locked Bug Reports: Thunderbird talks too much


 

hi all.

Well, I've reported this bug in bugzilla and was able to signin with my github.

I am following this bug and such.

this is the summery and number.

Bug 1628891 - Thunderbird talks to much.

Weather that actually means anything, who knows.

If other users want to reply to this and voice their issue with this bug it would be good.

Now lets hope I am actually doing the right thing as this is my first bug report with this system.

Thank god I can report bugs with github.


 

Shaun,

            The fact that you've reported this is great, really great.  But if you used both Bugzilla and GitHub then we're talking two different systems and two different bug reports.

             Having taken the time to look up this bug, it is a Bugzilla Bug on Thunderbird, https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1628891, and is not connected with GitHub in any way.  For those who have, or open, a Bugzilla Account you can add additional specific commentary to the filed bug.

             GitHub and Bugzilla are completely separate project management systems.  Thunderbird and Firefox are on Bugzilla.  NVDA is on GitHub.

--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

Power is being told you're not loved and not being destroyed by it.

       ~ Madonna

 

 


 

By the way, there appears to be a related bug on NVDA in GitHub, kind of:  NVDA fails to see text in the status bar of Mozilla Thunderbird 68 and newer
This bug was originally opened in November 2019.  It was the flip side of the current ultra verbose problem.  

However, a comment added yesterday reads, "This has been resolved in Thunderbird version 68.7.0. However, the new issue is that NVDA now tends to automatically read whatever Thunderbird displays in its status bar, thereby making the screen reader quite verbose. I suggest that the auto-reading of the status bar in Thunderbird version 68.7.0 and newer be suppressed. This is with NVDA Version alpha-19925,2d73010e."

There are others here who can advise, since this is the case, whether it's worth creating a new, separate bug or whether, based on the comment, which appears to have been seen by the those who check the reports since two tags, "app/thunderbird" and "bug," were added in response to that comment yesterday.  There's no point in creating a separate bug if it would either be merged into this existing one, or if the comment will trigger an issue split out in to a separate issue.  It's a question of where to comment, and whether that should wait or just occur on the end of the existing bug, even though the main problem description for that bug doesn't match the current issue.
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

Power is being told you're not loved and not being destroyed by it.

       ~ Madonna

 

 


 

Hi,

Depending on what is causing it, it might be best to either:

  • Create a new NVDA issue on GitHub: if NVDA is at fault.
  • Report this to Mozilla via Bugzilla: if it is Thunderbird doing this.

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Brian Vogel
Sent: Thursday, April 9, 2020 4:11 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Bug Reports: Thunderbird talks too much

 

By the way, there appears to be a related bug on NVDA in GitHub, kind of:  NVDA fails to see text in the status bar of Mozilla Thunderbird 68 and newer
This bug was originally opened in November 2019.  It was the flip side of the current ultra verbose problem.  

However, a comment added yesterday reads, "This has been resolved in Thunderbird version 68.7.0. However, the new issue is that NVDA now tends to automatically read whatever Thunderbird displays in its status bar, thereby making the screen reader quite verbose. I suggest that the auto-reading of the status bar in Thunderbird version 68.7.0 and newer be suppressed. This is with NVDA Version alpha-19925,2d73010e."

There are others here who can advise, since this is the case, whether it's worth creating a new, separate bug or whether, based on the comment, which appears to have been seen by the those who check the reports since two tags, "app/thunderbird" and "bug," were added in response to that comment yesterday.  There's no point in creating a separate bug if it would either be merged into this existing one, or if the comment will trigger an issue split out in to a separate issue.  It's a question of where to comment, and whether that should wait or just occur on the end of the existing bug, even though the main problem description for that bug doesn't match the current issue.
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

Power is being told you're not loved and not being destroyed by it.

       ~ Madonna

 

 


 

Joseph,

           Shaun has filed a bug report with Bugzilla for Thunderbird regarding this issue, for which I gave the direct link earlier:   https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1628891

           As I mentioned, there is already a bug in GitHub, NVDA fails to see text in the status bar of Mozilla Thunderbird 68 and newer , that seems to me to be the seed for a new issue.  What I want to know is what is the convention at NVDA/NVAccess in a situation like this.   Since I saw those two tags added to the existing bug just yesterday, after the comment reporting the current issue, if they follow a "spin-off protocol" it would be useless to log a new bug.  If, however, they don't split issues when something like this occurs to spin off a new issue, it would be worth creating one.   I don't want to create one unless I know it will not be adding more work for the folks who manage this.  I am hoping someone among our regular readership can shed some light regarding what should happen next.

