resource monitor add-on or some other way?


Bob Cavanaugh <cavbob1993@...>
 

Hi all,
I was on the phone with a technician this morning for about an hour
because for the past several months, my computer has been running
quite slow. He recommended I replace my hard drive, as he noted the
hard drive response time was extremely slow. When we finally hung up,
I figured I'd get to my usual daily computer activities, but found
what shouldn't have been surprising, my computer was painfully slow.
So, I restarted it, and it turned out it was installing more updates.
Now, performance is back to normal, but I want to continue to monitor
my hard drive's response time before I spend the money for a new
drive. Is this something the Resource monitor add-on can do, or do I
need to do what he did and open task manager? If the latter, how do I
get NVDA to read this information?
Bob


 

Hi,
I don't think it's something Resource Monitor can obtain easily (the add-on uses Psutil, a process, disk, and CPU usage information library and I don't believe this library has what's needed to show you what's commonly called "disk activity" or throughput).
As an alternative, you can obtain disk usage info through Task Manager:
1. Open Task Manager (Control+Shift+Escape).
2. If not done so, select "more details".
3. Go to "performance" tab.
4. Under Performance, select the disk you wish to see its activity. You can then use object navigation or screen review to view disk usage information (screen review won't work on portable NVDA).
Cheers,
Joseph

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Bob Cavanaugh
Sent: Friday, February 12, 2021 2:16 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] resource monitor add-on or some other way?

Hi all,
I was on the phone with a technician this morning for about an hour because for the past several months, my computer has been running quite slow. He recommended I replace my hard drive, as he noted the hard drive response time was extremely slow. When we finally hung up, I figured I'd get to my usual daily computer activities, but found what shouldn't have been surprising, my computer was painfully slow.
So, I restarted it, and it turned out it was installing more updates.
Now, performance is back to normal, but I want to continue to monitor my hard drive's response time before I spend the money for a new drive. Is this something the Resource monitor add-on can do, or do I need to do what he did and open task manager? If the latter, how do I get NVDA to read this information?
Bob


 

If you are having slowness secondary to hard disk drive performance, you need to proceed with great caution, and run a utility that lets you know the actual condition of your HDD.

Are any of the SMART parameters showing that something's off?  (I don't care what you might use to get them).

What does a utility like SeaTools for Windows (and I can't speak to accessibility, and it will work for non-Seagate branded drives) tell you about the health of your drive if you run the short test?

You could very well have a HDD that's on its way out.  If so, you do not want to wait for it to fail.
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 20H2, Build 19042  

The depths of denial one can be pushed to by outside forces of disapproval can make you not even recognize yourself to yourself.

       ~ Brian Vogel

 


Bob Cavanaugh <cavbob1993@...>
 

I just tried that, but it didn't give me the information I was looking
for. The tech indicated that my hard drive response time was being
measured in milliseconds, and that my response times were between
1,000 and 5,000. This was before I restarted and it finished
installing the updates, but I have no idea how to access this
information now. I did, using numpad 4 and 6, find out that my disk
was processing read and write requests 22% of the time, but couldn't
find the response time I'm looking for. I suspect it downloading
updates had a lot to do with the slow performance earlier, as once I
restarted it, it was running fine.

On 2/12/21, Joseph Lee <joseph.lee22590@gmail.com> wrote:
Hi,
I don't think it's something Resource Monitor can obtain easily (the add-on
uses Psutil, a process, disk, and CPU usage information library and I don't
believe this library has what's needed to show you what's commonly called
"disk activity" or throughput).
As an alternative, you can obtain disk usage info through Task Manager:
1. Open Task Manager (Control+Shift+Escape).
2. If not done so, select "more details".
3. Go to "performance" tab.
4. Under Performance, select the disk you wish to see its activity. You can
then use object navigation or screen review to view disk usage information
(screen review won't work on portable NVDA).
Cheers,
Joseph

-----Original Message-----
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Bob Cavanaugh
Sent: Friday, February 12, 2021 2:16 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] resource monitor add-on or some other way?

