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Showing a bit about object review

Gene
 

Given all the discussion of object review, I’ve prepared a short, or rather short, tutorial teaching something about object navigation and showing the difference between it and screen review.  Listening at a moderate speed, my guess is that it will take somewhere between about seven and ten minutes to listen to.  Of course, doing what I describe will take a little longer or perhaps more, depending on how much you want to play and repeat things to aid memory and perhaps understanding.
 
I hope some people find it useful. 
 
Many people may be wondering what is being talked about and this will give those who are curious some idea. 
I hope it also encourages those who would benefit from learning object navigation to do so.  It may also demystify the subject to an extent and give people more confidence that they can learn and understand object navigation.
 
I think most, perhaps almost all, of object navigation is better taught by having people do things rather than by mainly explaining them. 
 
This tutorial will teach something about moving in an object and from one object to another object.  It will also show how objects can vary radically in size and it may clear up confusion some people may have about when they are moving through an object or reviewing the screen.  I suspect a fair number of people may have this confusion.
 
I shall use desktop layout commands.  I don’t use nor know the laptop layout commands.  Someone may want to provide them.
 
We will use WordPad for our examples.
First, issue the command numpad insert plus numpad 1 until you hear no previous review mode.  That is to make sure you didn’t use screen review and forget to go back.  Object navigation is the default but I want to make sure everyone is using it.
 
Now, do the following:
Open WordPad.  Type a bit of text.  Now issue the close command.  You are in the are you sure dialog.
Press the following keys and listen to all speech.
Numpad 8.
Numpad 7.
Numpad 9.
Numpad 8 reads the current line in the object you are in.  You hear save.
Numpad 7 moves back one line in the object.
You hear top, save.
That’s because there is no previous line.
Numpad 9 moves you to the next line in the object.  You hear bottom, save because there is no next line.
This is a small object.  It is only one button.  Button isn’t announced for some reason but it is a save button.
Now, let’s move to the next object to the right.  Issue the command numpad insert plus numpad 9. 
You have now moved to the next object.  It is a bit of text, the do you want to save question.  For some reason, this dialog doesn’t work as expected when moving to next and previous objects.  Usually, if you move to the next and previous objects, you will get to the last one in the direction you are moving.  At that point, you will hear either no previous or no next.
To move to the right by object the command is numpad insert plus numpad 9.  To move to the left, the command is numpad insert numpad 7. 
Each time you move to another object, you can use the review keys I showed you earlier to see if you can move around the object and read the current line.  That is, numpad 7, back line, numpad 8, say current line, numpad 9, forward one line.
 
If you were using screen review, you would use the same commands to review the screen, numpad 8, 7, and 9.  You would be moving in the screen, not specifically in an object. 
 
At times objects are small as these are, at times they are very large. 
 
To see a very large or a larger object, finish closing WordPad, then open a large document in WordPad.  Either that or open WordPad and type a number of lines of text. 
If you use numpad 9 to move through the document, you will find that you can move through the entire document.  The entire document is one object. 
If you were using screen review, you would only be able to move as far up or down as the screen that is now visible. 
 
The command to go into screen review, if you want to experiment, is numpad insert plus numpad 7.  There may be another mode, document review, but keep moving until you get to screen review.  Don’t forget to go back to object review when you are finished in screen review.  If you don’t, some things you do may not work as expected.
 
There are times when you can see things using screen review that you can’t using object review.  There are times when the opposite is true.  One isn’t better or more useful than the other, though one may be of more use to a person, depending on how they use a computer, in other words, what programs they run and perhaps, how they work with certain programs. 
 
I hope this short tutorial is useful.
 
Gene
Louise Pfau
 

Thanks Gene.  I've saved this in a word document in my tutorials folder for future reference.

Louise
Gene
 

unfortunately, I haven’t looked at tutorials on the subject so I can’t recommend one.  I don’t know if its necessary or if I would just be repeating what has been done well, but I’ve been thinking of creating a full tutorial on the subject. 
 
Gene

-----Original Message-----
Sent: Saturday, December 18, 2021 5:16 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Showing a bit about object review
 
Thanks Gene.  I've saved this in a word document in my tutorials folder for future reference.

Louise

Louise Pfau
 

Hi Gene.  I just read the tutorial, and I've caught a couple of errors.  The commands for moving to the previous/next objects are NVDA+NUMPAD 4/6.  I checked the user guide to make sure.

