Topics

nvda doesn't speak first few characters of information


UMIT ERDEM Yigitoglu
 

hello, 
I have bouth a new computor and updated nvda to 2020.2. currently nvda doesn't read some information. for example. when ı read something line by line it doesn't read fiew letters of first word. when ı navigate between files it is similar. it is a global problem. I am using elequence  trial mode but it happens with espeak too although not ophen. 
do anyone have any idea about reason for this problem and solution?
Best regards     


 

Are you listening through a Bluetooth headset or speakers?  If so, consider getting the Bluetooth Audio add-on and installing it.
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 2004, Build 19041  

A gentleman is one who never hurts anyone's feelings unintentionally.

          ~ Oscar Wilde

 


UMIT ERDEM Yigitoglu
 

I use usbheadphone  not bluethoot but When you mentioned it, I relized that the problem disappears when I disconnect my headphone. I donwloaded the addon and it seems to work. 
thank you very much.  


Sean
 

Possibly a sound card or hardware problem.
Because I've been following the Issues for a long time. I did not see this type of problem.

You can open an Issue on GitHub with your detailed hardware information. Maybe a sound record file.

On 30/08/2020 19:52, UMIT ERDEM Yigitoglu wrote:
hello, 
I have bouth a new computor and updated nvda to 2020.2. currently nvda doesn't read some information. for example. when ı read something line by line it doesn't read fiew letters of first word. when ı navigate between files it is similar. it is a global problem. I am using elequence  trial mode but it happens with espeak too although not ophen. 
do anyone have any idea about reason for this problem and solution?
Best regards     
--
Sean

👨‍🦯 I’m programmer. I coding often Python, sometimes Go and rarely C++.


enes sarıbaş
 

This is due to enhancements, and computer putting audio card to sleep. Stable NVDA will enclude a fix for this, but until then there are programs etc to download to stop this behavior.

On 8/30/2020 2:26 PM, UMIT ERDEM Yigitoglu wrote:
I use usbheadphone  not bluethoot but When you mentioned it, I relized that the problem disappears when I disconnect my headphone. I donwloaded the addon and it seems to work. 
thank you very much.  


 

Hi,

Specifically, this and some related fixes are going through testing phase at the moment.

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of enes saribas
Sent: Saturday, September 5, 2020 9:25 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] nvda doesn't speak first few characters of information

 

This is due to enhancements, and computer putting audio card to sleep. Stable NVDA will enclude a fix for this, but until then there are programs etc to download to stop this behavior.

On 8/30/2020 2:26 PM, UMIT ERDEM Yigitoglu wrote:

I use usbheadphone  not bluethoot but When you mentioned it, I relized that the problem disappears when I disconnect my headphone. I donwloaded the addon and it seems to work. 
thank you very much.  


Sean
 

In which branch?

On 05/09/2020 19:28, Joseph Lee wrote:

Hi,

Specifically, this and some related fixes are going through testing phase at the moment.

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of enes saribas
Sent: Saturday, September 5, 2020 9:25 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] nvda doesn't speak first few characters of information

 

This is due to enhancements, and computer putting audio card to sleep. Stable NVDA will enclude a fix for this, but until then there are programs etc to download to stop this behavior.

On 8/30/2020 2:26 PM, UMIT ERDEM Yigitoglu wrote:

I use usbheadphone  not bluethoot but When you mentioned it, I relized that the problem disappears when I disconnect my headphone. I donwloaded the addon and it seems to work. 
thank you very much.  

--
Sean

👨‍🦯 I’m programmer. I coding often Python, sometimes Go and rarely C++.


enes sarıbaş
 

Hello Joseph,

What I think would be extremely useful, is if microsoft added a screen reader flag or something that automatically would disable all enhancements for audio cards. Often I have read on many laptops that the control panels for disabling these aren't usually accessible. NVDA then could have an option to disable them when the screen reader is enabled.

On 9/5/2020 11:28 AM, Joseph Lee wrote:

Hi,

Specifically, this and some related fixes are going through testing phase at the moment.

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of enes saribas
Sent: Saturday, September 5, 2020 9:25 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] nvda doesn't speak first few characters of information

 

This is due to enhancements, and computer putting audio card to sleep. Stable NVDA will enclude a fix for this, but until then there are programs etc to download to stop this behavior.

