Topics

Blog post on Firefox 58.


 

The below is a blog post explaining FF 58. It works better.

https://www.marcozehe.de/2018/01/16/nvda-firefox-58-team-regaining-strength/


Gene
 

Is there a way to contact the Firefox accessibility team?  Unless the notify me when a page tries to redirect or refresh feature was reintroduced in version 58, that is a serious question that should be addressed and that those concerned should write to the accessibility team about.  This wasn't mentioned in the blog entry about improvements in Firefox 58.
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----

Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 8:08 AM
Subject: [nvda] Blog post on Firefox 58.

The below is a blog post explaining FF 58. It works better.

https://www.marcozehe.de/2018/01/16/nvda-firefox-58-team-regaining-strength/





Antony Stone
 

Given that Marco Zehe, the author of that article, is part of the Firefox
accessibility team: https://www.marcozehe.de/about/

I'd start by contacting him directly: marco.zehe at gmail dot com

I've written it just the same way as he does on his website, so his linkable
email address doesn't appear in archives of this list.


Antony.

On Wednesday 17 January 2018 at 15:38:29, Gene wrote:

Is there a way to contact the Firefox accessibility team? Unless the
notify me when a page tries to redirect or refresh feature was
reintroduced in version 58, that is a serious question that should be
addressed and that those concerned should write to the accessibility team
about. This wasn't mentioned in the blog entry about improvements in
Firefox 58.

Gene
----- Original Message -----
From: Robert Kingett
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 8:08 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] Blog post on Firefox 58.


The below is a blog post explaining FF 58. It works better.

https://www.marcozehe.de/2018/01/16/nvda-firefox-58-team-regaining-strength
--
The first fifty percent of an engineering project takes ninety percent of the
time, and the remaining fifty percent takes another ninety percent of the time.

Please reply to the list;
please *don't* CC me.


Lino Morales
 

I don’t have that info, but I’ll track it down. I’ll reach out to James Teh via Twitter first.

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 

From: Gene
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 9:38 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Blog post on Firefox 58.

 

Is there a way to contact the Firefox accessibility team?  Unless the notify me when a page tries to redirect or refresh feature was reintroduced in version 58, that is a serious question that should be addressed and that those concerned should write to the accessibility team about.  This wasn't mentioned in the blog entry about improvements in Firefox 58.

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 8:08 AM

Subject: [nvda] Blog post on Firefox 58.

 

The below is a blog post explaining FF 58. It works better.

https://www.marcozehe.de/2018/01/16/nvda-firefox-58-team-regaining-strength/



 


Brian's Mail list account <bglists@...>
 

I am going to sound like a broken bit of 78 record here, and I do apologise.
Please could we have some optional sounds with Firefox so we can hear when downloads are complete, when clicking something actually worked and when the page is fully loaded again.

I grew up with ie and only went to firefox when navigational sounds was released, since certain ahem, other browsers in later windows decided to not go to sounds.
There has been a polarisation of views on this list, but I do seriously feel, from the people who do not use this list and are only interested in using their computers and are not expert users, I need to act as an advocate and say that having no sound is very very off-putting to such users.
Thank you and have a safe trip home...
last one out turns off the lights
Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk, putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Robert Kingett" <kingettr@gmail.com>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 2:08 PM
Subject: [nvda] Blog post on Firefox 58.


The below is a blog post explaining FF 58. It works better.

https://www.marcozehe.de/2018/01/16/nvda-firefox-58-team-regaining-strength/




Brian's Mail list account <bglists@...>
 

Yea, maybe it needs a sound instead ) well I could not resist it.
I agree I'd like to see a simple wish list form for firefox.
Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk, putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Gene" <gsasner@ripco.com>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 2:38 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Blog post on Firefox 58.


Is there a way to contact the Firefox accessibility team? Unless the notify me when a page tries to redirect or refresh feature was reintroduced in version 58, that is a serious question that should be addressed and that those concerned should write to the accessibility team about. This wasn't mentioned in the blog entry about improvements in Firefox 58.

Gene
----- Original Message -----
From: Robert Kingett
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 8:08 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] Blog post on Firefox 58.


The below is a blog post explaining FF 58. It works better.

https://www.marcozehe.de/2018/01/16/nvda-firefox-58-team-regaining-strength/


Lino Morales
 

Brian you just can’t let go ae? I don’t need extra sounds for this that and the other. Be a good bloak and contact Marko Z or James The if you really want this. Advocating on here won’t do you any good unless you do it yourself. This is the message I preach to other blind folks here in the US. No matter where you live its best you do it yourself.

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 

From: Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 12:05 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Blog post on Firefox 58.

 

I am going to sound like a broken bit of 78 record here, and I do apologise.

