|
Hi all, Is the edit field on this page not a conventional one? I play Heardle every day, and it looks like the edit box on this page should work similar to that one, but I can't seem to get the one here to work. All I hear is NVDA telling me that this is an edit box that contains multiple selections, and how many results are available, but I can't seem to choose any results. The same happens when you're trying to select a school to send to, and I suspect I won't have to enter as much information as it's asking for if I could choose a result. Any help on this would be appreciated, as I've put this off for two weeks already. The link is https://tsorder.studentclearinghouse.org/school/selectThanks, Bob
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When you are on the line that says enter the name of the school,
press enter. That makes the field editable and you can then press
enter again to go into focus mode if you aren't automatically placed
in it.
Gene
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
On 5/28/2022 10:07 PM, Bob Cavanaugh
wrote:
Hi all,
Is the edit field on this page not a conventional one? I play Heardle
every day, and it looks like the edit box on this page should work
similar to that one, but I can't seem to get the one here to work. All
I hear is NVDA telling me that this is an edit box that contains
multiple selections, and how many results are available, but I can't
seem to choose any results. The same happens when you're trying to
select a school to send to, and I suspect I won't have to enter as
much information as it's asking for if I could choose a result. Any
help on this would be appreciated, as I've put this off for two weeks
already. The link is
https://tsorder.studentclearinghouse.org/school/select
Thanks,
Bob
|
|
|
Yes, that's standard edit commands. However, when I start typing the
name of a school, NVDA says "this is an auto complete element and
there are # results available. Keyboard users, use up and down arrows
to select an option." The # in the example is, as one might guess, an
actual number. However, when using up and down arrow with NVDA in
focus mode, I just get the same auto complete message and NVDA reads
what I've already typed in, it won't let me actually choose a result.
The question is how do I actually choose a result as intended?
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
On 5/28/22, Gene <gsasner@...> wrote: When you are on the line that says enter the name of the school, press
enter. That makes the field editable and you can then press enter again
to go into focus mode if you aren't automatically placed in it.
Gene
On 5/28/2022 10:07 PM, Bob Cavanaugh wrote:
Hi all,
Is the edit field on this page not a conventional one? I play Heardle
every day, and it looks like the edit box on this page should work
similar to that one, but I can't seem to get the one here to work. All
I hear is NVDA telling me that this is an edit box that contains
multiple selections, and how many results are available, but I can't
seem to choose any results. The same happens when you're trying to
select a school to send to, and I suspect I won't have to enter as
much information as it's asking for if I could choose a result. Any
help on this would be appreciated, as I've put this off for two weeks
already. The link is
https://tsorder.studentclearinghouse.org/school/select
Thanks,
Bob
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|
Sarah k Alawami
Try alt down arrow. I had to do this in a trail head module today.
Good luck.
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
-----Original Message----- From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Bob Cavanaugh Sent: Saturday, May 28, 2022 9:37 PM To: nvda@nvda.groups.io Subject: Re: [nvda] help with an edit field Yes, that's standard edit commands. However, when I start typing the name of a school, NVDA says "this is an auto complete element and there are # results available. Keyboard users, use up and down arrows to select an option." The # in the example is, as one might guess, an actual number. However, when using up and down arrow with NVDA in focus mode, I just get the same auto complete message and NVDA reads what I've already typed in, it won't let me actually choose a result. The question is how do I actually choose a result as intended? On 5/28/22, Gene <gsasner@...> wrote: When you are on the line that says enter the name of the school, press
enter. That makes the field editable and you can then press enter
again to go into focus mode if you aren't automatically placed in it.
Gene
On 5/28/2022 10:07 PM, Bob Cavanaugh wrote:
Hi all,
Is the edit field on this page not a conventional one? I play Heardle
every day, and it looks like the edit box on this page should work
similar to that one, but I can't seem to get the one here to work.
All I hear is NVDA telling me that this is an edit box that contains
multiple selections, and how many results are available, but I can't
seem to choose any results. The same happens when you're trying to
select a school to send to, and I suspect I won't have to enter as
much information as it's asking for if I could choose a result. Any
help on this would be appreciated, as I've put this off for two weeks
already. The link is
https://tsorder.studentclearinghouse.org/school/select
Thanks,
Bob
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Hmm, unless my NVDA is broken, I'd say that the JavaScript for the autocomplete has a bug in it that makes it really hard to pick the school unless you brute force the entries one by one.
As a workaround, are you able to request a transcript from your school's self-service portal? For example, I can sign into my school's information system and I see an option to request an official transcript and have it mailed somewhere that is independent from the national student clearinghouse.
I welcome any additional feedback from others; so far I've tried Chrome, Microsoft Edge, and Internet Explorer with the latest version of NVDA. I don't have Firefox installed on this machine for me to try at the moment, but that may be helpful.
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
On 5/28/2022 10:07 PM, Bob Cavanaugh wrote: Hi all,
Is the edit field on this page not a conventional one? I play Heardle
every day, and it looks like the edit box on this page should work
similar to that one, but I can't seem to get the one here to work. All
I hear is NVDA telling me that this is an edit box that contains
multiple selections, and how many results are available, but I can't
seem to choose any results. The same happens when you're trying to
select a school to send to, and I suspect I won't have to enter as
much information as it's asking for if I could choose a result. Any
help on this would be appreciated, as I've put this off for two weeks
already. The link is
https://tsorder.studentclearinghouse.org/school/select
Thanks,
Bob
|
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|
Have you tried it with Narrator? I have also found if you use chromvox it sometimes works.
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
-----Original Message----- From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Carlos Medrano Sent: Sunday, May 29, 2022 1:03 AM To: nvda@nvda.groups.io Subject: Re: [nvda] help with an edit field Hmm, unless my NVDA is broken, I'd say that the JavaScript for the autocomplete has a bug in it that makes it really hard to pick the school unless you brute force the entries one by one. As a workaround, are you able to request a transcript from your school's self-service portal? For example, I can sign into my school's information system and I see an option to request an official transcript and have it mailed somewhere that is independent from the national student clearinghouse. I welcome any additional feedback from others; so far I've tried Chrome, Microsoft Edge, and Internet Explorer with the latest version of NVDA. I don't have Firefox installed on this machine for me to try at the moment, but that may be helpful. On 5/28/2022 10:07 PM, Bob Cavanaugh wrote: Hi all,
Is the edit field on this page not a conventional one? I play Heardle
every day, and it looks like the edit box on this page should work
similar to that one, but I can't seem to get the one here to work. All
I hear is NVDA telling me that this is an edit box that contains
multiple selections, and how many results are available, but I can't
seem to choose any results. The same happens when you're trying to
select a school to send to, and I suspect I won't have to enter as
much information as it's asking for if I could choose a result. Any
help on this would be appreciated, as I've put this off for two weeks
already. The link is
https://tsorder.studentclearinghouse.org/school/select
Thanks,
Bob
|
|
|
No, it isn't standard. I had to press enter on select a school to
make the field editable in the first place. Then I had to press
enter again, since I am using manual switching in NVDA, to go into
forms mode. You may have to as well, since you are in a field that
is not initially editable.
As far as the select a school edit field is concerned, is that the
field you are discussing? I'll look at the field again but I
thought I heard select a number when I was
Gene
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
On 5/28/2022 11:36 PM, Bob Cavanaugh
wrote:
Yes, that's standard edit commands. However, when I start typing the
name of a school, NVDA says "this is an auto complete element and
there are # results available. Keyboard users, use up and down arrows
to select an option." The # in the example is, as one might guess, an
actual number. However, when using up and down arrow with NVDA in
focus mode, I just get the same auto complete message and NVDA reads
what I've already typed in, it won't let me actually choose a result.
The question is how do I actually choose a result as intended?
On 5/28/22, Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:
When you are on the line that says enter the name of the school, press
enter. That makes the field editable and you can then press enter again
to go into focus mode if you aren't automatically placed in it.
Gene
On 5/28/2022 10:07 PM, Bob Cavanaugh wrote:
Hi all,
Is the edit field on this page not a conventional one? I play Heardle
every day, and it looks like the edit box on this page should work
similar to that one, but I can't seem to get the one here to work. All
I hear is NVDA telling me that this is an edit box that contains
multiple selections, and how many results are available, but I can't
seem to choose any results. The same happens when you're trying to
select a school to send to, and I suspect I won't have to enter as
much information as it's asking for if I could choose a result. Any
help on this would be appreciated, as I've put this off for two weeks
already. The link is
https://tsorder.studentclearinghouse.org/school/select
Thanks,
Bob
.
|
|
|
It appears i was wrong about the edit field. It appears to be a
standard edit field. I didn't hear anything about number of results
and moving up and down, as I recall. I did try using the search
field where you enter a key word to find your school and I then got
results like yours.
