|
Hello all,
When there is a empty line, nvda will report "blank."
But, if the line contain only spaces, say " " nvda will say "space blank."
I wanna understand why nvda still regard it as blank when there are spaces?
Thanks,
William.
|
|
|
What is the context and would you rather it read?
Hello all,
When there is a empty line, nvda will report "blank."
But, if the line contain only spaces, say " " nvda will say "space blank."
I wanna understand why nvda still regard it as blank when there are spaces?
Thanks,
William.
-- Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager
|
|
|
Hi Quentin
Hmm, I am just wondering to my understand, blank is nothing, but
if there is spaces, and it says blank, I may be confused.
Quentin Christensen 於 27/5/2022 10:13 寫道:
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
What is the context and would you rather it read?
Hello all,
When there is a empty line, nvda will report "blank."
But, if the line contain only spaces, say " " nvda will say
"space blank."
I wanna understand why nvda still regard it as blank when
there are spaces?
Thanks,
William.
--
Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager
|
|
|
It sounds to me as though you aren't reporting when it says space
and blank with enough detail. If I have a blank line in Notepad, I
hear blank. When I put spaces on the line and nothing else, it
still says blank. But if I want to check to see if there are any
spaces on the line and I issue the say current line command twice
quickly, the number of spaces are spoken on the line and blank
isn't.
That makes sense since if it announced space when it saw spaces in a
line when not spelling the line, you would hear space announced
during ordinary reading between every word.
Gene
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
On 5/26/2022 9:43 PM, William wrote:
Hi Quentin
Hmm, I am just wondering to my understand, blank is nothing,
but if there is spaces, and it says blank, I may be confused.
Quentin Christensen 於 27/5/2022 10:13 寫道:
What is the context and would you rather it read?
Hello all,
When there is a empty line, nvda will report "blank."
But, if the line contain only spaces, say " " nvda will say
"space blank."
I wanna understand why nvda still regard it as blank when
there are spaces?
Thanks,
William.
--
Quentin
Christensen
Training and Support Manager
|
|
|
Also, if I move by character with the left and right arrows and
there are spaces on a line, I hear space as I move and if there are
words and spaces, I hear the words spelled as I move and space
spoken between words. When I up and down arrow among lines with
spaces and nothing else, I hear blank. All this makes sense. You
don't want to hear space spoken when you are reading lines. You do
want to hear space spoken when you are moving by character through a
line.
Gene
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
On 5/26/2022 10:32 PM, Gene wrote:
It
sounds to me as though you aren't reporting when it says space and
blank with enough detail. If I have a blank line in Notepad, I
hear blank. When I put spaces on the line and nothing else, it
still says blank. But if I want to check to see if there are any
spaces on the line and I issue the say current line command twice
quickly, the number of spaces are spoken on the line and blank
isn't.
That makes sense since if it announced space when it saw spaces in
a line when not spelling the line, you would hear space announced
during ordinary reading between every word.
Gene
On 5/26/2022 9:43 PM, William wrote:
Hi Quentin
Hmm, I am just wondering to my understand, blank is nothing,
but if there is spaces, and it says blank, I may be confused.
Quentin Christensen 於 27/5/2022 10:13 寫道:
What is the context and would you rather it
read?
Hello all,
When there is a empty line, nvda will report "blank."
But, if the line contain only spaces, say " " nvda will
say "space blank."
I wanna understand why nvda still regard it as blank when
there are spaces?
Thanks,
William.
--
Quentin
Christensen
Training and Support Manager
|
|
|
It could also be argued that sighted users don't see anything for whitespace (either spaces, tabs, newlines, etc) (ok Word with non-printable characters displayed is an exception).
To the OP, In any case, if you can think of a good workaround and use case, then feel free to create an issue. As Gene noted, you don't generally want spaces between words read out when just reading regular text, and depending on how you navigate, they ARE reported now. Whether that fits what you need, will depend on.... what you need, and what you are doing.
On Fri, May 27, 2022 at 2:09 PM Gene < gsasner@...> wrote:
Also, if I move by character with the left and right arrows and
there are spaces on a line, I hear space as I move and if there are
words and spaces, I hear the words spelled as I move and space
spoken between words. When I up and down arrow among lines with
spaces and nothing else, I hear blank. All this makes sense. You
don't want to hear space spoken when you are reading lines. You do
want to hear space spoken when you are moving by character through a
line.
Gene
On 5/26/2022 10:32 PM, Gene wrote:
It
sounds to me as though you aren't reporting when it says space and
blank with enough detail. If I have a blank line in Notepad, I
hear blank. When I put spaces on the line and nothing else, it
still says blank. But if I want to check to see if there are any
spaces on the line and I issue the say current line command twice
quickly, the number of spaces are spoken on the line and blank
isn't.
