems to windows 10 and haven't seen any performance breaks, but remember the hassle of yure installing upgrades of 98 to ME, or 2000 to XP.  I've even experienced glitches upgrading my android devices that were serious showstopper issues which went away after a clean install.  It could be you were inadvertantly bitten by the upgrade bug.

Best,

Erik

Sent with AquaMail for Android
http://www.aqua-mail.com

On March 8, 2017 10:44:29 AM "Jacques" <lists4js@...> wrote:

Erik, you make valid points, none of which I have any problem with. Keep in mind though that the person who originally posted this question said that its an old laptop, which should be considered when deciding on a final verdict. One of my older machines here is a laptop dating back to 2009. Although quite a nice machine, it slowed down to a crawl after updating it to Win10, despite my best efforts to find the most appropriate drivers. I guess it was one of those boarder line situations, where the MS hardware validator gave it the green light, but for a power user it turned out to be shere frustration trying to use the machine after the upgrade. So yes, if the hardware leans itself towards 10, go for it, if it doesnt, stick to 7 for now and start saving for a new system, as to take advantage of the benefits of Windows 10.

 

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of erik burggraaf
Sent: Wednesday, 08 March 2017 17:04
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Can I still get it for free

 

Gene,  Here is my reasonable take on this based on my more than 15 years of in depth experience not only of windows, but also other major operating systems.

First, windows is a terrible product in any itteration.  There isn't a single thing windows does better than other operating systems except for arketecture support.  It's the most expensive operating system to implement if you remove hardware from the equation.  Windows supports cheeper hardware than the competition but that doesn't negate the fact that windows itself is the highest priced operating system on the market.  Windows is also more expensive to maintain.  In fact, an upgrade from windows seven to windows 10 takes about two hours time.  If you have to fully patch windows seven sp1 it takes between 3 and 6 hours depending on connection speed.  If you're paying by the hour, which would you choose?

Windows is the least secure of all the major OS, further compounding the astronomical maintanence cost and driving down productivity.  I have not yet had to hack windows 10, but I have windows seven.  In windows seven it is common place for programs to allow themselves transparently through built in firewalling.  It is also common place for programs to run as administrator without requiring the administrator account to be enabled or requiring an administrator password.  It is possible for programs to sircomvent the notification system that works on the front line, and it's even possible and considered advisable by many people to turn the security notifications off altogether.  In fact, it is possible when sitting at the keyboard of a windows seven workstation to gain administrator access without logging in at all, to add, remove, or rename windows system files, to take command line control of a workstation, and to perform any command line function including enabling or disabling the administrator account and changing account credentials, all without logging in.  Litterally any improvement would be better than the attrocity that is windows seven security.

Microsoft interface design is terrible.  Ribbons and tiles are only two examples of design choices meant to set windows apart from competetors but had the effect of alienating users.  Windows 10 does the smart thing and returns the windows interface to a more desktop feel. 

Windows only gets a refresh every three years or so.  That means a lot happens in the computer world between releases.  Because the releases are alternately pretty decent over all come terrible to the point of uselessness, windows appeals to pundets who don't like change and want to hault progress.  Fine, but windows seven is coming up on 8 years old and we are still talking about support for windows xp being discontinued.  Nowhere else in the world of operating systems are we talking about support for 8 year old software, and 17 year old software isn't even available for download on pirate sites.  Computers that shipped with windows 7 at the time of the release of windows 8 are now end of lifed, and yet, I was still able to buy and install a windows seven a month ago.  The cost to developers of supporting four operating systems spanning 11 years: ten, eight, seven and vista, is astronomical, and you lucky end-user, get to pay the bill.  The cost of windows software over all is significantly higher than on any other operating system, and part of the reason is that windows users live in the past more than any other userbase.

Windows ten continues to be a free upgrade for current users of seven and eight, long after it was supposed to switch to a completely paid product.  The minimum and recommended hardware configurations are similar to those of windows seven.  Upgrading usually brings better plug and play hardware support and other items under the hood that users would miss if they were gone.

There are features I like in windows ten such as it's minimalist email app and it's improved tts voices.  Then there are things I'm not too pleased with such as the loss of control over windows update and the increased relience on ribbons.  True, we don't really have enough information about this particular case to make a recommendation one way or the other, but in general, it is more than time to leave windows seven behind unlesss you have some substantial reason not to, such as loss of support for a crutial piece of hardware.

All upgrades on all systems require a bit of retraining for new features or fernature that moves, but that is part and parcel of computing.  Windows ten is market tested, reliable and functional at this point.  Staying with windows seven just because is fine for now if that's your personal choice, but if you're supporting or recommending on a pro or semipro basis, the recommendation has to be to upgrade at this point unless circomstances dictate otherwise.