Louise
Gene
 

If I do a full tutorial, I’ll change it.  I think of the command as numpad insert 4 and 6 because, using the desktop layout, that is the most convenient way to issue the command for most people, I would think. 
 
Thanks for telling me.  Your statement is more accurate in terms of completeness and accuracy.
 
Gene

-----Original Message-----
Sent: Saturday, December 18, 2021 7:52 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Showing a bit about object review
 
Hi Gene.  I just read the tutorial, and I've caught a couple of errors.  The commands for moving to the previous/next objects are NVDA+NUMPAD 4/6.  I checked the user guide to make sure.

Louise

Tyler Wood
 

Hello,
Thank you for posting this. Having actual practical demonstrations of this is very useful to some and really does help folks figure out what mode differentiates from another.


On Sat, Dec 18, 2021 at 5:07 PM Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:
Given all the discussion of object review, I’ve prepared a short, or rather short, tutorial teaching something about object navigation and showing the difference between it and screen review.  Listening at a moderate speed, my guess is that it will take somewhere between about seven and ten minutes to listen to.  Of course, doing what I describe will take a little longer or perhaps more, depending on how much you want to play and repeat things to aid memory and perhaps understanding.
 
I hope some people find it useful. 
 
Many people may be wondering what is being talked about and this will give those who are curious some idea. 
I hope it also encourages those who would benefit from learning object navigation to do so.  It may also demystify the subject to an extent and give people more confidence that they can learn and understand object navigation.
 
I think most, perhaps almost all, of object navigation is better taught by having people do things rather than by mainly explaining them. 
 
This tutorial will teach something about moving in an object and from one object to another object.  It will also show how objects can vary radically in size and it may clear up confusion some people may have about when they are moving through an object or reviewing the screen.  I suspect a fair number of people may have this confusion.
 
I shall use desktop layout commands.  I don’t use nor know the laptop layout commands.  Someone may want to provide them.
 
We will use WordPad for our examples.
First, issue the command numpad insert plus numpad 1 until you hear no previous review mode.  That is to make sure you didn’t use screen review and forget to go back.  Object navigation is the default but I want to make sure everyone is using it.
 
Now, do the following:
Open WordPad.  Type a bit of text.  Now issue the close command.  You are in the are you sure dialog.
Press the following keys and listen to all speech.
Numpad 8.
Numpad 7.
Numpad 9.
Numpad 8 reads the current line in the object you are in.  You hear save.
Numpad 7 moves back one line in the object.
You hear top, save.
That’s because there is no previous line.
Numpad 9 moves you to the next line in the object.  You hear bottom, save because there is no next line.
This is a small object.  It is only one button.  Button isn’t announced for some reason but it is a save button.
Now, let’s move to the next object to the right.  Issue the command numpad insert plus numpad 9. 
You have now moved to the next object.  It is a bit of text, the do you want to save question.  For some reason, this dialog doesn’t work as expected when moving to next and previous objects.  Usually, if you move to the next and previous objects, you will get to the last one in the direction you are moving.  At that point, you will hear either no previous or no next.
To move to the right by object the command is numpad insert plus numpad 9.  To move to the left, the command is numpad insert numpad 7. 
Each time you move to another object, you can use the review keys I showed you earlier to see if you can move around the object and read the current line.  That is, numpad 7, back line, numpad 8, say current line, numpad 9, forward one line.
 
If you were using screen review, you would use the same commands to review the screen, numpad 8, 7, and 9.  You would be moving in the screen, not specifically in an object. 
 
At times objects are small as these are, at times they are very large. 
 
To see a very large or a larger object, finish closing WordPad, then open a large document in WordPad.  Either that or open WordPad and type a number of lines of text. 
If you use numpad 9 to move through the document, you will find that you can move through the entire document.  The entire document is one object. 
If you were using screen review, you would only be able to move as far up or down as the screen that is now visible. 
 
The command to go into screen review, if you want to experiment, is numpad insert plus numpad 7.  There may be another mode, document review, but keep moving until you get to screen review.  Don’t forget to go back to object review when you are finished in screen review.  If you don’t, some things you do may not work as expected.
 
