Add-on issues after system restore on Windows 10


Parthy Siva
 

Hello,

I am on Windows 10 version 1909.

After an issue unrelated to NVDA I did a system restore.
Add-ons installed after the restore point and before the date on which I did the restore are not working anymore.

When I removed and reinstalled the add-ons they still won't work.
In the add-ons manager their status is installed enabled after restart.
No change happens after restarting NVDA or even the computer.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.


Jimmy Vonderlinden
 

have you tried uninstalling and re installing NVDA? Worth a shot, hope this helps


Gene
 

If you do try that, there are files that need to be removed for a complete uninstall.  Those with more technical knowledge of NVDA can discuss that.  The easiest and most reliable way to determine if a complete installation might work might be to create a portable version from running the exe file, not from the existing installation, and see if the add-ons work.  Its odd that add-ons before the restore point work and those after the restore point don't. 
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Friday, December 06, 2019 8:25 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Add-on issues after system restore on Windows 10

have you tried uninstalling and re installing NVDA? Worth a shot, hope this helps


 

There is the unanswered question of what version of NVDA, as well as what versions of the Add-Ons, are present.

System Restore (which I personally dislike because it's both unreliable and incomplete) only rolls back your system registry and certain folders, but not all of them.  It is not, in any meaningful sense, a full restore but is, instead, a selective partial one. See the articles:

System Restore (What It Is and How to Use It)

What System Restore Can and Cannot Do to Your Windows

I am quite certain that NVDA add-ons are unlikely to be touched by System Restore as they are not installed using a method that System Restore tracks, so you could possibly have an "older" version of NVDA for which "newer" versions of the add-ons are incompatible.

I'm in agreement with Mr. Vonderlinden that an complete uninstall of NVDA, and all associated add-ons, and a reinstall of same is the thing that is most likely to rectify the situation the most easily.

--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

Most of the change we think we see in life is due to truths being in and out of favor.

         ~ Robert Frost, The Black Cottage (1914)

 

 


 

Hi.

its worth noting in any os from winxp up that the system restore actually is not nice.

It says that it will protect your documents.

What that means is it will keep microsoft office documents, text files, mp3s, data files, it will even restore your downloads if you restored with those.

But it will also do the following.

1.  if its not in program files, program data, or program files x86 it will be deleted.

All executable files, bat, exe, com, cmd, etc are gone.

It will delete those out of your cloud storage if you just happen to have the cloud storage on the same drive.

It will delete any updated or installed addons you made after the restore point and it will corrupt all your windows apps that were updated after restore and others.

You will need to update/install addons, go to the store and the apps will redownload when you check for them.

Its why I encourage a twin drive system if you can get it especially for the cloud.

I have had people on a testing share get totally pissed at me for deleting files, going so far as to engage in a swearing match on line till we both got banned and deleted.

Ringing microsoft and telling them this got them to blatently admit that information.

So you will need to make sure that if its critical even if its the cloud storage, keep that backed up somewhere else if you need it urgently.

Else in my case I had to tell people I restored due to a crash.

For whatever reason system restore will not work with icloud drive, so I assume if you sign out of icloud, which will delete your icloud drive then restore then it works but don't quote me on it.

The of course the easyest thing to do is never use icloud for storage on windows which is dumb but there you go.

Worse, if your system restores to a previous time, your cloud solutions will update with the older data.

I do think cloud services should have system restore protection on them where if you run system restore, they don't restore what is allready uploaded on the cloud to an older version but they don't.

Of course if you have a virus on a system restore that restores that to which is why you clear out every once in a while in case.


 

System restore is ok if something is screwing up.

But yeah in addition to deleting stuff you don't want it will kill addons that have been installed since last point and you have to redownload/update them again.

It will also kill a few apps.

It will also destroy cloud storage folders like dropbox if they are in the user structure.

So programs will be gone, it made me unpopular with some groups for that.

On windows restore only being a partial restore, I'd hate to see what a full system restore would be.

1.  in addition to the above, deletes everything that is not microsoft.

2.  reset the system to defaults.

3.  reformat all drives including backups

4.  unsubscribe you from all email lists.

5.  deactivate your windows and require you to buy a new one.

6.  give you a restore limit.

7.  prompt you to run windows repair which will reformat all your drives and all the drives on your networks and your friends drives to.

Windows restore does what it does well, that is if you made an oopsy in a day or 2 it can undo it.

If you have a driver or something that screwed up or update you can undo it.

If its an easy thing like the system won't start or your user profile screws up it will do that, though it can't fix a corrupted profile as such.

Anything more and its a repair, or a reformat to make it go away.

System restore to me is like the undo on a word processer for the system.

It fixes your mistakes but its not infinite.

Due to its nature though if you really need to have that much going on with the system, I'd use an image solution with incrimental backup on it or something.