Best,

Erik

Sent with AquaMail for Android
http://www.aqua-mail.com

On March 8, 2017 8:39:42 AM "Gene" <gsasner@...> wrote:

You have made a statement and not given any reasons supporting it.  That doesn't tell us anything except that you believe something.  People may have reasons to upgrade from Windows 7 and Microsoft has recently claimed that for security reasons, you should upgrade because Windows 7 is not secure enough anymore because it isn't a new enough operating system to incorporate newer security features.  I haven't seen any independent discussion concerning this.  But there are always problems that may occur when updating and in this case, the point was stated that this is an old computer.  You don't just upgrade.  While many upgrades from Windows 7 go well, you can't assume they will.  I don't think it’s a good idea to urge upgrading as a general practice.  Why is an upgrade being considered?  What features, if any, will be used or are desired by upgrading?  Has the computer been tested for compatibility of the upgrade?

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

Sent: Wednesday, March 08, 2017 7:21 AM

Subject: Re: [nvda] Can I still get it for free

 

that is an extremely bad suggesstion. If you don't have a very good reason to not update, it is generally a good idea to update.

 

On 3/8/2017 4:04 PM, Gene wrote:

Is there a specific reason you want to use Windows 10?  You can upgrade for free but I don't know the procedure.  others, I expect, will advise you.  You say it's an old laptop.  There is a Microsoft site you can use to have your computer evaluated to see if it is able to be upgraded.  But unless there is a specific feature you want, I would advise leaving well enough alone. 

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

From: Sakina

Sent: Wednesday, March 08, 2017 6:53 AM

Subject: [nvda] Can I still get it for free

 

Hello gene and Friends,

 

I have got this passed down old laptop from a friend that has got window 7

Please forgive me for my terminology below

I wish to update or is called upgrade to window 10

Is it possible and can I still get the window 10 for free?

If yes, than please how do I go about.

I will be and always am grateful for your help and guidance.

Thanking you all again.

With best wishes

Sakina

 

Virus-free. www.avast.com

 


Travis Siegel <tsiegel@...>
 

Linux is plenty accessible. I've been using linux since somewhere around 1992, and I've had much better success on linux than I have had on any other operating system.
Now, with that said, I'd like to throw in the caveat that I'm a power user, rarely use the full-blown gui interface, and prefer command lines.
The most accessible gui I've ever found is on the mac under OSX, and I use that too, as well as windows. I use what's best for the current task at hand, and don't quible about which one is better. They all have their place, linux works with orca, mac works with voiceover, windows works with NVDA (and others), and how much each one works is partly up to the user. I also use BSD for certain tasks, and it's likely I'd use other operating systems too if I had them lying around here. I even used a raspberry pi for more than a year as my main computer, so I'm flexible, and don't care what's at hand, I'll use what's available, and manage to get things done, whether that's linux, windows, OSX, raspbian, BSD, dos, or some other operating system. As long as I can access it, I can find ways to get things done.

On Wed, 8 Mar 2017, Gene wrote:

From what I've heard, accessibility isn't as good in Linux. I'm not saying
Linux is less accessible.  But I've heard from more than one person on one
or two lists that Linux screen-readers aren't as good.  I'd want to see more
opinions on how horrible an operating system Windows is.  I remain
skeptical. 
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
From: David F.
Sent: Wednesday, March 08, 2017 9:51 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Can I still get it for free
This is why I wish I had the brains to learn Linux
 
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of erik
burggraaf
Sent: Wednesday, March 08, 2017 9:04 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Can I still get it for free
 
