NVDA 2017.3 and Outlook 2003


Michel Such
 

Hi all,


Does NVDA 2017.3 always support Outlook 2003?

Someone reports me that Outlook systematically crashes when trying to open a message, even with all addons disabled.

As I never used this software, I cannot help more.

Any idea?



--


Michel Such


Brian's Mail list account
 

You are right, at least two people have reported this. I am told the work around is to get into the outlook 2003 options and select view all messages as text or similar. of course this stops html links working and may need the read all command to read a message.
Not using that software here, but would be interested in finding out if this work around works.

I think it is a sad fact that in hooking the later versions of ms html and how its achieved it does crash programs still attempting to use ms html in the old way. of course Microsoft no longer support the older versions of office so you would be unlikely to find them fixing this.
Another way may be to go back to nvda 2016.4, but if this outlook is running on windows ten, then you will lose functionality elsewhere by doing this.
At least that is my understanding of the issue.
Brian

bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Michel Such" <michel.such@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Tuesday, October 10, 2017 12:14 PM
Subject: [nvda] NVDA 2017.3 and Outlook 2003


Hi all,


Does NVDA 2017.3 always support Outlook 2003?

Someone reports me that Outlook systematically crashes when trying to open a message, even with all addons disabled.

As I never used this software, I cannot help more.

Any idea?



--


Michel Such



Chris
 

                Hmm, this must have happened recently

Up until april I was running office 2003 with no issues and fully up to date

 

If you haven’t already done so make sure your copy of office 2003 has all the latest updates applied and service pack 3

 

 

 

From: Michel Such
Sent: 10 October 2017 12:14
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] NVDA 2017.3 and Outlook 2003

 

Hi all,

 

 

Does NVDA 2017.3 always support Outlook 2003?

 

Someone reports me that Outlook systematically crashes when trying to

open a message, even with all addons disabled.

 

As I never used this software, I cannot help more.

 

Any idea?

 

 

 

--

 

 

Michel Such

 

 

 

 


Gene
 

The person should test the program with another screen-reader such as a JAWS demo or even Narrator.  At this point, there is no way to know if NVDA has anything to do with the crash.  I don't know if Narrator will read much of anything in the program but it should be possible to open a message and see if the program crashes.
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Tuesday, October 10, 2017 6:14 AM
Subject: [nvda] NVDA 2017.3 and Outlook 2003

Hi all,


Does NVDA 2017.3 always support Outlook 2003?

Someone reports me that Outlook systematically crashes when trying to
open a message, even with all addons disabled.

As I never used this software, I cannot help more.

Any idea?



--


Michel Such




Sylvie Duchateau
 

Hello Gene and all,
First of all, I thank Michel who posted my question to this list.
The woman I am trying to help can use Outlook 2003 with Jaws. For now she has Jaws 14.
She tried to donwgrade to NVDA 2017.2 but outlook still crashes when she tries to open a message.
Thank you in advance for any other ideas.
Best
Sylvie

Le 10/10/2017 à 14:08, Gene a écrit :
The person should test the program with another screen-reader such as a JAWS demo or even Narrator.  At this point, there is no way to know if NVDA has anything to do with the crash.  I don't know if Narrator will read much of anything in the program but it should be possible to open a message and see if the program crashes.
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Tuesday, October 10, 2017 6:14 AM
Subject: [nvda] NVDA 2017.3 and Outlook 2003

Hi all,


Does NVDA 2017.3 always support Outlook 2003?

Someone reports me that Outlook systematically crashes when trying to
open a message, even with all addons disabled.

As I never used this software, I cannot help more.

Any idea?



--


Michel Such





Michel Such
 

Hi, it seems to work fine with Jaws, but it fails with at least NVDA 2017.2 and 2017.3.



Le 2017-10-10 à 14:08, Gene a écrit :
The person should test the program with another screen-reader such as a JAWS demo or even Narrator.  At this point, there is no way to know if NVDA has anything to do with the crash.  I don't know if Narrator will read much of anything in the program but it should be possible to open a message and see if the program crashes.
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Tuesday, October 10, 2017 6:14 AM
Subject: [nvda] NVDA 2017.3 and Outlook 2003

Hi all,


Does NVDA 2017.3 always support Outlook 2003?

Someone reports me that Outlook systematically crashes when trying to
open a message, even with all addons disabled.