On 8/30/2020 2:26 PM, UMIT ERDEM Yigitoglu wrote:

I use usbheadphone  not bluethoot but When you mentioned it, I relized that the problem disappears when I disconnect my headphone. I donwloaded the addon and it seems to work. 
thank you very much.  


 

Hi,

This will require a close collaboration with sound card manufacturers and driver providers so an API set can be created to control this behavior.

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of enes saribas
Sent: Saturday, September 5, 2020 9:30 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] nvda doesn't speak first few characters of information

 

Hello Joseph,

What I think would be extremely useful, is if microsoft added a screen reader flag or something that automatically would disable all enhancements for audio cards. Often I have read on many laptops that the control panels for disabling these aren't usually accessible. NVDA then could have an option to disable them when the screen reader is enabled.

On 9/5/2020 11:28 AM, Joseph Lee wrote:

Hi,

Specifically, this and some related fixes are going through testing phase at the moment.

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of enes saribas
Sent: Saturday, September 5, 2020 9:25 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] nvda doesn't speak first few characters of information

 

This is due to enhancements, and computer putting audio card to sleep. Stable NVDA will enclude a fix for this, but until then there are programs etc to download to stop this behavior.

On 8/30/2020 2:26 PM, UMIT ERDEM Yigitoglu wrote:

I use usbheadphone  not bluethoot but When you mentioned it, I relized that the problem disappears when I disconnect my headphone. I donwloaded the addon and it seems to work. 
thank you very much.  


 

Hi,

Alpha at the moment.

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Sean
Sent: Saturday, September 5, 2020 9:29 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] nvda doesn't speak first few characters of information

 

In which branch?

On 05/09/2020 19:28, Joseph Lee wrote:

Hi,

Specifically, this and some related fixes are going through testing phase at the moment.

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of enes saribas
Sent: Saturday, September 5, 2020 9:25 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] nvda doesn't speak first few characters of information

 

This is due to enhancements, and computer putting audio card to sleep. Stable NVDA will enclude a fix for this, but until then there are programs etc to download to stop this behavior.

On 8/30/2020 2:26 PM, UMIT ERDEM Yigitoglu wrote:

I use usbheadphone  not bluethoot but When you mentioned it, I relized that the problem disappears when I disconnect my headphone. I donwloaded the addon and it seems to work. 
thank you very much.  

--
Sean

👨🦯 I’m programmer. I coding often Python, sometimes Go and rarely C++.


enes sarıbaş
 

I really think it would be benefitial though. Audio effects probably were not designed to be used or to  enhance screen reader use. Also, there only a handful of companies producing the intigrated audio chips, and discrete cards.



On 9/5/2020 11:40 AM, Joseph Lee wrote:

Hi,

This will require a close collaboration with sound card manufacturers and driver providers so an API set can be created to control this behavior.

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of enes saribas
Sent: Saturday, September 5, 2020 9:30 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] nvda doesn't speak first few characters of information

 

Hello Joseph,

What I think would be extremely useful, is if microsoft added a screen reader flag or something that automatically would disable all enhancements for audio cards. Often I have read on many laptops that the control panels for disabling these aren't usually accessible. NVDA then could have an option to disable them when the screen reader is enabled.

On 9/5/2020 11:28 AM, Joseph Lee wrote:

Hi,

Specifically, this and some related fixes are going through testing phase at the moment.

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of enes saribas
Sent: Saturday, September 5, 2020 9:25 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] nvda doesn't speak first few characters of information

 

This is due to enhancements, and computer putting audio card to sleep. Stable NVDA will enclude a fix for this, but until then there are programs etc to download to stop this behavior.

On 8/30/2020 2:26 PM, UMIT ERDEM Yigitoglu wrote:

I use usbheadphone  not bluethoot but When you mentioned it, I relized that the problem disappears when I disconnect my headphone. I donwloaded the addon and it seems to work. 
thank you very much.  


 

On Sat, Sep 5, 2020 at 12:40 PM, Joseph Lee wrote:
This will require a close collaboration with sound card manufacturers and driver providers so an API set can be created to control this behavior.
-
It could also introduce a raft of problems as well.  Better that NVDA (or anything, really) be able to work whether or not enhancements are on or not.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 2004, Build 19041  

A gentleman is one who never hurts anyone's feelings unintentionally.

