A very damn well written article promoting NVDA
|
Lino Morales <linomorales001@...>
Chris Hoffstater wrote a damn good article on his blog about NVDA which you can read here.
http://chrishofstader.com/nvda-now-more-than-ever/ |
|
|
|
Gene New Zealand <hurrikennyandopo@...>
Hi
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
I agree a very well written article. I enjoyed the read. Gene nz On 24/05/2017 9:47 AM, Lino Morales wrote:
Chris Hoffstater wrote a damn good article on his blog about NVDA --
Check out my website for nvda tutorials and other blindness related material at http://www.accessibilitycentral.net. Regardless of where you are in New Zealand if you are near one of the APNK sites you can use a copy of the NVDA screen reader on one of their computers. To find out which locations or location is near to you please visit http://www.aotearoapeoplesnetwork.org/content/partner-libraries | Aotearoa People's Network Kaharoa - |
|
|
|
Mallard <mallard@...>
Wow! This is great! I'll forward it to all my friends, blind and sighted...
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
I usually donate to NVDA each time a new version comes out, but I think I won't wait for NVDA 2017.2 to be officially released. This time I'll make an early donation to celebrate this great article... (smile). Ciao, and thanks Christopher! Ollie Il 23/05/2017 23:47, Lino Morales ha scritto:
Chris Hoffstater wrote a damn good article on his blog about NVDA which you can read here. |
|
|
|
Brian's Mail list account
Except that every time someone says Floss to me I think of teeth.
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
sorry. Brian bglists@... Sent via blueyonder. Please address personal email to:- briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff' in the display name field. ----- Original Message -----
From: "Mallard" <mallard@...> To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io> Sent: Wednesday, May 24, 2017 9:04 AM Subject: Re: [nvda] A very damn well written article promoting NVDA Wow! This is great! I'll forward it to all my friends, blind and sighted... |
|
|
|
Devin Prater
I agree, this was a great article!
Devin Prater
From: Brian's Mail list account
Sent: Wednesday, May 24, 2017 10:34 AM To: nvda@nvda.groups.io Subject: Re: [nvda] A very damn well written article promoting NVDA
Except that every time someone says Floss to me I think of teeth. sorry. Brian
bglists@... Sent via blueyonder. Please address personal email to:- briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff' in the display name field. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mallard" <mallard@...> To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io> Sent: Wednesday, May 24, 2017 9:04 AM Subject: Re: [nvda] A very damn well written article promoting NVDA
> Wow! This is great! I'll forward it to all my friends, blind and > sighted... > > > I usually donate to NVDA each time a new version comes out, but I think I > won't wait for NVDA 2017.2 to be officially released. This time I'll make > an early donation to celebrate this great article... (smile). > > > Ciao, and thanks Christopher! > > Ollie > > > > > > Il 23/05/2017 23:47, Lino Morales ha scritto: >> Chris Hoffstater wrote a damn good article on his blog about NVDA which >> you can read here. >> >> http://chrishofstader.com/nvda-now-more-than-ever/ >> >> >> >> > > > >
|
|
|
|
I have to agree lets tell vfo where to shove it On 5/24/2017 9:08 AM, Devin Prater
wrote:
|
|
|
|
Hi all, May I say something about this article and offer a suggestion to the community at large: The article deals mostly with corporate attitudes, sales strategies, labels, standards and so on, using NVDA as an example and advocates for greater adoption of open-source solutions in screen reading. While I have mixed feelings about this, I’m more worried about what VFO and other parties will go through in the next while. As for response, as a community, I think it is better to use reasoned and ethical advocacy than rushed, emotional retweets and replies. I’m sure of us might be thinking that retweets is a reasonable form of advocacy and that’s all. I’d say not: retweets is just one thing, but reasonable advocacy involves willingness to think things through and come up with educated arguments. I myself advised VFO to reevaluate their corporate attitudes, sales strategies and public relations front based on content presented in this article and from other reports, and did warn them that they’ll have to answer tough questions. Cheers, Joseph
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of The Wolf
Sent: Wednesday, May 24, 2017 9:11 AM To: nvda@nvda.groups.io Subject: Re: [nvda] A very damn well written article promoting NVDA
I have to agree lets tell vfo where to shove it and get more people to drop jaws and switch to nvda On 5/24/2017 9:08 AM, Devin Prater wrote:
|
|
|
|
Tony Ballou
Hi,
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
Chris has written loads of good stuff about NVDA over the past few moons. His blog is a worthwhile read for any one who is in the screen reader business whether they be an instructor, IT guy, or end user. I'll check it out. Tony On 5/23/2017 5:47 PM, Lino Morales wrote:
Chris Hoffstater wrote a damn good article on his blog about NVDA |
|
|
|
Dennis L <dennisl1982@...>
That requires NVDA start to fix bugs in a timely manner and add features that Jaws has like when you have messages rules set up and you have 14 unread messages give me the option to have that read automatically when I arrow to the NVDA folder it says NVDA14 unread messages or something like that.