--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

Power is being told you're not loved and not being destroyed by it.

       ~ Madonna

 

 


Adriani Botez
 

Is the information in the status bar very critical? Is it needed to be able to use Thunderbird?
If not, then I suggest to open a bug with Mozilla requesting to include only critical information in the status bar. And write them exactly which information should be excluded from reporting.

Best

Adriani


Von meinem iPhone gesendet

Am 10.04.2020 um 01:15 schrieb Joseph Lee <joseph.lee22590@...>:



Hi,

Depending on what is causing it, it might be best to either:

  • Create a new NVDA issue on GitHub: if NVDA is at fault.
  • Report this to Mozilla via Bugzilla: if it is Thunderbird doing this.

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Brian Vogel
Sent: Thursday, April 9, 2020 4:11 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Bug Reports: Thunderbird talks too much

 

By the way, there appears to be a related bug on NVDA in GitHub, kind of:  NVDA fails to see text in the status bar of Mozilla Thunderbird 68 and newer
This bug was originally opened in November 2019.  It was the flip side of the current ultra verbose problem.  

However, a comment added yesterday reads, "This has been resolved in Thunderbird version 68.7.0. However, the new issue is that NVDA now tends to automatically read whatever Thunderbird displays in its status bar, thereby making the screen reader quite verbose. I suggest that the auto-reading of the status bar in Thunderbird version 68.7.0 and newer be suppressed. This is with NVDA Version alpha-19925,2d73010e."

There are others here who can advise, since this is the case, whether it's worth creating a new, separate bug or whether, based on the comment, which appears to have been seen by the those who check the reports since two tags, "app/thunderbird" and "bug," were added in response to that comment yesterday.  There's no point in creating a separate bug if it would either be merged into this existing one, or if the comment will trigger an issue split out in to a separate issue.  It's a question of where to comment, and whether that should wait or just occur on the end of the existing bug, even though the main problem description for that bug doesn't match the current issue.
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

Power is being told you're not loved and not being destroyed by it.

       ~ Madonna

 

 


 

On Thu, Apr 9, 2020 at 07:24 PM, Adriani Botez wrote:
[Status Bar] Is it needed to be able to use Thunderbird?
No, but it's already been pretty clearly identified that NVDA is doing something quite different than any other screen reader is doing with the same release of Thunderbird for the same data, as I very much doubt that Thunderbird does anything differently based on which screen reader is used if one is used at all.

This is an instance where there is enough data to strongly suggest an NVDA bug of some sort.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

Power is being told you're not loved and not being destroyed by it.

       ~ Madonna

 

 


Adriani Botez
 

Does this occur with nvda 2019.2.1?


Von meinem iPhone gesendet

Am 10.04.2020 um 01:27 schrieb Brian Vogel <britechguy@...>:

On Thu, Apr 9, 2020 at 07:24 PM, Adriani Botez wrote:
[Status Bar] Is it needed to be able to use Thunderbird?
No, but it's already been pretty clearly identified that NVDA is doing something quite different than any other screen reader is doing with the same release of Thunderbird for the same data, as I very much doubt that Thunderbird does anything differently based on which screen reader is used if one is used at all.

This is an instance where there is enough data to strongly suggest an NVDA bug of some sort.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

Power is being told you're not loved and not being destroyed by it.

       ~ Madonna

 

 


 

Well the only thing the statusbar needs to do actually is simply be a blank statusbar and continue not reading so I can continue to get my progress as normal.

I'd like to be able to customise things so actions I do have sounds maybe but I don't need a running log output which is what is currently happening.

I liked it when the status bar was useless but if its going to have information then I'd like a way to customise things.



On 10/04/2020 11:23 am, Adriani Botez wrote:
Is the information in the status bar very critical? Is it needed to be able to use Thunderbird?
If not, then I suggest to open a bug with Mozilla requesting to include only critical information in the status bar. And write them exactly which information should be excluded from reporting.

Best

Adriani


Von meinem iPhone gesendet

Am 10.04.2020 um 01:15 schrieb Joseph Lee <joseph.lee22590@...>:



Hi,

Depending on what is causing it, it might be best to either:

  • Create a new NVDA issue on GitHub: if NVDA is at fault.
  • Report this to Mozilla via Bugzilla: if it is Thunderbird doing this.