          ~ Oscar Wilde

 


enes sarıbaş
 

But Brian, the problem remains that these enhancements mess up audio output of NVDA, especially compression effects, due to eloquence being a formant synthesizer, probably what happens is it compresses some of the phonemes at the beginning and end of utterances.

On 9/5/2020 11:44 AM, Brian Vogel wrote:
On Sat, Sep 5, 2020 at 12:40 PM, Joseph Lee wrote:
This will require a close collaboration with sound card manufacturers and driver providers so an API set can be created to control this behavior.
-
It could also introduce a raft of problems as well.  Better that NVDA (or anything, really) be able to work whether or not enhancements are on or not.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 2004, Build 19041  

A gentleman is one who never hurts anyone's feelings unintentionally.

          ~ Oscar Wilde

 


 

Hi,

On one hand, a dedicated API to turn off enhancements may solve this issue (which to me is a symptom). But I would imagine people using older Windows releases or driver versions would ask NVDA developers to “backport” this for older releases (it’ll take a long thread to describe the process involved). There are other factors such as which enhancements are really on, synthesizer preferences, driver versions and such as it can become a sea of related (and possibly unrelated) discourse.

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of enes saribas
Sent: Saturday, September 5, 2020 9:43 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] nvda doesn't speak first few characters of information

 

I really think it would be benefitial though. Audio effects probably were not designed to be used or to  enhance screen reader use. Also, there only a handful of companies producing the intigrated audio chips, and discrete cards.

 

 

On 9/5/2020 11:40 AM, Joseph Lee wrote:

Hi,

This will require a close collaboration with sound card manufacturers and driver providers so an API set can be created to control this behavior.

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of enes saribas
Sent: Saturday, September 5, 2020 9:30 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] nvda doesn't speak first few characters of information

 

Hello Joseph,

What I think would be extremely useful, is if microsoft added a screen reader flag or something that automatically would disable all enhancements for audio cards. Often I have read on many laptops that the control panels for disabling these aren't usually accessible. NVDA then could have an option to disable them when the screen reader is enabled.

On 9/5/2020 11:28 AM, Joseph Lee wrote:

Hi,

Specifically, this and some related fixes are going through testing phase at the moment.

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of enes saribas
Sent: Saturday, September 5, 2020 9:25 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] nvda doesn't speak first few characters of information

 

This is due to enhancements, and computer putting audio card to sleep. Stable NVDA will enclude a fix for this, but until then there are programs etc to download to stop this behavior.

On 8/30/2020 2:26 PM, UMIT ERDEM Yigitoglu wrote:

I use usbheadphone  not bluethoot but When you mentioned it, I relized that the problem disappears when I disconnect my headphone. I donwloaded the addon and it seems to work. 
thank you very much.  


 

On Sat, Sep 5, 2020 at 12:48 PM, enes sarıbaş wrote:
But Brian, the problem remains that these enhancements mess up audio output of NVDA, especially compression effects, due to eloquence being a formant synthesizer, probably what happens is it compresses some of the phonemes at the beginning and end of utterances.
-
Then if one is using said synthesizers the synth makers should, as part of their installation documentation, tell you specifically what should be turned off.  Or, better yet, have the capability of probing whether a given something is on and turning it off (or vice versa) that is applicable to its functioning.

What you propose is a solution that would create many, many other potential problems, rather than focusing the solution on the specific situation.  That never makes sense.  It's asking for the law of unintended consequences to come roaring in.

And if you're going to argue with me about this, don't.  Having been a programmer for many, many years I know about this sort of situation all too well and I won't be changing my mind.  I've always said "tool to task" and that applies as far as "specific solution to specific problem" rather than casting an overly broad net that is very likely to catch all kinds of proverbial fish that you'd rather avoid.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 2004, Build 19041  

A gentleman is one who never hurts anyone's feelings unintentionally.

          ~ Oscar Wilde

 


enes sarıbaş
 

Hello Joseph,

This would also bring up the  obligation of developers to support obsolete software, such as win 7/8, and soon to be 8.1


On 9/5/2020 11:55 AM, Joseph Lee wrote:

Hi,

On one hand, a dedicated API to turn off enhancements may solve this issue (which to me is a symptom). But I would imagine people using older Windows releases or driver versions would ask NVDA developers to “backport” this for older releases (it’ll take a long thread to describe the process involved). There are other factors such as which enhancements are really on, synthesizer preferences, driver versions and such as it can become a sea of related (and possibly unrelated) discourse.