Hi all,
I was on the phone with a technician this morning for about an hour because
for the past several months, my computer has been running quite slow. He
recommended I replace my hard drive, as he noted the hard drive response
time was extremely slow. When we finally hung up, I figured I'd get to my
usual daily computer activities, but found what shouldn't have been
surprising, my computer was painfully slow.
So, I restarted it, and it turned out it was installing more updates.
Now, performance is back to normal, but I want to continue to monitor my
hard drive's response time before I spend the money for a new drive. Is this
something the Resource monitor add-on can do, or do I need to do what he did
and open task manager? If the latter, how do I get NVDA to read this
information?
Bob











Sarah k Alawami
 

Also crystal disk will also help. I just used it to runa health check of my drive and it is very healthy.

Take care

--

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Check out my adventures with a shadow machine.

to subscribe to the feed click here and you can also follow us on twitter

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Finally, to become a patron and help support the podcast go here

On 12 Feb 2021, at 15:22, Brian Vogel wrote:

If you are having slowness secondary to hard disk drive performance, you need to proceed with great caution, and run a utility that lets you know the actual condition of your HDD.

Are any of the SMART parameters showing that something's off?  (I don't care what you might use to get them).

What does a utility like SeaTools for Windows (and I can't speak to accessibility, and it will work for non-Seagate branded drives) tell you about the health of your drive if you run the short test?

You could very well have a HDD that's on its way out.  If so, you do not want to wait for it to fail.
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 20H2, Build 19042  

The depths of denial one can be pushed to by outside forces of disapproval can make you not even recognize yourself to yourself.

       ~ Brian Vogel

 


 

On Fri, Feb 12, 2021 at 08:31 PM, Sarah k Alawami wrote:
crystal disk will also help.
-
I forgot about CrystalDisk Info.  Yes, that's another tool well worth using to check the health status of a HDD or SSD.  I've got version 8.6.2
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 20H2, Build 19042  

The depths of denial one can be pushed to by outside forces of disapproval can make you not even recognize yourself to yourself.

       ~ Brian Vogel

 


Gene
 

If response time is back to normal, I am suspicious about the assertion that the hard drive is the problem. We'll have to see if the updates and the good response time are just a coincidence or not. But I would think that if a computer is operating slowly, that might result in the hard drive doing things slowly as well because a lot of things are slow and the hard drive may be slowing down to accommodate that.

During the slow period, for example, if you were working on something like a Word document, and you moved from line to line, was the computer slow in reading the line you move to? That's one example of where actions are being taken that have nothing to do with the hard drive. A good deal is done in RAM and the hard drive isn't used. Loading a program is done from the hard drive, but a program actually working isn't necessarily involving the hard drive.

I don't know anything about how the tech tested the machine but I'm suspicious of techs and often don't take with high confidence what they say, especially if I know nothing about the quality of the tech.

Also, if general slowness of the hard drive were the problem, I would think the machine might take a much longer time to reboot than usual. Was that the case?

Gene

-----Original Message-----
From: Bob Cavanaugh
Sent: Friday, February 12, 2021 4:15 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] resource monitor add-on or some other way?

Hi all,
I was on the phone with a technician this morning for about an hour
because for the past several months, my computer has been running
quite slow. He recommended I replace my hard drive, as he noted the
hard drive response time was extremely slow. When we finally hung up,
I figured I'd get to my usual daily computer activities, but found
what shouldn't have been surprising, my computer was painfully slow.
So, I restarted it, and it turned out it was installing more updates.
Now, performance is back to normal, but I want to continue to monitor
my hard drive's response time before I spend the money for a new
drive. Is this something the Resource monitor add-on can do, or do I
need to do what he did and open task manager? If the latter, how do I
get NVDA to read this information?
Bob


Nolan Darilek
 

I'm a bit hesitant to wade into this, but I too am a bit suspicious by the jump directly to HD issues.

Long shot, but you're not running Firefox or Thunderbird by chance, are you?

I've been having some odd, regular slowdowns recently. My PC is fairly high-power--I7, 8 cores, 32 GB of RAM, a few years old but not under-powered. Windows installation is only a few months old, but previously it ran Linux and barely broke a sweat. Under Windows, I got about a day or two of use before I often had to hard powercycle the machine. Task Manager didn't give me much that was reliable. Antimalware Service was often high on the performance list, but not reliably. I couldn't trace it to a specific action or change--my CPU fan would eventually go crazy, and my entire system would slowly go unresponsive.