I figured out how to find a school name. Its a little work but you
can accomplish this in the following way:
Follow the key word search link.
An edit field will become available. If you are not in forms mode
go into forms mode. Just pressing enter where you are after
following the link should do it.
Be in forms mode in the key word search edit field.
Type a word such as Chicago.
You will hear how many results there are.
Down arrow to the first one. You won't hear the school read but you
will hear that you are on the first result.
Press enter. You have now placed the name in the field you are in
and it can be read while in forms mode. I don't recall if you
automatically hear it but you can use read current line or maybe
just pressing the down or up arrow will read it.
If that is not the result you want, select all, control a, and press
delete.
Write Chicago again.
Down arrow to the second result and press enter.
Again, you will be able to hear the word.
Follow this procedure until you hear the name you want.
Once you do, it is in the field it should be in and you can then
activate the continue button, which will now be available.
On considering this further, I don't know if this is a bug in
anything. It may be that the results shown as you move aren't
announced because the function isn't designed to be accessible.
Gene
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
On 5/29/2022 7:07 AM, Gene via
groups.io wrote:
No, it isn't standard. I had to press enter on select a school to
make the field editable in the first place. Then I had to press
enter again, since I am using manual switching in NVDA, to go
into forms mode. You may have to as well, since you are in a
field that is not initially editable.
As far as the select a school edit field is concerned, is that the
field you are discussing? I'll look at the field again but I
thought I heard select a number when I was
Gene
On 5/28/2022 11:36 PM, Bob Cavanaugh
wrote:
Yes, that's standard edit commands. However, when I start typing the
name of a school, NVDA says "this is an auto complete element and
there are # results available. Keyboard users, use up and down arrows
to select an option." The # in the example is, as one might guess, an
actual number. However, when using up and down arrow with NVDA in
focus mode, I just get the same auto complete message and NVDA reads
what I've already typed in, it won't let me actually choose a result.
The question is how do I actually choose a result as intended?
On 5/28/22, Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:
When you are on the line that says enter the name of the school, press
enter. That makes the field editable and you can then press enter again
to go into focus mode if you aren't automatically placed in it.
Gene
On 5/28/2022 10:07 PM, Bob Cavanaugh wrote:
Hi all,
Is the edit field on this page not a conventional one? I play Heardle
every day, and it looks like the edit box on this page should work
similar to that one, but I can't seem to get the one here to work. All
I hear is NVDA telling me that this is an edit box that contains
multiple selections, and how many results are available, but I can't
seem to choose any results. The same happens when you're trying to
select a school to send to, and I suspect I won't have to enter as
much information as it's asking for if I could choose a result. Any
help on this would be appreciated, as I've put this off for two weeks
already. The link is
https://tsorder.studentclearinghouse.org/school/select
Thanks,
Bob
.
|
|
|
I just did a bit more experimenting. I had tried this in Firefox
but I then used the Brave browser. The procedure works in both.
Also, when using default screen-reader settings, if you press enter
on the key word link, you are automatically placed in focus mode and
can type the word, as I described doing.
Gene
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
On 5/29/2022 7:41 AM, Gene wrote:
It
appears i was wrong about the edit field. It appears to be a
standard edit field. I didn't hear anything about number of
results and moving up and down, as I recall. I did try using the
search field where you enter a key word to find your school and I
then got results like yours.
I figured out how to find a school name. Its a little work but
you can accomplish this in the following way:
Follow the key word search link.
An edit field will become available. If you are not in forms mode
go into forms mode. Just pressing enter where you are after
following the link should do it.
Be in forms mode in the key word search edit field.
Type a word such as Chicago.
You will hear how many results there are.
Down arrow to the first one. You won't hear the school read but
you will hear that you are on the first result.
Press enter. You have now placed the name in the field you are in
and it can be read while in forms mode. I don't recall if you
automatically hear it but you can use read current line or maybe
just pressing the down or up arrow will read it.
If that is not the result you want, select all, control a, and
press delete.
Write Chicago again.
Down arrow to the second result and press enter.
Again, you will be able to hear the word.
Follow this procedure until you hear the name you want.
Once you do, it is in the field it should be in and you can then
activate the continue button, which will now be available.
On considering this further, I don't know if this is a bug in
anything. It may be that the results shown as you move aren't
announced because the function isn't designed to be accessible.
Gene
On 5/29/2022 7:07 AM, Gene via
groups.io wrote:
No, it isn't
standard. I had to press enter on select a school to make the
field editable in the first place. Then I had to press enter
again, since I am using manual switching in NVDA, to go into
forms mode. You may have to as well, since you are in a field
that is not initially editable.
As far as the select a school edit field is concerned, is that
the field you are discussing? I'll look at the field again but
I thought I heard select a number when I was
Gene
On 5/28/2022 11:36 PM, Bob
Cavanaugh wrote:
Yes, that's standard edit commands. However, when I start typing the
name of a school, NVDA says "this is an auto complete element and
there are # results available. Keyboard users, use up and down arrows
to select an option." The # in the example is, as one might guess, an
actual number. However, when using up and down arrow with NVDA in
focus mode, I just get the same auto complete message and NVDA reads
what I've already typed in, it won't let me actually choose a result.
The question is how do I actually choose a result as intended?
On 5/28/22, Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:
When you are on the line that says enter the name of the school, press
enter. That makes the field editable and you can then press enter again
to go into focus mode if you aren't automatically placed in it.
Gene
On 5/28/2022 10:07 PM, Bob Cavanaugh wrote:
Hi all,
Is the edit field on this page not a conventional one? I play Heardle
every day, and it looks like the edit box on this page should work
similar to that one, but I can't seem to get the one here to work. All
I hear is NVDA telling me that this is an edit box that contains
multiple selections, and how many results are available, but I can't
seem to choose any results. The same happens when you're trying to
select a school to send to, and I suspect I won't have to enter as
much information as it's asking for if I could choose a result. Any
help on this would be appreciated, as I've put this off for two weeks
already. The link is
https://tsorder.studentclearinghouse.org/school/select
Thanks,
Bob
.
|
|
|
Quoting: On considering this further, I don't know if this is a bug in anything. It may be that the results shown as you move aren't announced because the function isn't designed to be accessible.
end quote: Wow, wouldn’t that be considered a “major” bug then? Or, At least a “big flaw”? Isn’t that bad if someone designs a control on a page to be purposefully inaccessible? (especially a school clearing house)? Just curious?
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene Sent: Sunday, May 29, 2022 8:41 AM To: nvda@nvda.groups.io Subject: Re: [nvda] help with an edit field It appears i was wrong about the edit field. It appears to be a standard edit field. I didn't hear anything about number of results and moving up and down, as I recall. I did try using the search field where you enter a key word to find your school and I then got results like yours.
I figured out how to find a school name. Its a little work but you can accomplish this in the following way:
Follow the key word search link.
An edit field will become available. If you are not in forms mode go into forms mode. Just pressing enter where you are after following the link should do it.
Be in forms mode in the key word search edit field.
Type a word such as Chicago.
You will hear how many results there are.
Down arrow to the first one. You won't hear the school read but you will hear that you are on the first result.
Press enter. You have now placed the name in the field you are in and it can be read while in forms mode. I don't recall if you automatically hear it but you can use read current line or maybe just pressing the down or up arrow will read it.
If that is not the result you want, select all, control a, and press delete.
Write Chicago again.
Down arrow to the second result and press enter.
Again, you will be able to hear the word.
Follow this procedure until you hear the name you want.
Once you do, it is in the field it should be in and you can then activate the continue button, which will now be available.
On considering this further, I don't know if this is a bug in anything. It may be that the results shown as you move aren't announced because the function isn't designed to be accessible.
Gene On 5/29/2022 7:07 AM, Gene via groups.io wrote: No, it isn't standard. I had to press enter on select a school to make the field editable in the first place. Then I had to press enter again, since I am using manual switching in NVDA, to go into forms mode. You may have to as well, since you are in a field that is not initially editable.