And if the system randomly breaks without any warning, its usually hardware.


On 7/12/2019 5:10 am, Brian Vogel wrote:
There is the unanswered question of what version of NVDA, as well as what versions of the Add-Ons, are present.

System Restore (which I personally dislike because it's both unreliable and incomplete) only rolls back your system registry and certain folders, but not all of them.  It is not, in any meaningful sense, a full restore but is, instead, a selective partial one. See the articles:

System Restore (What It Is and How to Use It)

What System Restore Can and Cannot Do to Your Windows

I am quite certain that NVDA add-ons are unlikely to be touched by System Restore as they are not installed using a method that System Restore tracks, so you could possibly have an "older" version of NVDA for which "newer" versions of the add-ons are incompatible.

I'm in agreement with Mr. Vonderlinden that an complete uninstall of NVDA, and all associated add-ons, and a reinstall of same is the thing that is most likely to rectify the situation the most easily.

--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

Most of the change we think we see in life is due to truths being in and out of favor.

         ~ Robert Frost, The Black Cottage (1914)

 

 


Cordelia Scharpf
 

Please correct me if I misunderstand. Is a "twin drive system" an external disk drive onto which you would save a copy an image of your Windows application every week or so? If so, this can be configured to be done automatically in specific intervals, can't it?

Cordelia

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Shaun Everiss
Sent: Friday, December 06, 2019 5:18 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [Spam] [nvda] restoring things

Hi.

its worth noting in any os from winxp up that the system restore
actually is not nice.

It says that it will protect your documents.

What that means is it will keep microsoft office documents, text files,
mp3s, data files, it will even restore your downloads if you restored
with those.

But it will also do the following.

1. if its not in program files, program data, or program files x86 it
will be deleted.

All executable files, bat, exe, com, cmd, etc are gone.

It will delete those out of your cloud storage if you just happen to
have the cloud storage on the same drive.

It will delete any updated or installed addons you made after the
restore point and it will corrupt all your windows apps that were
updated after restore and others.

You will need to update/install addons, go to the store and the apps
will redownload when you check for them.

Its why I encourage a twin drive system if you can get it especially for
the cloud.

I have had people on a testing share get totally pissed at me for
deleting files, going so far as to engage in a swearing match on line
till we both got banned and deleted.

Ringing microsoft and telling them this got them to blatently admit that
information.

So you will need to make sure that if its critical even if its the cloud
storage, keep that backed up somewhere else if you need it urgently.

Else in my case I had to tell people I restored due to a crash.

For whatever reason system restore will not work with icloud drive, so I
assume if you sign out of icloud, which will delete your icloud drive
then restore then it works but don't quote me on it.

The of course the easyest thing to do is never use icloud for storage on
windows which is dumb but there you go.

Worse, if your system restores to a previous time, your cloud solutions
will update with the older data.

I do think cloud services should have system restore protection on them
where if you run system restore, they don't restore what is allready
uploaded on the cloud to an older version but they don't.

Of course if you have a virus on a system restore that restores that to
which is why you clear out every once in a while in case.


 

On Fri, Dec 6, 2019 at 11:32 AM, Cordelia Scharpf wrote:
Is a "twin drive system" an external disk drive onto which you would save a copy an image of your Windows application every week or so? If so, this can be configured to be done automatically in specific intervals, can't it?
That's pretty much it, though the secondary drive can also be internal, but I don't recommend that.

At one time it was standard practice to have one's system image backup drive constantly connected and one's backup & recovery software set up to take full system image backups and/or incremental backups at specific intervals.  Since the advent of ransomware, this is no longer recommended practice (unless you're using a cloud-based backup solution such as Carbonite, to name but one) because ransomware will encrypt each and every drive it can find that's currently connected on a given system, sometimes even on a given network once it finds the first entry point.   The last thing in the world you want is for your system image and/or user data backup drive or drives to be encrypted during a ransomware attack, as then they cannot serve their intended purpose.  Current best practice is to have a backup drive connected in only two circumstances: 

1.  You're taking a backup.

2.  You're restoring from a backup.

Otherwise, they should be offline.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

Most of the change we think we see in life is due to truths being in and out of favor.

         ~ Robert Frost, The Black Cottage (1914)

 

 


Cordelia Scharpf
 

Thanks, Brian. I have backups made once a week and plug in my external drive for this purpose and for backing up important documents.

 

Call me old-fashioned, but I don’t go near clouds. Using them may sound convenient and easy, yet I don’t want my data stored by some company and don’t trust such storage facilities.

 

Cordelia

 

 

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Brian Vogel
Sent: Friday, December 06, 2019 5:42 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [Spam] Re: [nvda] Add-on issues after system restore on Windows 10

 

On Fri, Dec 6, 2019 at 11:32 AM, Cordelia Scharpf wrote:

Is a "twin drive system" an external disk drive onto which you would save a copy an image of your Windows application every week or so? If so, this can be configured to be done automatically in specific intervals, can't it?