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of The Wolf
Sent: Wednesday, May 24, 2017 12:11 PM To: nvda@nvda.groups.io Subject: Re: [nvda] A very damn well written article promoting NVDA
I have to agree lets tell vfo where to shove it and get more people to drop jaws and switch to nvda On 5/24/2017 9:08 AM, Devin Prater wrote:
|
|
|
|
Hi, Part of that involves users telling us how to reproduce bugs so the talented devs (inside and outside NV Access) can troubleshoot them. I’m not saying this lightly: user cooperation is also a key in making screen readers better. Cheers, Joseph
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Dennis L
Sent: Wednesday, May 24, 2017 9:38 AM To: nvda@nvda.groups.io Subject: Re: [nvda] A very damn well written article promoting NVDA
That requires NVDA start to fix bugs in a timely manner and add features that Jaws has like when you have messages rules set up and you have 14 unread messages give me the option to have that read automatically when I arrow to the NVDA folder it says NVDA14 unread messages or something like that.
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of The Wolf
I have to agree lets tell vfo where to shove it and get more people to drop jaws and switch to nvda On 5/24/2017 9:08 AM, Devin Prater wrote:
|
|
|
|
Dennis L <dennisl1982@...>
I reported it to the git hub and to Quinton I don’t know what else to do but since you asked I will report it hear as well. 1 set www.ixquick.com as your home in internet explorer. 2 do the same in Firefox. Now using Internet explorer do a search press h for heading try clicking on any link in the search results . Nothing will happen. If you do the same in Firefox the link will click. I shouldn’t have to use Firefox or a browser I don’t want to use or am not comfortable with just for it to work right. If the issues I stated were fixed I would gladly donate to NVDA.
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Joseph Lee
Sent: Wednesday, May 24, 2017 12:39 PM To: nvda@nvda.groups.io Subject: Re: [nvda] A very damn well written article promoting NVDA
Hi, Part of that involves users telling us how to reproduce bugs so the talented devs (inside and outside NV Access) can troubleshoot them. I’m not saying this lightly: user cooperation is also a key in making screen readers better. Cheers, Joseph
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Dennis L
That requires NVDA start to fix bugs in a timely manner and add features that Jaws has like when you have messages rules set up and you have 14 unread messages give me the option to have that read automatically when I arrow to the NVDA folder it says NVDA14 unread messages or something like that.
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of The Wolf
I have to agree lets tell vfo where to shove it and get more people to drop jaws and switch to nvda On 5/24/2017 9:08 AM, Devin Prater wrote:
|
|
|
|
Hi, Yes, reproducible. Surprisingly, it works in Edge – that is, when I press H to move to a search results heading and press ENTER, the new page opens. This looks like something odd with either the site’s code or something’s happening at our end (NVDA’s side of things). Was this issue reported via GitHub, and if so, do you have the issue number handy? Cheers, Joseph
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Dennis L
Sent: Wednesday, May 24, 2017 9:50 AM To: nvda@nvda.groups.io Subject: Re: [nvda] A very damn well written article promoting NVDA
I reported it to the git hub and to Quinton I don’t know what else to do but since you asked I will report it hear as well. 1 set www.ixquick.com as your home in internet explorer. 2 do the same in Firefox. Now using Internet explorer do a search press h for heading try clicking on any link in the search results . Nothing will happen. If you do the same in Firefox the link will click. I shouldn’t have to use Firefox or a browser I don’t want to use or am not comfortable with just for it to work right. If the issues I stated were fixed I would gladly donate to NVDA.
