Topics

links

Don H
 

Running NVDA 2019.2 beta 1 on a Win 10 1903 system.

On certain web pages there are links that I can not activate.  I hit enter on them, I hit space bar on them and nothing happens.  I get sighted help and they can both activate them with a physical mouse or by using the touch screen.

Are there other ways to activate a link?

 

Specific pages and the links involved would be helpful for those of us who are trying to test out possible alternatives (or what's going on/not going on).

If these are not on pages where you have to be logged in to encounter them, please share several page addresses.

--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1809, Build 17763  

Puritanism:  The haunting fear that someone, somewhere, may be happy.

        ~ H.L. Mencken

 

 

Don H
 

Sorry but this is on a broker site where I have to sign in.

On 6/10/2019 6:14 PM, Brian Vogel wrote:
Specific pages and the links involved would be helpful for those of us who are trying to test out possible alternatives (or what's going on/not going on).

If these are not on pages where you have to be logged in to encounter them, please share several page addresses.

--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1809, Build 17763  

Puritanism:  The haunting fear that someone, somewhere, may be happy.

        ~ H.L. Mencken

 

 

 

I understand why you can't supply those addresses, then, but if you encounter the issue elsewhere be certain to make note of the web addresses and pass them along.  It's often well-nigh impossible to give accurate advice if an issue can not be replicated and worked with to find out what's happening.

--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1809, Build 17763  

Puritanism:  The haunting fear that someone, somewhere, may be happy.

        ~ H.L. Mencken

 

 

Gene
 

When you are on such a link, try the following two things.  I think it may be more likely that the one I'll describe will work first than the one I will describe second.
 
Some links are specified to only work with the mouse.  For those, if you do the following, you may be able to follow them:
When you are on the link, route the virtual mouse to the link with the command NVDA key numpad slash.  Numpad Slash is the left click key in NVDA and you are using the NVDA key with it to route the mouse.  Hold the NVDA key and while doing so, press numpad slash.  See if the link is followed.  I gave the left click command for the desktop layout.  I don't use the laptop layout. 
 
The second thing to try is to be on the link, then turn on forms mode with NVDA key space.  Try pressing enter on the link.  After doing so, turn browse mode back on with NVDA key space again.  When you go into forms mode, before pressing enter, see if you are on the correct link by shift tabbing, then tabbing to see if you are in the right place.  At times, browse mode doesn't line up properly with forms mode.
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----

From: Don H
Sent: Monday, June 10, 2019 6:10 PM
Subject: [nvda] links

Running NVDA 2019.2 beta 1 on a Win 10 1903 system.

On certain web pages there are links that I can not activate.  I hit
enter on them, I hit space bar on them and nothing happens.  I get
sighted help and they can both activate them with a physical mouse or by
using the touch screen.

Are there other ways to activate a link?




Don H
 

My question is whether there other ways to activate a link other than space bar or entr key.

On 6/10/2019 6:35 PM, Brian Vogel wrote:
I understand why you can't supply those addresses, then, but if you encounter the issue elsewhere be certain to make note of the web addresses and pass them along.  It's often well-nigh impossible to give accurate advice if an issue can not be replicated and worked with to find out what's happening.

--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1809, Build 17763  

Puritanism:  The haunting fear that someone, somewhere, may be happy.

        ~ H.L. Mencken

 

 

Don H
 

In this case the method of hitting NVDA key space does it.

Thanks

On 6/10/2019 7:09 PM, Gene wrote:
When you are on such a link, try the following two things.  I think it may be more likely that the one I'll describe will work first than the one I will describe second.
 
Some links are specified to only work with the mouse.  For those, if you do the following, you may be able to follow them:
When you are on the link, route the virtual mouse to the link with the command NVDA key numpad slash.  Numpad Slash is the left click key in NVDA and you are using the NVDA key with it to route the mouse.  Hold the NVDA key and while doing so, press numpad slash.  See if the link is followed.  I gave the left click command for the desktop layout.  I don't use the laptop layout. 
 
The second thing to try is to be on the link, then turn on forms mode with NVDA key space.  Try pressing enter on the link.  After doing so, turn browse mode back on with NVDA key space again.  When you go into forms mode, before pressing enter, see if you are on the correct link by shift tabbing, then tabbing to see if you are in the right place.  At times, browse mode doesn't line up properly with forms mode.
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----

From: Don H
Sent: Monday, June 10, 2019 6:10 PM
Subject: [nvda] links

Running NVDA 2019.2 beta 1 on a Win 10 1903 system.

On certain web pages there are links that I can not activate.  I hit
enter on them, I hit space bar on them and nothing happens.  I get
sighted help and they can both activate them with a physical mouse or by
using the touch screen.