Gene,  Here is my reasonable take on this based on my more than 15 years of
in depth experience not only of windows, but also other major operating
systems.
First, windows is a terrible product in any itteration.  There isn't a
single thing windows does better than other operating systems except for
arketecture support.  It's the most expensive operating system to implement
if you remove hardware from the equation.  Windows supports cheeper hardware
than the competition but that doesn't negate the fact that windows itself is
the highest priced operating system on the market.  Windows is also more
expensive to maintain.  In fact, an upgrade from windows seven to windows 10
takes about two hours time.  If you have to fully patch windows seven sp1 it
takes between 3 and 6 hours depending on connection speed.  If you're paying
by the hour, which would you choose?
Windows is the least secure of all the major OS, further compounding the
astronomical maintanence cost and driving down productivity.  I have not yet
had to hack windows 10, but I have windows seven.  In windows seven it is
common place for programs to allow themselves transparently through built in
firewalling.  It is also common place for programs to run as administrator
without requiring the administrator account to be enabled or requiring an
administrator password.  It is possible for programs to sircomvent the
notification system that works on the front line, and it's even possible and
considered advisable by many people to turn the security notifications off
altogether.  In fact, it is possible when sitting at the keyboard of a
windows seven workstation to gain administrator access without logging in at
all, to add, remove, or rename windows system files, to take command line
control of a workstation, and to perform any command line function including
enabling or disabling the administrator account and changing account
credentials, all without logging in.  Litterally any improvement would be
better than the attrocity that is windows seven security.
Microsoft interface design is terrible.  Ribbons and tiles are only two
examples of design choices meant to set windows apart from competetors but
had the effect of alienating users.  Windows 10 does the smart thing and
returns the windows interface to a more desktop feel. 
Windows only gets a refresh every three years or so.  That means a lot
happens in the computer world between releases.  Because the releases are
alternately pretty decent over all come terrible to the point of
uselessness, windows appeals to pundets who don't like change and want to
hault progress.  Fine, but windows seven is coming up on 8 years old and we
are still talking about support for windows xp being discontinued.  Nowhere
else in the world of operating systems are we talking about support for 8
year old software, and 17 year old software isn't even available for
download on pirate sites.  Computers that shipped with windows 7 at the time
of the release of windows 8 are now end of lifed, and yet, I was still able
to buy and install a windows seven a month ago.  The cost to developers of
supporting four operating systems spanning 11 years: ten, eight, seven and
vista, is astronomical, and you lucky end-user, get to pay the bill.  The
cost of windows software over all is significantly higher than on any other
operating system, and part of the reason is that windows users live in the
past more than any other userbase.
Windows ten continues to be a free upgrade for current users of seven and
eight, long after it was supposed to switch to a completely paid product. 
The minimum and recommended hardware configurations are similar to those of
windows seven.  Upgrading usually brings better plug and play hardware
support and other items under the hood that users would miss if they were
gone.
There are features I like in windows ten such as it's minimalist email app
and it's improved tts voices.  Then there are things I'm not too pleased
with such as the loss of control over windows update and the increased
relience on ribbons.  True, we don't really have enough information about
this particular case to make a recommendation one way or the other, but in
general, it is more than time to leave windows seven behind unlesss you have
some substantial reason not to, such as loss of support for a crutial piece
of hardware.
All upgrades on all systems require a bit of retraining for new features or
fernature that moves, but that is part and parcel of computing.  Windows ten
is market tested, reliable and functional at this point.  Staying with
windows seven just because is fine for now if that's your personal choice,
but if you're supporting or recommending on a pro or semipro basis, the
recommendation has to be to upgrade at this point unless circomstances
dictate otherwise.
Best,
Erik
Sent with AquaMail for Android
http://www.aqua-mail.com
On March 8, 2017 8:39:42 AM "Gene" <gsasner@ripco.com> wrote:

You have made a statement and not given any reasons supporting
it.  That doesn't tell us anything except that you believe
something.  People may have reasons to upgrade from Windows 7
and Microsoft has recently claimed that for security reasons,
you should upgrade because Windows 7 is not secure enough
anymore because it isn't a new enough operating system to
incorporate newer security features.  I haven't seen any
independent discussion concerning this.  But there are always
problems that may occur when updating and in this case, the
point was stated that this is an old computer.  You don't just
upgrade.  While many upgrades from Windows 7 go well, you can't
assume they will.  I don't think it?s a good idea to urge
upgrading as a general practice.  Why is an upgrade being
considered?  What features, if any, will be used or are desired
by upgrading?  Has the computer been tested for compatibility of
the upgrade?
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
From: enes sar?ba?
Sent: Wednesday, March 08, 2017 7:21 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Can I still get it for free
 
that is an extremely bad suggesstion. If you don't have a very good
reason to not update, it is generally a good idea to update.
 
On 3/8/2017 4:04 PM, Gene wrote:

Is there a specific reason you want to use Windows 10? 
You can upgrade for free but I don't know the procedure. 
others, I expect, will advise you.  You say it's an old
laptop.  There is a Microsoft site you can use to have
your computer evaluated to see if it is able to be
upgraded.  But unless there is a specific feature you
want, I would advise leaving well enough alone. 
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
From: Sakina
Sent: Wednesday, March 08, 2017 6:53 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] Can I still get it for free
 
Hello gene and Friends,
 
I have got this passed down old laptop from a friend that has
got window 7
Please forgive me for my terminology below
I wish to update or is called upgrade to window 10
Is it possible and can I still get the window 10 for free?
If yes, than please how do I go about.
I will be and always am grateful for your help and guidance.
Thanking you all again.
With best wishes
Sakina
 
[IMAGE]
Virus-free. www.avast.com
 


Gene New Zealand <hurrikennyandopo@...>
 

Hi


From what i have heard it is still going.


I had a friend update from 7 to 10 not even a month ago. the other way
for sighted people has ended.


Gene nz

On 9/03/2017 5:40 AM, Brian's Mail list account wrote:
I'd be very careful, Sakina. Laptops have often got specific drivers
for their unusual hardware, and these may not be in windows 10.
Personally, I'd leave well alone unless there is some specific reason
you want to try it.
Also of course. I think even the special VI offer has ended now, at
least nobody has mentioned it recently to me.