That makes sense since if it announced space when it saw spaces in
a line when not spelling the line, you would hear space announced
during ordinary reading between every word.
Gene
On 5/26/2022 9:43 PM, William wrote:
Hi Quentin
Hmm, I am just wondering to my understand, blank is nothing,
but if there is spaces, and it says blank, I may be confused.
Quentin Christensen 於 27/5/2022 10:13 寫道:
What is the context and would you rather it
read?
Hello all,
When there is a empty line, nvda will report "blank."
But, if the line contain only spaces, say " " nvda will
say "space blank."
I wanna understand why nvda still regard it as blank when
there are spaces?
Thanks,
William.
--
Quentin
Christensen
Training and Support Manager
-- Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager
|
|
|
Hi Group,
I have experienced the following issue with Blank lines and symbols.
When I receive a message from audible informing me of books or
things I might be interested in, I usually get a first line like
'Audible an Amazon company. Then I press the down arrow key 5 times
and hear absolutely nothing. I do not hear blank--but nothing is
spoken. When I hit the sixth line, then speech resumes. Sighted
people tell me there are strange characters on those 5 lines--some
kind of ASCII art for appearance sake.
I wonder if this is what some people are experiencing.
On 5/26/2022 11:32 PM, Gene wrote:
It
sounds to me as though you aren't reporting when it says space and
blank with enough detail. If I have a blank line in Notepad, I
hear blank. When I put spaces on the line and nothing else, it
still says blank. But if I want to check to see if there are any
spaces on the line and I issue the say current line command twice
quickly, the number of spaces are spoken on the line and blank
isn't.
That makes sense since if it announced space when it saw spaces in
a line when not spelling the line, you would hear space announced
during ordinary reading between every word.
Gene
On 5/26/2022 9:43 PM, William wrote:
Hi Quentin
Hmm, I am just wondering to my understand, blank is nothing,
but if there is spaces, and it says blank, I may be confused.
Quentin Christensen 於 27/5/2022 10:13 寫道:
What is the context and would you rather it
read?
Hello all,
When there is a empty line, nvda will report "blank."
But, if the line contain only spaces, say " " nvda will
say "space blank."
I wanna understand why nvda still regard it as blank when
there are spaces?
Thanks,
William.
--
Quentin
Christensen
Training and Support Manager
--
Signature:
For a nation to admit it has done grevous wrongs and will strive to correct them for the betterment of all is no vice;
For a nation to claim it has always been great, needs no improvement and to cling to its past achievements is no virtue!
|
|
|
That is likely because the text on that line is all symbols which are set to a higher punctuation level than you currently have NVDA set to - so they aren't read.. There is a pull request designed to address this kind of thing here: https://github.com/nvaccess/nvda/pull/13483
Kind regards
Quentin.
On Fri, May 27, 2022 at 2:25 PM Ron Canazzi < aa2vm@...> wrote:
Hi Group,
I have experienced the following issue with Blank lines and symbols.
When I receive a message from audible informing me of books or
things I might be interested in, I usually get a first line like
'Audible an Amazon company. Then I press the down arrow key 5 times
and hear absolutely nothing. I do not hear blank--but nothing is
spoken. When I hit the sixth line, then speech resumes. Sighted
people tell me there are strange characters on those 5 lines--some
kind of ASCII art for appearance sake.
I wonder if this is what some people are experiencing.
On 5/26/2022 11:32 PM, Gene wrote:
It
sounds to me as though you aren't reporting when it says space and
blank with enough detail. If I have a blank line in Notepad, I
hear blank. When I put spaces on the line and nothing else, it
still says blank. But if I want to check to see if there are any
spaces on the line and I issue the say current line command twice
quickly, the number of spaces are spoken on the line and blank
isn't.
That makes sense since if it announced space when it saw spaces in
a line when not spelling the line, you would hear space announced
during ordinary reading between every word.
Gene
On 5/26/2022 9:43 PM, William wrote:
Hi Quentin
Hmm, I am just wondering to my understand, blank is nothing,
but if there is spaces, and it says blank, I may be confused.
Quentin Christensen 於 27/5/2022 10:13 寫道:
What is the context and would you rather it
read?
Hello all,
When there is a empty line, nvda will report "blank."
But, if the line contain only spaces, say " " nvda will
say "space blank."
I wanna understand why nvda still regard it as blank when
there are spaces?
Thanks,
William.
--
Quentin
Christensen
Training and Support Manager
--
Signature:
For a nation to admit it has done grevous wrongs and will strive to correct them for the betterment of all is no vice;
For a nation to claim it has always been great, needs no improvement and to cling to its past achievements is no virtue!
-- Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager
|
|
|
I have a blank line in Notepad, I hear blank. When I put spaces
on the line and nothing else, it still says blank. But if I want
to check to see if there are any spaces on the line and I issue
the say current line command twice quickly, the > number of
spaces are spoken on the line and blank isn't.
If it is in Notepad++, it will say
space blank.
> You don't want to hear space
spoken when you are reading lines.
Sometimes, I am editing a file which
was given by a sighted person, and I see that there are lines of
spaces but it says blank, so at the first glance, I am confused.
But I totally agree that it is like sighted people do not see
spaces, so line with only spaces can be regarded as blank.
Gene 於 27/5/2022 11:32 寫道:
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
It
sounds to me as though you aren't reporting when it says space and
blank with enough detail. If I have a blank line in Notepad, I
hear blank. When I put spaces on the line and nothing else, it
still says blank. But if I want to check to see if there are any
spaces on the line and I issue the say current line command twice
quickly, the number of spaces are spoken on the line and blank
isn't.
That makes sense since if it announced space when it saw spaces in
a line when not spelling the line, you would hear space announced
during ordinary reading between every word.
Gene
On 5/26/2022 9:43 PM, William wrote:
Hi Quentin
Hmm, I am just wondering to my understand, blank is nothing,
but if there is spaces, and it says blank, I may be confused.
Quentin Christensen 於 27/5/2022 10:13 寫道:
What is the context and would you rather it
read?
Hello all,
When there is a empty line, nvda will report "blank."
But, if the line contain only spaces, say " " nvda will
say "space blank."
I wanna understand why nvda still regard it as blank when
there are spaces?
Thanks,
William.
--
Quentin
Christensen
Training and Support Manager
|
|
|
I can't help further unless what you are describing is stated very
clearly. When do you hear space blank? What, exactly, are you
doing when you hear it? You write as though you hear both space and
blank spoken when you take the same action. For example, when you
move by character, you hear space blank spoken when you move. I'm
not saying that is what happens, but I don't know what you are
describing. Is that what you are saying and if so, what is the
action that causes the behavior?
Gene
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
On 5/27/2022 1:15 AM, William wrote:
I have a blank line in Notepad, I hear blank. When I put
spaces on the line and nothing else, it still says blank. But
if I want to check to see if there are any spaces on the line
and I issue the say current line command twice quickly, the >
number of spaces are spoken on the line and blank isn't.
If it is in Notepad++, it will say
space blank.
> You don't want to hear space
spoken when you are reading lines.
Sometimes, I am editing a file which
was given by a sighted person, and I see that there are lines of
spaces but it says blank, so at the first glance, I am confused.
But I totally agree that it is like sighted people do not see
spaces, so line with only spaces can be regarded as blank.
Gene 於 27/5/2022 11:32 寫道:
It
sounds to me as though you aren't reporting when it says space
and blank with enough detail. If I have a blank line in
Notepad, I hear blank. When I put spaces on the line and
nothing else, it still says blank. But if I want to check to
see if there are any spaces on the line and I issue the say
current line command twice quickly, the number of spaces are
spoken on the line and blank isn't.
That makes sense since if it announced space when it saw spaces
in a line when not spelling the line, you would hear space
announced during ordinary reading between every word.
Gene
On 5/26/2022 9:43 PM, William
wrote:
Hi Quentin
Hmm, I am just wondering to my understand, blank is
nothing, but if there is spaces, and it says blank, I may be
confused.
Quentin Christensen 於 27/5/2022 10:13 寫道:
What is the context and would you rather it
read?
Hello all,
When there is a empty line, nvda will report "blank."
But, if the line contain only spaces, say " " nvda will
say "space blank."
I wanna understand why nvda still regard it as blank
when there are spaces?
Thanks,
William.
--
Quentin
Christensen
Training and Support Manager
|
|
|
Sorry, I found out the reason.
Because I have set nvda to report indentation, so my nvda will report space blank if the line is containing one space.
Gene 於 27/5/2022 18:55 寫道:
I can't help further unless what you are describing is stated very clearly. When do you hear space blank? What, exactly, are you doing when you hear it? You write as though you hear both space and blank spoken when you take the same action. For example, when you move by character, you hear space blank spoken when you move. I'm not saying that is what happens, but I don't know what you are describing. Is that what you are saying and if so, what is the action that causes the behavior?
Gene
On 5/27/2022 1:15 AM, William wrote:
I have a blank line in Notepad, I hear blank. When I put spaces on the line and nothing else, it still says blank. But if I want to check to see if there are any spaces on the line and I issue the say current line command twice quickly, the > number of spaces are spoken on the line and blank isn't.
If it is in Notepad++, it will say space blank.
> You don't want to hear space spoken when you are reading lines.
Sometimes, I am editing a file which was given by a sighted person, and I see that there are lines of spaces but it says blank, so at the first glance, I am confused. But I totally agree that it is like sighted people do not see spaces, so line with only spaces can be regarded as blank.