Are there other ways to activate a link?




Blaster
 

Don, Both of Gene's methods described earlier are alternate methods of
clicking a link, other than just using the enter key or the spacebar
key. Also, switching to object nav mode and using the enter key or
spacebar may be worth a try.

HTH,
Blaster

On 6/10/19, Don H <lmddh50@...> wrote:
My question is whether there other ways to activate a link other than
space bar or entr key.

On 6/10/2019 6:35 PM, Brian Vogel wrote:
I understand why you can't supply those addresses, then, but if you
encounter the issue elsewhere be certain to make note of the web
addresses and pass them along. It's often well-nigh impossible to
give accurate advice if an issue can not be replicated and worked with
to find out what's happening.

--

Brian *-*Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1809, Build 17763

*/Puritanism: The haunting fear that someone, somewhere, may be happy./*

~ H.L. Mencken



Gene
 

You should always be in object navigation mode when you aren't specifically using another mode.  If you aren't, you may have problems that seem unrelated but they are.  I have long maintained that NVDA should automatically switch to object navigation when the user leaves the window where he is using another mode to avoid such problems.  But no matter that this list has seen problems solved by telling people to use Object Navigation Mode, and that that is the intended mode to be used in general, what I've suggested has made no difference.  People don't realize they shouldn't stay in screen navigation mode and have problems.  Who knows how many people have problems and aren't on a list like this where they can find out why.
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
From: Blaster
Sent: Monday, June 10, 2019 7:27 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] links

Don, Both of Gene's methods described earlier are alternate methods of
clicking a link, other than just using the enter key or the spacebar
key.  Also, switching to object nav mode and using the enter key or
spacebar  may be worth a try.

HTH,
Blaster


On 6/10/19, Don H <lmddh50@...> wrote:
> My question is whether there other ways to activate a link other than
> space bar or entr key.
>
> On 6/10/2019 6:35 PM, Brian Vogel wrote:
>> I understand why you can't supply those addresses, then, but if you
>> encounter the issue elsewhere be certain to make note of the web
>> addresses and pass them along.  It's often well-nigh impossible to
>> give accurate advice if an issue can not be replicated and worked with
>> to find out what's happening.
>>
>> --
>>
>> Brian *-*Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1809, Build 17763
>>
>> */Puritanism:  The haunting fear that someone, somewhere, may be happy./*
>>
>>         ~ H.L. Mencken
>>
>>
>
>
>
>


Don H
 

how do you switch to object nav mode?

On 6/10/2019 7:27 PM, Blaster wrote:
Don, Both of Gene's methods described earlier are alternate methods of
clicking a link, other than just using the enter key or the spacebar
key. Also, switching to object nav mode and using the enter key or
spacebar may be worth a try.

HTH,
Blaster


On 6/10/19, Don H <lmddh50@...> wrote:
My question is whether there other ways to activate a link other than
space bar or entr key.

On 6/10/2019 6:35 PM, Brian Vogel wrote:
I understand why you can't supply those addresses, then, but if you
encounter the issue elsewhere be certain to make note of the web
addresses and pass them along. It's often well-nigh impossible to
give accurate advice if an issue can not be replicated and worked with
to find out what's happening.

--

Brian *-*Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1809, Build 17763

*/Puritanism: The haunting fear that someone, somewhere, may be happy./*

~ H.L. Mencken



 

Hitting NVDA+NumPad 5 (desktop) or NVDA+shift+O (laptop) should tell you what the current object is, and shift into object navigation mode if you're not in it.

Open your keyboard shortcuts document from NVDA help and look through the Object Navigation section.

--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1809, Build 17763  

Puritanism:  The haunting fear that someone, somewhere, may be happy.

        ~ H.L. Mencken

 

 

Gene
 

To make sure you are in object navigation mode, for the desktop, issue the command NVDA key numpad 1.  Hold the NVDA key and press numpad 1.  You will either hear that you are in objectnavigation mode or you will hear something else.  Press it repeatedly until you hear either something like object navigation or something like no previous mode.  Object navigation is the first mode.
To move from object navigation to whatever modes are available, use NVDA key numpad 7. 
 
Unless this has changed in recent versions of NVDA that I haven't used, numpad 5 doesn't read the current object unless you are in object navigation mode or unless you are in screen review mode and you are on the current object while in screen review mode. It reads your current position in screen review mode. 
 
Also, it would make no sense for that command to switch you to object navigation mode.  If you are in screen review mode, you want to review the screen and not be moved into a different mode when issuing a read command such as read current item. 
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
From: Don H
Sent: Monday, June 10, 2019 7:54 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] links

how do you switch to object nav mode?