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of enes saribas
Sent: Saturday, September 5, 2020 9:43 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] nvda doesn't speak first few characters of information

 

I really think it would be benefitial though. Audio effects probably were not designed to be used or to  enhance screen reader use. Also, there only a handful of companies producing the intigrated audio chips, and discrete cards.

 

 

On 9/5/2020 11:40 AM, Joseph Lee wrote:

Hi,

This will require a close collaboration with sound card manufacturers and driver providers so an API set can be created to control this behavior.

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of enes saribas
Sent: Saturday, September 5, 2020 9:30 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] nvda doesn't speak first few characters of information

 

Hello Joseph,

What I think would be extremely useful, is if microsoft added a screen reader flag or something that automatically would disable all enhancements for audio cards. Often I have read on many laptops that the control panels for disabling these aren't usually accessible. NVDA then could have an option to disable them when the screen reader is enabled.

On 9/5/2020 11:28 AM, Joseph Lee wrote:

Hi,

Specifically, this and some related fixes are going through testing phase at the moment.

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of enes saribas
Sent: Saturday, September 5, 2020 9:25 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] nvda doesn't speak first few characters of information

 

This is due to enhancements, and computer putting audio card to sleep. Stable NVDA will enclude a fix for this, but until then there are programs etc to download to stop this behavior.

On 8/30/2020 2:26 PM, UMIT ERDEM Yigitoglu wrote:

I use usbheadphone  not bluethoot but When you mentioned it, I relized that the problem disappears when I disconnect my headphone. I donwloaded the addon and it seems to work. 
thank you very much.  


enes sarıbaş
 

Brian, out of curiousity, what sort of issues would this cause. I really despise the software enhancements  that come with soundcards, and think it is laptop manufacturerers trying to make their cheap audio hardware sound good. It interfeers with naturalness of audio, and alot of sighted users have a desire to disable signal processing as well, for a purerer music listening experience. If I find I cannot disable enhancements on my next machine easily, I will pay for an external DAC that has no signal processing for unenhanced audio, as audiophiles often do.

Additionally, the issue with documentation listing specific effects is that there is  no uniformness of effects in soundcard drivers iether. Realtek for example has bathroom, running water, consert effects etc.


On 9/5/2020 12:03 PM, Brian Vogel wrote:
On Sat, Sep 5, 2020 at 12:48 PM, enes sarıbaş wrote:
But Brian, the problem remains that these enhancements mess up audio output of NVDA, especially compression effects, due to eloquence being a formant synthesizer, probably what happens is it compresses some of the phonemes at the beginning and end of utterances.
-
Then if one is using said synthesizers the synth makers should, as part of their installation documentation, tell you specifically what should be turned off.  Or, better yet, have the capability of probing whether a given something is on and turning it off (or vice versa) that is applicable to its functioning.

What you propose is a solution that would create many, many other potential problems, rather than focusing the solution on the specific situation.  That never makes sense.  It's asking for the law of unintended consequences to come roaring in.

And if you're going to argue with me about this, don't.  Having been a programmer for many, many years I know about this sort of situation all too well and I won't be changing my mind.  I've always said "tool to task" and that applies as far as "specific solution to specific problem" rather than casting an overly broad net that is very likely to catch all kinds of proverbial fish that you'd rather avoid.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 2004, Build 19041  

A gentleman is one who never hurts anyone's feelings unintentionally.

          ~ Oscar Wilde

 


Sean
 

I agree Enes's opinion.

Manufacturers implement many different configurations for their sound cards, and this distorts the screen reader's audio, occasionally down the synthesizers's audio, etc.

Manufacturers do not offer a good UI/accessible UI for changing settings.
This makes us dependent on someone else while changing these settings.

I have friends using Lenovo and Asus.
And they do nothing but spoil the sound of NVDA.

Also, your programming for years is not an obstacle to discussing this problem.

On 05/09/2020 20:10, enes sarıbaş wrote:

Brian, out of curiousity, what sort of issues would this cause. I really despise the software enhancements  that come with soundcards, and think it is laptop manufacturerers trying to make their cheap audio hardware sound good. It interfeers with naturalness of audio, and alot of sighted users have a desire to disable signal processing as well, for a purerer music listening experience. If I find I cannot disable enhancements on my next machine easily, I will pay for an external DAC that has no signal processing for unenhanced audio, as audiophiles often do.

