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Question: Are there any tutorials on backup and restore helpful for NVDA users who totally rely on speech or Braille?


Laurie Mehta
 

Does anyone have a tutorial on image backup and restore using something that works well with NVDA?
Thanks, LM

On Sunday, April 26, 2020, 12:10:27 PM PDT, Rob Hudson <rob_hudson_3182@...> wrote:
in part
...
Perhaps a document should be composed walking newbies through the steps of taking an image backup and restoring it. I personally use active@ diskimage lite to do this. Because you can take a snapshot while the system is running and then restore it from the windows PE. This is the procedure I've been doing for a long time. But I'd be interested to find out how many average computer users know how to do such a thing, or even know it's possible, let alone possible to restore such an image backup with speech. Such a tutorial would greatly benefit the community, I think.


 

Laurie,

            I have nothing on restore simply because I've never had any instance to even try to do one with a screen reader.  Given that most recovery is done through a dedicated bootable disk, and not Windows itself, since you are actually trying to recover a Windows System Image, it's doubtful that there is any way to do so with a screen reader.  If someone knows of a recovery utility that either has a screen reader built in or that can otherwise be made to speak I'd love to hear about it.

            You could use any backup & recovery suite of your choosing, but I wrote a tutorial several years ago on using Macrium Reflect Free to take backups.  The first page deals entirely with installing the utility, which you'll do only once.  The second is the set of step-by-step instructions for actually taking the backup.  In this day and age of ransomware, I do not recommend that backup drives remain attached to a machine other than when a backup is being taken or a recovery performed.  Any drive that's attached if ransomware hits gets encrypted, and in the case of a backup drive that makes having the backup pointless.

Using Macrium Reflect Free with a Screen Reader
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

Science has become just another voice in the room; it has lost its platform.  Now, you simply declare your own truth.

      ~ Dr. Paul A. Offit, in New York Times article, How Anti-Vaccine Sentiment Took Hold in the United States, September 23, 2019

 

 


 

hi.
i know the excellent program that even restoring backup is accessible
for screen readers.
in the past, it was not freeware unfortunately.
i dont know about current versions of it.
the program is drive snapshot.

On 4/27/20, Brian Vogel <@britechguy> wrote:
Laurie,

I have nothing on restore simply because I've never had any instance to even
try to do one with a screen reader.  Given that most recovery is done
through a dedicated bootable disk, and not Windows itself, since you are
actually trying to recover a Windows System Image, it's doubtful that there
is any way to do so with a screen reader.  If someone knows of a recovery
utility that either has a screen reader built in or that can otherwise be
made to speak I'd love to hear about it.

You could use any backup & recovery suite of your choosing, but I wrote a
tutorial several years ago on using Macrium Reflect Free to take backups.
The first page deals entirely with installing the utility, which you'll do
only once.  The second is the set of step-by-step instructions for actually
taking the backup.  In this day and age of ransomware, I do not recommend
that backup drives remain attached to a machine other than when a backup is
being taken or a recovery performed.  Any drive that's attached if
ransomware hits gets encrypted, and in the case of a backup drive that makes
having the backup pointless.

*Using Macrium Reflect Free with a Screen Reader (
https://drive.google.com/uc?export=download&id=1MaK3Pe-eI8P3dRJOS2T9ulY3ykmjKlKD
)*
--

Brian *-* Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363

*Science has become just another voice in the room; it has lost its
platform.  Now, you simply declare your own truth.*

~ Dr. Paul A. Offit, in New York Times article, How Anti-Vaccine Sentiment
Took Hold in the United States (
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/09/23/health/anti-vaccination-movement-us.html
) , September 23, 2019



--
By God,
were I given all the seven heavens
with all they contain
in order that
I may disobey God
by depriving an ant
from the husk of a grain of barley,
I would not do it.
imam ali


 

On Mon, Apr 27, 2020 at 12:55 PM, zahra wrote:
restoring backup is accessible
for screen readers.
In looking at the website for Drive Snapshot, unless you were to be restoring from within Windows, which is not what you're doing in the event of a disaster recovery like having your main disk die, I cannot see how this utility is any more accessible than any other is under those circumstances.

Virtually all of them are accessible if you're doing a recovery starting from within Windows itself, but that's not the kind of recovery that's done most often except by those who have "experimental machines" that they wish to restore to pre-experimenting state afterward.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

Science has become just another voice in the room; it has lost its platform.  Now, you simply declare your own truth.

      ~ Dr. Paul A. Offit, in New York Times article, How Anti-Vaccine Sentiment Took Hold in the United States, September 23, 2019

 

 


John Isige
 

Has anybody tried booting Windows and recovering from there? What I mean is, if you boot off of a Windows disk, DVD/USB/whatever, as though you were installing, you can run Narrator. I wonder if you could then get out of that install, and put in the disk/whatever with your recovery program, and restore your image that way? I'm surprised Windows doesn't have tools to do this built-in, by this point.