Gene 於 27/5/2022 11:32 寫道:
It sounds to me as though you aren't reporting when it says space and blank with enough detail. If I have a blank line in Notepad, I hear blank. When I put spaces on the line and nothing else, it still says blank. But if I want to check to see if there are any spaces on the line and I issue the say current line command twice quickly, the number of spaces are spoken on the line and blank isn't.
That makes sense since if it announced space when it saw spaces in a line when not spelling the line, you would hear space announced during ordinary reading between every word.
Gene
On 5/26/2022 9:43 PM, William wrote:
Hi Quentin
Hmm, I am just wondering to my understand, blank is nothing, but if there is spaces, and it says blank, I may be confused.
Quentin Christensen 於 27/5/2022 10:13 寫道:
What is the context and would you rather it read?
Hello all,
When there is a empty line, nvda will report "blank."
But, if the line contain only spaces, say " " nvda will say "space blank."
I wanna understand why nvda still regard it as blank when there are spaces?
Thanks,
William.
--
Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager
|
|
|
Others may have more comments. Now we know what the problem is but
it is outside of my knowledge.
gene
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
On 5/27/2022 6:22 AM, William wrote:
Oh I found out that why you did not understand what I meant.
My nvda is now set to zh-tw
1. open somewhere that can type characters, like the composing
window of Thunderbird, Notepad++
2. type a space into the first line
3. press nvda+up arrow to report current line
4. my nvda says "space blank" (in chinese)
5. switch nvda locale to english
6. repeat step 3
7. nvda only says "blank"
So different locale produce different result regarding this
situation.
Gene 於 27/5/2022 18:55 寫道:
I
can't help further unless what you are describing is stated very
clearly. When do you hear space blank? What, exactly, are you
doing when you hear it? You write as though you hear both space
and blank spoken when you take the same action. For example,
when you move by character, you hear space blank spoken when you
move. I'm not saying that is what happens, but I don't know
what you are describing. Is that what you are saying and if so,
what is the action that causes the behavior?
Gene
On 5/27/2022 1:15 AM, William
wrote:
I have a blank line in Notepad, I hear blank. When I put
spaces on the line and nothing else, it still says blank.
But if I want to check to see if there are any spaces on the
line and I issue the say current line command twice quickly,
the > number of spaces are spoken on the line and blank
isn't.
If it is in Notepad++, it will
say space blank.
> You don't want to hear space
spoken when you are reading lines.
Sometimes, I am editing a file
which was given by a sighted person, and I see that there
are lines of spaces but it says blank, so at the first
glance, I am confused. But I totally agree that it is like
sighted people do not see spaces, so line with only spaces
can be regarded as blank.
Gene 於 27/5/2022 11:32 寫道:
It sounds to me as though you aren't reporting when it says
space and blank with enough detail. If I have a blank line
in Notepad, I hear blank. When I put spaces on the line and
nothing else, it still says blank. But if I want to check
to see if there are any spaces on the line and I issue the
say current line command twice quickly, the number of spaces
are spoken on the line and blank isn't.
That makes sense since if it announced space when it saw
spaces in a line when not spelling the line, you would hear
space announced during ordinary reading between every word.
Gene
On 5/26/2022 9:43 PM, William
wrote:
Hi Quentin
Hmm, I am just wondering to my understand, blank is
nothing, but if there is spaces, and it says blank, I
may be confused.
Quentin Christensen 於 27/5/2022 10:13 寫道:
What is the context and would you rather
it read?
Hello all,
When there is a empty line, nvda will report
"blank."
But, if the line contain only spaces, say " " nvda
will say "space blank."
I wanna understand why nvda still regard it as blank
when there are spaces?
Thanks,
William.
--
Quentin
Christensen
Training and Support
Manager
|
|
|
Gene,
Sorry, locale is irrelevant to this issue, I have used different
configuration profile after switching the nvda locale, so at first
I wonder the problem is related to the locale.
Sorry for causing confusion.
SuperSilly 於 27/5/2022 19:22 寫道:
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
Oh I found out that why you did not understand what I meant.
My nvda is now set to zh-tw
1. open somewhere that can type characters, like the composing
window of Thunderbird, Notepad++
2. type a space into the first line
3. press nvda+up arrow to report current line
4. my nvda says "space blank" (in chinese)
5. switch nvda locale to english
6. repeat step 3
7. nvda only says "blank"
So different locale produce different result regarding this
situation.
Gene 於 27/5/2022 18:55 寫道:
I
can't help further unless what you are describing is stated very
clearly. When do you hear space blank? What, exactly, are you
doing when you hear it? You write as though you hear both space
and blank spoken when you take the same action. For example,
when you move by character, you hear space blank spoken when you
move. I'm not saying that is what happens, but I don't know
what you are describing. Is that what you are saying and if so,
what is the action that causes the behavior?