As far as the select a school edit field is concerned, is that the field you are discussing? I'll look at the field again but I thought I heard select a number when I was
Gene On 5/28/2022 11:36 PM, Bob Cavanaugh wrote: Yes, that's standard edit commands. However, when I start typing the name of a school, NVDA says "this is an auto complete element and there are # results available. Keyboard users, use up and down arrows to select an option." The # in the example is, as one might guess, an actual number. However, when using up and down arrow with NVDA in focus mode, I just get the same auto complete message and NVDA reads what I've already typed in, it won't let me actually choose a result. The question is how do I actually choose a result as intended? On 5/28/22, Gene <gsasner@...> wrote: When you are on the line that says enter the name of the school, press enter. That makes the field editable and you can then press enter again to go into focus mode if you aren't automatically placed in it. Gene On 5/28/2022 10:07 PM, Bob Cavanaugh wrote: Hi all, Is the edit field on this page not a conventional one? I play Heardle every day, and it looks like the edit box on this page should work similar to that one, but I can't seem to get the one here to work. All I hear is NVDA telling me that this is an edit box that contains multiple selections, and how many results are available, but I can't seem to choose any results. The same happens when you're trying to select a school to send to, and I suspect I won't have to enter as much information as it's asking for if I could choose a result. Any help on this would be appreciated, as I've put this off for two weeks already. The link is https://tsorder.studentclearinghouse.org/school/select Thanks, Bob
.
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I don't consider lack of accessibility to be a bug. A bug is an
unintended behavior. Saying a lack of accessibility is a bug
implies that the item was intended to be accessible but isn't
because of unanticipated problem or problems.
If a stove isn't accessible and isn't designed to be, that isn't a
bug. You may call it a flaw, a serious flaw, you may describe it as
you wish in terms of advocating for more accessibility, but it isn't
a bug. It is operating as designed.
If my stove is designed to be accessible and the speech is giving
inaccurate numbers as I move through settings, that is a bug.
Gene
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
On 5/29/2022 7:49 AM, mike mcglashon
wrote:
Quoting:
On considering this further, I don't
know if this is a bug in anything.
It may be that the results shown as
you move aren't announced because the function isn't
designed to be accessible.
end quote:
Wow, wouldn’t that be considered a
“major” bug then? Or,
At least a “big flaw”?
Isn’t that bad if someone designs a
control on a page to be purposefully inaccessible?
(especially a school clearing house)?
Just curious?
It appears i was wrong about the edit
field. It appears to be a standard edit field. I didn't
hear anything about number of results and moving up and
down, as I recall. I did try using the search field where
you enter a key word to find your school and I then got
results like yours.
I figured out how to find a school name. Its a little work
but you can accomplish this in the following way:
Follow the key word search link.
An edit field will become available. If you are not in
forms mode go into forms mode. Just pressing enter where
you are after following the link should do it.
Be in forms mode in the key word search edit field.
Type a word such as Chicago.
You will hear how many results there are.
Down arrow to the first one. You won't hear the school read
but you will hear that you are on the first result.
Press enter. You have now placed the name in the field you
are in and it can be read while in forms mode. I don't
recall if you automatically hear it but you can use read
current line or maybe just pressing the down or up arrow
will read it.
If that is not the result you want, select all, control a,
and press delete.
Write Chicago again.
Down arrow to the second result and press enter.
Again, you will be able to hear the word.
Follow this procedure until you hear the name you want.
Once you do, it is in the field it should be in and you can
then activate the continue button, which will now be
available.
On considering this further, I don't know if this is a bug
in anything. It may be that the results shown as you move
aren't announced because the function isn't designed to be
accessible.
Gene
On 5/29/2022 7:07 AM, Gene via
groups.io wrote:
No, it isn't standard. I had to
press enter on select a school to make the field editable
in the first place. Then I had to press enter again,
since I am using manual switching in NVDA, to go into
forms mode. You may have to as well, since you are in a
field that is not initially editable.
As far as the select a school edit field is concerned, is
that the field you are discussing? I'll look at the field
again but I thought I heard select a number when I was
Gene
On 5/28/2022 11:36 PM, Bob
Cavanaugh wrote:
Yes, that's standard edit commands. However, when I start typing the
name of a school, NVDA says "this is an auto complete element and
there are # results available. Keyboard users, use up and down arrows
to select an option." The # in the example is, as one might guess, an
actual number. However, when using up and down arrow with NVDA in
focus mode, I just get the same auto complete message and NVDA reads
what I've already typed in, it won't let me actually choose a result.
The question is how do I actually choose a result as intended?
On 5/28/22, Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:
When you are on the line that says enter the name of the school, press
enter. That makes the field editable and you can then press enter again
to go into focus mode if you aren't automatically placed in it.
Gene
On 5/28/2022 10:07 PM, Bob Cavanaugh wrote:
Hi all,
Is the edit field on this page not a conventional one? I play Heardle
every day, and it looks like the edit box on this page should work
similar to that one, but I can't seem to get the one here to work. All
I hear is NVDA telling me that this is an edit box that contains
multiple selections, and how many results are available, but I can't
seem to choose any results. The same happens when you're trying to
select a school to send to, and I suspect I won't have to enter as
much information as it's asking for if I could choose a result. Any
help on this would be appreciated, as I've put this off for two weeks
already. The link is
https://tsorder.studentclearinghouse.org/school/select
Thanks,
Bob
.
|
|
|
Fair enough, Point well taken.
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene Sent: Sunday, May 29, 2022 9:03 AM To: nvda@nvda.groups.io Subject: Re: [nvda] help with an edit field I don't consider lack of accessibility to be a bug. A bug is an unintended behavior. Saying a lack of accessibility is a bug implies that the item was intended to be accessible but isn't because of unanticipated problem or problems.
If a stove isn't accessible and isn't designed to be, that isn't a bug. You may call it a flaw, a serious flaw, you may describe it as you wish in terms of advocating for more accessibility, but it isn't a bug. It is operating as designed.
If my stove is designed to be accessible and the speech is giving inaccurate numbers as I move through settings, that is a bug.
Gene
On 5/29/2022 7:49 AM, mike mcglashon wrote: Quoting: On considering this further, I don't know if this is a bug in anything. It may be that the results shown as you move aren't announced because the function isn't designed to be accessible.
end quote: Wow, wouldn’t that be considered a “major” bug then? Or, At least a “big flaw”? Isn’t that bad if someone designs a control on a page to be purposefully inaccessible? (especially a school clearing house)? Just curious? It appears i was wrong about the edit field. It appears to be a standard edit field. I didn't hear anything about number of results and moving up and down, as I recall. I did try using the search field where you enter a key word to find your school and I then got results like yours.
I figured out how to find a school name. Its a little work but you can accomplish this in the following way:
Follow the key word search link.
An edit field will become available. If you are not in forms mode go into forms mode. Just pressing enter where you are after following the link should do it.
Be in forms mode in the key word search edit field.
Type a word such as Chicago.
You will hear how many results there are.
Down arrow to the first one. You won't hear the school read but you will hear that you are on the first result.
Press enter. You have now placed the name in the field you are in and it can be read while in forms mode. I don't recall if you automatically hear it but you can use read current line or maybe just pressing the down or up arrow will read it.
If that is not the result you want, select all, control a, and press delete.
Write Chicago again.
Down arrow to the second result and press enter.
Again, you will be able to hear the word.
Follow this procedure until you hear the name you want.
Once you do, it is in the field it should be in and you can then activate the continue button, which will now be available.
On considering this further, I don't know if this is a bug in anything. It may be that the results shown as you move aren't announced because the function isn't designed to be accessible.
Gene On 5/29/2022 7:07 AM, Gene via groups.io wrote: No, it isn't standard. I had to press enter on select a school to make the field editable in the first place. Then I had to press enter again, since I am using manual switching in NVDA, to go into forms mode. You may have to as well, since you are in a field that is not initially editable.
As far as the select a school edit field is concerned, is that the field you are discussing? I'll look at the field again but I thought I heard select a number when I was
Gene On 5/28/2022 11:36 PM, Bob Cavanaugh wrote: Yes, that's standard edit commands. However, when I start typing the name of a school, NVDA says "this is an auto complete element and there are # results available. Keyboard users, use up and down arrows to select an option." The # in the example is, as one might guess, an actual number. However, when using up and down arrow with NVDA in focus mode, I just get the same auto complete message and NVDA reads what I've already typed in, it won't let me actually choose a result. The question is how do I actually choose a result as intended? On 5/28/22, Gene <gsasner@...> wrote: When you are on the line that says enter the name of the school, press enter. That makes the field editable and you can then press enter again to go into focus mode if you aren't automatically placed in it. Gene On 5/28/2022 10:07 PM, Bob Cavanaugh wrote: Hi all, Is the edit field on this page not a conventional one? I play Heardle every day, and it looks like the edit box on this page should work similar to that one, but I can't seem to get the one here to work. All I hear is NVDA telling me that this is an edit box that contains multiple selections, and how many results are available, but I can't seem to choose any results. The same happens when you're trying to select a school to send to, and I suspect I won't have to enter as much information as it's asking for if I could choose a result. Any help on this would be appreciated, as I've put this off for two weeks already. The link is https://tsorder.studentclearinghouse.org/school/select Thanks, Bob
.
|
|
|
Gene wrote:
> I don't consider lack of accessibility to be a bug.