Please could we have some optional sounds with Firefox so we can hear when

downloads are complete, when clicking something actually worked and when the

page is fully loaded again.

 

I grew up with ie and only went to firefox when navigational sounds was

released, since certain ahem, other browsers in later windows decided to not

go to sounds.

There has been a polarisation of views on this list, but I do seriously

feel, from the people who do not use this list and are only interested in

using their computers and are not expert users, I need to act as an advocate

and say that having no sound is very very off-putting to such users.

Thank you and have a safe trip home...

last one out turns off the lights

Brian

 

bglists@...

Sent via blueyonder.

Please address personal email to:-

briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'

in the display name field.

----- Original Message -----

From: "Robert Kingett" <kingettr@...>

To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>

Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 2:08 PM

Subject: [nvda] Blog post on Firefox 58.

 

 

> The below is a blog post explaining FF 58. It works better.

> https://www.marcozehe.de/2018/01/16/nvda-firefox-58-team-regaining-strength/

>

>

 

 

 

 


Rosemarie Chavarria
 

Hi, Lino,

 

I don't need special sounds to tell me when a web site has finished loading. Brian, listen for the word "busy" when a page has finished loading. Why do we have to have special sounds for that?

 

Rosemarie

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Lino Morales
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 9:30 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Blog post on Firefox 58.

 

Brian you just can’t let go ae? I don’t need extra sounds for this that and the other. Be a good bloak and contact Marko Z or James The if you really want this. Advocating on here won’t do you any good unless you do it yourself. This is the message I preach to other blind folks here in the US. No matter where you live its best you do it yourself.

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 

From: Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 12:05 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Blog post on Firefox 58.

 

I am going to sound like a broken bit of 78 record here, and I do apologise.

Please could we have some optional sounds with Firefox so we can hear when

downloads are complete, when clicking something actually worked and when the

page is fully loaded again.

 

I grew up with ie and only went to firefox when navigational sounds was

released, since certain ahem, other browsers in later windows decided to not

go to sounds.

There has been a polarisation of views on this list, but I do seriously

feel, from the people who do not use this list and are only interested in

using their computers and are not expert users, I need to act as an advocate

and say that having no sound is very very off-putting to such users.

Thank you and have a safe trip home...

last one out turns off the lights

Brian

 

bglists@...

Sent via blueyonder.

Please address personal email to:-

briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'

in the display name field.

----- Original Message -----

From: "Robert Kingett" <kingettr@...>

To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>

Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 2:08 PM

Subject: [nvda] Blog post on Firefox 58.

 

 

> The below is a blog post explaining FF 58. It works better.

> https://www.marcozehe.de/2018/01/16/nvda-firefox-58-team-regaining-strength/

>

>

 

 

 

 


Lino Morales
 

That’s the whole point I’m trying to make here Rosemarie. Its not nessessary.

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 

From: Rosemarie Chavarria
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 12:35 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Blog post on Firefox 58.

 

Hi, Lino,

 

I don't need special sounds to tell me when a web site has finished loading. Brian, listen for the word "busy" when a page has finished loading. Why do we have to have special sounds for that?

 

Rosemarie

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Lino Morales
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 9:30 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Blog post on Firefox 58.

 

Brian you just can’t let go ae? I don’t need extra sounds for this that and the other. Be a good bloak and contact Marko Z or James The if you really want this. Advocating on here won’t do you any good unless you do it yourself. This is the message I preach to other blind folks here in the US. No matter where you live its best you do it yourself.

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 

From: Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 12:05 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Blog post on Firefox 58.

 

I am going to sound like a broken bit of 78 record here, and I do apologise.

Please could we have some optional sounds with Firefox so we can hear when

downloads are complete, when clicking something actually worked and when the

page is fully loaded again.

 

I grew up with ie and only went to firefox when navigational sounds was

released, since certain ahem, other browsers in later windows decided to not

go to sounds.

There has been a polarisation of views on this list, but I do seriously

feel, from the people who do not use this list and are only interested in

using their computers and are not expert users, I need to act as an advocate

and say that having no sound is very very off-putting to such users.

Thank you and have a safe trip home...

last one out turns off the lights

Brian

 

bglists@...

Sent via blueyonder.

Please address personal email to:-

briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'

in the display name field.

----- Original Message -----

From: "Robert Kingett" <kingettr@...>

To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>

Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 2:08 PM

Subject: [nvda] Blog post on Firefox 58.

 

 

> The below is a blog post explaining FF 58. It works better.

> https://www.marcozehe.de/2018/01/16/nvda-firefox-58-team-regaining-strength/

>

>

 

 

 

 

 


Gene
 

Busy is what is said at times when a web page is loading.  When a page has finished loading, it starts reading automatically, if NVDA defaults are used.  And while a page is loading, you can't move around on the page.
 