Additionally, the issue with documentation listing specific effects is that there is  no uniformness of effects in soundcard drivers iether. Realtek for example has bathroom, running water, consert effects etc.


On 9/5/2020 12:03 PM, Brian Vogel wrote:
On Sat, Sep 5, 2020 at 12:48 PM, enes sarıbaş wrote:
But Brian, the problem remains that these enhancements mess up audio output of NVDA, especially compression effects, due to eloquence being a formant synthesizer, probably what happens is it compresses some of the phonemes at the beginning and end of utterances.
-
Then if one is using said synthesizers the synth makers should, as part of their installation documentation, tell you specifically what should be turned off.  Or, better yet, have the capability of probing whether a given something is on and turning it off (or vice versa) that is applicable to its functioning.

What you propose is a solution that would create many, many other potential problems, rather than focusing the solution on the specific situation.  That never makes sense.  It's asking for the law of unintended consequences to come roaring in.

And if you're going to argue with me about this, don't.  Having been a programmer for many, many years I know about this sort of situation all too well and I won't be changing my mind.  I've always said "tool to task" and that applies as far as "specific solution to specific problem" rather than casting an overly broad net that is very likely to catch all kinds of proverbial fish that you'd rather avoid.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 2004, Build 19041  

A gentleman is one who never hurts anyone's feelings unintentionally.

          ~ Oscar Wilde

 

--
Sean

👨‍🦯 I’m programmer. I coding often Python, sometimes Go and rarely C++.


 

Hi,

Of course there will be people who will ask us (developers) to keep supporting obsolete software, with the understanding that certain policies are beyond a user’s control. Even then, we have to move on, and at the moment we are playing a complicated balancing game.

To illustrate the game we developers play, consider an upcoming feature in NVDA 2020.3 that will help you test whether or not NVDA will work better in UIA applications. In the past, NVDA would listen to all sorts of UIA events coming from UIA apps. In 2020.3, an experimental option will be introduced to let NVDA listen to events coming from the app you are using. With this turned on, whenever you switch between apps, NVDA will discard events from the old app in one sitting, and then tell Windows it wants to listen to UIA events coming from the new app (there are exceptions where an event will be handled across all apps); previously it didn’t do this. This was made possible thanks to what is called “event group” – a collection of UIA events that can be registered or unregistered in one single move rather than registering/unregistering one event at a time, which improves performance. This was introduced as part of IUIAutomation6 interface, which was included in Windows 10 October 2018 Update (Version 1809). But knowing that many of you are using older Windows releases, this concept was backported through use of a “fake event group” mechanism so you can give us feedback on if this backported concept is working or not. Developers know that this experiment is working on newer Windows 10 releases, but we need more solid evidence that this benefits everyone with the understanding that it may not be an optimal solution for users still using Windows 7 and 8.x.

A more serious example is improving support for Windows Console employed in Command Prompt, PowerShell, and to some extent, Windows Subsystem for Linux. Developers had to ask ourselves whether or not UIA-based console access is going to work, and if yes, which Windows 10 release introduced improved UIA code for console output. After verifying that the UIA-based console access is working, we had to hunt for a version of Windows 10 that did support an optimized version of what we are looking for. We initially thought that October 2018 Update was a suitable candidate, but learned that Version 1809 wasn’t quite adequate due to issues. NVDA people ended up talking to Microsoft engineers working on Windows Console, and as a result, future Windows 10 feature updates will come with improved UIA implementation for console access. This change cannot be backported to older Windows releases due to fundamental changes involved when it comes to console handling, and as a result, console handling via UIA is restricted to newer Windows 10 releases.

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of enes saribas
Sent: Saturday, September 5, 2020 10:05 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] nvda doesn't speak first few characters of information

 

Hello Joseph,

This would also bring up the  obligation of developers to support obsolete software, such as win 7/8, and soon to be 8.1

 

On 9/5/2020 11:55 AM, Joseph Lee wrote:

Hi,

On one hand, a dedicated API to turn off enhancements may solve this issue (which to me is a symptom). But I would imagine people using older Windows releases or driver versions would ask NVDA developers to “backport” this for older releases (it’ll take a long thread to describe the process involved). There are other factors such as which enhancements are really on, synthesizer preferences, driver versions and such as it can become a sea of related (and possibly unrelated) discourse.