Actually it kind of does, you could reset while keeping files or whatever it's called, though I'm not sure if that menu's accessible with Narrator yet. I know the boot menu, i.e. where you pick safe mode or what have you, isn't accessible with a screen reader. I did do an install from a Windows image mostly by myself once, I had to get my wife to help me figure out selecting from their table of options but other than that I did it, but I've never tried booting from an image and seeing what, if any, recovery options I can get. Of course this probably won't help if you're drive's messed up enough that you're doing the equivalent of a reinstall. But that's where trying to boot from a Windows install and getting to your recovery program of choice would come in.


I should add this is only for Windows 10 past certain editions, I can't recall which one but you should pretty much be able to do it by now because I think it was like Creator's or something fairly old. Yet another reason to update, if you can manage it, you're getting some spiffy new features, including Narrator in safe mode.

On 4/27/2020 13:31, Brian Vogel wrote:
On Mon, Apr 27, 2020 at 12:55 PM, zahra wrote:

restoring backup is accessible
for screen readers.

In looking at the website for Drive Snapshot <http://www.drivesnapshot.de/en/>, unless you were to be restoring from within Windows, which is not what you're doing in the event of a disaster recovery like having your main disk die, I cannot see how this utility is any more accessible than any other is under those circumstances.

Virtually all of them are accessible if you're doing a recovery starting from within Windows itself, but that's not the kind of recovery that's done most often except by those who have "experimental machines" that they wish to restore to pre-experimenting state afterward.

--

Brian *-*Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363

*/Science has become just another voice in the room; it has lost its platform. Now, you simply declare your own truth./*

~ Dr. Paul A. Offit, in /New York Times/ article, /How Anti-Vaccine Sentiment Took Hold in the United States/ <https://www.nytimes.com/2019/09/23/health/anti-vaccination-movement-us.html>/,/September 23, 2019


 

On Mon, Apr 27, 2020 at 02:46 PM, John Isige wrote:
But that's where trying to boot from a Windows install and getting to your recovery program of choice would come in.
But this is not how most backup and recovery suites operate.  They have dedicated bootable recovery software to handle the system images they create.  And none of these run within Windows when being used, because they're being used to recover a Windows instance.  (And I don't count using Windows PE, or part of it, as "running under Windows" such that a screen reader is available.)
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

Science has become just another voice in the room; it has lost its platform.  Now, you simply declare your own truth.

      ~ Dr. Paul A. Offit, in New York Times article, How Anti-Vaccine Sentiment Took Hold in the United States, September 23, 2019

 

 


John Isige
 

Don't count whatever you want. Will it work? If none of the self-booting
ones will work, will some program that can create an image and run from
within Windows work? I'm interested in practical solutions. There are
always Linux rescue disks of course, but lots of people aren't
comfortable with Linux. Windows might not provide a comfortable solution
either, e.g. if you can only get to a CLI and people aren't comfortable
with the command-line, but it would be a lot more readily accessible at
least. Anyway, my point is that with Narrator running right from the
installation screen of any bootable Windows nowadays, I feel like there
should be a way to get access to image restoration with a screen reader,
at least in theory. I don't know if there's a practical solution
available though.


I don't care if it runs from within Windows proper, or Windows PE, or
whatever. If we can boot media we should readily have available in case
of accidents anyway and get to some sort of program that will restore a
recovery image while a screen reader is active, then there you go. That
gives us a tool we can use independently that we couldn't use before.
More importantly, all we need is standard Windows, we don't have to make
a talking Linux disk or some special talking Windows environment. It's
already available. If I can boot standard Windows, activate Narrator and
run a GUI program or get to the command-line and do restore
\path\windows-image-name and have it restore Windows with all of my
programs, or most of them, to a messed up or brand new drive, then I'm
happy.

On 4/27/2020 15:42, Brian Vogel wrote:
On Mon, Apr 27, 2020 at 02:46 PM, John Isige wrote:

But that's where trying to boot from a Windows install and getting
to your recovery program of choice would come in.

But this is not how most backup and recovery suites operate.  They
have dedicated bootable recovery software to handle the system images
they create.  And none of these run within Windows when being used,
because they're being used to recover a Windows instance.  (And I
don't count using Windows PE, or part of it, as "running under
Windows" such that a screen reader is available.)

--

Brian *-*Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363

*/Science has become just another voice in the room; it has lost its
platform. Now, you simply declare your own truth./*

~ Dr. Paul A. Offit, in /New York Times/ article, /How Anti-Vaccine
Sentiment Took Hold in the United States/
<https://www.nytimes.com/2019/09/23/health/anti-vaccination-movement-us.html>/,/September
23, 2019


Rob Hudson
 

John Isige <gwynn@...> wrote:
Anyway, my point is that with Narrator running right from the
installation screen of any bootable Windows nowadays, I feel like there
should be a way to get access to image restoration with a screen reader,
at least in theory. I don't know if there's a practical solution
available though.

Are you able to run things from a USB flash drive while the windows disk is booted? Say from the repair console?
You could get a portable version of active@ diskimage lite plus your disk images on an external drive, and run it that way.


 

On Mon, Apr 27, 2020 at 05:12 PM, John Isige wrote:
If we can boot media we should readily have available in case
of accidents anyway and get to some sort of program that will restore a
recovery image while a screen reader is active, then there you go.
And, John, if you know of one please share.   I do not, and I've been in the IT business and assistive technology business for years now.