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Joseph Lee
Hi, Part of that involves users telling us how to reproduce bugs so the talented devs (inside and outside NV Access) can troubleshoot them. I’m not saying this lightly: user cooperation is also a key in making screen readers better. Cheers, Joseph
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Dennis L
That requires NVDA start to fix bugs in a timely manner and add features that Jaws has like when you have messages rules set up and you have 14 unread messages give me the option to have that read automatically when I arrow to the NVDA folder it says NVDA14 unread messages or something like that.
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of The Wolf
I have to agree lets tell vfo where to shove it and get more people to drop jaws and switch to nvda On 5/24/2017 9:08 AM, Devin Prater wrote:
|
|
|
|
Dennis L <dennisl1982@...>
It was reported through github I don’t have the issue number handy my computer crashed so there went that email. It works with any other screen reader just fine.
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Joseph Lee
Sent: Wednesday, May 24, 2017 12:54 PM To: nvda@nvda.groups.io Subject: Re: [nvda] A very damn well written article promoting NVDA
Hi, Yes, reproducible. Surprisingly, it works in Edge – that is, when I press H to move to a search results heading and press ENTER, the new page opens. This looks like something odd with either the site’s code or something’s happening at our end (NVDA’s side of things). Was this issue reported via GitHub, and if so, do you have the issue number handy? Cheers, Joseph
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Dennis L
I reported it to the git hub and to Quinton I don’t know what else to do but since you asked I will report it hear as well. 1 set www.ixquick.com as your home in internet explorer. 2 do the same in Firefox. Now using Internet explorer do a search press h for heading try clicking on any link in the search results . Nothing will happen. If you do the same in Firefox the link will click. I shouldn’t have to use Firefox or a browser I don’t want to use or am not comfortable with just for it to work right. If the issues I stated were fixed I would gladly donate to NVDA.
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Joseph Lee
Hi, Part of that involves users telling us how to reproduce bugs so the talented devs (inside and outside NV Access) can troubleshoot them. I’m not saying this lightly: user cooperation is also a key in making screen readers better. Cheers, Joseph
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Dennis L
That requires NVDA start to fix bugs in a timely manner and add features that Jaws has like when you have messages rules set up and you have 14 unread messages give me the option to have that read automatically when I arrow to the NVDA folder it says NVDA14 unread messages or something like that.
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of The Wolf
I have to agree lets tell vfo where to shove it and get more people to drop jaws and switch to nvda On 5/24/2017 9:08 AM, Devin Prater wrote:
|
|
|
|
Dennis L <dennisl1982@...>
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Joseph Lee
Sent: Wednesday, May 24, 2017 12:54 PM To: nvda@nvda.groups.io Subject: Re: [nvda] A very damn well written article promoting NVDA
Hi, Yes, reproducible. Surprisingly, it works in Edge – that is, when I press H to move to a search results heading and press ENTER, the new page opens. This looks like something odd with either the site’s code or something’s happYes I’m willing to test a beta if you think you get this figured out. Feel free to email me at Dennisl1982@...ening at our end (NVDA’s side of things). Was this issue reported via GitHub, and if so, do you have the issue number handy? Cheers, Joseph
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Dennis L
I reported it to the git hub and to Quinton I don’t know what else to do but since you asked I will report it hear as well. 1 set www.ixquick.com as your home in internet explorer. 2 do the same in Firefox. Now using Internet explorer do a search press h for heading try clicking on any link in the search results . Nothing will happen. If you do the same in Firefox the link will click. I shouldn’t have to use Firefox or a browser I don’t want to use or am not comfortable with just for it to work right. If the issues I stated were fixed I would gladly donate to NVDA.