Eventually I tracked it to Firefox. Killing Firefox always replaced the need for a reboot. Tried debugging Firefox further--disabling some extensions, using Nightly, etc. Nothing reliably fixed it. I'm also using a few layers of ad blocking, and while the blocking itself may have slowed things down a bit, I imagine the code that was blocked and didn't run probably cancelled out the extra effort the blockers made filtering it out. So it likely wasn't any page in particular, and none reliably caused this behavior either.

Now I'm running Brave, and the problems are mostly gone. I do, however, experience slowdowns when working in Thunderbird, particularly when opening a message. Yes, I've seen the Thunderbird speedup tips recently, but I don't feel like those helped, particularly since things worked fine under Linux.

Starting to wonder if there's some Gecko NVDA regression, or maybe a Gecko regression with the underlying a11y APIs. Haven't tried diagnosing it further, but as a developer that's kind of what this feels like. Wondering if you might be hitting this too. Are you running FF, and if so, does killing it get your performance back? I guess this could be non-a11y-related, or maybe an issue with crappy drivers, but if this regression were more mainstream then I can't imagine it wouldn't be high priority and fixed. That's why I suspect something in the a11y stack.


Russell James
 

Hi Nolan

Thanks for sharing your Firefox related performance problems

I use it frequently and have observed similar problems in recent weeks
I usually use nightly and I often have many windows and many tabs in each window open
I also use a script locker
My computer may be a little older than yours but very similar hardware configuration
Sometimes we starting Firefox helps and sometimes we starting nvda helps
Sometimes I will come back to the machine in the morning after not using it overnight but leaving things up just locking my screen and it will be almost unusable

Thanks for the tip on using brave maybe I'll give that a try at some point

Just wanted to chime in and let you know I've had similar observations with things pointing in similar directions to your conclusions

using the task manager I haven't been able to pinpoint anything other than Firefox using lots of resources

I haven't done any deep dive into logs

Russ


On Sat, Feb 13, 2021, 9:14 AM Nolan Darilek <nolan@...> wrote:
I'm a bit hesitant to wade into this, but I too am a bit suspicious by the jump directly to HD issues.

Long shot, but you're not running Firefox or Thunderbird by chance, are you?

I've been having some odd, regular slowdowns recently. My PC is fairly
high-power--I7, 8 cores, 32 GB of RAM, a few years old but not
under-powered. Windows installation is only a few months old, but
previously it ran Linux and barely broke a sweat. Under Windows, I got
about a day or two of use before I often had to hard powercycle the
machine. Task Manager didn't give me much that was reliable. Antimalware
Service was often high on the performance list, but not reliably. I
couldn't trace it to a specific action or change--my CPU fan would
eventually go crazy, and my entire system would slowly go unresponsive.

Eventually I tracked it to Firefox. Killing Firefox always replaced the
need for a reboot. Tried debugging Firefox further--disabling some
extensions, using Nightly, etc. Nothing reliably fixed it. I'm also
using a few layers of ad blocking, and while the blocking itself may
have slowed things down a bit, I imagine the code that was blocked and
didn't run probably cancelled out the extra effort the blockers made
filtering it out. So it likely wasn't any page in particular, and none
reliably caused this behavior either.

Now I'm running Brave, and the problems are mostly gone. I do, however,
experience slowdowns when working in Thunderbird, particularly when
opening a message. Yes, I've seen the Thunderbird speedup tips recently,
but I don't feel like those helped, particularly since things worked
fine under Linux.

Starting to wonder if there's some Gecko NVDA regression, or maybe a
Gecko regression with the underlying a11y APIs. Haven't tried diagnosing
it further, but as a developer that's kind of what this feels like.
Wondering if you might be hitting this too. Are you running FF, and if
so, does killing it get your performance back? I guess this could be
non-a11y-related, or maybe an issue with crappy drivers, but if this
regression were more mainstream then I can't imagine it wouldn't be high
priority and fixed. That's why I suspect something in the a11y stack.