I have no objection to wanting sounds.  My objection is in being so unyielding about sounds that you would, evidently, not use the newest version of Firefox even after the ESR is no longer being kept current with security updates.  I don't know if that's what you, Brian, are saying you will do, but you said you wouldn't use the newer versions of Firefox until there are sounds. 
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 11:34 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Blog post on Firefox 58.

Hi, Lino,

 

I don't need special sounds to tell me when a web site has finished loading. Brian, listen for the word "busy" when a page has finished loading. Why do we have to have special sounds for that?

 

Rosemarie

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Lino Morales
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 9:30 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Blog post on Firefox 58.

 

Brian you just can’t let go ae? I don’t need extra sounds for this that and the other. Be a good bloak and contact Marko Z or James The if you really want this. Advocating on here won’t do you any good unless you do it yourself. This is the message I preach to other blind folks here in the US. No matter where you live its best you do it yourself.

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 

From: Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 12:05 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Blog post on Firefox 58.

 

I am going to sound like a broken bit of 78 record here, and I do apologise.

Please could we have some optional sounds with Firefox so we can hear when

downloads are complete, when clicking something actually worked and when the

page is fully loaded again.

 

I grew up with ie and only went to firefox when navigational sounds was

released, since certain ahem, other browsers in later windows decided to not

go to sounds.

There has been a polarisation of views on this list, but I do seriously

feel, from the people who do not use this list and are only interested in

using their computers and are not expert users, I need to act as an advocate

and say that having no sound is very very off-putting to such users.

Thank you and have a safe trip home...

last one out turns off the lights

Brian

 

bglists@...

Sent via blueyonder.

Please address personal email to:-

briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'

in the display name field.

----- Original Message -----

From: "Robert Kingett" <kingettr@...>

To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>

Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 2:08 PM

Subject: [nvda] Blog post on Firefox 58.

 

 

> The below is a blog post explaining FF 58. It works better.

> https://www.marcozehe.de/2018/01/16/nvda-firefox-58-team-regaining-strength/

>

>

 

 

 

 


Brian's Mail list account <bglists@...>
 

True but often it says nothing at all or gets just unknown for a while, ie I tried on the latest snap of master to view the whats new and here is the log and the developer info from the resulting window. This happens a lot with Firefox randomly.

IO - inputCore.InputManager.executeGesture (09:11:08.651):

Input: kb(desktop):NVDA+n

IO - speech.speak (09:11:08.721):

Speaking [LangChangeCommand ('en_GB'), u'NVDA menu']

IO - inputCore.InputManager.executeGesture (09:11:10.555):

Input: kb(desktop):downArrow

IO - speech.speak (09:11:10.608):

Speaking [LangChangeCommand ('en_GB'), u'Preferences subMenu p']

IO - inputCore.InputManager.executeGesture (09:11:11.028):

Input: kb(desktop):downArrow

IO - speech.speak (09:11:11.075):

Speaking [LangChangeCommand ('en_GB'), u'Tools subMenu t']

IO - inputCore.InputManager.executeGesture (09:11:11.427):

Input: kb(desktop):downArrow

IO - speech.speak (09:11:11.463):

Speaking [LangChangeCommand ('en_GB'), u'Help subMenu h']

IO - inputCore.InputManager.executeGesture (09:11:11.900):

Input: kb(desktop):enter

IO - speech.speak (09:11:11.953):

Speaking [LangChangeCommand ('en_GB'), u'User Guide u 1 of 10']

IO - inputCore.InputManager.executeGesture (09:11:12.707):

Input: kb(desktop):downArrow

IO - speech.speak (09:11:12.757):

Speaking [LangChangeCommand ('en_GB'), u'Commands Quick Reference q 2 of 10']

IO - inputCore.InputManager.executeGesture (09:11:13.444):

Input: kb(desktop):downArrow

IO - speech.speak (09:11:13.492):

Speaking [LangChangeCommand ('en_GB'), u"What's new n 3 of 10"]

IO - inputCore.InputManager.executeGesture (09:11:14.628):

Input: kb(desktop):enter

IO - speech.speak (09:11:14.694):

Speaking [LangChangeCommand ('en_GB'), u'Inbox - Outlook Express - Brians lists account BGlists']

IO - speech.speak (09:11:14.696):

Speaking [LangChangeCommand ('en_GB'), u'Outlook Express Message List list']

IO - speech.speak (09:11:14.750):

Speaking [LangChangeCommand ('en_GB'), u'From: ktnews downstairs (Brian Gaff); Subject: not a lot; Received: 18/12/2017 12:56 89 of 89']