On 6/10/2019 7:27 PM, Blaster wrote:
> Don, Both of Gene's methods described earlier are alternate methods of
> clicking a link, other than just using the enter key or the spacebar
> key.  Also, switching to object nav mode and using the enter key or
> spacebar  may be worth a try.
>
> HTH,
> Blaster
>
>
> On 6/10/19, Don H <lmddh50@...> wrote:
>> My question is whether there other ways to activate a link other than
>> space bar or entr key.
>>
>> On 6/10/2019 6:35 PM, Brian Vogel wrote:
>>> I understand why you can't supply those addresses, then, but if you
>>> encounter the issue elsewhere be certain to make note of the web
>>> addresses and pass them along.  It's often well-nigh impossible to
>>> give accurate advice if an issue can not be replicated and worked with
>>> to find out what's happening.
>>>
>>> --
>>>
>>> Brian *-*Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1809, Build 17763
>>>
>>> */Puritanism:  The haunting fear that someone, somewhere, may be happy./*
>>>
>>>          ~ H.L. Mencken
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>



Luke Davis
 

On Mon, 10 Jun 2019, Brian Vogel wrote:

Hitting NVDA+NumPad 5 (desktop) or NVDA+shift+O (laptop) should tell you what the current object is, and shift into object navigation mode if you're not in
it.
Sorry. The first part of that is accurate. The second is not, at least for 2019.1.1.

NVDA+numpad5 does not change navigation modes.

Luke

Luke Davis
 

Gene, I agree, generally, with this and a few of your other long standing best-practices-should-be-default arguments. Have you ever filed issues for any of this, so they would be in a place where the developers might be in a position to see and comment on them?

Luke

On Mon, 10 Jun 2019, Gene wrote:

You should always be in object navigation mode when you aren't specifically using another mode.  If you aren't, you may have problems that seem unrelated
but they are.  I have long maintained that NVDA should automatically switch to object navigation when the user leaves the window where he is using another
mode to avoid such problems.  But no matter that this list has seen problems solved by telling people to use Object Navigation Mode, and that that is the
intended mode to be used in general, what I've suggested has made no difference.  People don't realize they shouldn't stay in screen navigation mode and
have problems.  Who knows how many people have problems and aren't on a list like this where they can find out why.

 

On Tue, Jun 11, 2019 at 12:20 AM, Luke Davis wrote:
Sorry. The first part of that [desktop/laptop commands for state current object] is accurate. The second is not, at least for 2019.1.1.

NVDA+numpad5 does not change navigation modes.
I have no problem admitting I make errors, and have made one here.   I appreciate the corrections from both Gene and yourself.  It's important that when errors are made that corrections are offered.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1809, Build 17763  

Puritanism:  The haunting fear that someone, somewhere, may be happy.

        ~ H.L. Mencken

 

 

Gene
 

I haven't gone to the trouble of learning how to create a ticket since I have so few issues to submit and since all or almost all of them were considered by the developers in the past when I made comments about them on the list, at least that is my impression.  I may create a ticket for one or two of these items, just to be sure.
 
Gene.

----- Original Message ------
From: Luke Davis
Sent: Monday, June 10, 2019 11:21 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] links

Gene, I agree, generally, with this and a few of your other long standing
best-practices-should-be-default arguments. Have you ever filed issues for any
of this, so they would be in a place where the developers might be in a position
to see and comment on them?

Luke

On Mon, 10 Jun 2019, Gene wrote:

> You should always be in object navigation mode when you aren't specifically using another mode.  If you aren't, you may have problems that seem unrelated
> but they are.  I have long maintained that NVDA should automatically switch to object navigation when the user leaves the window where he is using another
> mode to avoid such problems.  But no matter that this list has seen problems solved by telling people to use Object Navigation Mode, and that that is the
> intended mode to be used in general, what I've suggested has made no difference.  People don't realize they shouldn't stay in screen navigation mode and
> have problems.  Who knows how many people have problems and aren't on a list like this where they can find out why.



Luke Davis
 

On Tue, 11 Jun 2019, Gene wrote:

I haven't gone to the trouble of learning how to create a ticket since I have so few issues to submit
Well if you do decide to do it, it is extremely little trouble.

Go to https://github.com, and create an account, which you can do right on the homepage, by entering a username, your email address, and a password.

After your account is setup, go to: https://github.com/nvaccess/nvda/issues

There will be an add an issue button, or similar. Push it, fill out the template for feature request, submit it, and that's pretty much it.

Of course, it doesn't hurt to search existing issues to see if what you propose is already out there, so you can read and comment on that instead, but that can be done from the same place.