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Brian Vogel
Sent: Thursday, April 9, 2020 4:11 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Bug Reports: Thunderbird talks too much

 

By the way, there appears to be a related bug on NVDA in GitHub, kind of:  NVDA fails to see text in the status bar of Mozilla Thunderbird 68 and newer
This bug was originally opened in November 2019.  It was the flip side of the current ultra verbose problem.  

However, a comment added yesterday reads, "This has been resolved in Thunderbird version 68.7.0. However, the new issue is that NVDA now tends to automatically read whatever Thunderbird displays in its status bar, thereby making the screen reader quite verbose. I suggest that the auto-reading of the status bar in Thunderbird version 68.7.0 and newer be suppressed. This is with NVDA Version alpha-19925,2d73010e."

There are others here who can advise, since this is the case, whether it's worth creating a new, separate bug or whether, based on the comment, which appears to have been seen by the those who check the reports since two tags, "app/thunderbird" and "bug," were added in response to that comment yesterday.  There's no point in creating a separate bug if it would either be merged into this existing one, or if the comment will trigger an issue split out in to a separate issue.  It's a question of where to comment, and whether that should wait or just occur on the end of the existing bug, even though the main problem description for that bug doesn't match the current issue.
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

Power is being told you're not loved and not being destroyed by it.

       ~ Madonna

 

 


 

Hi,

I'm running some diagnostic tests at the moment...

From what I've seen over the years, once a user files an issue with the app developer, NV Access is supposed to be notified of this. In this case, since the issues described here and on GitHub are a bit related yet are quite separate, the best way is creating a new issue with whoever is going to file one providing the direct link to Bugzilla report. Then:

* If it is NVDA problem, NVDA developers will come up with a fix.

* If this is from Thunderbird, the issue will be closed with "needs external fix" label attached.

Cheers,

Joseph


On 4/9/2020 4:22 PM, Brian Vogel wrote:
Joseph,

           Shaun has filed a bug report with Bugzilla for Thunderbird regarding this issue, for which I gave the direct link earlier:   https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1628891

           As I mentioned, there is already a bug in GitHub, NVDA fails to see text in the status bar of Mozilla Thunderbird 68 and newer , that seems to me to be the seed for a new issue.  What I want to know is what is the convention at NVDA/NVAccess in a situation like this.   Since I saw those two tags added to the existing bug just yesterday, after the comment reporting the current issue, if they follow a "spin-off protocol" it would be useless to log a new bug.  If, however, they don't split issues when something like this occurs to spin off a new issue, it would be worth creating one.   I don't want to create one unless I know it will not be adding more work for the folks who manage this.  I am hoping someone among our regular readership can shed some light regarding what should happen next.

--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

Power is being told you're not loved and not being destroyed by it.

       ~ Madonna

 

 


 

well to be honest I have added a comment to the report that at least for those with disabilities there actually needs to be a direct way to email someone to explain without mucking round like this.

Now bugzilla aint bad butt direct communication I still feel is best.



On 10/04/2020 11:22 am, Brian Vogel wrote:
Joseph,

           Shaun has filed a bug report with Bugzilla for Thunderbird regarding this issue, for which I gave the direct link earlier:   https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1628891

           As I mentioned, there is already a bug in GitHub, NVDA fails to see text in the status bar of Mozilla Thunderbird 68 and newer , that seems to me to be the seed for a new issue.  What I want to know is what is the convention at NVDA/NVAccess in a situation like this.   Since I saw those two tags added to the existing bug just yesterday, after the comment reporting the current issue, if they follow a "spin-off protocol" it would be useless to log a new bug.  If, however, they don't split issues when something like this occurs to spin off a new issue, it would be worth creating one.   I don't want to create one unless I know it will not be adding more work for the folks who manage this.  I am hoping someone among our regular readership can shed some light regarding what should happen next.

--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

Power is being told you're not loved and not being destroyed by it.

       ~ Madonna

 

 


 

Well I have reported it to mozilla since it didn't happen before but hell if you want to crossport it to nvda git then be my guest.

Fact is, I am technically putting it on here, there is an archive to this topic if people want to make an issue and shove that topic on the git as a port for nvaccess well who knows.

It would be nice if the dev of the software actually fixed things.



