On Wed, Aug 3, 2022 at 09:16 AM, Chris Smart wrote:

Have you tried Adobe Acrobat DC?

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Adobe Reader DC definitely supports the filling out of fillable PDF forms, and the saving of ones that permit you to save them once they're filled out.  Yes, there are fillable forms that do not allow you to save them and the process there is to fill them out then print the filled-out result.  They're less rare than you'd think.

Every fillable form I've ever dealt with, be it PDF or MS-Word, just involves traversing the form fields (including checkboxes, radio buttons, etc.) using TAB to move from item to item and doing whatever is appropriate for the particular item to fill it out.  A properly designed fillable form should announce the name/purpose of the item when you land in it and, if necessary, have associated help text if the name/purpose is not descriptive enough on its own.
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Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044  

The difference between a top-flight creative man and the hack is his ability to express powerful meanings indirectly.

         ~ Vance Packard

On Wed, Aug 3, 2022 at 10:48 AM, Sarah k Alawami wrote:

If the form is accessibly created, it will be accessible in word,

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I have literally never encountered a fillable PDF form that worked when opened in MS-Word.  If you have an example of such, I'd appreciate your sending it to me to play with.

The way fillable forms, whether PDF or native Word, are engineered makes any conversion of same to another file format such that the fillable aspect is no more.
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Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044  

The difference between a top-flight creative man and the hack is his ability to express powerful meanings indirectly.

         ~ Vance Packard

I'm assuming you're using Adobe Reader? We had an extensive discussion
about this a couple months ago, and the solution ended up being that
you have to force focus mode in order to make the fields work
properly.

On Wed, Aug 3, 2022 at 01:04 PM, Sarah k Alawami wrote:

The form was not accessible in adobe, at all.

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Sarah,

What was it's extension?   The probability that a fillable PDF form, with a PDF extension, would be accessible in Word and not in Acrobat (whether reader or full Acrobat) is pretty much zero.

There are, of course, fillable Word forms, and I've written about those at length before.  The DOTX extension indicates an actual form (whether fillable or not) that, when activated, will create an instance of the form that you later save.  It's possible to mail out such a form, after creation, that will have the DOCX extension.
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Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044  

The difference between a top-flight creative man and the hack is his ability to express powerful meanings indirectly.

         ~ Vance Packard

On Wed, Aug 3, 2022 at 02:03 PM, Sarah k Alawami wrote:

No, it was pdf, but the text was not written in form fields. It was just written:

name:

Date:

Address:

 

Something like that. There were no form fields. You had to write the answers with a virtual pen.

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And that's not a fillable form.  It's just a form, like a paper form, that allows you to fill it out with a virtual pen rather than printing it on paper and using a real pen.

And I'm not trying to be difficult or split-hairs, but "in the IT business" a fillable form is one that has form fields, checkboxes, etc., that can be traversed either by keyboard methods (Tabbing) or point and click and where you can type in edit boxes and do what's appropriate for checkboxes, radio buttons, etc.

Taking a paper form and typing it in a word processor, Acrobat, etc., but where the end result is simply an electronic version of the paper form is not considered to be a fillable form as the terminology has been used for as long as I've been in the IT business (and that's since 1985).  The electronic pen is a relatively new invention, but the fact that you can fill-in (non-accessibly) via the screen in a way that's exactly analogous to a paper form does not a "fillable form" make, at least not in the commonly construed way.  If that were considered to be a fillable form then a paper form should be considered "a fillable form," and it is not.

Fillable forms, although they can be fabulous accessibility tools, were not originally created with that express purpose in mind.  It was to allow you to fill them out entirely on a computer that had nothing but a keyboard (and mouse, for mouse users) and either save it once filled out or print it once it's filled out.  If you can't/couldn't do that it was simply a form that was to be printed and filled out by hand.  And heaven knows how many documents (regardless of file format) exist where that's exactly how they're set up and intended to be used.
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Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044  

The difference between a top-flight creative man and the hack is his ability to express powerful meanings indirectly.

         ~ Vance Packard

The key word is 'should' and many are what we might call a dogs dinner over here in the UK!

Brian

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On Thu, Aug 4, 2022 at 03:04 AM, Brian's Mail list account wrote:

The key word is 'should' and many are what we might call a dogs dinner over here in the UK!

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And even more key is making the distinction between a fillable form and a paper form that happens to have been typed out in the format to allow printing in Word, Acrobat, or similar.

While there are some fillable forms that are actually crap because the necessary information to make the items accessible is not included, that's an issue of its own.

But calling an electronic equivalent of a paper form a "fillable form" muddies the water so badly.  That's not a fillable form as the term has been used for a very, very long time.  The fact that you can fill out a form with pen on paper or electronic pen on screen does not make it a fillable form.  A fillable form is something else entirely.
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Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044  

The difference between a top-flight creative man and the hack is his ability to express powerful meanings indirectly.

         ~ Vance Packard