Gene
On 5/27/2022 1:15 AM, William
wrote:
I have a blank line in Notepad, I hear blank. When I put
spaces on the line and nothing else, it still says blank.
But if I want to check to see if there are any spaces on the
line and I issue the say current line command twice quickly,
the > number of spaces are spoken on the line and blank
isn't.
If it is in Notepad++, it will
say space blank.
> You don't want to hear space
spoken when you are reading lines.
Sometimes, I am editing a file
which was given by a sighted person, and I see that there
are lines of spaces but it says blank, so at the first
glance, I am confused. But I totally agree that it is like
sighted people do not see spaces, so line with only spaces
can be regarded as blank.
Gene 於 27/5/2022 11:32 寫道:
It sounds to me as though you aren't reporting when it says
space and blank with enough detail. If I have a blank line
in Notepad, I hear blank. When I put spaces on the line and
nothing else, it still says blank. But if I want to check
to see if there are any spaces on the line and I issue the
say current line command twice quickly, the number of spaces
are spoken on the line and blank isn't.
That makes sense since if it announced space when it saw
spaces in a line when not spelling the line, you would hear
space announced during ordinary reading between every word.
Gene
On 5/26/2022 9:43 PM, William
wrote:
Hi Quentin
Hmm, I am just wondering to my understand, blank is
nothing, but if there is spaces, and it says blank, I
may be confused.
Quentin Christensen 於 27/5/2022 10:13 寫道:
What is the context and would you rather
it read?
Hello all,
When there is a empty line, nvda will report
"blank."
But, if the line contain only spaces, say " " nvda
will say "space blank."
I wanna understand why nvda still regard it as blank
when there are spaces?
Thanks,
William.
--
Quentin
Christensen
Training and Support
Manager
|
|
|
Its good you found out.
Gene
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
On 5/27/2022 6:22 AM, William wrote:
[Edited Message Follows]
Sorry, I found out the reason.
Because I have set nvda to report indentation, so my nvda will
report space blank if the line is containing one space.
Gene 於 27/5/2022 18:55 寫道:
I
can't help further unless what you are describing is stated very
clearly. When do you hear space blank? What, exactly, are you
doing when you hear it? You write as though you hear both space
and blank spoken when you take the same action. For example,
when you move by character, you hear space blank spoken when you
move. I'm not saying that is what happens, but I don't know
what you are describing. Is that what you are saying and if so,
what is the action that causes the behavior?
Gene
On 5/27/2022 1:15 AM, William
wrote:
I have a blank line in Notepad, I hear blank. When I put
spaces on the line and nothing else, it still says blank.
But if I want to check to see if there are any spaces on the
line and I issue the say current line command twice quickly,
the > number of spaces are spoken on the line and blank
isn't.
If it is in Notepad++, it will
say space blank.
> You don't want to hear space
spoken when you are reading lines.
Sometimes, I am editing a file
which was given by a sighted person, and I see that there
are lines of spaces but it says blank, so at the first
glance, I am confused. But I totally agree that it is like
sighted people do not see spaces, so line with only spaces
can be regarded as blank.
Gene 於 27/5/2022 11:32 寫道:
It
sounds to me as though you aren't reporting when it says
space and blank with enough detail. If I have a blank line
in Notepad, I hear blank. When I put spaces on the line and
nothing else, it still says blank. But if I want to check
to see if there are any spaces on the line and I issue the
say current line command twice quickly, the number of spaces
are spoken on the line and blank isn't.
That makes sense since if it announced space when it saw
spaces in a line when not spelling the line, you would hear
space announced during ordinary reading between every word.
Gene
On 5/26/2022 9:43 PM, William
wrote:
Hi Quentin
Hmm, I am just wondering to my understand, blank is
nothing, but if there is spaces, and it says blank, I
may be confused.
Quentin Christensen 於 27/5/2022 10:13 寫道:
What is the context and would you rather
it read?
Hello all,
When there is a empty line, nvda will report
"blank."
But, if the line contain only spaces, say " " nvda
will say "space blank."
I wanna understand why nvda still regard it as blank
when there are spaces?
Thanks,
William.
--
Quentin
Christensen
Training and Support Manager
|
|
|
Hi all,
Sorry I thought my mind was stuck yesterday. Please ignore all the
conversations yesterday.
Let me restate my concern.
-----
First of all, lets type a few lines into something like notepad
'''
Hello, this is the new worl.
Hi, this is the second line.
'''
While I am typing those lines, I mistakenly typed some spaces into
the third line, which nvda says blank.
Now, I move my edit cursor up two line to do proof reading by
pressing up arrows.