Lenron
 

it lags out alot

On 2/13/21, Russell James <4rjames@gmail.com> wrote:
Hi Nolan

Thanks for sharing your Firefox related performance problems

I use it frequently and have observed similar problems in recent weeks
I usually use nightly and I often have many windows and many tabs in each
window open
I also use a script locker
My computer may be a little older than yours but very similar hardware
configuration
Sometimes we starting Firefox helps and sometimes we starting nvda helps
Sometimes I will come back to the machine in the morning after not using it
overnight but leaving things up just locking my screen and it will be
almost unusable

Thanks for the tip on using brave maybe I'll give that a try at some point

Just wanted to chime in and let you know I've had similar observations with
things pointing in similar directions to your conclusions

using the task manager I haven't been able to pinpoint anything other than
Firefox using lots of resources

I haven't done any deep dive into logs

Russ

On Sat, Feb 13, 2021, 9:14 AM Nolan Darilek <nolan@thewordnerd.info> wrote:

I'm a bit hesitant to wade into this, but I too am a bit suspicious by
the
jump directly to HD issues.

Long shot, but you're not running Firefox or Thunderbird by chance, are
you?

I've been having some odd, regular slowdowns recently. My PC is fairly
high-power--I7, 8 cores, 32 GB of RAM, a few years old but not
under-powered. Windows installation is only a few months old, but
previously it ran Linux and barely broke a sweat. Under Windows, I got
about a day or two of use before I often had to hard powercycle the
machine. Task Manager didn't give me much that was reliable. Antimalware
Service was often high on the performance list, but not reliably. I
couldn't trace it to a specific action or change--my CPU fan would
eventually go crazy, and my entire system would slowly go unresponsive.

Eventually I tracked it to Firefox. Killing Firefox always replaced the
need for a reboot. Tried debugging Firefox further--disabling some
extensions, using Nightly, etc. Nothing reliably fixed it. I'm also
using a few layers of ad blocking, and while the blocking itself may
have slowed things down a bit, I imagine the code that was blocked and
didn't run probably cancelled out the extra effort the blockers made
filtering it out. So it likely wasn't any page in particular, and none
reliably caused this behavior either.

Now I'm running Brave, and the problems are mostly gone. I do, however,
experience slowdowns when working in Thunderbird, particularly when
opening a message. Yes, I've seen the Thunderbird speedup tips recently,
but I don't feel like those helped, particularly since things worked
fine under Linux.

Starting to wonder if there's some Gecko NVDA regression, or maybe a
Gecko regression with the underlying a11y APIs. Haven't tried diagnosing
it further, but as a developer that's kind of what this feels like.
Wondering if you might be hitting this too. Are you running FF, and if
so, does killing it get your performance back? I guess this could be
non-a11y-related, or maybe an issue with crappy drivers, but if this
regression were more mainstream then I can't imagine it wouldn't be high
priority and fixed. That's why I suspect something in the a11y stack.










--
Lenron Brown
Cell: 985-271-2832
Skype: ron.brown762


Bob Cavanaugh <cavbob1993@...>
 

The only thing running when he mentioned the slow hard drive response
time was Go to Assist, which is the program he was using to connect to
my machine. I had been running Firefox to get that program, and that's
my default browser these days. That being said though, I don't
experience the slow downs some other users were reporting unless I
have several windows open, though it does seem to overload much easier
than IE did. He tested the machine the same way Joseph told me to do,
go into task manager and on the performance tab and look at the drive
letter in question. I can't seem to get NVDA to read the information
wanted though. As I said in a previous message, I can get NVDA to tell
me that at the time, it was doing read/write requests 22% of the time,
but that's the only information I can get NVDA to read. It definitely
took longer than normal to reboot, as we hung up at 11:44 a.m.
according to my phone. I'd estimate it was about 10 minutes before I
finally said "screw it" and rebooted, as in that time I managed to get
iTunes to load and my phone to sync, but Firefox wouldn't load at all.
I got another phone call at 12:42 P.M. and it was about 7 minutes into
that call when NVDA started speaking, saying "working on updates."