You can take the tone you're taking because I'm reporting how things are, not how you'd like them to be, but it isn't pretty.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

Science has become just another voice in the room; it has lost its platform.  Now, you simply declare your own truth.

      ~ Dr. Paul A. Offit, in New York Times article, How Anti-Vaccine Sentiment Took Hold in the United States, September 23, 2019

 

 


Laurie Mehta
 

Brian,
Thanks for your reply and for the information you've shared.
- Laurie

On Monday, April 27, 2020, 08:10:04 AM PDT, Brian Vogel <britechguy@...> wrote:


Laurie,

            I have nothing on restore simply because I've never had any instance to even try to do one with a screen reader.  Given that most recovery is done through a dedicated bootable disk, and not Windows itself, since you are actually trying to recover a Windows System Image, it's doubtful that there is any way to do so with a screen reader.  If someone knows of a recovery utility that either has a screen reader built in or that can otherwise be made to speak I'd love to hear about it.

            You could use any backup & recovery suite of your choosing, but I wrote a tutorial several years ago on using Macrium Reflect Free to take backups.  The first page deals entirely with installing the utility, which you'll do only once.  The second is the set of step-by-step instructions for actually taking the backup.  In this day and age of ransomware, I do not recommend that backup drives remain attached to a machine other than when a backup is being taken or a recovery performed.  Any drive that's attached if ransomware hits gets encrypted, and in the case of a backup drive that makes having the backup pointless.

Using Macrium Reflect Free with a Screen Reader
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

Science has become just another voice in the room; it has lost its platform.  Now, you simply declare your own truth.

      ~ Dr. Paul A. Offit, in New York Times article, How Anti-Vaccine Sentiment Took Hold in the United States, September 23, 2019

 

 


 

brian,
i heard various positive informations about this program from several people.
they told me
making backup in the windows invironment not Dos,
after creating backup on windows,
we can specify one drive for restoring backup.
we can consider drive c to be formatted and reinstalling windows again.
drive snapshot format our desired drive and restore our backup without
needing bios invironment and after finishing reinstalling windows,
windows becomes restarted and works as normal!

On 4/27/20, Brian Vogel <@britechguy> wrote:
On Mon, Apr 27, 2020 at 12:55 PM, zahra wrote:


restoring backup is accessible
for screen readers.
In looking at the website for Drive Snapshot (
http://www.drivesnapshot.de/en/ ) , unless you were to be restoring from
within Windows, which is not what you're doing in the event of a disaster
recovery like having your main disk die, I cannot see how this utility is
any more accessible than any other is under those circumstances.

Virtually all of them are accessible if you're doing a recovery starting
from within Windows itself, but that's not the kind of recovery that's done
most often except by those who have "experimental machines" that they wish
to restore to pre-experimenting state afterward.

--

Brian *-* Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363

*Science has become just another voice in the room; it has lost its
platform. Now, you simply declare your own truth.*

~ Dr. Paul A. Offit, in New York Times article, How Anti-Vaccine Sentiment
Took Hold in the United States (
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/09/23/health/anti-vaccination-movement-us.html
) , September 23, 2019



--
By God,
were I given all the seven heavens
with all they contain
in order that
I may disobey God
by depriving an ant
from the husk of a grain of barley,
I would not do it.
imam ali


Kevin Cussick
 

this program is good, but if Your locked out of windows it can not be used.

On 27/04/2020 17:55, zahra wrote:
hi.
i know the excellent program that even restoring backup is accessible
for screen readers.
in the past, it was not freeware unfortunately.
i dont know about current versions of it.
the program is drive snapshot.
On 4/27/20, Brian Vogel <@britechguy> wrote:
Laurie,

I have nothing on restore simply because I've never had any instance to even
try to do one with a screen reader.  Given that most recovery is done
through a dedicated bootable disk, and not Windows itself, since you are
actually trying to recover a Windows System Image, it's doubtful that there
is any way to do so with a screen reader.  If someone knows of a recovery
utility that either has a screen reader built in or that can otherwise be
made to speak I'd love to hear about it.

You could use any backup & recovery suite of your choosing, but I wrote a
tutorial several years ago on using Macrium Reflect Free to take backups.
The first page deals entirely with installing the utility, which you'll do
only once.  The second is the set of step-by-step instructions for actually
taking the backup.  In this day and age of ransomware, I do not recommend
that backup drives remain attached to a machine other than when a backup is
being taken or a recovery performed.  Any drive that's attached if
ransomware hits gets encrypted, and in the case of a backup drive that makes
having the backup pointless.

*Using Macrium Reflect Free with a Screen Reader (
https://drive.google.com/uc?export=download&id=1MaK3Pe-eI8P3dRJOS2T9ulY3ykmjKlKD
)*
--

Brian *-* Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363

*Science has become just another voice in the room; it has lost its
platform.  Now, you simply declare your own truth.*

~ Dr. Paul A. Offit, in New York Times article, How Anti-Vaccine Sentiment
Took Hold in the United States (
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/09/23/health/anti-vaccination-movement-us.html
) , September 23, 2019