As an accessibility tester I disagree. I understand what you are saying in your example of a stove which doesn’t take inclusive design into account. However, if you have a Web site which has no labels on form fields or which doesn’t expose
an edit field to a screen reader this is definitely considered a bug or defect and needs to be treated as such.
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of
Gene
Sent: Sunday, May 29, 2022 9:03 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] help with an edit field
I don't consider lack of accessibility to be a bug. A bug is an unintended behavior. Saying a lack of accessibility is a bug implies that the item was intended to be accessible but isn't because of unanticipated
problem or problems.
If a stove isn't accessible and isn't designed to be, that isn't a bug. You may call it a flaw, a serious flaw, you may describe it as you wish in terms of advocating for more accessibility, but it isn't a bug. It is operating as designed.
If my stove is designed to be accessible and the speech is giving inaccurate numbers as I move through settings, that is a bug.
Gene
On 5/29/2022 7:49 AM, mike mcglashon wrote:
Quoting:
On considering this further, I don't know if this is a bug in anything.
It may be that the results shown as you move aren't announced because the function isn't designed to be accessible.
end quote:
Wow, wouldn’t that be considered a “major” bug then? Or,
At least a “big flaw”?
Isn’t that bad if someone designs a control on a page to be purposefully inaccessible?
(especially a school clearing house)?
Just curious?
It appears i was wrong about the edit field. It appears to be a standard edit field. I didn't hear anything about number of results and moving up and down, as I recall. I did
try using the search field where you enter a key word to find your school and I then got results like yours.
I figured out how to find a school name. Its a little work but you can accomplish this in the following way:
Follow the key word search link.
An edit field will become available. If you are not in forms mode go into forms mode. Just pressing enter where you are after following the link should do it.
Be in forms mode in the key word search edit field.
Type a word such as Chicago.
You will hear how many results there are.
Down arrow to the first one. You won't hear the school read but you will hear that you are on the first result.
Press enter. You have now placed the name in the field you are in and it can be read while in forms mode. I don't recall if you automatically hear it but you can use read current line or maybe just pressing the down or up arrow will read it.
If that is not the result you want, select all, control a, and press delete.
Write Chicago again.
Down arrow to the second result and press enter.
Again, you will be able to hear the word.
Follow this procedure until you hear the name you want.
Once you do, it is in the field it should be in and you can then activate the continue button, which will now be available.
On considering this further, I don't know if this is a bug in anything. It may be that the results shown as you move aren't announced because the function isn't designed to be accessible.
Gene
On 5/29/2022 7:07 AM, Gene via groups.io wrote:
No, it isn't standard. I had to press enter on select a school to make the field editable in the first place. Then I had to press enter again, since I am using manual switching
in NVDA, to go into forms mode. You may have to as well, since you are in a field that is not initially editable.
As far as the select a school edit field is concerned, is that the field you are discussing? I'll look at the field again but I thought I heard select a number when I was
Gene
On 5/28/2022 11:36 PM, Bob Cavanaugh wrote:
Yes, that's standard edit commands. However, when I start typing the
name of a school, NVDA says "this is an auto complete element and
there are # results available. Keyboard users, use up and down arrows
to select an option." The # in the example is, as one might guess, an
actual number. However, when using up and down arrow with NVDA in
focus mode, I just get the same auto complete message and NVDA reads
what I've already typed in, it won't let me actually choose a result.
The question is how do I actually choose a result as intended?
On 5/28/22, Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:
When you are on the line that says enter the name of the school, press
enter. That makes the field editable and you can then press enter again
to go into focus mode if you aren't automatically placed in it.
Gene
On 5/28/2022 10:07 PM, Bob Cavanaugh wrote:
Hi all,
Is the edit field on this page not a conventional one? I play Heardle
every day, and it looks like the edit box on this page should work
similar to that one, but I can't seem to get the one here to work. All
I hear is NVDA telling me that this is an edit box that contains
multiple selections, and how many results are available, but I can't
seem to choose any results. The same happens when you're trying to
select a school to send to, and I suspect I won't have to enter as
much information as it's asking for if I could choose a result. Any
help on this would be appreciated, as I've put this off for two weeks
already. The link is
https://tsorder.studentclearinghouse.org/school/select
Thanks,
Bob
.
|
|
|
I didn't say anything about what other words someone might want to
use, but bug is not correct. You might want to call it a flaw or an
omission, or use some sort of word or phrase that indicates that it
is no longer acceptable not to include accessibility, but it isn't a
bug.
One definition from Google I just looked up is:
"an error in a computer program or system."
Lack of accessibility isn't an error. It may be unconscionable,
unacceptable or you may wish to use other wording, but it is not an
error.
Gene
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
On 5/29/2022 10:27 AM, David Goldfield
wrote:
Gene wrote:
> I don't consider lack of accessibility
to be a bug.
As an accessibility tester I disagree. I
understand what you are saying in your example of a stove
which doesn’t take inclusive design into account. However, if
you have a Web site which has no labels on form fields or
which doesn’t expose an edit field to a screen reader this is
definitely considered a bug or defect and needs to be treated
as such.
I don't consider lack of accessibility to
be a bug. A bug is an unintended behavior. Saying a lack of
accessibility is a bug implies that the item was intended to
be accessible but isn't because of unanticipated problem or
problems.
If a stove isn't accessible and isn't designed to be, that
isn't a bug. You may call it a flaw, a serious flaw, you may
describe it as you wish in terms of advocating for more
accessibility, but it isn't a bug. It is operating as
designed.
If my stove is designed to be accessible and the speech is
giving inaccurate numbers as I move through settings, that is
a bug.
Gene
On 5/29/2022 7:49 AM, mike mcglashon
wrote:
Quoting:
On considering this further, I don't
know if this is a bug in anything.
It may be that the results shown as you
move aren't announced because the function isn't designed
to be accessible.
end quote:
Wow, wouldn’t that be considered a
“major” bug then? Or,
At least a “big flaw”?
Isn’t that bad if someone designs a
control on a page to be purposefully inaccessible?
(especially a school clearing house)?
Just curious?
It appears i was wrong about the edit
field. It appears to be a standard edit field. I didn't
hear anything about number of results and moving up and
down, as I recall. I did try using the search field where
you enter a key word to find your school and I then got
results like yours.
I figured out how to find a school name. Its a little
work but you can accomplish this in the following way:
Follow the key word search link.
An edit field will become available. If you are not in
forms mode go into forms mode. Just pressing enter where
you are after following the link should do it.
Be in forms mode in the key word search edit field.
Type a word such as Chicago.
You will hear how many results there are.
Down arrow to the first one. You won't hear the school
read but you will hear that you are on the first result.
Press enter. You have now placed the name in the field
you are in and it can be read while in forms mode. I
don't recall if you automatically hear it but you can use
read current line or maybe just pressing the down or up
arrow will read it.
If that is not the result you want, select all, control a,
and press delete.
Write Chicago again.
Down arrow to the second result and press enter.
Again, you will be able to hear the word.
Follow this procedure until you hear the name you want.
Once you do, it is in the field it should be in and you
can then activate the continue button, which will now be
available.
On considering this further, I don't know if this is a bug
in anything. It may be that the results shown as you move
aren't announced because the function isn't designed to be
accessible.
Gene
On 5/29/2022 7:07 AM, Gene via
groups.io wrote:
No, it isn't standard. I had to
press enter on select a school to make the field
editable in the first place. Then I had to press enter
again, since I am using manual switching in NVDA, to go
into forms mode. You may have to as well, since you are
in a field that is not initially editable.
As far as the select a school edit field is concerned,
is that the field you are discussing? I'll look at the
field again but I thought I heard select a number when
I was
Gene
On 5/28/2022 11:36 PM, Bob
Cavanaugh wrote:
Yes, that's standard edit commands. However, when I start typing the
name of a school, NVDA says "this is an auto complete element and
there are # results available. Keyboard users, use up and down arrows
to select an option." The # in the example is, as one might guess, an
actual number. However, when using up and down arrow with NVDA in
focus mode, I just get the same auto complete message and NVDA reads
what I've already typed in, it won't let me actually choose a result.
The question is how do I actually choose a result as intended?
On 5/28/22, Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:
When you are on the line that says enter the name of the school, press
enter. That makes the field editable and you can then press enter again
to go into focus mode if you aren't automatically placed in it.
