Topics

The next evolution of NVDA?


Luke Robinett
 

As a home recording enthusiast, I use various types of music production software in conjunction with NVDA. There’s a very interesting NVDA plug-in that basically grants users access to graphical interfaces that are otherwise completely inaccessible. you run into a lot of these types of apps in the music world, such as various software instruments and effects plugins. anyway, I don’t quite understand how it does it’s magic but basically it uses optical character recognition to figure out what’s on the interface and you can then navigate its various controls like any other app. I do believe it requires specific templates to be developed for whatever software you are using it with. I’m just wondering, it seems like this type of approach could signal the next evolution of screen reader technology. Imagine if a screen reader could use artificial intelligence and machine learning along with existing strategies to grant us access to basically any interface, whether or not it followed accessibility standards. I wonder if such a thing will be possible in the near future outside of these very specific use cases like I described. Interesting food for thought.


William Wong
 

I do hope to have such advancement.

But would you think that AI improvement would some day replace such thing called screen reader and all will be done byAI?


Luke Robinett 於 19/5/2020 6:00 寫道:

As a home recording enthusiast, I use various types of music production software in conjunction with NVDA. There’s a very interesting NVDA plug-in that basically grants users access to graphical interfaces that are otherwise completely inaccessible. you run into a lot of these types of apps in the music world, such as various software instruments and effects plugins. anyway, I don’t quite understand how it does it’s magic but basically it uses optical character recognition to figure out what’s on the interface and you can then navigate its various controls like any other app. I do believe it requires specific templates to be developed for whatever software you are using it with. I’m just wondering, it seems like this type of approach could signal the next evolution of screen reader technology. Imagine if a screen reader could use artificial intelligence and machine learning along with existing strategies to grant us access to basically any interface, whether or not it followed accessibility standards. I wonder if such a thing will be possible in the near future outside of these very specific use cases like I described. Interesting food for thought.


 

Hi,
We need the name of the plugin please. Besides that, all we can say is that the wheel has begun to spin.
Cheers,
Joseph

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Luke Robinett
Sent: Monday, May 18, 2020 3:01 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] The next evolution of NVDA?

As a home recording enthusiast, I use various types of music production software in conjunction with NVDA. There’s a very interesting NVDA plug-in that basically grants users access to graphical interfaces that are otherwise completely inaccessible. you run into a lot of these types of apps in the music world, such as various software instruments and effects plugins. anyway, I don’t quite understand how it does it’s magic but basically it uses optical character recognition to figure out what’s on the interface and you can then navigate its various controls like any other app. I do believe it requires specific templates to be developed for whatever software you are using it with. I’m just wondering, it seems like this type of approach could signal the next evolution of screen reader technology. Imagine if a screen reader could use artificial intelligence and machine learning along with existing strategies to grant us access to basically any interface, whether or not it followed accessibility standards. I wonder if such a thing will be possible in the near future outside of these very specific use cases like I described. Interesting food for thought.


Daniel Wolak
 

Hi,
The plugin that is being referred to is I believe Sibiac (Single Image Blob Interface Accessible Control).
Here's a link to the website containing more information:
http://www.azslow.com/index.php?topic=372.0

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Joseph Lee
Sent: May 18, 2020 6:26 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] The next evolution of NVDA?

Hi,
We need the name of the plugin please. Besides that, all we can say is that the wheel has begun to spin.
Cheers,
Joseph

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Luke Robinett
Sent: Monday, May 18, 2020 3:01 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] The next evolution of NVDA?

As a home recording enthusiast, I use various types of music production software in conjunction with NVDA. There’s a very interesting NVDA plug-in that basically grants users access to graphical interfaces that are otherwise completely inaccessible. you run into a lot of these types of apps in the music world, such as various software instruments and effects plugins. anyway, I don’t quite understand how it does it’s magic but basically it uses optical character recognition to figure out what’s on the interface and you can then navigate its various controls like any other app. I do believe it requires specific templates to be developed for whatever software you are using it with. I’m just wondering, it seems like this type of approach could signal the next evolution of screen reader technology. Imagine if a screen reader could use artificial intelligence and machine learning along with existing strategies to grant us access to basically any interface, whether or not it followed accessibility standards. I wonder if such a thing will be possible in the near future outside of these very specific use cases like I described. Interesting food for thought.