There are times when you can see things using screen review that you can’t using object review.  There are times when the opposite is true.  One isn’t better or more useful than the other, though one may be of more use to a person, depending on how they use a computer, in other words, what programs they run and perhaps, how they work with certain programs. 
 
I hope this short tutorial is useful.
 
Gene
Pele West
 

Hi Gene

Thank you so much for this tutorial. It is a great help.

Pele West
Gene
 

An important correction.
 
I just got a message pointing out that I gave two incorrect commands.  The commands for move to next object and move to previous object are numpad insert numpad 6 and numpad insert numpad 4. 
 
I looked at the tutorial before I sent it to look for errors but I didn’t realize I had made those.  Sometimes, you write something like a command and even when you review what you write, you don’t realize it is incorrect.  I’ve used those commands for years but for some reason, I was thinking about them incorrectly, even though I was using them while writing the tutorial to look at what I saw when moving that way in Wordpad.
 
I’ll send a corrected version of the tutorial to the list. 
 
Brian, would you please remove the first message giving the incorrect version from the archives?  Thank you.
 
Gene

-----Original Message-----
From: Gene
Sent: Saturday, December 18, 2021 5:07 PM
Subject: Showing a bit about object review
 
Given all the discussion of object review, I’ve prepared a short, or rather short, tutorial teaching something about object navigation and showing the difference between it and screen review.  Listening at a moderate speed, my guess is that it will take somewhere between about seven and ten minutes to listen to.  Of course, doing what I describe will take a little longer or perhaps more, depending on how much you want to play and repeat things to aid memory and perhaps understanding.
 
I hope some people find it useful. 
 
Many people may be wondering what is being talked about and this will give those who are curious some idea. 
I hope it also encourages those who would benefit from learning object navigation to do so.  It may also demystify the subject to an extent and give people more confidence that they can learn and understand object navigation.
 
I think most, perhaps almost all, of object navigation is better taught by having people do things rather than by mainly explaining them. 
 
This tutorial will teach something about moving in an object and from one object to another object.  It will also show how objects can vary radically in size and it may clear up confusion some people may have about when they are moving through an object or reviewing the screen.  I suspect a fair number of people may have this confusion.
 
I shall use desktop layout commands.  I don’t use nor know the laptop layout commands.  Someone may want to provide them.
 
We will use WordPad for our examples.
First, issue the command numpad insert plus numpad 1 until you hear no previous review mode.  That is to make sure you didn’t use screen review and forget to go back.  Object navigation is the default but I want to make sure everyone is using it.
 
Now, do the following:
Open WordPad.  Type a bit of text.  Now issue the close command.  You are in the are you sure dialog.
Press the following keys and listen to all speech.
Numpad 8.
Numpad 7.
Numpad 9.
Numpad 8 reads the current line in the object you are in.  You hear save.
Numpad 7 moves back one line in the object.
You hear top, save.
That’s because there is no previous line.
Numpad 9 moves you to the next line in the object.  You hear bottom, save because there is no next line.
This is a small object.  It is only one button.  Button isn’t announced for some reason but it is a save button.
Now, let’s move to the next object to the right.  Issue the command numpad insert plus numpad 9. 
You have now moved to the next object.  It is a bit of text, the do you want to save question.  For some reason, this dialog doesn’t work as expected when moving to next and previous objects.  Usually, if you move to the next and previous objects, you will get to the last one in the direction you are moving.  At that point, you will hear either no previous or no next.
To move to the right by object the command is numpad insert plus numpad 9.  To move to the left, the command is numpad insert numpad 7. 
Each time you move to another object, you can use the review keys I showed you earlier to see if you can move around the object and read the current line.  That is, numpad 7, back line, numpad 8, say current line, numpad 9, forward one line.
 
If you were using screen review, you would use the same commands to review the screen, numpad 8, 7, and 9.  You would be moving in the screen, not specifically in an object. 
 
At times objects are small as these are, at times they are very large. 
 
To see a very large or a larger object, finish closing WordPad, then open a large document in WordPad.  Either that or open WordPad and type a number of lines of text. 
If you use numpad 9 to move through the document, you will find that you can move through the entire document.  The entire document is one object. 
If you were using screen review, you would only be able to move as far up or down as the screen that is now visible. 
 