DEBUGWARNING - watchdog._watcher (09:11:16.111):

Trying to recover from freeze, core stack:

File "nvda.pyw", line 212, in <module>

File "core.pyc", line 473, in main

File "wx\_core.pyc", line 8657, in MainLoop

File "wx\_core.pyc", line 7952, in MainLoop

File "core.pyc", line 443, in Notify

File "IAccessibleHandler.pyc", line 880, in pumpAll

File "IAccessibleHandler.pyc", line 754, in processForegroundWinEvent

File "IAccessibleHandler.pyc", line 529, in winEventToNVDAEvent

File "NVDAObjects\IAccessible\__init__.pyc", line 37, in getNVDAObjectFromEvent

File "IAccessibleHandler.pyc", line 339, in accessibleObjectFromEvent

File "oleacc.pyc", line 240, in AccessibleObjectFromEvent

 

DEBUGWARNING - core.CorePump.Notify (09:11:16.211):

errors in this core pump cycle

Traceback (most recent call last):

File "core.pyc", line 443, in Notify

File "IAccessibleHandler.pyc", line 880, in pumpAll

File "IAccessibleHandler.pyc", line 754, in processForegroundWinEvent

File "IAccessibleHandler.pyc", line 529, in winEventToNVDAEvent

File "NVDAObjects\IAccessible\__init__.pyc", line 43, in getNVDAObjectFromEvent

File "NVDAObjects\__init__.pyc", line 62, in __call__

File "NVDAObjects\__init__.pyc", line 201, in findBestAPIClass

File "NVDAObjects\IAccessible\MSHTML.pyc", line 454, in kwargsFromSuper

File "watchdog.pyc", line 202, in _COMError_init

CallCancelled

DEBUGWARNING - NVDAObjects.IAccessible.IAccessible._get_IAccessibleRole (09:11:16.411):

accRole failed: (-2147024809, 'The parameter is incorrect.', (None, None, None, 0, None))

DEBUGWARNING - watchdog._watcher (09:11:16.719):

Trying to recover from freeze, core stack:

File "nvda.pyw", line 212, in <module>

File "core.pyc", line 473, in main

File "wx\_core.pyc", line 8657, in MainLoop

File "wx\_core.pyc", line 7952, in MainLoop

File "core.pyc", line 443, in Notify

File "IAccessibleHandler.pyc", line 894, in pumpAll

File "IAccessibleHandler.pyc", line 617, in processGenericWinEvent

File "IAccessibleHandler.pyc", line 529, in winEventToNVDAEvent

File "NVDAObjects\IAccessible\__init__.pyc", line 43, in getNVDAObjectFromEvent

File "NVDAObjects\__init__.pyc", line 72, in __call__

File "NVDAObjects\IAccessible\__init__.pyc", line 615, in __init__

File "comtypes\__init__.pyc", line 1158, in QueryInterface

 

DEBUGWARNING - core.CorePump.Notify (09:11:16.769):

errors in this core pump cycle

Traceback (most recent call last):

File "core.pyc", line 443, in Notify

File "IAccessibleHandler.pyc", line 894, in pumpAll

File "IAccessibleHandler.pyc", line 617, in processGenericWinEvent

File "IAccessibleHandler.pyc", line 529, in winEventToNVDAEvent

File "NVDAObjects\IAccessible\__init__.pyc", line 43, in getNVDAObjectFromEvent

File "NVDAObjects\__init__.pyc", line 72, in __call__

File "watchdog.pyc", line 202, in _COMError_init

CallCancelled

DEBUGWARNING - watchdog._watcher (09:11:17.443):

Trying to recover from freeze, core stack:

File "nvda.pyw", line 212, in <module>

File "core.pyc", line 473, in main

File "wx\_core.pyc", line 8657, in MainLoop

File "wx\_core.pyc", line 7952, in MainLoop

File "core.pyc", line 443, in Notify

File "IAccessibleHandler.pyc", line 880, in pumpAll

File "IAccessibleHandler.pyc", line 654, in processFocusWinEvent

File "IAccessibleHandler.pyc", line 529, in winEventToNVDAEvent

File "NVDAObjects\IAccessible\__init__.pyc", line 37, in getNVDAObjectFromEvent

File "IAccessibleHandler.pyc", line 339, in accessibleObjectFromEvent

File "oleacc.pyc", line 240, in AccessibleObjectFromEvent

 

DEBUGWARNING - core.CorePump.Notify (09:11:17.542):

errors in this core pump cycle

Traceback (most recent call last):