Gene
On 5/28/2022 10:07 PM, Bob Cavanaugh wrote:
Hi all,
Is the edit field on this page not a conventional one? I play Heardle
every day, and it looks like the edit box on this page should work
similar to that one, but I can't seem to get the one here to work. All
I hear is NVDA telling me that this is an edit box that contains
multiple selections, and how many results are available, but I can't
seem to choose any results. The same happens when you're trying to
select a school to send to, and I suspect I won't have to enter as
much information as it's asking for if I could choose a result. Any
help on this would be appreciated, as I've put this off for two weeks
already. The link is
https://tsorder.studentclearinghouse.org/school/select
Thanks,
Bob
.
|
|
|
Also, consider that referring to lack of accessibility aws a bug
makes it sound benign, it was just an unforeseen and unforeseeable
error that didn't become evident through testing and evaluation
until now. Lack of accessibility is either a lack of knowledge or a
lack of concern or a belief that it isn't necessary for your
product. A bug is something that is in a program that isn't known
until testing brings it out.
Gene
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
On 5/29/2022 10:46 AM, Gene via
groups.io wrote:
I didn't say anything about what other words someone might want to
use, but bug is not correct. You might want to call it a flaw or
an omission, or use some sort of word or phrase that indicates
that it is no longer acceptable not to include accessibility, but
it isn't a bug.
One definition from Google I just looked up is:
"an error in a computer program or system."
Lack of accessibility isn't an error. It may be unconscionable,
unacceptable or you may wish to use other wording, but it is not
an error.
Gene
On 5/29/2022 10:27 AM, David
Goldfield wrote:
Gene wrote:
> I don't consider lack of
accessibility to be a bug.
As an accessibility tester I disagree. I
understand what you are saying in your example of a stove
which doesn’t take inclusive design into account. However,
if you have a Web site which has no labels on form fields or
which doesn’t expose an edit field to a screen reader this
is definitely considered a bug or defect and needs to be
treated as such.
I don't consider lack of accessibility to
be a bug. A bug is an unintended behavior. Saying a lack
of accessibility is a bug implies that the item was intended
to be accessible but isn't because of unanticipated problem
or problems.
If a stove isn't accessible and isn't designed to be, that
isn't a bug. You may call it a flaw, a serious flaw, you
may describe it as you wish in terms of advocating for more
accessibility, but it isn't a bug. It is operating as
designed.
If my stove is designed to be accessible and the speech is
giving inaccurate numbers as I move through settings, that
is a bug.
Gene
On 5/29/2022 7:49 AM, mike mcglashon
wrote:
Quoting:
On considering this further, I don't
know if this is a bug in anything.
It may be that the results shown as
you move aren't announced because the function isn't
designed to be accessible.
end quote:
Wow, wouldn’t that be considered a
“major” bug then? Or,
At least a “big flaw”?
Isn’t that bad if someone designs a
control on a page to be purposefully inaccessible?
(especially a school clearing house)?
Just curious?
It appears i was wrong about the edit
field. It appears to be a standard edit field. I
didn't hear anything about number of results and moving
up and down, as I recall. I did try using the search
field where you enter a key word to find your school and
I then got results like yours.
I figured out how to find a school name. Its a little
work but you can accomplish this in the following way:
Follow the key word search link.
An edit field will become available. If you are not in
forms mode go into forms mode. Just pressing enter
where you are after following the link should do it.
Be in forms mode in the key word search edit field.
Type a word such as Chicago.
You will hear how many results there are.
Down arrow to the first one. You won't hear the school
read but you will hear that you are on the first result.
Press enter. You have now placed the name in the field
you are in and it can be read while in forms mode. I
don't recall if you automatically hear it but you can
use read current line or maybe just pressing the down or
up arrow will read it.
If that is not the result you want, select all, control
a, and press delete.
Write Chicago again.
Down arrow to the second result and press enter.
Again, you will be able to hear the word.
Follow this procedure until you hear the name you want.
Once you do, it is in the field it should be in and you
can then activate the continue button, which will now be
available.
On considering this further, I don't know if this is a
bug in anything. It may be that the results shown as
you move aren't announced because the function isn't
designed to be accessible.
Gene
On 5/29/2022 7:07 AM, Gene via
groups.io wrote:
No, it isn't standard. I had to
press enter on select a school to make the field
editable in the first place. Then I had to press
enter again, since I am using manual switching in
NVDA, to go into forms mode. You may have to as well,
since you are in a field that is not initially
editable.
As far as the select a school edit field is concerned,
is that the field you are discussing? I'll look at
the field again but I thought I heard select a number
when I was
Gene
On 5/28/2022 11:36 PM, Bob
Cavanaugh wrote:
Yes, that's standard edit commands. However, when I start typing the
name of a school, NVDA says "this is an auto complete element and
there are # results available. Keyboard users, use up and down arrows
to select an option." The # in the example is, as one might guess, an
actual number. However, when using up and down arrow with NVDA in
focus mode, I just get the same auto complete message and NVDA reads
what I've already typed in, it won't let me actually choose a result.
The question is how do I actually choose a result as intended?
On 5/28/22, Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:
When you are on the line that says enter the name of the school, press
enter. That makes the field editable and you can then press enter again
to go into focus mode if you aren't automatically placed in it.
Gene
On 5/28/2022 10:07 PM, Bob Cavanaugh wrote:
Hi all,
Is the edit field on this page not a conventional one? I play Heardle
every day, and it looks like the edit box on this page should work
similar to that one, but I can't seem to get the one here to work. All
I hear is NVDA telling me that this is an edit box that contains
multiple selections, and how many results are available, but I can't
seem to choose any results. The same happens when you're trying to
select a school to send to, and I suspect I won't have to enter as
much information as it's asking for if I could choose a result. Any
help on this would be appreciated, as I've put this off for two weeks
already. The link is
https://tsorder.studentclearinghouse.org/school/select
Thanks,
Bob
.
|
|
|
Lack of accessibility isn’t an error? I am quite certain that nobody in the accessibility field will agree with you but I am done with this conversation. You are free to respond to this if you like but I will, unfortunately, resume my habit
of skipping your messages so your response will not be read by me.
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of
Gene
Sent: Sunday, May 29, 2022 11:46 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] help with an edit field
I didn't say anything about what other words someone might want to use, but bug is not correct. You might want to call it a flaw or an omission, or use some sort of word or phrase that indicates that it is
no longer acceptable not to include accessibility, but it isn't a bug.
One definition from Google I just looked up is:
"an error in a computer program or system."
Lack of accessibility isn't an error. It may be unconscionable, unacceptable or you may wish to use other wording, but it is not an error.
Gene
On 5/29/2022 10:27 AM, David Goldfield wrote:
Gene wrote:
> I don't consider lack of accessibility to be a bug.
As an accessibility tester I disagree. I understand what you are saying in your example of a stove which doesn’t take inclusive design into account. However, if you have a Web site
which has no labels on form fields or which doesn’t expose an edit field to a screen reader this is definitely considered a bug or defect and needs to be treated as such.
I don't consider lack of accessibility to be a bug. A bug is an unintended behavior. Saying a lack of accessibility is a bug implies that the item was intended to be accessible but
isn't because of unanticipated problem or problems.
If a stove isn't accessible and isn't designed to be, that isn't a bug. You may call it a flaw, a serious flaw, you may describe it as you wish in terms of advocating for more accessibility, but it isn't a bug. It is operating as designed.
If my stove is designed to be accessible and the speech is giving inaccurate numbers as I move through settings, that is a bug.
Gene
On 5/29/2022 7:49 AM, mike mcglashon wrote:
Quoting:
On considering this further, I don't know if this is a bug in anything.
It may be that the results shown as you move aren't announced because the function isn't designed to be accessible.
end quote:
Wow, wouldn’t that be considered a “major” bug then? Or,
At least a “big flaw”?
Isn’t that bad if someone designs a control on a page to be purposefully inaccessible?
(especially a school clearing house)?
Just curious?
It appears i was wrong about the edit field. It appears to be a standard edit field. I didn't hear anything about number of results and moving up and down, as I recall. I did
try using the search field where you enter a key word to find your school and I then got results like yours.
I figured out how to find a school name. Its a little work but you can accomplish this in the following way:
Follow the key word search link.
An edit field will become available. If you are not in forms mode go into forms mode. Just pressing enter where you are after following the link should do it.
Be in forms mode in the key word search edit field.
Type a word such as Chicago.
You will hear how many results there are.
Down arrow to the first one. You won't hear the school read but you will hear that you are on the first result.
Press enter. You have now placed the name in the field you are in and it can be read while in forms mode. I don't recall if you automatically hear it but you can use read current line or maybe just pressing the down or up arrow will read it.