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Joseph Lee
Hi, Part of that involves users telling us how to reproduce bugs so the talented devs (inside and outside NV Access) can troubleshoot them. I’m not saying this lightly: user cooperation is also a key in making screen readers better. Cheers, Joseph
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Dennis L
That requires NVDA start to fix bugs in a timely manner and add features that Jaws has like when you have messages rules set up and you have 14 unread messages give me the option to have that read automatically when I arrow to the NVDA folder it says NVDA14 unread messages or something like that.
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of The Wolf
I have to agree lets tell vfo where to shove it and get more people to drop jaws and switch to nvda On 5/24/2017 9:08 AM, Devin Prater wrote:
|
|
|
|
Gene
The article makes interesting points but it's
really overdone. Here is most of a message I sent to another list on the
subject. I have added more comments.
The assertion that a screen-reader can make a great
piece of spyware sounds plausible to me, someone without in depth technical
knowledge. I suspect that it is technically true but I hardly think that
VFO would risk the reputation of JAWS by doing so. It would be illegal on
its face, I would think and it would certainly be illegal if it weren't spelled
out in the user agreement. JAWS is very heavily dependent on business use
for its revenue. As one example of liability, if JAWS collected
information, anyone business or individual doing medical work in The United
States where a person's name is ever used, could prosecute VFO for violating the
patient privacy act. And that's just one example that comes to mind.
Are there blind psychiatrists or psychologists or social workers or people who
work for them who use JAWS to keep patient records? Another case of
devastating liability for JAWS. How about lawyers? The idea that the
owners of JAWS would turn it into spyware is just not credible. To
paraphrase the late Justice Scalia, it should strain the credulity of the
credulous. People may criticize JAWS and its developers for various
reasons but it makes no sense to believe that the company is suicidal.
And what is the risk when compared to the
benefits? The blind user base isn't large enough nore affluent enough to
even begin to justify such risks, even if the company were suicidal.
I'd have to read the article again to see if I
disagree with other assertions, but that was the one I really remember.
There is no question that NVDA is a necessary program and that it fills a vital
need in many peoples' lives. And over time, JAWS will, I would think, lose
an increasing amount of market share in the personal market. It may lose
some business market share over time as well. But when assessing the need
for NVDA and its future, paranoia about the irrationality of the major
competitor is not a good basis to build a good deal of the argument.
If you make such assertions, you lose credibility
for your assertions that are well based. And even here, one assertion I
recall is possible but highly improbable at this time. The assertion that
JAWS is more likely to disappear may be correct, but its highly improbable
unless things change dramatically and it should be regarded more as a remote
possibility and largely academic at this time.
There are lots of compelling arguments to support
and use NVDA. But such arguments as make up much of this article, while
interesting and provocative, are so far-fetched, even though possible, that they
are not a good basis to form much of such arguments. They may gain support
for NVDA among some people but they may needlessly erode support among some JAWS
users, making NVDA appear more like a project supported by paranoid fanatics
than what it actually is, a project that is hard-headed and realistic in its
development and outlook.
Gene ----- Original Message -----
From: The Wolf
Sent: Wednesday, May 24, 2017 11:11 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] A very damn well written article promoting
NVDA I have to agree lets tell vfo where to shove it On 5/24/2017 9:08 AM, Devin Prater wrote:
|
|
|
|
Rui Fontes
Your message is not clear!