Oh I found that the word 'worl' is missing a 'd' so I move the
cursor to the end, before the dot, add a 'd.'
Then I keep proof reading and find that the second line is
perfect.
Then I press down arrow to move to the third line.
As nvda default to not reading indentations, I assume that the
line is a blank line, because I heard nvda says blank.
Then I keep typing the third line.
'''
Hello, this is the new world.
Hi, this is the second line.
Oh this is the third line.
'''
So the problem comes, I have typed those words after those
mistakenly typed spaces.
I know that for blind people who use braille display will
immediately pick up those spaces because they are not relying
mainly on speech of nvda. Even though nvda says the line is blank,
they can still determine that the line is a line containing spaces
by touching braille display.
But for people like me, who do not use braille display, I am
mainly relying on the audio information provided by nvda. So if I
hear blank, I assumed that it is really blank and has nothing, not
even spaces.
But refer to the above situation, I assumed that it is a blank
line without anything, and start typing on the third line.
But in fact, it is not really a blank line, so what I have typed
is after those spaces.
This is the problem that I have came across.
Thanks,
William
Gene 於 27/5/2022 19:53 寫道:
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
Its
good you found out.
Gene
On 5/27/2022 6:22 AM, William wrote:
[Edited Message Follows]
Sorry, I found out the reason.
Because I have set nvda to report indentation, so my nvda will
report space blank if the line is containing one space.
Gene 於 27/5/2022 18:55 寫道:
I
can't help further unless what you are describing is stated
very clearly. When do you hear space blank? What, exactly,
are you doing when you hear it? You write as though you hear
both space and blank spoken when you take the same action.
For example, when you move by character, you hear space blank
spoken when you move. I'm not saying that is what happens,
but I don't know what you are describing. Is that what you
are saying and if so, what is the action that causes the
behavior?
Gene
On 5/27/2022 1:15 AM, William
wrote:
I have a blank line in Notepad, I hear blank. When I put
spaces on the line and nothing else, it still says blank.
But if I want to check to see if there are any spaces on
the line and I issue the say current line command twice
quickly, the > number of spaces are spoken on the line
and blank isn't.
If it is in Notepad++, it will
say space blank.
> You don't want to hear
space spoken when you are reading lines.
Sometimes, I am editing a file
which was given by a sighted person, and I see that there
are lines of spaces but it says blank, so at the first
glance, I am confused. But I totally agree that it is like
sighted people do not see spaces, so line with only spaces
can be regarded as blank.
Gene 於 27/5/2022 11:32 寫道:
It
sounds to me as though you aren't reporting when it says
space and blank with enough detail. If I have a blank
line in Notepad, I hear blank. When I put spaces on the
line and nothing else, it still says blank. But if I want
to check to see if there are any spaces on the line and I
issue the say current line command twice quickly, the
number of spaces are spoken on the line and blank isn't.
That makes sense since if it announced space when it saw
spaces in a line when not spelling the line, you would
hear space announced during ordinary reading between every
word.
Gene
On 5/26/2022 9:43 PM, William
wrote:
Hi Quentin
Hmm, I am just wondering to my understand, blank is
nothing, but if there is spaces, and it says blank, I
may be confused.
Quentin Christensen 於 27/5/2022 10:13 寫道:
What is the context and would you
rather it read?
Hello all,
When there is a empty line, nvda will report
"blank."
But, if the line contain only spaces, say " " nvda
will say "space blank."
I wanna understand why nvda still regard it as
blank when there are spaces?
Thanks,
William.
--
Quentin
Christensen
Training and Support
Manager
|
|
|
Unless NVDA has an add-on for the problem, I don't know of any way
to hear that information. JAWS has something you can turn on, I
think its called the text analyzer, that will say something like two
spaces or run on of spaces, but unless there is an add-on I don't
know about, NVDA can't be made to do that. We'll see if anyone
knows of an add-on.
Perhaps NVDA should have some function to do that.
Gene
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
On 5/27/2022 8:05 PM, William wrote:
Hi all,
Sorry I thought my mind was stuck yesterday. Please ignore all
the conversations yesterday.
Let me restate my concern.
-----
First of all, lets type a few lines into something like notepad
'''
Hello, this is the new worl.
Hi, this is the second line.
'''
While I am typing those lines, I mistakenly typed some spaces
into the third line, which nvda says blank.
Now, I move my edit cursor up two line to do proof reading by
pressing up arrows.
Oh I found that the word 'worl' is missing a 'd' so I move the
cursor to the end, before the dot, add a 'd.'
Then I keep proof reading and find that the second line is
perfect.
Then I press down arrow to move to the third line.
As nvda default to not reading indentations, I assume that the
line is a blank line, because I heard nvda says blank.
Then I keep typing the third line.
'''
Hello, this is the new world.