As I never used this software, I cannot help more.

Any idea?



--


Michel Such




-- 


Michel Such


Sylvie Duchateau
 

Hello Brian and all,
Thank you for your suggestion!
My contact displayed e-mails in text format instead of HTML and OUtlook works again.
It is not the best solution but with this workaround she can read her mail without Outlook crashing.
Thank you again!
Best
Sylvie

Le 10/10/2017 à 13:31, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io a écrit :
You are right, at least two people have reported this. I am told the work around is to get into the outlook 2003 options and select view all messages as text or similar. of course this stops html links working and may need the read all command to read a message.
Not using that software here, but would be interested in finding out if this work around works.

I think it is a sad fact that in hooking the later versions of ms html and how its achieved it does crash programs still attempting to use ms html in the old way. of course Microsoft no longer support  the older versions of office so you would be unlikely to find them fixing this.
Another way may be to go back to nvda 2016.4, but if this outlook is running on windows ten, then you will lose functionality elsewhere by doing this.
At least that is my understanding of the issue.
Brian

bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Michel Such" <michel.such@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Tuesday, October 10, 2017 12:14 PM
Subject: [nvda] NVDA 2017.3 and Outlook 2003


Hi all,


Does NVDA 2017.3 always support Outlook 2003?

Someone reports me that Outlook systematically crashes when trying to open a message, even with all addons disabled.

As I never used this software, I cannot help more.

Any idea?



--


Michel Such





Gene
 

Does the person need to use Outlook?  I see more complaints regarding one problem or another regarding Outlook than any other e-mail program. 
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Tuesday, October 10, 2017 9:09 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA 2017.3 and Outlook 2003

Hello Brian and all,
Thank you for your suggestion!
My contact displayed e-mails in text format instead of HTML and OUtlook
works again.
It is not the best solution but with this workaround she can read her
mail without Outlook crashing.
Thank you again!
Best
Sylvie
Le 10/10/2017 à 13:31, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io a écrit :
> You are right, at least two people have reported this. I am told the
> work around is to get into the outlook 2003 options and select view
> all messages as text or similar. of course this stops html links
> working and may need the read all command to read a message.
> Not using that software here, but would be interested in finding out
> if this work around works.
>
> I think it is a sad fact that in hooking the later versions of ms html
> and how its achieved it does crash programs still attempting to use ms
> html in the old way. of course Microsoft no longer support  the older
> versions of office so you would be unlikely to find them fixing this.
> Another way may be to go back to nvda 2016.4, but if this outlook is
> running on windows ten, then you will lose functionality elsewhere by
> doing this.
> At least that is my understanding of the issue.
> Brian
>
> bglists@...
> Sent via blueyonder.
> Please address personal email to:-
> briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
> in the display name field.
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michel Such" <michel.such@...>
> To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
> Sent: Tuesday, October 10, 2017 12:14 PM
> Subject: [nvda] NVDA 2017.3 and Outlook 2003
>
>
>> Hi all,
>>
>>
>> Does NVDA 2017.3 always support Outlook 2003?
>>
>> Someone reports me that Outlook systematically crashes when trying to
>> open a message, even with all addons disabled.
>>
>> As I never used this software, I cannot help more.
>>
>> Any idea?
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>>
>>
>> Michel Such
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>





 

On Tue, Oct 10, 2017 at 07:41 am, Gene wrote:
Does the person need to use Outlook? 
Or, if they want Outlook (and some do), Outlook 2003?

Every time I, or anyone else, suggest that it's long past time to update and/or change software we tend to get trounced for doing so.  There are lots of free e-mail client programs that are being actively maintained that do not have these issues.

Even with patches, Outlook 2003 is over 15 years in the rear window and, given the trends in Windows 10 and what screen readers are having to do to keep current, backward compatibility cannot be maintained perpetually and won't be.

Software does have a fixed expected service life and there does come a time where updating to the next generation or switching to a currently maintained alternative is the best course of action.  This is one of them.
--
Brian  Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1703, Build 15063  (dot level on request - it changes too often to keep in signature)

     The opposite of a correct statement is a false statement.  But the opposite of a profound truth may well be another profound truth.