What Windows? What mail application? Without details like that, is difficult to fix... Regards, Rui From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Dennis L Sent: Wednesday, May 24, 2017 9:38 AM To: nvda@nvda.groups.io Subject: Re: [nvda] A very damn well written article promoting NVDA That requires NVDA start to fix bugs in a timely manner and add features that Jaws has like when you have messages rules set up and you have 14 unread messages give me the option to have that read automatically when I arrow to the NVDA folder it says NVDA14 unread messages or something like that. From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of The Wolf Sent: Wednesday, May 24, 2017 12:11 PM To: nvda@nvda.groups.io Subject: Re: [nvda] A very damn well written article promoting NVDA I have to agree lets tell vfo where to shove it and get more people to drop jaws and switch to nvda On 5/24/2017 9:08 AM, Devin Prater wrote: I agree, this was a great article! Devin Prater Assistive Technology in training, World Services for the Blind Sent from Mail for windows 10 From: Brian's Mail list account Sent: Wednesday, May 24, 2017 10:34 AM To: nvda@nvda.groups.io Subject: Re: [nvda] A very damn well written article promoting NVDA Except that every time someone says Floss to me I think of teeth. sorry. Brian bglists@... Sent via blueyonder. Please address personal email to:- briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff' in the display name field. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mallard" mailto:mallard@... To: mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io Sent: Wednesday, May 24, 2017 9:04 AM Subject: Re: [nvda] A very damn well written article promoting NVDA Wow! This is great! I'll forward it to all my friends, blind and sighted... I usually donate to NVDA each time a new version comes out, but I think I won't wait for NVDA 2017.2 to be officially released. This time I'll make an early donation to celebrate this great article... (smile). Ciao, and thanks Christopher! Ollie Il 23/05/2017 23:47, Lino Morales ha scritto: Chris Hoffstater wrote a damn good article on his blog about NVDA which you can read here. http://chrishofstader.com/nvda-now-more-than-ever/ |
|
|
|
Rui Fontes
Hi Joseph!
Users should point out the problems, that is a must... But, when I, and not only me, point out problems in Windows Live Mail, ok, it is a descontinued product, but is one of the most used mail apps by brazilian and portuguese comunity, and brazilian is by far the largest NVDA comunity, all problems remain without solution because is a descontinued app or with so low priority that never will be looked... Regards, and, please, do not considere this as a personal criticism to you or NVDA team, but only as a outdurst! Rui Fontes -----Mensagem Original----- De: Joseph Lee Data: 24 de maio de 2017 17:39 Para: nvda@nvda.groups.io Assunto: Re: [nvda] A very damn well written article promoting NVDA Hi, Part of that involves users telling us how to reproduce bugs so the talented devs (inside and outside NV Access) can troubleshoot them. I’m not saying this lightly: user cooperation is also a key in making screen readers better. Cheers, Joseph From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Dennis L Sent: Wednesday, May 24, 2017 9:38 AM To: nvda@nvda.groups.io Subject: Re: [nvda] A very damn well written article promoting NVDA That requires NVDA start to fix bugs in a timely manner and add features that Jaws has like when you have messages rules set up and you have 14 unread messages give me the option to have that read automatically when I arrow to the NVDA folder it says NVDA14 unread messages or something like that. From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of The Wolf Sent: Wednesday, May 24, 2017 12:11 PM To: nvda@nvda.groups.io Subject: Re: [nvda] A very damn well written article promoting NVDA I have to agree lets tell vfo where to shove it and get more people to drop jaws and switch to nvda On 5/24/2017 9:08 AM, Devin Prater wrote: I agree, this was a great article! Devin Prater Assistive Technology in training, World Services for the Blind Sent from Mail for windows 10 From: Brian's Mail list account Sent: Wednesday, May 24, 2017 10:34 AM To: nvda@nvda.groups.io Subject: Re: [nvda] A very damn well written article promoting NVDA Except that every time someone says Floss to me I think of teeth. sorry. Brian bglists@... Sent via blueyonder. Please address personal email to:- briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff' in the display name field. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mallard" mailto:mallard@... To: mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io Sent: Wednesday, May 24, 2017 9:04 AM Subject: Re: [nvda] A very damn well written article promoting NVDA Wow! This is great! I'll forward it to all my friends, blind and sighted... I usually donate to NVDA each time a new version comes out, but I think I won't wait for NVDA 2017.2 to be officially released. This time I'll make an early donation to celebrate this great article... (smile). Ciao, and thanks Christopher! Ollie Il 23/05/2017 23:47, Lino Morales ha scritto: Chris Hoffstater wrote a damn good article on his blog about NVDA which you can read here. http://chrishofstader.com/nvda-now-more-than-ever/ |
|
|
|
Dennis L <dennisl1982@...>
As for the mail app it should be outlook express to outlook to thunderbird it shouldn't matter the mail app. I'm using windows7.