Hi, this is the second line.
Oh this is the third line.
'''
So the problem comes, I have typed those words after those
mistakenly typed spaces.
I know that for blind people who use braille display will
immediately pick up those spaces because they are not relying
mainly on speech of nvda. Even though nvda says the line is
blank, they can still determine that the line is a line
containing spaces by touching braille display.
But for people like me, who do not use braille display, I am
mainly relying on the audio information provided by nvda. So if
I hear blank, I assumed that it is really blank and has nothing,
not even spaces.
But refer to the above situation, I assumed that it is a blank
line without anything, and start typing on the third line.
But in fact, it is not really a blank line, so what I have typed
is after those spaces.
This is the problem that I have came across.
Thanks,
William
Gene 於 27/5/2022 19:53 寫道:
Its
good you found out.
Gene
On 5/27/2022 6:22 AM, William
wrote:
[Edited Message Follows]
Sorry, I found out the reason.
Because I have set nvda to report indentation, so my nvda
will report space blank if the line is containing one space.
Gene 於 27/5/2022 18:55 寫道:
I
can't help further unless what you are describing is stated
very clearly. When do you hear space blank? What, exactly,
are you doing when you hear it? You write as though you
hear both space and blank spoken when you take the same
action. For example, when you move by character, you hear
space blank spoken when you move. I'm not saying that is
what happens, but I don't know what you are describing. Is
that what you are saying and if so, what is the action that
causes the behavior?
Gene
On 5/27/2022 1:15 AM, William
wrote:
I have a blank line in Notepad, I hear blank. When I
put spaces on the line and nothing else, it still says
blank. But if I want to check to see if there are any
spaces on the line and I issue the say current line
command twice quickly, the > number of spaces are
spoken on the line and blank isn't.
If it is in Notepad++, it
will say space blank.
> You don't want to hear
space spoken when you are reading lines.
Sometimes, I am editing a
file which was given by a sighted person, and I see that
there are lines of spaces but it says blank, so at the
first glance, I am confused. But I totally agree that it
is like sighted people do not see spaces, so line with
only spaces can be regarded as blank.
Gene 於 27/5/2022 11:32 寫道:
It
sounds to me as though you aren't reporting when it says
space and blank with enough detail. If I have a blank
line in Notepad, I hear blank. When I put spaces on the
line and nothing else, it still says blank. But if I
want to check to see if there are any spaces on the line
and I issue the say current line command twice quickly,
the number of spaces are spoken on the line and blank
isn't.
That makes sense since if it announced space when it saw
spaces in a line when not spelling the line, you would
hear space announced during ordinary reading between
every word.
Gene
On 5/26/2022 9:43 PM,
William wrote:
Hi Quentin
Hmm, I am just wondering to my understand, blank is
nothing, but if there is spaces, and it says blank,
I may be confused.
Quentin Christensen 於 27/5/2022 10:13 寫道:
What is the context and would you
rather it read?
Hello all,
When there is a empty line, nvda will report
"blank."
But, if the line contain only spaces, say " "
nvda will say "space blank."
I wanna understand why nvda still regard it as
blank when there are spaces?
Thanks,
William.
--
Quentin
Christensen
Training and Support
Manager
|
|
|
Hi, I would prefer NVDA or any screen reader say something like “Three Spaces” if they are present on a line. All the best Steve
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Quentin Christensen
Sent: 27 May 2022 05:12
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA reporting blank It could also be argued that sighted users don't see anything for whitespace (either spaces, tabs, newlines, etc) (ok Word with non-printable characters displayed is an exception). To the OP, In any case, if you can think of a good workaround and use case, then feel free to create an issue. As Gene noted, you don't generally want spaces between words read out when just reading regular text, and depending on how you navigate, they ARE reported now. Whether that fits what you need, will depend on.... what you need, and what you are doing. On Fri, May 27, 2022 at 2:09 PM Gene <gsasner@...> wrote: Also, if I move by character with the left and right arrows and there are spaces on a line, I hear space as I move and if there are words and spaces, I hear the words spelled as I move and space spoken between words. When I up and down arrow among lines with spaces and nothing else, I hear blank. All this makes sense. You don't want to hear space spoken when you are reading lines. You do want to hear space spoken when you are moving by character through a line.
Gene On 5/26/2022 10:32 PM, Gene wrote: It sounds to me as though you aren't reporting when it says space and blank with enough detail. If I have a blank line in Notepad, I hear blank. When I put spaces on the line and nothing else, it still says blank. But if I want to check to see if there are any spaces on the line and I issue the say current line command twice quickly, the number of spaces are spoken on the line and blank isn't.
That makes sense since if it announced space when it saw spaces in a line when not spelling the line, you would hear space announced during ordinary reading between every word.