If that is not the result you want, select all, control a, and press delete.
Write Chicago again.
Down arrow to the second result and press enter.
Again, you will be able to hear the word.
Follow this procedure until you hear the name you want.
Once you do, it is in the field it should be in and you can then activate the continue button, which will now be available.
On considering this further, I don't know if this is a bug in anything. It may be that the results shown as you move aren't announced because the function isn't designed to be accessible.
Gene
On 5/29/2022 7:07 AM, Gene via groups.io wrote:
No, it isn't standard. I had to press enter on select a school to make the field editable in the first place. Then I had to press enter again, since I am using manual switching
in NVDA, to go into forms mode. You may have to as well, since you are in a field that is not initially editable.
As far as the select a school edit field is concerned, is that the field you are discussing? I'll look at the field again but I thought I heard select a number when I was
Gene
On 5/28/2022 11:36 PM, Bob Cavanaugh wrote:
Yes, that's standard edit commands. However, when I start typing the
name of a school, NVDA says "this is an auto complete element and
there are # results available. Keyboard users, use up and down arrows
to select an option." The # in the example is, as one might guess, an
actual number. However, when using up and down arrow with NVDA in
focus mode, I just get the same auto complete message and NVDA reads
what I've already typed in, it won't let me actually choose a result.
The question is how do I actually choose a result as intended?
On 5/28/22, Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:
When you are on the line that says enter the name of the school, press
enter. That makes the field editable and you can then press enter again
to go into focus mode if you aren't automatically placed in it.
Gene
On 5/28/2022 10:07 PM, Bob Cavanaugh wrote:
Hi all,
Is the edit field on this page not a conventional one? I play Heardle
every day, and it looks like the edit box on this page should work
similar to that one, but I can't seem to get the one here to work. All
I hear is NVDA telling me that this is an edit box that contains
multiple selections, and how many results are available, but I can't
seem to choose any results. The same happens when you're trying to
select a school to send to, and I suspect I won't have to enter as
much information as it's asking for if I could choose a result. Any
help on this would be appreciated, as I've put this off for two weeks
already. The link is
https://tsorder.studentclearinghouse.org/school/select
Thanks,
Bob
.
|
|
|
That's a real example of both civility and intellectual open
mindedness. I didn't know you harbor such hostility toward me.
If you can't be civil and you refuse to discuss what I say without
attacking me, don't bother.
Your last message displays a logical fallacy. You said that you are
confident no one in the accessibility field will agree with me. So
what? That is arguing from authority and doesn't prove anything.
How many people believed the world was flat before Columbuss?
You have not, in either answer, presented any reasons for believing
what you believe. You just say what you believe.
Gene
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
On 5/29/2022 10:51 AM, David Goldfield
wrote:
Lack of accessibility isn’t an error? I am
quite certain that nobody in the accessibility field will
agree with you but I am done with this conversation. You are
free to respond to this if you like but I will, unfortunately,
resume my habit of skipping your messages so your response
will not be read by me.
I didn't say anything about what other
words someone might want to use, but bug is not correct. You
might want to call it a flaw or an omission, or use some sort
of word or phrase that indicates that it is no longer
acceptable not to include accessibility, but it isn't a bug.
One definition from Google I just looked up is:
"an error in a computer program or system."
Lack of accessibility isn't an error. It may be
unconscionable, unacceptable or you may wish to use other
wording, but it is not an error.
Gene
On 5/29/2022 10:27 AM, David Goldfield
wrote:
Gene wrote:
> I don't consider lack of
accessibility to be a bug.
As an accessibility tester I disagree.
I understand what you are saying in your example of a
stove which doesn’t take inclusive design into account.
However, if you have a Web site which has no labels on
form fields or which doesn’t expose an edit field to a
screen reader this is definitely considered a bug or
defect and needs to be treated as such.
I don't consider lack of accessibility
to be a bug. A bug is an unintended behavior. Saying a
lack of accessibility is a bug implies that the item was
intended to be accessible but isn't because of
unanticipated problem or problems.
If a stove isn't accessible and isn't designed to be, that
isn't a bug. You may call it a flaw, a serious flaw, you
may describe it as you wish in terms of advocating for
more accessibility, but it isn't a bug. It is operating
as designed.
If my stove is designed to be accessible and the speech is
giving inaccurate numbers as I move through settings, that
is a bug.
Gene
On 5/29/2022 7:49 AM, mike mcglashon
wrote:
Quoting:
On considering this further, I
don't know if this is a bug in anything.
It may be that the results shown as
you move aren't announced because the function isn't
designed to be accessible.
end quote:
Wow, wouldn’t that be considered a
“major” bug then? Or,
At least a “big flaw”?
Isn’t that bad if someone designs a
control on a page to be purposefully inaccessible?
(especially a school clearing
house)?
Just curious?
It appears i was wrong about the
edit field. It appears to be a standard edit field.
I didn't hear anything about number of results and
moving up and down, as I recall. I did try using the
search field where you enter a key word to find your
school and I then got results like yours.
I figured out how to find a school name. Its a little
work but you can accomplish this in the following way:
Follow the key word search link.
An edit field will become available. If you are not
in forms mode go into forms mode. Just pressing enter
where you are after following the link should do it.
Be in forms mode in the key word search edit field.
Type a word such as Chicago.
You will hear how many results there are.
Down arrow to the first one. You won't hear the
school read but you will hear that you are on the
first result.
Press enter. You have now placed the name in the
field you are in and it can be read while in forms
mode. I don't recall if you automatically hear it but
you can use read current line or maybe just pressing
the down or up arrow will read it.
If that is not the result you want, select all,
control a, and press delete.
Write Chicago again.
Down arrow to the second result and press enter.
Again, you will be able to hear the word.
Follow this procedure until you hear the name you
want.
Once you do, it is in the field it should be in and
you can then activate the continue button, which will
now be available.
On considering this further, I don't know if this is a
bug in anything. It may be that the results shown as
you move aren't announced because the function isn't
designed to be accessible.
Gene
On 5/29/2022 7:07 AM, Gene via
groups.io wrote:
No, it isn't standard. I had to
press enter on select a school to make the field
editable in the first place. Then I had to press
enter again, since I am using manual switching in
NVDA, to go into forms mode. You may have to as
well, since you are in a field that is not initially
editable.
As far as the select a school edit field is
concerned, is that the field you are discussing?
I'll look at the field again but I thought I heard
select a number when I was
Gene
On 5/28/2022 11:36 PM, Bob
Cavanaugh wrote:
Yes, that's standard edit commands. However, when I start typing the
name of a school, NVDA says "this is an auto complete element and
there are # results available. Keyboard users, use up and down arrows
to select an option." The # in the example is, as one might guess, an
actual number. However, when using up and down arrow with NVDA in
focus mode, I just get the same auto complete message and NVDA reads
what I've already typed in, it won't let me actually choose a result.
The question is how do I actually choose a result as intended?
On 5/28/22, Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:
When you are on the line that says enter the name of the school, press
enter. That makes the field editable and you can then press enter again
to go into focus mode if you aren't automatically placed in it.
Gene
On 5/28/2022 10:07 PM, Bob Cavanaugh wrote:
Hi all,
Is the edit field on this page not a conventional one? I play Heardle
every day, and it looks like the edit box on this page should work
similar to that one, but I can't seem to get the one here to work. All
I hear is NVDA telling me that this is an edit box that contains
multiple selections, and how many results are available, but I can't
seem to choose any results. The same happens when you're trying to
select a school to send to, and I suspect I won't have to enter as
much information as it's asking for if I could choose a result. Any
help on this would be appreciated, as I've put this off for two weeks
already. The link is
https://tsorder.studentclearinghouse.org/school/select
Thanks,
Bob
.
|
|
|
I apologize; I did not mean to cause a rift.
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene Sent: Sunday, May 29, 2022 12:04 PM To: nvda@nvda.groups.io Subject: Re: [nvda] help with an edit field That's a real example of both civility and intellectual open mindedness. I didn't know you harbor such hostility toward me.
If you can't be civil and you refuse to discuss what I say without attacking me, don't bother.
Your last message displays a logical fallacy. You said that you are confident no one in the accessibility field will agree with me. So what? That is arguing from authority and doesn't prove anything. How many people believed the world was flat before Columbuss?
You have not, in either answer, presented any reasons for believing what you believe. You just say what you believe.