 

Great idea. Make a feature request for it on the NVDA github.


 

For those who want to know more about SIBIAC, see:  https://reaperaccessibility.com/index.php/SIBIAC_add_on_for_NVDA

It is strictly for Reaper and requires a minimum screen resolution of 1920x1080, which would rule it out for me on a laptop.

AI is a marvelous thing, and there will definitely be major advances in the coming years.  But it will be a very long time before it comes close to what wetware (the human brain) can do.  Not to mention that AI, like other humans, will make choices that you, personally, may not prefer,a particularly until it trains itself to you.

It's interesting to see what people envision as far as AI.  I've been saying for a long time that if we could train a screen reader to consider a web page the way most sighted individuals do when they see them, which means instantly ignoring an awful lot of stuff, it would be so much faster to get to the information that's generally being sought.  But even then, what I consider extraneous you may consider essential, or vice versa.  But that's not likely to be the case for things like navigation bars and the collections of links that appear at the bottom (and sometimes top) of a very great many web pages.  If those get used once every hundred visits to most sites, with the exception of newspapers where their sections are generally presented near the top, that's probably an overestimate.
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

Science has become just another voice in the room; it has lost its platform.  Now, you simply declare your own truth.

      ~ Dr. Paul A. Offit, in New York Times article, How Anti-Vaccine Sentiment Took Hold in the United States, September 23, 2019

 

 


Luke Robinett
 

Yes, SIBIAC is the one. Thanks to those of you who chimed in with the name. I haven’t used the plug-in much myself but it’s very popular in the Reaper Without Peepers listserv, A group dedicated to discussion of accessibility for the Reaper digital recording application.

On May 18, 2020, at 4:29 PM, Brian Vogel <britechguy@...> wrote:

For those who want to know more about SIBIAC, see:  https://reaperaccessibility.com/index.php/SIBIAC_add_on_for_NVDA

It is strictly for Reaper and requires a minimum screen resolution of 1920x1080, which would rule it out for me on a laptop.

AI is a marvelous thing, and there will definitely be major advances in the coming years.  But it will be a very long time before it comes close to what wetware (the human brain) can do.  Not to mention that AI, like other humans, will make choices that you, personally, may not prefer,a particularly until it trains itself to you.

It's interesting to see what people envision as far as AI.  I've been saying for a long time that if we could train a screen reader to consider a web page the way most sighted individuals do when they see them, which means instantly ignoring an awful lot of stuff, it would be so much faster to get to the information that's generally being sought.  But even then, what I consider extraneous you may consider essential, or vice versa.  But that's not likely to be the case for things like navigation bars and the collections of links that appear at the bottom (and sometimes top) of a very great many web pages.  If those get used once every hundred visits to most sites, with the exception of newspapers where their sections are generally presented near the top, that's probably an overestimate.
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

Science has become just another voice in the room; it has lost its platform.  Now, you simply declare your own truth.

      ~ Dr. Paul A. Offit, in New York Times article, How Anti-Vaccine Sentiment Took Hold in the United States, September 23, 2019

 

 


Felix G.
 

Hi!
As long as it is not understood by developers to absolve them of
implementing a11y apis, this is a good forward thrust.
Best,
Felix

Am Di., 19. Mai 2020 um 01:56 Uhr schrieb Luke Robinett
<lukeblindgroups@...>:


Yes, SIBIAC is the one. Thanks to those of you who chimed in with the name. I haven’t used the plug-in much myself but it’s very popular in the Reaper Without Peepers listserv, A group dedicated to discussion of accessibility for the Reaper digital recording application.

On May 18, 2020, at 4:29 PM, Brian Vogel <@britechguy> wrote:

For those who want to know more about SIBIAC, see: https://reaperaccessibility.com/index.php/SIBIAC_add_on_for_NVDA

It is strictly for Reaper and requires a minimum screen resolution of 1920x1080, which would rule it out for me on a laptop.