On 10/04/2020 11:15 am, Joseph Lee wrote:

Hi,

Depending on what is causing it, it might be best to either:

  • Create a new NVDA issue on GitHub: if NVDA is at fault.
  • Report this to Mozilla via Bugzilla: if it is Thunderbird doing this.

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Brian Vogel
Sent: Thursday, April 9, 2020 4:11 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Bug Reports: Thunderbird talks too much

 

By the way, there appears to be a related bug on NVDA in GitHub, kind of:  NVDA fails to see text in the status bar of Mozilla Thunderbird 68 and newer
This bug was originally opened in November 2019.  It was the flip side of the current ultra verbose problem.  

However, a comment added yesterday reads, "This has been resolved in Thunderbird version 68.7.0. However, the new issue is that NVDA now tends to automatically read whatever Thunderbird displays in its status bar, thereby making the screen reader quite verbose. I suggest that the auto-reading of the status bar in Thunderbird version 68.7.0 and newer be suppressed. This is with NVDA Version alpha-19925,2d73010e."

There are others here who can advise, since this is the case, whether it's worth creating a new, separate bug or whether, based on the comment, which appears to have been seen by the those who check the reports since two tags, "app/thunderbird" and "bug," were added in response to that comment yesterday.  There's no point in creating a separate bug if it would either be merged into this existing one, or if the comment will trigger an issue split out in to a separate issue.  It's a question of where to comment, and whether that should wait or just occur on the end of the existing bug, even though the main problem description for that bug doesn't match the current issue.
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

Power is being told you're not loved and not being destroyed by it.

       ~ Madonna

 

 


 

Well I have never had the issue of not reading status, nvda sends progress when sending and recieving, in fact the status bar appears when sending but thats ok.

I don't need every message on the status bar read, message status maybe would be good, if there is an error or if something is processing then I'd like to hear a time report on request like I can get from outlook if I ask it for one, etc.

I don't need a running comentary.



On 10/04/2020 11:10 am, Brian Vogel wrote:
By the way, there appears to be a related bug on NVDA in GitHub, kind of:  NVDA fails to see text in the status bar of Mozilla Thunderbird 68 and newer
This bug was originally opened in November 2019.  It was the flip side of the current ultra verbose problem.  

However, a comment added yesterday reads, "This has been resolved in Thunderbird version 68.7.0. However, the new issue is that NVDA now tends to automatically read whatever Thunderbird displays in its status bar, thereby making the screen reader quite verbose. I suggest that the auto-reading of the status bar in Thunderbird version 68.7.0 and newer be suppressed. This is with NVDA Version alpha-19925,2d73010e."

There are others here who can advise, since this is the case, whether it's worth creating a new, separate bug or whether, based on the comment, which appears to have been seen by the those who check the reports since two tags, "app/thunderbird" and "bug," were added in response to that comment yesterday.  There's no point in creating a separate bug if it would either be merged into this existing one, or if the comment will trigger an issue split out in to a separate issue.  It's a question of where to comment, and whether that should wait or just occur on the end of the existing bug, even though the main problem description for that bug doesn't match the current issue.
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

Power is being told you're not loved and not being destroyed by it.

       ~ Madonna

 

 


 

I was able to report to bugzilla using my github account if that makes sence.



On 10/04/2020 10:32 am, Brian Vogel wrote:
Shaun,

            The fact that you've reported this is great, really great.  But if you used both Bugzilla and GitHub then we're talking two different systems and two different bug reports.

             Having taken the time to look up this bug, it is a Bugzilla Bug on Thunderbird, https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1628891, and is not connected with GitHub in any way.  For those who have, or open, a Bugzilla Account you can add additional specific commentary to the filed bug.

             GitHub and Bugzilla are completely separate project management systems.  Thunderbird and Firefox are on Bugzilla.  NVDA is on GitHub.

--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

Power is being told you're not loved and not being destroyed by it.

       ~ Madonna

 

 


 

Joseph, et. al.,

       Based on your latest comment I have created a new GitHub issue for NVDA:  NVDA reads Thunderbird Status Bar, intruding on anything else you're doing.

       The information included is a direct link to both the Bugzilla bug filed by Shaun Everiss and the other NVDA issue I mentioned previously.

       Unless I am mistaken, this behavior appears to have started only with the installation of Thunderbird 68.7.  If it is happening in earlier dot releases of 68 then will those experiencing it there please add a comment to the issue indicating same, and specifying the version of Tbird they're having the issue with.  