Gene On 5/29/2022 10:51 AM, David Goldfield wrote: Lack of accessibility isn’t an error? I am quite certain that nobody in the accessibility field will agree with you but I am done with this conversation. You are free to respond to this if you like but I will, unfortunately, resume my habit of skipping your messages so your response will not be read by me. I didn't say anything about what other words someone might want to use, but bug is not correct. You might want to call it a flaw or an omission, or use some sort of word or phrase that indicates that it is no longer acceptable not to include accessibility, but it isn't a bug.
One definition from Google I just looked up is:
"an error in a computer program or system."
Lack of accessibility isn't an error. It may be unconscionable, unacceptable or you may wish to use other wording, but it is not an error.
Gene On 5/29/2022 10:27 AM, David Goldfield wrote: Gene wrote: > I don't consider lack of accessibility to be a bug. As an accessibility tester I disagree. I understand what you are saying in your example of a stove which doesn’t take inclusive design into account. However, if you have a Web site which has no labels on form fields or which doesn’t expose an edit field to a screen reader this is definitely considered a bug or defect and needs to be treated as such. I don't consider lack of accessibility to be a bug. A bug is an unintended behavior. Saying a lack of accessibility is a bug implies that the item was intended to be accessible but isn't because of unanticipated problem or problems.
If a stove isn't accessible and isn't designed to be, that isn't a bug. You may call it a flaw, a serious flaw, you may describe it as you wish in terms of advocating for more accessibility, but it isn't a bug. It is operating as designed.
If my stove is designed to be accessible and the speech is giving inaccurate numbers as I move through settings, that is a bug.
Gene On 5/29/2022 7:49 AM, mike mcglashon wrote: Quoting: On considering this further, I don't know if this is a bug in anything. It may be that the results shown as you move aren't announced because the function isn't designed to be accessible.
end quote: Wow, wouldn’t that be considered a “major” bug then? Or, At least a “big flaw”? Isn’t that bad if someone designs a control on a page to be purposefully inaccessible? (especially a school clearing house)? Just curious? It appears i was wrong about the edit field. It appears to be a standard edit field. I didn't hear anything about number of results and moving up and down, as I recall. I did try using the search field where you enter a key word to find your school and I then got results like yours.
I figured out how to find a school name. Its a little work but you can accomplish this in the following way:
Follow the key word search link.
An edit field will become available. If you are not in forms mode go into forms mode. Just pressing enter where you are after following the link should do it.
Be in forms mode in the key word search edit field.
Type a word such as Chicago.
You will hear how many results there are.
Down arrow to the first one. You won't hear the school read but you will hear that you are on the first result.
Press enter. You have now placed the name in the field you are in and it can be read while in forms mode. I don't recall if you automatically hear it but you can use read current line or maybe just pressing the down or up arrow will read it.
If that is not the result you want, select all, control a, and press delete.
Write Chicago again.
Down arrow to the second result and press enter.
Again, you will be able to hear the word.
Follow this procedure until you hear the name you want.
Once you do, it is in the field it should be in and you can then activate the continue button, which will now be available.
On considering this further, I don't know if this is a bug in anything. It may be that the results shown as you move aren't announced because the function isn't designed to be accessible.
Gene On 5/29/2022 7:07 AM, Gene via groups.io wrote: No, it isn't standard. I had to press enter on select a school to make the field editable in the first place. Then I had to press enter again, since I am using manual switching in NVDA, to go into forms mode. You may have to as well, since you are in a field that is not initially editable.
As far as the select a school edit field is concerned, is that the field you are discussing? I'll look at the field again but I thought I heard select a number when I was
Gene On 5/28/2022 11:36 PM, Bob Cavanaugh wrote: Yes, that's standard edit commands. However, when I start typing the name of a school, NVDA says "this is an auto complete element and there are # results available. Keyboard users, use up and down arrows to select an option." The # in the example is, as one might guess, an actual number. However, when using up and down arrow with NVDA in focus mode, I just get the same auto complete message and NVDA reads what I've already typed in, it won't let me actually choose a result. The question is how do I actually choose a result as intended? On 5/28/22, Gene <gsasner@...> wrote: When you are on the line that says enter the name of the school, press enter. That makes the field editable and you can then press enter again to go into focus mode if you aren't automatically placed in it. Gene On 5/28/2022 10:07 PM, Bob Cavanaugh wrote: Hi all, Is the edit field on this page not a conventional one? I play Heardle every day, and it looks like the edit box on this page should work similar to that one, but I can't seem to get the one here to work. All I hear is NVDA telling me that this is an edit box that contains multiple selections, and how many results are available, but I can't seem to choose any results. The same happens when you're trying to select a school to send to, and I suspect I won't have to enter as much information as it's asking for if I could choose a result. Any help on this would be appreciated, as I've put this off for two weeks already. The link is https://tsorder.studentclearinghouse.org/school/select Thanks, Bob
.
|
|
|
You didn't cause one. it isn't your responsibility if people
disagree about something you said if you aren't expressing something
you think is controversial. In addition, a little controversy even
if you say something people may disagree with, is alright as long as
you are staying within the list rules. I may express an opinion
about a program, for example, that is controversial. There are
going to be disagreements.
Gene
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
On 5/29/2022 11:13 AM, mike mcglashon
wrote:
I apologize;
I did not mean to cause a rift.
That's a real example of both
civility and intellectual open mindedness. I didn't know
you harbor such hostility toward me.
If you can't be civil and you refuse to discuss what I say
without attacking me, don't bother.
Your last message displays a logical fallacy. You said that
you are confident no one in the accessibility field will
agree with me. So what? That is arguing from authority and
doesn't prove anything. How many people believed the world
was flat before Columbuss?
You have not, in either answer, presented any reasons for
believing what you believe. You just say what you believe.
Gene
On 5/29/2022 10:51 AM, David
Goldfield wrote:
Lack of accessibility isn’t an
error? I am quite certain that nobody in the
accessibility field will agree with you but I am done
with this conversation. You are free to respond to this
if you like but I will, unfortunately, resume my habit
of skipping your messages so your response will not be
read by me.
I didn't say anything about what
other words someone might want to use, but bug is not
correct. You might want to call it a flaw or an
omission, or use some sort of word or phrase that
indicates that it is no longer acceptable not to include
accessibility, but it isn't a bug.
One definition from Google I just looked up is:
"an error in a computer program or system."
Lack of accessibility isn't an error. It may be
unconscionable, unacceptable or you may wish to use
other wording, but it is not an error.
Gene
On 5/29/2022 10:27 AM, David
Goldfield wrote:
Gene wrote:
> I don't consider lack of
accessibility to be a bug.
As an accessibility tester I
disagree. I understand what you are saying in your
example of a stove which doesn’t take inclusive
design into account. However, if you have a Web site
which has no labels on form fields or which doesn’t
expose an edit field to a screen reader this is
definitely considered a bug or defect and needs to
be treated as such.
I don't consider lack of
accessibility to be a bug. A bug is an unintended
behavior. Saying a lack of accessibility is a bug
implies that the item was intended to be accessible
but isn't because of unanticipated problem or
problems.
If a stove isn't accessible and isn't designed to
be, that isn't a bug. You may call it a flaw, a
serious flaw, you may describe it as you wish in
terms of advocating for more accessibility, but it
isn't a bug. It is operating as designed.
If my stove is designed to be accessible and the
speech is giving inaccurate numbers as I move
through settings, that is a bug.
Gene
On 5/29/2022 7:49 AM, mike
mcglashon wrote:
Quoting:
On considering this
further, I don't know if this is a bug in
anything.
It may be that the
results shown as you move aren't announced
because the function isn't designed to be
accessible.
end quote:
Wow, wouldn’t that be
considered a “major” bug then? Or,
At least a “big flaw”?
Isn’t that bad if someone
designs a control on a page to be purposefully
inaccessible?
(especially a school
clearing house)?
Just curious?
It appears i was wrong
about the edit field. It appears to be a
standard edit field. I didn't hear anything
about number of results and moving up and down,
as I recall. I did try using the search field
where you enter a key word to find your school
and I then got results like yours.
I figured out how to find a school name. Its a
little work but you can accomplish this in the
following way:
Follow the key word search link.
An edit field will become available. If you are
not in forms mode go into forms mode. Just
pressing enter where you are after following the
link should do it.
Be in forms mode in the key word search edit
field.
Type a word such as Chicago.
You will hear how many results there are.
Down arrow to the first one. You won't hear the
school read but you will hear that you are on
the first result.
Press enter. You have now placed the name in
the field you are in and it can be read while in
forms mode. I don't recall if you automatically
hear it but you can use read current line or
maybe just pressing the down or up arrow will
read it.
If that is not the result you want, select all,
control a, and press delete.
Write Chicago again.
Down arrow to the second result and press enter.
Again, you will be able to hear the word.