File "core.pyc", line 443, in Notify

File "IAccessibleHandler.pyc", line 880, in pumpAll

File "IAccessibleHandler.pyc", line 654, in processFocusWinEvent

File "IAccessibleHandler.pyc", line 529, in winEventToNVDAEvent

File "NVDAObjects\IAccessible\__init__.pyc", line 43, in getNVDAObjectFromEvent

File "NVDAObjects\__init__.pyc", line 72, in __call__

File "watchdog.pyc", line 202, in _COMError_init

CallCancelled

IO - speech.speak (09:11:17.911):

Speaking [LangChangeCommand ('en_GB'), u"What's New in NVDA - Mozilla Firefox"]

DEBUGWARNING - NVDAObjects.IAccessible.IAccessible._get_IAccessibleRole (09:11:17.913):

accRole failed: (-2147024809, 'The parameter is incorrect.', (None, None, None, 0, None))

IO - speech.speak (09:11:17.915):

Speaking [LangChangeCommand ('en_GB'), u'unknown']

IO - inputCore.InputManager.executeGesture (09:11:37.437):

Input: kb(desktop):NVDA+f1

DEBUGWARNING - NVDAObjects.IAccessible.IAccessible._get_IAccessibleRole (09:11:37.450):

accRole failed: (-2147024809, 'The parameter is incorrect.', (None, None, None, 0, None))

INFO - globalCommands.GlobalCommands.script_navigatorObject_devInfo (09:11:37.542):

Developer info for navigator object:

name: None

role: ROLE_UNKNOWN

states:

isFocusable: False

hasFocus: False

Python object: <NVDAObjects.IAccessible.IAccessible object at 0x055D7910>

Python class mro: (<class 'NVDAObjects.IAccessible.IAccessible'>, <class 'NVDAObjects.window.Window'>, <class 'NVDAObjects.NVDAObject'>, <class 'documentBase.TextContainerObject'>, <class 'baseObject.ScriptableObject'>, <class 'baseObject.AutoPropertyObject'>, <type 'object'>)

description: None

location: None

value: None

appModule: <'firefox' (appName u'firefox', process ID 1088) at address 561af30>

appModule.productName: u'Firefox'

appModule.productVersion: u'52.5.3'

TextInfo: <class 'NVDAObjects.NVDAObjectTextInfo'>

windowHandle: 590470

windowClassName: u'MozillaWindowClass'

windowControlID: 0

windowStyle: 399441920

windowThreadID: 2412

windowText: u"What's New in NVDA - Mozilla Firefox"

displayText: exception: 'NoneType' object is not iterable

IAccessibleObject: <POINTER(IAccessible) ptr=0x76ac988 at 53bca80>

IAccessibleChildID: -29

IAccessible event parameters: windowHandle=590470, objectID=-4, childID=-29

IAccessible accName: exception: (-2147024809, 'The parameter is incorrect.', (None, None, None, 0, None))

IAccessible accRole: exception: (-2147024809, 'The parameter is incorrect.', (None, None, None, 0, None))

IAccessible accState: exception: (-2147024809, 'The parameter is incorrect.', (None, None, None, 0, None))

IAccessible accDescription: exception: (-2147024809, 'The parameter is incorrect.', (None, None, None, 0, None))

IAccessible accValue: exception: (-2147024809, 'The parameter is incorrect.', (None, None, None, 0, None))

 



Brian


bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk, putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Gene" <gsasner@ripco.com>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 7:46 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Blog post on Firefox 58.


Busy is what is said at times when a web page is loading. When a page has finished loading, it starts reading automatically, if NVDA defaults are used. And while a page is loading, you can't move around on the page.

I have no objection to wanting sounds. My objection is in being so unyielding about sounds that you would, evidently, not use the newest version of Firefox even after the ESR is no longer being kept current with security updates. I don't know if that's what you, Brian, are saying you will do, but you said you wouldn't use the newer versions of Firefox until there are sounds.

Gene
----- Original Message -----

From: Rosemarie Chavarria
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 11:34 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Blog post on Firefox 58.


Hi, Lino,



I don't need special sounds to tell me when a web site has finished loading. Brian, listen for the word "busy" when a page has finished loading. Why do we have to have special sounds for that?



Rosemarie



From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Lino Morales
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 9:30 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Blog post on Firefox 58.



Brian you just can’t let go ae? I don’t need extra sounds for this that and the other. Be a good bloak and contact Marko Z or James The if you really want this. Advocating on here won’t do you any good unless you do it yourself. This is the message I preach to other blind folks here in the US. No matter where you live its best you do it yourself.



Sent from Mail for Windows 10



From: Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 12:05 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Blog post on Firefox 58.



I am going to sound like a broken bit of 78 record here, and I do apologise.