The command to go into screen review, if you want to experiment, is numpad insert plus numpad 7.  There may be another mode, document review, but keep moving until you get to screen review.  Don’t forget to go back to object review when you are finished in screen review.  If you don’t, some things you do may not work as expected.
 
There are times when you can see things using screen review that you can’t using object review.  There are times when the opposite is true.  One isn’t better or more useful than the other, though one may be of more use to a person, depending on how they use a computer, in other words, what programs they run and perhaps, how they work with certain programs. 
 
I hope this short tutorial is useful.
 
Gene
Gene
 

This is a corrected version of the tutorial I sent the list.  I made an error in giving the move to next object and move to previous object commands in the original version.  The correct commands are move to next object, numpad insert plus numpad 6.  Move to previous object, numpad insert plus numpad 4.  I corrected the commands in the tutorial itself but I’m stating them here as well.
 
the tutorial begins immediately below.
 
Given all the discussion of object review, I’ve prepared a short, or rather short, tutorial teaching something about object navigation and showing the difference between it and screen review.  Listening at a moderate speed, my guess is that it will take somewhere between about seven and ten minutes to listen to.  Of course, doing what I describe will take a little longer or perhaps more, depending on how much you want to play and repeat things to aid memory and perhaps understanding.
 
I hope some people find it useful. 
 
Many people may be wondering what is being talked about and this will give those who are curious some idea. 
I hope it also encourages those who would benefit from learning object navigation to do so.  It may also demystify the subject to an extent and give people more confidence that they can learn and understand object navigation.
 
I think most, perhaps almost all, of object navigation is better taught by having people do things rather than by mainly explaining them. 
 
This tutorial will teach something about moving in an object and from one object to another object.  It will also show how objects can vary radically in size and it may clear up confusion some people may have about when they are moving through an object or reviewing the screen.  I suspect a fair number of people may have this confusion.
 
I shall use desktop layout commands.  I don’t use nor know the laptop layout commands.  Someone may want to provide them.
 
We will use WordPad for our examples.
First, issue the command numpad insert plus numpad 1 until you hear no previous review mode.  That is to make sure you didn’t use screen review and forget to go back.  Object navigation is the default but I want to make sure everyone is using it.
 
Now, do the following:
Open WordPad.  Type a bit of text.  Now issue the close command.  You are in the are you sure dialog.
Press the following keys and listen to all speech.
Numpad 8.
Numpad 7.
Numpad 9.
Numpad 8 reads the current line in the object you are in.  You hear save.
Numpad 7 moves back one line in the object.
You hear top, save.
That’s because there is no previous line.
Numpad 9 moves you to the next line in the object.  You hear bottom, save because there is no next line.
This is a small object.  It is only one button.  Button isn’t announced for some reason but it is a save button.
Now, let’s move to the next object to the right.  Issue the command numpad insert plus numpad 9. 
You have now moved to the next object.  It is a bit of text, the do you want to save question.  For some reason, this dialog doesn’t work as expected when moving to next and previous objects.  Usually, if you move to the next and previous objects, you will get to the last one in the direction you are moving.  At that point, you will hear either no previous or no next.
To move to the right by object the command is numpad insert plus numpad 6.  To move to the left, the command is numpad insert numpad 4. 
Each time you move to another object, you can use the review keys I showed you earlier to see if you can move around the object and read the current line.  That is, numpad 7, back line, numpad 8, say current line, numpad 9, forward one line.
 
If you were using screen review, you would use the same commands to review the screen, numpad 8, 7, and 9.  You would be moving in the screen, not specifically in an object. 
 
At times objects are small as these are, at times they are very large. 
 
To see a very large or a larger object, finish closing WordPad, then open a large document in WordPad.  Either that or open WordPad and type a number of lines of text. 
If you use numpad 9 to move through the document, you will find that you can move through the entire document.  The entire document is one object. 
If you were using screen review, you would only be able to move as far up or down as the screen that is now visible. 
 
The command to go into screen review, if you want to experiment, is numpad insert plus numpad 7.  There may be another mode, document review, but keep moving until you get to screen review.  Don’t forget to go back to object review when you are finished in screen review.  If you don’t, some things you do may not work as expected.
 
There are times when you can see things using screen review that you can’t using object review.  There are times when the opposite is true.  One isn’t better or more useful than the other, though one may be of more use to a person, depending on how they use a computer, in other words, what programs they run and perhaps, how they work with certain programs. 
 