        I am currently using NVDA 2019.3.1 and do not know if this occurs with the same Tbird release, but an earlier NVDA release.

--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

Power is being told you're not loved and not being destroyed by it.

       ~ Madonna

 

 


 

On Thu, Apr 9, 2020 at 07:43 PM, Shaun Everiss wrote:
I was able to report to bugzilla using my github account if that makes sence.
Shaun - this is a message from me speaking as Moderator.   Please, please, please start reading what has already been told to you about this not making one bit of sense and taking that on board before posting exactly what you've been told is wrong again.  It's the very least you can do.

If you don't start doing that, I will put you on moderated status.

One final time - There is absolutely, positively no connection of any kind between GitHub and Bugzilla other than they are both systems used to report bugs.  In this specifi case, Thunderbird bugs are reported on Bugzilla.  NVDA issues/bugs are reported on GitHub.

You cannot use a GitHub account on Bugzilla or vice versa.  They are completely separate worlds.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

Power is being told you're not loved and not being destroyed by it.

       ~ Madonna

 

 


Ron Canazzi
 

Hi Adriani,

If you subscribe to  multiple mailing lists and if you have filters for each list and if you group messages by conversation, then seeing the number of messages in a folder and the number of unread messages is critical.  It saves a lot of time in moving around collapsing and expanding your conversations,  looking at the folder tree view and so on. 

Previous to version 60.9, when you used the hotkey for reading the status line, it red the critical information described above but otherwise it was silent.  You could navigate around the list of messages and read a message without hearing any blow by blow account of your actions.  With the old JAWS program, you could create a frame around an area of the screen and silence it and use a hotkey to read it.  Maybe NVDA developers could creat a tool for such activity.  Thunderbird isn't the only program where NVDA becomes too verbose.


On 4/9/2020 7:23 PM, Adriani Botez wrote:
Is the information in the status bar very critical? Is it needed to be able to use Thunderbird?
If not, then I suggest to open a bug with Mozilla requesting to include only critical information in the status bar. And write them exactly which information should be excluded from reporting.

Best

Adriani


Von meinem iPhone gesendet

Am 10.04.2020 um 01:15 schrieb Joseph Lee <joseph.lee22590@...>:



Hi,

Depending on what is causing it, it might be best to either:

  • Create a new NVDA issue on GitHub: if NVDA is at fault.
  • Report this to Mozilla via Bugzilla: if it is Thunderbird doing this.

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Brian Vogel
Sent: Thursday, April 9, 2020 4:11 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Bug Reports: Thunderbird talks too much

 

By the way, there appears to be a related bug on NVDA in GitHub, kind of:  NVDA fails to see text in the status bar of Mozilla Thunderbird 68 and newer
This bug was originally opened in November 2019.  It was the flip side of the current ultra verbose problem.  

However, a comment added yesterday reads, "This has been resolved in Thunderbird version 68.7.0. However, the new issue is that NVDA now tends to automatically read whatever Thunderbird displays in its status bar, thereby making the screen reader quite verbose. I suggest that the auto-reading of the status bar in Thunderbird version 68.7.0 and newer be suppressed. This is with NVDA Version alpha-19925,2d73010e."

There are others here who can advise, since this is the case, whether it's worth creating a new, separate bug or whether, based on the comment, which appears to have been seen by the those who check the reports since two tags, "app/thunderbird" and "bug," were added in response to that comment yesterday.  There's no point in creating a separate bug if it would either be merged into this existing one, or if the comment will trigger an issue split out in to a separate issue.  It's a question of where to comment, and whether that should wait or just occur on the end of the existing bug, even though the main problem description for that bug doesn't match the current issue.
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

Power is being told you're not loved and not being destroyed by it.

       ~ Madonna

 

 


-- 
They Ask Me If I'm Happy; I say Yes.
They ask: "How Happy are You?"
I Say: "I'm as happy as a stow away chimpanzee on a banana boat!"


 

A final message on this topic.

The issue I created for NVDA can be found at:    NVDA reads Thunderbird Status Bar, intruding on anything else you're doing.
The naked URL for that issue is: https://github.com/nvaccess/nvda/issues/10975

The Bugzilla bug related to this, filed by Shaun Everiss, for Thunderbird is available at: https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1628891 

The appropriate place for additional input, if any, is on one, the other, or both of these locations.

This topic is now locked.
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

Power is being told you're not loved and not being destroyed by it.

       ~ Madonna