Please could we have some optional sounds with Firefox so we can hear when

downloads are complete, when clicking something actually worked and when the

page is fully loaded again.



I grew up with ie and only went to firefox when navigational sounds was

released, since certain ahem, other browsers in later windows decided to not

go to sounds.

There has been a polarisation of views on this list, but I do seriously

feel, from the people who do not use this list and are only interested in

using their computers and are not expert users, I need to act as an advocate

and say that having no sound is very very off-putting to such users.

Thank you and have a safe trip home...

last one out turns off the lights

Brian



bglists@blueyonder.co.uk

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----- Original Message -----

From: "Robert Kingett" <kingettr@gmail.com>

To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>

Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 2:08 PM

Subject: [nvda] Blog post on Firefox 58.





The below is a blog post explaining FF 58. It works better.
https://www.marcozehe.de/2018/01/16/nvda-firefox-58-team-regaining-strength/


Brian's Mail list account <bglists@...>
 

Not to you its not but everyone has different needs and to remove a feature with no ability to recreate it is shoddy policy.
Brian

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----- Original Message -----
From: "Lino Morales" <linomorales001@gmail.com>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 5:40 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Blog post on Firefox 58.


That’s the whole point I’m trying to make here Rosemarie. Its not nessessary.

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

From: Rosemarie Chavarria
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 12:35 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Blog post on Firefox 58.

Hi, Lino,

I don't need special sounds to tell me when a web site has finished loading. Brian, listen for the word "busy" when a page has finished loading. Why do we have to have special sounds for that?

Rosemarie

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Lino Morales
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 9:30 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Blog post on Firefox 58.

Brian you just can’t let go ae? I don’t need extra sounds for this that and the other. Be a good bloak and contact Marko Z or James The if you really want this. Advocating on here won’t do you any good unless you do it yourself. This is the message I preach to other blind folks here in the US. No matter where you live its best you do it yourself.

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

From: Brian's Mail list account via Groups.Io
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 12:05 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Blog post on Firefox 58.

I am going to sound like a broken bit of 78 record here, and I do apologise.
Please could we have some optional sounds with Firefox so we can hear when
downloads are complete, when clicking something actually worked and when the
page is fully loaded again.

I grew up with ie and only went to firefox when navigational sounds was
released, since certain ahem, other browsers in later windows decided to not
go to sounds.
There has been a polarisation of views on this list, but I do seriously
feel, from the people who do not use this list and are only interested in
using their computers and are not expert users, I need to act as an advocate
and say that having no sound is very very off-putting to such users.
Thank you and have a safe trip home...
last one out turns off the lights
Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk, putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Robert Kingett" <kingettr@gmail.com>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 2:08 PM
Subject: [nvda] Blog post on Firefox 58.


The below is a blog post explaining FF 58. It works better.

https://www.marcozehe.de/2018/01/16/nvda-firefox-58-team-regaining-strength/





 

I did some digging for you! This is why I love blind people so much. Giving opinions rather than answering your question, to the person who is looking for the sound scheme. It's not worth hearing all opinions, much less explain it to a super blindy. :, don't bother with them. They are not worth a reply. Anyway, I did some digging for you and, although, it is not browser focused, it may help. It is a sound scheme for windows that covers the whole operating system, even web browsers. The link is below.

http://onj3.andrelouis.com/programs/44.1k%20-%20soundscheme%20for%20windows.exe


Brian's Mail list account <bglists@...>
 

I suspect though that it may not have any events passed to it from Firefox, if there was this, then there would not have been any need for navigational sounds to start with as we could just use the windows ones already there.
Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
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----- Original Message -----
From: "Robert Kingett" <kingettr@gmail.com>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Thursday, January 18, 2018 3:13 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Blog post on Firefox 58.


I did some digging for you! This is why I love blind people so much. Giving opinions rather than answering your question, to the person who is looking for the sound scheme. It's not worth hearing all opinions, much less explain it to a super blindy. :, don't bother with them. They are not worth a reply. Anyway, I did some digging for you and, although, it is not browser focused, it may help. It is a sound scheme for windows that covers the whole operating system, even web browsers. The link is below.

http://onj3.andrelouis.com/programs/44.1k%20-%20soundscheme%20for%20windows.exe


Gene
 

It has nothing to do with superblind people nor with blind people at all, whom you generalize about and disparage by saying that they just offer opinions.  I didn't look up such information because I thought there was unlikely to be another such add on. There are lots of blind people who use firefox who don't use sounds and they aren't, nor do they hold themselves out as super blind people. 
 
If you finally looked something up, after this discussion has gone on for a month, fine.  I'm glad you found something that may be useful.  You can present such information without disparaging others.  You can also express an opinion such as, some blind people are too intent on convincing others to do something another way.  That isn't disparaging or dismissive.
 