I hope this short tutorial is useful.
 
Gene
Gene
 

I’m sorry, but I’m sending another copy of the corrected tutorial.  Please disregard the one I sent immediately previously.  I found an instance where I gave the move to next object command incorrectly that I didn’t realize was there.  I have now replaced all instances of the incorrect command.
 
This is a corrected version of the tutorial I sent the list.  I made an error in giving the move to next object and move to previous object commands in the original version.  The correct commands are move to next object, numpad insert plus numpad 6.  Move to previous object, numpad insert plus numpad 4.  I corrected the commands in the tutorial itself but I’m stating them here as well.
 
the tutorial begins immediately below.
 
Given all the discussion of object review, I’ve prepared a short, or rather short, tutorial teaching something about object navigation and showing the difference between it and screen review.  Listening at a moderate speed, my guess is that it will take somewhere between about seven and ten minutes to listen to.  Of course, doing what I describe will take a little longer or perhaps more, depending on how much you want to play and repeat things to aid memory and perhaps understanding.
 
I hope some people find it useful. 
 
Many people may be wondering what is being talked about and this will give those who are curious some idea. 
I hope it also encourages those who would benefit from learning object navigation to do so.  It may also demystify the subject to an extent and give people more confidence that they can learn and understand object navigation.
 
I think most, perhaps almost all, of object navigation is better taught by having people do things rather than by mainly explaining them. 
 
This tutorial will teach something about moving in an object and from one object to another object.  It will also show how objects can vary radically in size and it may clear up confusion some people may have about when they are moving through an object or reviewing the screen.  I suspect a fair number of people may have this confusion.
 
I shall use desktop layout commands.  I don’t use nor know the laptop layout commands.  Someone may want to provide them.
 
We will use WordPad for our examples.
First, issue the command numpad insert plus numpad 1 until you hear no previous review mode.  That is to make sure you didn’t use screen review and forget to go back.  Object navigation is the default but I want to make sure everyone is using it.
 
Now, do the following:
Open WordPad.  Type a bit of text.  Now issue the close command.  You are in the are you sure dialog.
Press the following keys and listen to all speech.
Numpad 8.
Numpad 7.
Numpad 9.
Numpad 8 reads the current line in the object you are in.  You hear save.
Numpad 7 moves back one line in the object.
You hear top, save.
That’s because there is no previous line.
Numpad 9 moves you to the next line in the object.  You hear bottom, save because there is no next line.
This is a small object.  It is only one button.  Button isn’t announced for some reason but it is a save button.
Now, let’s move to the next object to the right.  Issue the command numpad insert plus numpad 6. 
You have now moved to the next object.  It is a bit of text, the do you want to save question.  For some reason, this dialog doesn’t work as expected when moving to next and previous objects.  Usually, if you move to the next and previous objects, you will get to the last one in the direction you are moving.  At that point, you will hear either no previous or no next.
To move to the right by object the command is numpad insert plus numpad 6.  To move to the left, the command is numpad insert numpad 4. 
Each time you move to another object, you can use the review keys I showed you earlier to see if you can move around the object and read the current line.  That is, numpad 7, back line, numpad 8, say current line, numpad 9, forward one line.
 
If you were using screen review, you would use the same commands to review the screen, numpad 8, 7, and 9.  You would be moving in the screen, not specifically in an object. 
 
At times objects are small as these are, at times they are very large. 
 
To see a very large or a larger object, finish closing WordPad, then open a large document in WordPad.  Either that or open WordPad and type a number of lines of text. 
If you use numpad 9 to move through the document, you will find that you can move through the entire document.  The entire document is one object. 
If you were using screen review, you would only be able to move as far up or down as the screen that is now visible. 
 
The command to go into screen review, if you want to experiment, is numpad insert plus numpad 7.  There may be another mode, document review, but keep moving until you get to screen review.  Don’t forget to go back to object review when you are finished in screen review.  If you don’t, some things you do may not work as expected.
 
There are times when you can see things using screen review that you can’t using object review.  There are times when the opposite is true.  One isn’t better or more useful than the other, though one may be of more use to a person, depending on how they use a computer, in other words, what programs they run and perhaps, how they work with certain programs. 
 
I hope this short tutorial is useful.
 
Gene
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