Follow this procedure until you hear the name
you want.
Once you do, it is in the field it should be in
and you can then activate the continue button,
which will now be available.
On considering this further, I don't know if
this is a bug in anything. It may be that the
results shown as you move aren't announced
because the function isn't designed to be
accessible.
Gene
On 5/29/2022 7:07 AM,
Gene via groups.io wrote:
No, it isn't standard.
I had to press enter on select a school to
make the field editable in the first place.
Then I had to press enter again, since I am
using manual switching in NVDA, to go into
forms mode. You may have to as well, since
you are in a field that is not initially
editable.
As far as the select a school edit field is
concerned, is that the field you are
discussing? I'll look at the field again but
I thought I heard select a number when I was
Gene
On 5/28/2022 11:36
PM, Bob Cavanaugh wrote:
Yes, that's standard edit commands. However, when I start typing the
name of a school, NVDA says "this is an auto complete element and
there are # results available. Keyboard users, use up and down arrows
to select an option." The # in the example is, as one might guess, an
actual number. However, when using up and down arrow with NVDA in
focus mode, I just get the same auto complete message and NVDA reads
what I've already typed in, it won't let me actually choose a result.
The question is how do I actually choose a result as intended?
On 5/28/22, Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:
When you are on the line that says enter the name of the school, press
enter. That makes the field editable and you can then press enter again
to go into focus mode if you aren't automatically placed in it.
Gene
On 5/28/2022 10:07 PM, Bob Cavanaugh wrote:
Hi all,
Is the edit field on this page not a conventional one? I play Heardle
every day, and it looks like the edit box on this page should work
similar to that one, but I can't seem to get the one here to work. All
I hear is NVDA telling me that this is an edit box that contains
multiple selections, and how many results are available, but I can't
seem to choose any results. The same happens when you're trying to
select a school to send to, and I suspect I won't have to enter as
much information as it's asking for if I could choose a result. Any
help on this would be appreciated, as I've put this off for two weeks
already. The link is
https://tsorder.studentclearinghouse.org/school/select
Thanks,
Bob
.
|
|
|
This is a terribly designed autocomplete. However, there is a workaround but it involves using object navigation.
Start typing in the first few letters of the desired school. Once you do this use your numeric keypad, assuming that you have a full-size keyboard, and press insert numpad-4 to move across the objects until you hear NVDA announce the word
“list.”
Once you hear this press insert numpad-2 to drill down into that list. Insert numpad-6 should move from one item to the next in the list of schools.
When you hear the school that you want press insert numpad-enter to select it.
Next, navigate with the tab key to the Continue button and select it.
If you don’t have a full-size keyboard I’m afraid you’ll either need to look up the laptop equivalents for these hotkeys or use a full-size keyboard as I will admit that I never learned the laptop layout.
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of
Gene
Sent: Sunday, May 29, 2022 12:19 PM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] help with an edit field
You didn't cause one. it isn't your responsibility if people disagree about something you said if you aren't expressing something you think is controversial. In addition, a little controversy even if you say
something people may disagree with, is alright as long as you are staying within the list rules. I may express an opinion about a program, for example, that is controversial. There are going to be disagreements.
Gene
On 5/29/2022 11:13 AM, mike mcglashon wrote:
I apologize;
I did not mean to cause a rift.
That's a real example of both civility and intellectual open mindedness. I didn't know you harbor such hostility toward me.
If you can't be civil and you refuse to discuss what I say without attacking me, don't bother.
Your last message displays a logical fallacy. You said that you are confident no one in the accessibility field will agree with me. So what? That is arguing from authority and doesn't prove anything. How many people believed the world was flat before Columbuss?
You have not, in either answer, presented any reasons for believing what you believe. You just say what you believe.
Gene
On 5/29/2022 10:51 AM, David Goldfield wrote:
Lack of accessibility isn’t an error? I am quite certain that nobody in the accessibility field will agree with you but I am done with this conversation. You are free to respond
to this if you like but I will, unfortunately, resume my habit of skipping your messages so your response will not be read by me.
I didn't say anything about what other words someone might want to use, but bug is not correct. You might want to call it a flaw or an omission, or use some sort of word or phrase
that indicates that it is no longer acceptable not to include accessibility, but it isn't a bug.
One definition from Google I just looked up is:
"an error in a computer program or system."
Lack of accessibility isn't an error. It may be unconscionable, unacceptable or you may wish to use other wording, but it is not an error.
Gene
On 5/29/2022 10:27 AM, David Goldfield wrote:
Gene wrote:
> I don't consider lack of accessibility to be a bug.
As an accessibility tester I disagree. I understand what you are saying in your example of a stove which doesn’t take inclusive design into account. However, if you have a Web site
which has no labels on form fields or which doesn’t expose an edit field to a screen reader this is definitely considered a bug or defect and needs to be treated as such.
I don't consider lack of accessibility to be a bug. A bug is an unintended behavior. Saying a lack of accessibility is a bug implies that the item was intended to be accessible
but isn't because of unanticipated problem or problems.
If a stove isn't accessible and isn't designed to be, that isn't a bug. You may call it a flaw, a serious flaw, you may describe it as you wish in terms of advocating for more accessibility, but it isn't a bug. It is operating as designed.
If my stove is designed to be accessible and the speech is giving inaccurate numbers as I move through settings, that is a bug.
Gene
On 5/29/2022 7:49 AM, mike mcglashon wrote:
Quoting:
On considering this further, I don't know if this is a bug in anything.
It may be that the results shown as you move aren't announced because the function isn't designed to be accessible.
end quote:
Wow, wouldn’t that be considered a “major” bug then? Or,
At least a “big flaw”?
Isn’t that bad if someone designs a control on a page to be purposefully inaccessible?
(especially a school clearing house)?
Just curious?
It appears i was wrong about the edit field. It appears to be a standard edit field. I didn't hear anything about number of results and moving up and down, as I recall. I did
try using the search field where you enter a key word to find your school and I then got results like yours.
I figured out how to find a school name. Its a little work but you can accomplish this in the following way:
Follow the key word search link.
An edit field will become available. If you are not in forms mode go into forms mode. Just pressing enter where you are after following the link should do it.
Be in forms mode in the key word search edit field.
Type a word such as Chicago.
You will hear how many results there are.
Down arrow to the first one. You won't hear the school read but you will hear that you are on the first result.
Press enter. You have now placed the name in the field you are in and it can be read while in forms mode. I don't recall if you automatically hear it but you can use read current line or maybe just pressing the down or up arrow will read it.
If that is not the result you want, select all, control a, and press delete.
Write Chicago again.
Down arrow to the second result and press enter.
Again, you will be able to hear the word.
Follow this procedure until you hear the name you want.
Once you do, it is in the field it should be in and you can then activate the continue button, which will now be available.
On considering this further, I don't know if this is a bug in anything. It may be that the results shown as you move aren't announced because the function isn't designed to be accessible.
Gene
On 5/29/2022 7:07 AM, Gene via groups.io wrote:
No, it isn't standard. I had to press enter on select a school to make the field editable in the first place. Then I had to press enter again, since I am using manual switching
in NVDA, to go into forms mode. You may have to as well, since you are in a field that is not initially editable.
As far as the select a school edit field is concerned, is that the field you are discussing? I'll look at the field again but I thought I heard select a number when I was
Gene
On 5/28/2022 11:36 PM, Bob Cavanaugh wrote:
Yes, that's standard edit commands. However, when I start typing the
name of a school, NVDA says "this is an auto complete element and
there are # results available. Keyboard users, use up and down arrows
to select an option." The # in the example is, as one might guess, an
actual number. However, when using up and down arrow with NVDA in
focus mode, I just get the same auto complete message and NVDA reads
what I've already typed in, it won't let me actually choose a result.
The question is how do I actually choose a result as intended?
On 5/28/22, Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:
When you are on the line that says enter the name of the school, press
enter. That makes the field editable and you can then press enter again
to go into focus mode if you aren't automatically placed in it.
Gene
On 5/28/2022 10:07 PM, Bob Cavanaugh wrote:
Hi all,
Is the edit field on this page not a conventional one? I play Heardle
every day, and it looks like the edit box on this page should work
similar to that one, but I can't seem to get the one here to work. All
I hear is NVDA telling me that this is an edit box that contains
multiple selections, and how many results are available, but I can't
seem to choose any results. The same happens when you're trying to
select a school to send to, and I suspect I won't have to enter as
much information as it's asking for if I could choose a result. Any
help on this would be appreciated, as I've put this off for two weeks
already. The link is
https://tsorder.studentclearinghouse.org/school/select
Thanks,
Bob
.
|
|
|