AI is a marvelous thing, and there will definitely be major advances in the coming years. But it will be a very long time before it comes close to what wetware (the human brain) can do. Not to mention that AI, like other humans, will make choices that you, personally, may not prefer,a particularly until it trains itself to you.

It's interesting to see what people envision as far as AI. I've been saying for a long time that if we could train a screen reader to consider a web page the way most sighted individuals do when they see them, which means instantly ignoring an awful lot of stuff, it would be so much faster to get to the information that's generally being sought. But even then, what I consider extraneous you may consider essential, or vice versa. But that's not likely to be the case for things like navigation bars and the collections of links that appear at the bottom (and sometimes top) of a very great many web pages. If those get used once every hundred visits to most sites, with the exception of newspapers where their sections are generally presented near the top, that's probably an overestimate.
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363

Science has become just another voice in the room; it has lost its platform. Now, you simply declare your own truth.

~ Dr. Paul A. Offit, in New York Times article, How Anti-Vaccine Sentiment Took Hold in the United States, September 23, 2019






Sarah k Alawami
 

Isn't it that lexi program, I know the one you are talking about as the dev is on the reaper's list. He managed to make I think it was melodine accessible etc.

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On 18 May 2020, at 15:26, Joseph Lee wrote:

Hi,
We need the name of the plugin please. Besides that, all we can say is that the wheel has begun to spin.
Cheers,
Joseph

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io nvda@nvda.groups.io On Behalf Of Luke Robinett
Sent: Monday, May 18, 2020 3:01 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] The next evolution of NVDA?

As a home recording enthusiast, I use various types of music production software in conjunction with NVDA. There’s a very interesting NVDA plug-in that basically grants users access to graphical interfaces that are otherwise completely inaccessible. you run into a lot of these types of apps in the music world, such as various software instruments and effects plugins. anyway, I don’t quite understand how it does it’s magic but basically it uses optical character recognition to figure out what’s on the interface and you can then navigate its various controls like any other app. I do believe it requires specific templates to be developed for whatever software you are using it with. I’m just wondering, it seems like this type of approach could signal the next evolution of screen reader technology. Imagine if a screen reader could use artificial intelligence and machine learning along with existing strategies to grant us access to basically any interface, whether or not it followed accessibility standards. I wonder if such a thing will be possible in the near future outside of these very specific use cases like I described. Interesting food for thought.


Sean
 

This addon is not an AI example.
OCR is not AI in general.

And yes. 20 years of screen readers are now interested in AI.
There is work on this at GSoC. Recognication  the objects of images etc.

Currently an experienced user can do whatever they want with a screen reader like NVDA.
Almost all obstacles disappear with AI.

On 19/05/2020 02:29, Brian Vogel wrote:
For those who want to know more about SIBIAC, see:  https://reaperaccessibility.com/index.php/SIBIAC_add_on_for_NVDA

It is strictly for Reaper and requires a minimum screen resolution of 1920x1080, which would rule it out for me on a laptop.

AI is a marvelous thing, and there will definitely be major advances in the coming years.  But it will be a very long time before it comes close to what wetware (the human brain) can do.  Not to mention that AI, like other humans, will make choices that you, personally, may not prefer,a particularly until it trains itself to you.

It's interesting to see what people envision as far as AI.  I've been saying for a long time that if we could train a screen reader to consider a web page the way most sighted individuals do when they see them, which means instantly ignoring an awful lot of stuff, it would be so much faster to get to the information that's generally being sought.  But even then, what I consider extraneous you may consider essential, or vice versa.  But that's not likely to be the case for things like navigation bars and the collections of links that appear at the bottom (and sometimes top) of a very great many web pages.  If those get used once every hundred visits to most sites, with the exception of newspapers where their sections are generally presented near the top, that's probably an overestimate.
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

Science has become just another voice in the room; it has lost its platform.  Now, you simply declare your own truth.

      ~ Dr. Paul A. Offit, in New York Times article, How Anti-Vaccine Sentiment Took Hold in the United States, September 23, 2019

 

 

--

Sean

I’m student and programmer. I write often Python, sometimes Go and rarely C++.
I can understand Turkish and English.