On 2/12/21, Gene <gsasner@gmail.com> wrote:
If response time is back to normal, I am suspicious about the assertion that

the hard drive is the problem. We'll have to see if the updates and the
good response time are just a coincidence or not. But I would think that if

a computer is operating slowly, that might result in the hard drive doing
things slowly as well because a lot of things are slow and the hard drive
may be slowing down to accommodate that.

During the slow period, for example, if you were working on something like a

Word document, and you moved from line to line, was the computer slow in
reading the line you move to? That's one example of where actions are being

taken that have nothing to do with the hard drive. A good deal is done in
RAM and the hard drive isn't used. Loading a program is done from the hard

drive, but a program actually working isn't necessarily involving the hard
drive.

I don't know anything about how the tech tested the machine but I'm
suspicious of techs and often don't take with high confidence what they say,

especially if I know nothing about the quality of the tech.

Also, if general slowness of the hard drive were the problem, I would think

the machine might take a much longer time to reboot than usual. Was that
the case?

Gene
-----Original Message-----
From: Bob Cavanaugh
Sent: Friday, February 12, 2021 4:15 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] resource monitor add-on or some other way?

Hi all,
I was on the phone with a technician this morning for about an hour
because for the past several months, my computer has been running
quite slow. He recommended I replace my hard drive, as he noted the
hard drive response time was extremely slow. When we finally hung up,
I figured I'd get to my usual daily computer activities, but found
what shouldn't have been surprising, my computer was painfully slow.
So, I restarted it, and it turned out it was installing more updates.
Now, performance is back to normal, but I want to continue to monitor
my hard drive's response time before I spend the money for a new
drive. Is this something the Resource monitor add-on can do, or do I
need to do what he did and open task manager? If the latter, how do I
get NVDA to read this information?
Bob










Hareth
 

Hi Nolan,
Firefox on windows with all screenreaders used became a resources nightmare.
I gave up using it for a good few months now, much better overall PC
usage with Chrome, Edge, and waterfox classic packed with a ton of
extensions.
TC

On 2/13/21, Nolan Darilek <nolan@thewordnerd.info> wrote:
I'm a bit hesitant to wade into this, but I too am a bit suspicious by the
jump directly to HD issues.

Long shot, but you're not running Firefox or Thunderbird by chance, are
you?

I've been having some odd, regular slowdowns recently. My PC is fairly
high-power--I7, 8 cores, 32 GB of RAM, a few years old but not
under-powered. Windows installation is only a few months old, but
previously it ran Linux and barely broke a sweat. Under Windows, I got
about a day or two of use before I often had to hard powercycle the
machine. Task Manager didn't give me much that was reliable. Antimalware
Service was often high on the performance list, but not reliably. I
couldn't trace it to a specific action or change--my CPU fan would
eventually go crazy, and my entire system would slowly go unresponsive.

Eventually I tracked it to Firefox. Killing Firefox always replaced the
need for a reboot. Tried debugging Firefox further--disabling some
extensions, using Nightly, etc. Nothing reliably fixed it. I'm also
using a few layers of ad blocking, and while the blocking itself may
have slowed things down a bit, I imagine the code that was blocked and
didn't run probably cancelled out the extra effort the blockers made
filtering it out. So it likely wasn't any page in particular, and none
reliably caused this behavior either.

Now I'm running Brave, and the problems are mostly gone. I do, however,
experience slowdowns when working in Thunderbird, particularly when
opening a message. Yes, I've seen the Thunderbird speedup tips recently,
but I don't feel like those helped, particularly since things worked
fine under Linux.

Starting to wonder if there's some Gecko NVDA regression, or maybe a
Gecko regression with the underlying a11y APIs. Haven't tried diagnosing
it further, but as a developer that's kind of what this feels like.
Wondering if you might be hitting this too. Are you running FF, and if
so, does killing it get your performance back? I guess this could be
non-a11y-related, or maybe an issue with crappy drivers, but if this
regression were more mainstream then I can't imagine it wouldn't be high
priority and fixed. That's why I suspect something in the a11y stack.