As to the issue of sounds, my position is that if you use an older version of a browser which has stopped being supported just because of sounds, that is an overreliance on sounds.  Sacrificing security for sounds when there are other ways to tell when a page finishes loading and of following downloads is, in my opinion, a bad idea.  Things aren't ideal.  In deciding whether to hear sounds or have a safer computer, I think choosing sounds is a bad choice.  there is nothing superblind about it.  If you disagree, fine.  You can express your disagreement without being disparaging.
 
Gene 

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Thursday, January 18, 2018 9:13 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Blog post on Firefox 58.

I did some digging for you! This is why I love blind people so much. Giving opinions rather than answering your question, to the person who is looking for the sound scheme. It's not worth hearing all opinions, much less explain it to a super blindy. :, don't bother with them. They are not worth a reply. Anyway, I did some digging for you and, although, it is not browser focused, it may help. It is a sound scheme for windows that covers the whole operating system, even web browsers. The link is below.

http://onj3.andrelouis.com/programs/44.1k%20-%20soundscheme%20for%20windows.exe


 

Hello
thanks for getting this to me.

On 1/18/2018 8:13 AM, Robert Kingett wrote:
I did some digging for you! This is why I love blind people so much. Giving opinions rather than answering your question, to the person who is looking for the sound scheme. It's not worth hearing all opinions, much less explain it to a super blindy. :, don't bother with them. They are not worth a reply. Anyway, I did some digging for you and, although, it is not browser focused, it may help. It is a sound scheme for windows that covers the whole operating system, even web browsers. The link is below.

http://onj3.andrelouis.com/programs/44.1k%20-%20soundscheme%20for%20windows.exe


Brian's Mail list account <bglists@...>
 

Hmm, the Firefox esr is supported after all, but IE is not as far as I can tell.
As for over relience, well, that depends on your experience of what is reliable and everyone probably has their own anecdote about this.
Just take a look at my experiences with problems with nvda and browsers no matter what computer I'm using. its all probably due to something as yet unknown, so you find work arounds, in my case its sounds.
Brian

bglists@blueyonder.co.uk
Sent via blueyonder.
Please address personal email to:-
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk, putting 'Brian Gaff'
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----- Original Message -----
From: "Gene" <gsasner@ripco.com>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Thursday, January 18, 2018 5:16 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Blog post on Firefox 58.


It has nothing to do with superblind people nor with blind people at all, whom you generalize about and disparage by saying that they just offer opinions. I didn't look up such information because I thought there was unlikely to be another such add on. There are lots of blind people who use firefox who don't use sounds and they aren't, nor do they hold themselves out as super blind people.

If you finally looked something up, after this discussion has gone on for a month, fine. I'm glad you found something that may be useful. You can present such information without disparaging others. You can also express an opinion such as, some blind people are too intent on convincing others to do something another way. That isn't disparaging or dismissive.

As to the issue of sounds, my position is that if you use an older version of a browser which has stopped being supported just because of sounds, that is an overreliance on sounds. Sacrificing security for sounds when there are other ways to tell when a page finishes loading and of following downloads is, in my opinion, a bad idea. Things aren't ideal. In deciding whether to hear sounds or have a safer computer, I think choosing sounds is a bad choice. there is nothing superblind about it. If you disagree, fine. You can express your disagreement without being disparaging.

Gene
----- Original Message -----

From: Robert Kingett
Sent: Thursday, January 18, 2018 9:13 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Blog post on Firefox 58.


I did some digging for you! This is why I love blind people so much. Giving opinions rather than answering your question, to the person who is looking for the sound scheme. It's not worth hearing all opinions, much less explain it to a super blindy. :, don't bother with them. They are not worth a reply. Anyway, I did some digging for you and, although, it is not browser focused, it may help. It is a sound scheme for windows that covers the whole operating system, even web browsers. The link is below.

http://onj3.andrelouis.com/programs/44.1k%20-%20soundscheme%20for%20windows.exe


Clare Page <clare.page@...>
 

Hi !

I have used the Windows sound scheme for which a link was posted below for a ong time now, both with Internet Explorer and with Firefox, and I can report from my own experience that this sound scheme only adds browser sounds to Firefox if the Navigational Sounds Firefox add-on is used. Therefore, as I gather that Navigational Sounds doesn’t work with Firefox Quantum, the sound scheme won’t restore sounds in Firefox 57 or later, even though you will get other sounds for the rest of Windows if you use the scheme.

Sorry this doesn’t help people who prefer sounds in their web browsers, but I felt I should point out that the sound scheme mentioned below will not solve the problem of there being no sounds in the newest versions of Firefox and no possibility of installing Navigational Sounds as an add-on for those new versions.