            Niels Bohr

 

 


Brian's Mail list account
 

I have already said this but I do have some sympathy as I still use Outlook Express and there is no current client that works the same way and is accessible unless oeclassic has moved on in leaps and bounds since I last tried it. Sadly Tbird and its ilk still uses a tree with all accounts in it, not little compartmements like the identities of Outlook Express.

I feel that its one of those rare programs, a good design but for some reason nobody else does.


I have run this on 10, but it gets trashed on major updates, so I use its adapted version on 7 and am happy as the app module in nvda still works well with it.

It seldom crashes and can do usenet all in the same interface.
As for Outlook which is part of Office. A lot, and I do mean a lot, of people still do not like ribbons and many had this software when their machine was running 7, and have been running it since with no trouble. its only recently that issues have arisen with it.


I think if we all lived in a perfect world then fine but we do not and do not all have much money either.
Brian

bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Brian Vogel" <britechguy@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Tuesday, October 10, 2017 4:15 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA 2017.3 and Outlook 2003


On Tue, Oct 10, 2017 at 07:41 am, Gene wrote:


Does the person need to use Outlook?
Or, if they want Outlook (and some do), Outlook 2003?

Every time I, or anyone else, suggest that it's long past time to update and/or change software we tend to get trounced for doing so. There are lots of free e-mail client programs that are being actively maintained that do not have these issues.

Even with patches, Outlook 2003 is over 15 years in the rear window and, given the trends in Windows 10 and what screen readers are having to do to keep current, backward compatibility cannot be maintained perpetually and won't be.

Software does have a fixed expected service life and there does come a time where updating to the next generation or switching to a currently maintained alternative is the best course of action. This is one of them.
--
Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1703, Build 15063 (dot level on request - it changes too often to keep in signature)

* * *The opposite of a correct statement is a false statement.* * But the opposite of a profound truth may well be another* * profound truth.*

* ~ * *Niels Bohr*


Brian's Mail list account
 

I'm a bit of erudite as well. I enjoy playing with new stuff, but if I'm trying to get stuff done the muscle memory used for reading emails and other stuff takes a lot to relearn so why bother when its still working.
Brian

bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Sylvie Duchateau" <sduchateau@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Tuesday, October 10, 2017 3:09 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA 2017.3 and Outlook 2003


Hello Brian and all,
Thank you for your suggestion!
My contact displayed e-mails in text format instead of HTML and OUtlook
works again.
It is not the best solution but with this workaround she can read her
mail without Outlook crashing.
Thank you again!
Best
Sylvie
Le 10/10/2017 à 13:31, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io a écrit :
You are right, at least two people have reported this. I am told the work around is to get into the outlook 2003 options and select view all messages as text or similar. of course this stops html links working and may need the read all command to read a message.
Not using that software here, but would be interested in finding out if this work around works.

I think it is a sad fact that in hooking the later versions of ms html and how its achieved it does crash programs still attempting to use ms html in the old way. of course Microsoft no longer support the older versions of office so you would be unlikely to find them fixing this.
Another way may be to go back to nvda 2016.4, but if this outlook is running on windows ten, then you will lose functionality elsewhere by doing this.
At least that is my understanding of the issue.
Brian

bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Michel Such" <michel.such@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Tuesday, October 10, 2017 12:14 PM
Subject: [nvda] NVDA 2017.3 and Outlook 2003


Hi all,


Does NVDA 2017.3 always support Outlook 2003?

Someone reports me that Outlook systematically crashes when trying to open a message, even with all addons disabled.

As I never used this software, I cannot help more.

Any idea?



--


Michel Such






Brian's Mail list account
 

Its odd that it works with Jaws as I was told it had more to do with how the code has to be hooked by screenreaders now that was crashing the html part of the system. If Jaws is using a different way, then it might be interesting to find out how.

Brian

bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Michel Such" <michel.such@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Tuesday, October 10, 2017 1:24 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA 2017.3 and Outlook 2003


Hi, it seems to work fine with Jaws, but it fails with at least NVDA
2017.2 and 2017.3.



Le 2017-10-10 à 14:08, Gene a écrit :
The person should test the program with another screen-reader such as
a JAWS demo or even Narrator. At this point, there is no way to know
if NVDA has anything to do with the crash. I don't know if Narrator
will read much of anything in the program but it should be possible to
open a message and see if the program crashes.
Gene
----- Original Message -----
*From:* Michel Such <mailto:michel.such@...>
*Sent:* Tuesday, October 10, 2017 6:14 AM
*To:* nvda@nvda.groups.io <mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io>
*Subject:* [nvda] NVDA 2017.3 and Outlook 2003

Hi all,


Does NVDA 2017.3 always support Outlook 2003?