Luke

Quentin Christensen
 

I wrote up a piece on filing issues for In-Process last week, but since everything else I wrote already took up more than I often say, I held it over for next edition.  It's fairly straightforward though, as Luke said, but of course if you get stuck, please do let us know.

I am happy to file issues I can recreate myself (and occasionally ones I can't if someone gives me enough info).  One reason we encourage people to file issues themselves is that when the issue is addressed, often a special "try" build is created to test just that feature - If the original person who reported it is the one who filed the issue, they will see the reply and the link to download that test build so they can test whether it is indeed fixed.

Kind regards

Quentin.

On Tue, Jun 11, 2019 at 6:15 PM Luke Davis <luke@...> wrote:
On Tue, 11 Jun 2019, Gene wrote:

> I haven't gone to the trouble of learning how to create a ticket since I have so few issues to submit

Well if you do decide to do it, it is extremely little trouble.

Go to https://github.com, and create an account, which you can do
right on the homepage, by entering a username, your email address, and a
password.

After your account is setup, go to: https://github.com/nvaccess/nvda/issues

There will be an add an issue button, or similar. Push it, fill out the template
for feature request, submit it, and that's pretty much it.

Of course, it doesn't hurt to search existing issues to see if what you propose
is already out there, so you can read and comment on that instead, but that can
be done from the same place.

Luke






--
Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager

NVDA 2019.2beta1 now available!

Gene
 

I'll consider more seriously submitting a ticket but as I think about it more, I remember more clearly that someone said on list that the developers considered my list comments on this question in the past and didn't want to change it. That was a few years ago and, while I doubt the response will be different, I may try again.  And if others agree with me and comment on the ticket, maybe that will help, though I'm not optimistic.
 
Gene 

----- Original Message -----
From: Luke Davis
Sent: Tuesday, June 11, 2019 3:15 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] links

On Tue, 11 Jun 2019, Gene wrote:

> I haven't gone to the trouble of learning how to create a ticket since I have so few issues to submit

Well if you do decide to do it, it is extremely little trouble.

Go to https://github.com, and create an account, which you can do
right on the homepage, by entering a username, your email address, and a
password.

After your account is setup, go to: https://github.com/nvaccess/nvda/issues

There will be an add an issue button, or similar. Push it, fill out the template
for feature request, submit it, and that's pretty much it.

Of course, it doesn't hurt to search existing issues to see if what you propose
is already out there, so you can read and comment on that instead, but that can
be done from the same place.

Luke



Quentin Christensen
 

Gene,

I must admit, I wasn't paying attention to the original issue being discussed, so sticking broadly, for most things, if you can put forward a reasoned case for something, we're certainly willing to reconsider it, particularly if it's been a couple of years since it was proposed.  There are several other reasons why it can be worth submitting it to Github as well:

- Firstly, we will sometimes say that a proposed feature is not something WE will prioritise, but if someone else is interested in implementing it, we will accept a pull request for it (which is, if someone else writes the code we will review it to include in NVDA).

- Particularly in that case, it may also be something which can be created as an add-on, which then doesn't necessarily require as much review as a pull request to add something to core.

- GitHub is a central repository of feature requests and subsequent actions.  If we have an email conversation and from that decide not to implement something, it potentially means having the same conversation in year or so when it gets proposed again.  If the rationale for and against is documented on GitHub, it's much easier to come back later and put forward reasoning why things have changed.  it might even be as simple as people didn't think it would take off a couple of years ago but things have changed and such a feature would be really useful now.

Kind regards

Quentin.

On Tue, Jun 11, 2019 at 7:12 PM Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:
I'll consider more seriously submitting a ticket but as I think about it more, I remember more clearly that someone said on list that the developers considered my list comments on this question in the past and didn't want to change it. That was a few years ago and, while I doubt the response will be different, I may try again.  And if others agree with me and comment on the ticket, maybe that will help, though I'm not optimistic.
 
Gene 
----- Original Message -----
From: Luke Davis
Sent: Tuesday, June 11, 2019 3:15 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] links

On Tue, 11 Jun 2019, Gene wrote:

> I haven't gone to the trouble of learning how to create a ticket since I have so few issues to submit

Well if you do decide to do it, it is extremely little trouble.

Go to https://github.com, and create an account, which you can do
right on the homepage, by entering a username, your email address, and a
password.

After your account is setup, go to: https://github.com/nvaccess/nvda/issues

There will be an add an issue button, or similar. Push it, fill out the template
for feature request, submit it, and that's pretty much it.

Of course, it doesn't hurt to search existing issues to see if what you propose
is already out there, so you can read and comment on that instead, but that can
be done from the same place.

Luke





--
Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager

NVDA 2019.2beta1 now available!