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Rui Fontes Sent: Wednesday, May 24, 2017 1:46 PM To: nvda@nvda.groups.io Subject: Re: [nvda] A very damn well written article promoting NVDA Your message is not clear! What Windows? What mail application? Without details like that, is difficult to fix... Regards, Rui From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Dennis L Sent: Wednesday, May 24, 2017 9:38 AM To: nvda@nvda.groups.io Subject: Re: [nvda] A very damn well written article promoting NVDA That requires NVDA start to fix bugs in a timely manner and add features that Jaws has like when you have messages rules set up and you have 14 unread messages give me the option to have that read automatically when I arrow to the NVDA folder it says NVDA14 unread messages or something like that. From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of The Wolf Sent: Wednesday, May 24, 2017 12:11 PM To: nvda@nvda.groups.io Subject: Re: [nvda] A very damn well written article promoting NVDA I have to agree lets tell vfo where to shove it and get more people to drop jaws and switch to nvda On 5/24/2017 9:08 AM, Devin Prater wrote: I agree, this was a great article! Devin Prater Assistive Technology in training, World Services for the Blind Sent from Mail for windows 10 From: Brian's Mail list account Sent: Wednesday, May 24, 2017 10:34 AM To: nvda@nvda.groups.io Subject: Re: [nvda] A very damn well written article promoting NVDA Except that every time someone says Floss to me I think of teeth. sorry. Brian bglists@... Sent via blueyonder. Please address personal email to:- briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff' in the display name field. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mallard" mailto:mallard@... To: mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io Sent: Wednesday, May 24, 2017 9:04 AM Subject: Re: [nvda] A very damn well written article promoting NVDA Wow! This is great! I'll forward it to all my friends, blind and sighted... I usually donate to NVDA each time a new version comes out, but I won't wait for NVDA 2017.2 to be officially released. This time I'll an early donation to celebrate this great article... (smile). Ciao, and thanks Christopher! Ollie Il 23/05/2017 23:47, Lino Morales ha scritto: Chris Hoffstater wrote a damn good article on his blog about NVDA you can read here. http://chrishofstader.com/nvda-now-more-than-ever/ |
|
|
|
Kwork
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
And I also believe that the best way to talk up
NVDA isn't to tell VFO to shove it, and we, as grateful NVDA users, need to
watch how we present ourselves so that we don't look ridiculous. ----- Original Message -----
From: Gene
Sent: Wednesday, May 24, 2017 10:26 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] A very damn well written article promoting
NVDA The article makes interesting points but it's
really overdone. Here is most of a message I sent to another list on the
subject. I have added more comments.
The assertion that a screen-reader can make a great
piece of spyware sounds plausible to me, someone without in depth technical
knowledge. I suspect that it is technically true but I hardly think that
VFO would risk the reputation of JAWS by doing so. It would be illegal on
its face, I would think and it would certainly be illegal if it weren't spelled
out in the user agreement. JAWS is very heavily dependent on business use
for its revenue. As one example of liability, if JAWS collected
information, anyone business or individual doing medical work in The United
States where a person's name is ever used, could prosecute VFO for violating the
patient privacy act. And that's just one example that comes to mind.
Are there blind psychiatrists or psychologists or social workers or people who
work for them who use JAWS to keep patient records? Another case of
devastating liability for JAWS. How about lawyers? The idea that the
owners of JAWS would turn it into spyware is just not credible. To
paraphrase the late Justice Scalia, it should strain the credulity of the
credulous. People may criticize JAWS and its developers for various
reasons but it makes no sense to believe that the company is suicidal.