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of enes saribas
Sent: Saturday, September 5, 2020 9:43 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] nvda doesn't speak first few characters of information

 

I really think it would be benefitial though. Audio effects probably were not designed to be used or to  enhance screen reader use. Also, there only a handful of companies producing the intigrated audio chips, and discrete cards.

 

 

On 9/5/2020 11:40 AM, Joseph Lee wrote:

Hi,

This will require a close collaboration with sound card manufacturers and driver providers so an API set can be created to control this behavior.

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of enes saribas
Sent: Saturday, September 5, 2020 9:30 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] nvda doesn't speak first few characters of information

 

Hello Joseph,

What I think would be extremely useful, is if microsoft added a screen reader flag or something that automatically would disable all enhancements for audio cards. Often I have read on many laptops that the control panels for disabling these aren't usually accessible. NVDA then could have an option to disable them when the screen reader is enabled.

On 9/5/2020 11:28 AM, Joseph Lee wrote:

Hi,

Specifically, this and some related fixes are going through testing phase at the moment.

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of enes saribas
Sent: Saturday, September 5, 2020 9:25 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] nvda doesn't speak first few characters of information

 

This is due to enhancements, and computer putting audio card to sleep. Stable NVDA will enclude a fix for this, but until then there are programs etc to download to stop this behavior.

On 8/30/2020 2:26 PM, UMIT ERDEM Yigitoglu wrote:

I use usbheadphone  not bluethoot but When you mentioned it, I relized that the problem disappears when I disconnect my headphone. I donwloaded the addon and it seems to work. 
thank you very much.  


 

Hi,

I think a better approach is contacting sound card manufacturers directly and explain the situation to them. Talking to synthesizer makers may or may not help, as some synths were developed by folks no longer in business or synth makers may say that this is a sound card driver problem.

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Sean
Sent: Saturday, September 5, 2020 10:22 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] nvda doesn't speak first few characters of information

 

I agree Enes's opinion.

Manufacturers implement many different configurations for their sound cards, and this distorts the screen reader's audio, occasionally down the synthesizers's audio, etc.

Manufacturers do not offer a good UI/accessible UI for changing settings.
This makes us dependent on someone else while changing these settings.

I have friends using Lenovo and Asus.
And they do nothing but spoil the sound of NVDA.

Also, your programming for years is not an obstacle to discussing this problem.

On 05/09/2020 20:10, enes sarıbaş wrote:

Brian, out of curiousity, what sort of issues would this cause. I really despise the software enhancements  that come with soundcards, and think it is laptop manufacturerers trying to make their cheap audio hardware sound good. It interfeers with naturalness of audio, and alot of sighted users have a desire to disable signal processing as well, for a purerer music listening experience. If I find I cannot disable enhancements on my next machine easily, I will pay for an external DAC that has no signal processing for unenhanced audio, as audiophiles often do.

Additionally, the issue with documentation listing specific effects is that there is  no uniformness of effects in soundcard drivers iether. Realtek for example has bathroom, running water, consert effects etc.

 

On 9/5/2020 12:03 PM, Brian Vogel wrote:

On Sat, Sep 5, 2020 at 12:48 PM, enes sarıbaş wrote:

But Brian, the problem remains that these enhancements mess up audio output of NVDA, especially compression effects, due to eloquence being a formant synthesizer, probably what happens is it compresses some of the phonemes at the beginning and end of utterances.

-
Then if one is using said synthesizers the synth makers should, as part of their installation documentation, tell you specifically what should be turned off.  Or, better yet, have the capability of probing whether a given something is on and turning it off (or vice versa) that is applicable to its functioning.

What you propose is a solution that would create many, many other potential problems, rather than focusing the solution on the specific situation.  That never makes sense.  It's asking for the law of unintended consequences to come roaring in.

And if you're going to argue with me about this, don't.  Having been a programmer for many, many years I know about this sort of situation all too well and I won't be changing my mind.  I've always said "tool to task" and that applies as far as "specific solution to specific problem" rather than casting an overly broad net that is very likely to catch all kinds of proverbial fish that you'd rather avoid.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 2004, Build 19041  

A gentleman is one who never hurts anyone's feelings unintentionally.

          ~ Oscar Wilde

 

--
Sean

👨🦯 I’m programmer. I coding often Python, sometimes Go and rarely C++.