Someone reports me that Outlook systematically crashes when trying to
open a message, even with all addons disabled.

As I never used this software, I cannot help more.

Any idea?



--


Michel Such



--


Michel Such


Brian's Mail list account
 

it is recent, nvda 2017.2.
Sakina on this lisst has the same issue. I emailed her with the plain text work around the other day, but not sure if she has found the right setting. Can somebody with this version of Outlook tell me exactly the route to change it to plain text and I'll forward it.
Brian

bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Chris" <chrismedley@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Tuesday, October 10, 2017 12:41 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA 2017.3 and Outlook 2003


Hmm, this must have happened recently
Up until april I was running office 2003 with no issues and fully up to date

If you haven’t already done so make sure your copy of office 2003 has all the latest updates applied and service pack 3



From: Michel Such
Sent: 10 October 2017 12:14
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] NVDA 2017.3 and Outlook 2003

Hi all,


Does NVDA 2017.3 always support Outlook 2003?

Someone reports me that Outlook systematically crashes when trying to
open a message, even with all addons disabled.

As I never used this software, I cannot help more.

Any idea?



--


Michel Such


Antony Stone
 

Um... erudite or luddite?

Antony.

On Tuesday 10 October 2017 at 18:59:03, Brian wrote:

I'm a bit of erudite as well. I enjoy playing with new stuff, but if I'm
trying to get stuff done the muscle memory used for reading emails and
other stuff takes a lot to relearn so why bother when its still working.
Brian
--
I thought of going into banking, until I lost interest.

Please reply to the list;
please *don't* CC me.


 

On Tue, Oct 10, 2017 at 09:56 am, Brian's Mail list account wrote:
A lot, and I do mean a lot, of people still do not like ribbons
So.  Ribbons are here to stay and have nothing to do with the issue of outdated software.

I don't like the ribbons as much as I liked menu driven systems.  I had to suck it up and learn it, because my personal preferences do not rule the world and it's obvious that I am not on "the winning side" of the ribbons design decision.  The same applies to the beloved "identities" of Outlook Express.

Those who refuse to eventually acknowledge that they must go with the flow will be drowned.  I really have no patience with that attitude after a certain point, and that point is long past for me when it comes to Windows XP, Outlook Express, and other hangers on to long defunct software.  There are other options, and many of them free, for most of these things.  It's not the job of the rest of the world to try to hold ancient technology together with the proverbial spit and baling wire.  If someone is absolutely stuck in a situation where they have no choice that's one thing, but that's not the typical case.

Saying that "it's only recently that issues cropped up with . . ." is also not relevant.  There come clear tipping points, and when talking about software in excess of 15 years old one should presume that the tipping point has been reached.
 
--
Brian  Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1703, Build 15063  (dot level on request - it changes too often to keep in signature)

     The opposite of a correct statement is a false statement.  But the opposite of a profound truth may well be another profound truth.

            Niels Bohr

 

 


Brian's Mail list account
 

Probably both! :-)

Brian

bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Antony Stone" <antony.stone@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Tuesday, October 10, 2017 6:07 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA 2017.3 and Outlook 2003


Um... erudite or luddite?

Antony.

On Tuesday 10 October 2017 at 18:59:03, Brian wrote:

I'm a bit of erudite as well. I enjoy playing with new stuff, but if I'm
trying to get stuff done the muscle memory used for reading emails and
other stuff takes a lot to relearn so why bother when its still working.
Brian
--
I thought of going into banking, until I lost interest.

Please reply to the list;
please *don't* CC me.


 

i agree with maintaining all old aincient technology forever!
its freedom of choice for every person and his-her right to select the
favorite programs, office, operating systems etc!
noone should not force others to change, just because beeing uptodate
and jusg for change and new things to come!

On 10/10/17, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io
<bglists@...> wrote:
Probably both! :-)

Brian

bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Antony Stone" <antony.stone@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Tuesday, October 10, 2017 6:07 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA 2017.3 and Outlook 2003


Um... erudite or luddite?

Antony.