And what is the risk when compared to the
benefits? The blind user base isn't large enough nore affluent enough to
even begin to justify such risks, even if the company were suicidal.
I'd have to read the article again to see if I
disagree with other assertions, but that was the one I really remember.
There is no question that NVDA is a necessary program and that it fills a vital
need in many peoples' lives. And over time, JAWS will, I would think, lose
an increasing amount of market share in the personal market. It may lose
some business market share over time as well. But when assessing the need
for NVDA and its future, paranoia about the irrationality of the major
competitor is not a good basis to build a good deal of the argument.
If you make such assertions, you lose credibility
for your assertions that are well based. And even here, one assertion I
recall is possible but highly improbable at this time. The assertion that
JAWS is more likely to disappear may be correct, but its highly improbable
unless things change dramatically and it should be regarded more as a remote
possibility and largely academic at this time.
There are lots of compelling arguments to support
and use NVDA. But such arguments as make up much of this article, while
interesting and provocative, are so far-fetched, even though possible, that they
are not a good basis to form much of such arguments. They may gain support
for NVDA among some people but they may needlessly erode support among some JAWS
users, making NVDA appear more like a project supported by paranoid fanatics
than what it actually is, a project that is hard-headed and realistic in its
development and outlook.
Gene
----- Original Message ----- From: The Wolf
Sent: Wednesday, May 24, 2017 11:11 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] A very damn well written article promoting
NVDA I have to agree lets tell vfo where to shove it On 5/24/2017 9:08 AM, Devin Prater wrote:
|
|
|
|
Gene
One bug on one site is hardly a reason not to
donate. Demanding users of any screen-reader probably are aware of at
least one bugg in whatever screen-reader they use.
Internet Explorer is increasingly archaic and it
isn't a good idea to cling to it. You will have more and more problems
over time as it becomes increasingly outdated. I have no objection to this
bug being looked into. But I'm saying that Internet Explorer is not being
developed and hasn't been for years. Other browsers are just about
identical to use for browsing. Browse mode is browse mode in any browser
that supports it.
You have to learn something about working with
settings in different browsers because the actual interface is different but
there isn't much to learn whether you use Chrome or Firefox as the main
browser. Most of what you do will be exactly the same. And Firefox
has features that Internet Explorer doesn't have that are of real advantage to
many users if you know them. I would never go back to Internet Explorer
after seeing how useful certain firefox features are.
I try to encourage blind people to stop using
Internet Explorer as their main browser because it is not a good idea to do so
with a browser that becomes more outdated every day.
Gene ----- Original Message -----
From: Dennis L
Sent: Wednesday, May 24, 2017 11:49 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] A very damn well written article promoting
NVDA I reported it to the git hub and to Quinton I don’t know what else to do but since you asked I will report it hear as well. 1 set www.ixquick.com as your home in internet explorer. 2 do the same in Firefox. Now using Internet explorer do a search press h for heading try clicking on any link in the search results . Nothing will happen. If you do the same in Firefox the link will click. I shouldn’t have to use Firefox or a browser I don’t want to use or am not comfortable with just for it to work right. If the issues I stated were fixed I would gladly donate to NVDA.
From:
nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Joseph
Lee
Hi, Part of that involves users telling us how to reproduce bugs so the talented devs (inside and outside NV Access) can troubleshoot them. I’m not saying this lightly: user cooperation is also a key in making screen readers better. Cheers, Joseph
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io]
On Behalf Of Dennis L
That requires NVDA start to fix bugs in a timely manner and add features that Jaws has like when you have messages rules set up and you have 14 unread messages give me the option to have that read automatically when I arrow to the NVDA folder it says NVDA14 unread messages or something like that.
From:
nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf
Of The Wolf
I have to agree lets tell vfo where to shove it and get more people to drop jaws and switch to nvda On 5/24/2017 9:08 AM, Devin Prater wrote:
|
|
|