Bye for now!

From Clare

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Robert Kingett
Sent: jeudi 18 janvier 2018 16:14
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Blog post on Firefox 58.

 

I did some digging for you! This is why I love blind people so much. Giving opinions rather than answering your question, to the person who is looking for the sound scheme. It's not worth hearing all opinions, much less explain it to a super blindy. :, don't bother with them. They are not worth a reply. Anyway, I did some digging for you and, although, it is not browser focused, it may help. It is a sound scheme for windows that covers the whole operating system, even web browsers. The link is below.

http://onj3.andrelouis.com/programs/44.1k%20-%20soundscheme%20for%20windows.exe


Robert Mendoza
 

Unfortunately, some of the addons is not usable if you are using Firefox Quantum that somehow could not adhere as for specific function or purpose I do hope they would able to came up resolution to handle this problem in terms of accessibility. Wondering they would have predict this on hand cause seemingly impact lots of users. Not sure if anyone here reported this to the Mozillian space so that they are aware of. 


Robert Mendoza

On 1/19/2018 7:16 PM, Clare Page wrote:

Hi !

I have used the Windows sound scheme for which a link was posted below for a ong time now, both with Internet Explorer and with Firefox, and I can report from my own experience that this sound scheme only adds browser sounds to Firefox if the Navigational Sounds Firefox add-on is used. Therefore, as I gather that Navigational Sounds doesn’t work with Firefox Quantum, the sound scheme won’t restore sounds in Firefox 57 or later, even though you will get other sounds for the rest of Windows if you use the scheme.

Sorry this doesn’t help people who prefer sounds in their web browsers, but I felt I should point out that the sound scheme mentioned below will not solve the problem of there being no sounds in the newest versions of Firefox and no possibility of installing Navigational Sounds as an add-on for those new versions.

Bye for now!

From Clare

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Robert Kingett
Sent: jeudi 18 janvier 2018 16:14
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Blog post on Firefox 58.

 

I did some digging for you! This is why I love blind people so much. Giving opinions rather than answering your question, to the person who is looking for the sound scheme. It's not worth hearing all opinions, much less explain it to a super blindy. :, don't bother with them. They are not worth a reply. Anyway, I did some digging for you and, although, it is not browser focused, it may help. It is a sound scheme for windows that covers the whole operating system, even web browsers. The link is below.

http://onj3.andrelouis.com/programs/44.1k%20-%20soundscheme%20for%20windows.exe



Robert Mendoza
 

In addition, I did tested this one time to my Windows 10 and nothing to be against in terms of the speed. However, upon downloading certain file the progress bar could not even heard in the background and not sure what exactly causing of no sounds of it.


Robert Mendoza
On 1/19/2018 8:40 PM, Robert Mendoza wrote:

Unfortunately, some of the addons is not usable if you are using Firefox Quantum that somehow could not adhere as for specific function or purpose I do hope they would able to came up resolution to handle this problem in terms of accessibility. Wondering they would have predict this on hand cause seemingly impact lots of users. Not sure if anyone here reported this to the Mozillian space so that they are aware of. 


Robert Mendoza

On 1/19/2018 7:16 PM, Clare Page wrote:

Hi !

I have used the Windows sound scheme for which a link was posted below for a ong time now, both with Internet Explorer and with Firefox, and I can report from my own experience that this sound scheme only adds browser sounds to Firefox if the Navigational Sounds Firefox add-on is used. Therefore, as I gather that Navigational Sounds doesn’t work with Firefox Quantum, the sound scheme won’t restore sounds in Firefox 57 or later, even though you will get other sounds for the rest of Windows if you use the scheme.

Sorry this doesn’t help people who prefer sounds in their web browsers, but I felt I should point out that the sound scheme mentioned below will not solve the problem of there being no sounds in the newest versions of Firefox and no possibility of installing Navigational Sounds as an add-on for those new versions.

Bye for now!

From Clare

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io [mailto:nvda@nvda.groups.io] On Behalf Of Robert Kingett
Sent: jeudi 18 janvier 2018 16:14
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] Blog post on Firefox 58.

 

I did some digging for you! This is why I love blind people so much. Giving opinions rather than answering your question, to the person who is looking for the sound scheme. It's not worth hearing all opinions, much less explain it to a super blindy. :, don't bother with them. They are not worth a reply. Anyway, I did some digging for you and, although, it is not browser focused, it may help. It is a sound scheme for windows that covers the whole operating system, even web browsers. The link is below.

http://onj3.andrelouis.com/programs/44.1k%20-%20soundscheme%20for%20windows.exe