On Tuesday 10 October 2017 at 18:59:03, Brian wrote:

I'm a bit of erudite as well. I enjoy playing with new stuff, but if I'm
trying to get stuff done the muscle memory used for reading emails and
other stuff takes a lot to relearn so why bother when its still working.
Brian
--
I thought of going into banking, until I lost interest.

Please reply to the
list;
please *don't* CC

me.






--
we have not sent you but as a mercy to the entire creation.
holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
in the very authentic narration from prophet Mohammad is:
indeed, imam husayn is the beacon of guidance and the ark of salvation.
best website for studying islamic book in different languages
www.al-islam.org


Brian's Mail list account
 

I don't think that they are deliberately doing these things, just that when changes to a part of a system need to look back so far that it can be a problem to take into account all eventualities and it takes a lot more time to check them out as developers old systems may have died years back.
In an ideal world we could use programs built in the dos days in windows, but most of them either fail to run or no screenreader can read them.
I aam just saying that I think Micosoft should at least make some consessions when they are dealing with blind users.
Brian

bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.

----- Original Message -----
From: "zahra" <nasrinkhaksar3@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Wednesday, October 11, 2017 7:24 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA 2017.3 and Outlook 2003


i agree with maintaining all old aincient technology forever!
its freedom of choice for every person and his-her right to select the
favorite programs, office, operating systems etc!
noone should not force others to change, just because beeing uptodate
and jusg for change and new things to come!

On 10/10/17, Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io
<bglists@...> wrote:
Probably both! :-)

Brian

bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Antony Stone" <antony.stone@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Tuesday, October 10, 2017 6:07 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA 2017.3 and Outlook 2003


Um... erudite or luddite?

Antony.

On Tuesday 10 October 2017 at 18:59:03, Brian wrote:

I'm a bit of erudite as well. I enjoy playing with new stuff, but if I'm
trying to get stuff done the muscle memory used for reading emails and
other stuff takes a lot to relearn so why bother when its still working.
Brian
--
I thought of going into banking, until I lost interest.

Please reply to the
list;
please *don't* CC

me.






--
we have not sent you but as a mercy to the entire creation.
holy quran, chapter 21, verse 107.
in the very authentic narration from prophet Mohammad is:
indeed, imam husayn is the beacon of guidance and the ark of salvation.
best website for studying islamic book in different languages
www.al-islam.org


 

On Tue, Oct 10, 2017 at 11:24 pm, zahra wrote:
i agree with maintaining all old aincient technology forever!
its freedom of choice for every person and his-her right to select the
favorite programs, office, operating systems etc!
Good luck with that.

I hope you enjoy your icebox, that horse and buggy you have, and sending communications by telegraph.

The world changes and the wise change with it.
 
--
Brian  Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1703, Build 15063  (dot level on request - it changes too often to keep in signature)

     The opposite of a correct statement is a false statement.  But the opposite of a profound truth may well be another profound truth.

            Niels Bohr

 

 


Cristóbal
 

I generally point people to this clip when they don’t want to let go of the past. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uIty7vFwVYM

Not that newer is always better per say, but sometimes… you simply have to move on. I’ve got in a drawer an old HTC Tytan that I paid $700 for back in 2006 along with Code Factory’s Mobile Speak Pocket that cost me an additional $600. Not that I enjoyed paying $1,300 just to be able to have access to what at that time was a solid smartphone option, but oh well, what are you going to do? I don’t think I’ve turned that thing on in six years. There is a valid argument to continue to use something so long as it is useful to you, but if its obsolescence is more and more obvious and getting in the way of what you need for it to do, then again, time to move on.

 

 

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Brian Vogel
Sent: Wednesday, October 11, 2017 6:55 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA 2017.3 and Outlook 2003

 

On Tue, Oct 10, 2017 at 11:24 pm, zahra wrote:

i agree with maintaining all old aincient technology forever!
its freedom of choice for every person and his-her right to select the
favorite programs, office, operating systems etc!

Good luck with that.

I hope you enjoy your icebox, that horse and buggy you have, and sending communications by telegraph.

The world changes and the wise change with it.
 
--
Brian  Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1703, Build 15063  (dot level on request - it changes too often to keep in signature)

     The opposite of a correct statement is a false statement.  But the opposite of a profound truth may well be another profound truth.

            Niels Bohr