If you know the model of the machine, talk to the makers and see if
they will support it with drivers in Windows 10 before you change
anything.
Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk, putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Sakina" <sakina.gable@gmail.com>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Wednesday, March 08, 2017 12:53 PM
Subject: [nvda] Can I still get it for free


Hello gene and Friends,



I have got this passed down old laptop from a friend that has got
window 7

Please forgive me for my terminology below

I wish to update or is called upgrade to window 10

Is it possible and can I still get the window 10 for free?

If yes, than please how do I go about.

I will be and always am grateful for your help and guidance.

Thanking you all again.

With best wishes

Sakina





--
<b>Check out the new location of my accessibility central website for NVDA tutorials, NVDA road tested programs, and other eyesight related topics.
http://www.accessibilitycentral.net/ If you would like to keep up to date with whats being updated on our website, you can also follow us on facebook by visiting
the following link https://en-gb.facebook.com/people/AccessibilityCentral-Net/100009727930216
Also, check out which New Zealand libraries have the NVDA screen reader available by visiting the following link http://www.aotearoapeoplesnetwork.org/content/partner-libraries


enes sarıbaş
 

hi Gene,

I have upgraded 3 older laptops in addition to my own 2014 model core i5 4200m laptop. Two first gen 2010 model I3 laptops and a 2007 model dell laptop with a core II duo. In fact, the upgrade was done by a family member. On all three devices, no loss of functionality or serious problems were observed. Upgrading as a general practice is very advisable. First, microsoft has thoroughly tested windows 10 and ironed out all known serious bugs. Second, microsoft and windows insiders through the windows insider program, have test and continue to test windows 10 on a multitude of hardware. Finally, in the extremely unlikely event that something occured that was impossible to resolve, he can easily roll back to his previous operating system within 10 days. Your are actively discouraging possibly less experienced users to upgrade even though it is clearly better to do so. Even if you don't care or want any of the new features of windows, there is security. Windows 10 has a whole new core, and is much more secure against attacks. Windows 7 is an ancient and now obsolete operating system long into the extended support phase. Here are some articles from reputable sites to back up my claims.

http://www.infoworld.com/article/3044089/security/the-best-new-security-features-of-windows-10.html

https://www.howtogeek.com/219034/here%E2%80%99s-what%E2%80%99s-different-about-windows-10-for-windows-7-users/

an article that describes what security features windows 7 users miss out on: added in windows 8

https://www.howtogeek.com/128182/6-ways-windows-8-is-more-secure-than-windows-7/

http://www.trustedreviews.com/opinions/windows-10-vs-windows-7

https://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/itpro/windows/whats-new/security

http://www.pcadvisor.co.uk/feature/windows/windows-10-upgrade-still-free-why-upgrade-windows-10-is-windows-10-good-3618139/

http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2487499,00.asp

On 3/8/2017 4:38 PM, Gene wrote:
You have made a statement and not given any reasons supporting it.  That doesn't tell us anything except that you believe something.  People may have reasons to upgrade from Windows 7 and Microsoft has recently claimed that for security reasons, you should upgrade because Windows 7 is not secure enough anymore because it isn't a new enough operating system to incorporate newer security features.  I haven't seen any independent discussion concerning this.  But there are always problems that may occur when updating and in this case, the point was stated that this is an old computer.  You don't just upgrade.  While many upgrades from Windows 7 go well, you can't assume they will.  I don't think it’s a good idea to urge upgrading as a general practice.  Why is an upgrade being considered?  What features, if any, will be used or are desired by upgrading?  Has the computer been tested for compatibility of the upgrade?
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Wednesday, March 08, 2017 7:21 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Can I still get it for free

that is an extremely bad suggesstion. If you don't have a very good reason to not update, it is generally a good idea to update.


On 3/8/2017 4:04 PM, Gene wrote:
Is there a specific reason you want to use Windows 10?  You can upgrade for free but I don't know the procedure.  others, I expect, will advise you.  You say it's an old laptop.  There is a Microsoft site you can use to have your computer evaluated to see if it is able to be upgraded.  But unless there is a specific feature you want, I would advise leaving well enough alone. 
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
From: Sakina
Sent: Wednesday, March 08, 2017 6:53 AM
Subject: [nvda] Can I still get it for free

Hello gene and Friends,

 

I have got this passed down old laptop from a friend that has got window 7

Please forgive me for my terminology below

I wish to update or is called upgrade to window 10

Is it possible and can I still get the window 10 for free?

If yes, than please how do I go about.

I will be and always am grateful for your help and guidance.

Thanking you all again.

With best wishes

Sakina


Virus-free. www.avast.com