That's pretty much it, though the secondary drive can also be internal, but I don't recommend that.

At one time it was standard practice to have one's system image backup drive constantly connected and one's backup & recovery software set up to take full system image backups and/or incremental backups at specific intervals.  Since the advent of ransomware, this is no longer recommended practice (unless you're using a cloud-based backup solution such as Carbonite, to name but one) because ransomware will encrypt each and every drive it can find that's currently connected on a given system, sometimes even on a given network once it finds the first entry point.   The last thing in the world you want is for your system image and/or user data backup drive or drives to be encrypted during a ransomware attack, as then they cannot serve their intended purpose.  Current best practice is to have a backup drive connected in only two circumstances: 

1.  You're taking a backup.

2.  You're restoring from a backup.

Otherwise, they should be offline.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

Most of the change we think we see in life is due to truths being in and out of favor.

         ~ Robert Frost, The Black Cottage (1914)

 

 


Sarah k Alawami
 

Yeah I use back blaze so all of my system except for exe and app my programs folder are backed up. I don't really mind as all I would need to do is reenter my keys which I keep backed up in 3 places. Ask on nvda sub group chat if you want to know more about backblaze.

Sarah Alawami, owner of TFFP. . For more info go to our website. This is also our libsyn page as well.

to subscribe to the feed click here

Our telegram channel is also a good place for an announce only in regard to podcasts, contests, etc.

Our discord is where you will know when we go live on youtube, twitch and mixer. Thanks Restream staff.

Finally, to become a patron and help support the podcast go here

On 6 Dec 2019, at 8:41, Brian Vogel wrote:

On Fri, Dec 6, 2019 at 11:32 AM, Cordelia Scharpf wrote:
Is a "twin drive system" an external disk drive onto which you would save a copy an image of your Windows application every week or so? If so, this can be configured to be done automatically in specific intervals, can't it?
That's pretty much it, though the secondary drive can also be internal, but I don't recommend that.

At one time it was standard practice to have one's system image backup drive constantly connected and one's backup & recovery software set up to take full system image backups and/or incremental backups at specific intervals.  Since the advent of ransomware, this is no longer recommended practice (unless you're using a cloud-based backup solution such as Carbonite, to name but one) because ransomware will encrypt each and every drive it can find that's currently connected on a given system, sometimes even on a given network once it finds the first entry point.   The last thing in the world you want is for your system image and/or user data backup drive or drives to be encrypted during a ransomware attack, as then they cannot serve their intended purpose.  Current best practice is to have a backup drive connected in only two circumstances: 

1.  You're taking a backup.

2.  You're restoring from a backup.

Otherwise, they should be offline.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

Most of the change we think we see in life is due to truths being in and out of favor.

         ~ Robert Frost, The Black Cottage (1914)

 

 


Parthy Siva
 

Hi everyone,

Thanks for all your inputs.
I am using the latest stable version of NVDA and add-ons. So, I know it is not compatibility issues as I have successfully ran these add-ons with this version of NVDA.

I too think that system restore is the culprit. I had no other options.

I guess re-installing NVDA is the solution.

Thanks again.


Kevin Cussick
 

Hi Brian and list, Yes correct You need to go into %appdata% and delete the nvda folder in there, this is quite drastic, then You need to reboot Nvda, I should have said You need another screen reader like Narrator. then delete the nvda folder under %appdata%\nvda as I say it will wipe everything out and You will need to start again. but it will fix things.

On 06/12/2019 16:10, Brian Vogel wrote:
There is the unanswered question of what version of NVDA, as well as what versions of the Add-Ons, are present.
System Restore (which I personally dislike because it's both unreliable and incomplete) only rolls back your system registry and certain folders, but not all of them.  It is not, in any meaningful sense, a full restore but is, instead, a selective partial one. See the articles:
System Restore (What It Is and How to Use It)
<https://www.lifewire.com/what-is-system-restore-2626022>
What System Restore Can and Cannot Do to Your Windows
<https://www.maketecheasier.com/what-system-restore-can-and-cannot-do-to-your-windows-system/>
I am quite certain that NVDA add-ons are unlikely to be touched by System Restore as they are not installed using a method that System Restore tracks, so you could possibly have an "older" version of NVDA for which "newer" versions of the add-ons are incompatible.
I'm in agreement with Mr. Vonderlinden that an complete uninstall of NVDA, and all associated add-ons, and a reinstall of same is the thing that is most likely to rectify the situation the most easily.
--
Brian *-*Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363
Most of the change we think we see in life is due to truths being in and out of favor.
         ~ Robert Frost, /The Black Cottage/ (1914)