Gene On 5/26/2022 9:43 PM, William wrote: Hi Quentin Hmm, I am just wondering to my understand, blank is nothing, but if there is spaces, and it says blank, I may be confused. Quentin Christensen 於 27/5/2022 10:13 寫道: What is the context and would you rather it read? Hello all,
When there is a empty line, nvda will report "blank."
But, if the line contain only spaces, say " " nvda will say "space blank."
I wanna understand why nvda still regard it as blank when there are spaces?
Thanks,
William.
-- Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager
-- Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager
|
|
|
Hi, You could try increasing your punctuation level. All the best
Steve
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Ron Canazzi
Sent: 27 May 2022 05:23
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA reporting blank Hi Group,
I have experienced the following issue with Blank lines and symbols. When I receive a message from audible informing me of books or things I might be interested in, I usually get a first line like 'Audible an Amazon company. Then I press the down arrow key 5 times and hear absolutely nothing. I do not hear blank--but nothing is spoken. When I hit the sixth line, then speech resumes. Sighted people tell me there are strange characters on those 5 lines--some kind of ASCII art for appearance sake.
I wonder if this is what some people are experiencing.
On 5/26/2022 11:32 PM, Gene wrote: It sounds to me as though you aren't reporting when it says space and blank with enough detail. If I have a blank line in Notepad, I hear blank. When I put spaces on the line and nothing else, it still says blank. But if I want to check to see if there are any spaces on the line and I issue the say current line command twice quickly, the number of spaces are spoken on the line and blank isn't.
That makes sense since if it announced space when it saw spaces in a line when not spelling the line, you would hear space announced during ordinary reading between every word.
Gene On 5/26/2022 9:43 PM, William wrote: Hi Quentin Hmm, I am just wondering to my understand, blank is nothing, but if there is spaces, and it says blank, I may be confused. Quentin Christensen 於 27/5/2022 10:13 寫道: What is the context and would you rather it read? Hello all,
When there is a empty line, nvda will report "blank."
But, if the line contain only spaces, say " " nvda will say "space blank."
I wanna understand why nvda still regard it as blank when there are spaces?
Thanks,
William.
-- Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager
-- Signature: For a nation to admit it has done grevous wrongs and will strive to correct them for the betterment of all is no vice; For a nation to claim it has always been great, needs no improvement and to cling to its past achievements is no virtue!
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Yes that works, but it shouldn’t say blank at the end. All the best
Steve
From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of William
Sent: 27 May 2022 12:22
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA reporting blank [Edited Message Follows] Sorry, I found out the reason.
Because I have set nvda to report indentation, so my nvda will report space blank if the line is containing one space.
Gene 於 27/5/2022 18:55 寫道: I can't help further unless what you are describing is stated very clearly. When do you hear space blank? What, exactly, are you doing when you hear it? You write as though you hear both space and blank spoken when you take the same action. For example, when you move by character, you hear space blank spoken when you move. I'm not saying that is what happens, but I don't know what you are describing. Is that what you are saying and if so, what is the action that causes the behavior?
Gene On 5/27/2022 1:15 AM, William wrote: I have a blank line in Notepad, I hear blank. When I put spaces on the line and nothing else, it still says blank. But if I want to check to see if there are any spaces on the line and I issue the say current line command twice quickly, the > number of spaces are spoken on the line and blank isn't. If it is in Notepad++, it will say space blank. > You don't want to hear space spoken when you are reading lines. Sometimes, I am editing a file which was given by a sighted person, and I see that there are lines of spaces but it says blank, so at the first glance, I am confused. But I totally agree that it is like sighted people do not see spaces, so line with only spaces can be regarded as blank. Gene 於 27/5/2022 11:32 寫道: It sounds to me as though you aren't reporting when it says space and blank with enough detail. If I have a blank line in Notepad, I hear blank. When I put spaces on the line and nothing else, it still says blank. But if I want to check to see if there are any spaces on the line and I issue the say current line command twice quickly, the number of spaces are spoken on the line and blank isn't.
That makes sense since if it announced space when it saw spaces in a line when not spelling the line, you would hear space announced during ordinary reading between every word.
Gene On 5/26/2022 9:43 PM, William wrote: Hi Quentin Hmm, I am just wondering to my understand, blank is nothing, but if there is spaces, and it says blank, I may be confused. Quentin Christensen 於 27/5/2022 10:13 寫道: What is the context and would you rather it read? Hello all,
When there is a empty line, nvda will report "blank."
But, if the line contain only spaces, say " " nvda will say "space blank."
I wanna understand why nvda still regard it as blank when there are spaces?
Thanks,
William.
-- Quentin Christensen
Training and Support Manager
|
|
|
JAWS has a feature called Text Analyzer which reports things it
thinks may be errors. I don't know how many spaces it reports
beyond one space between words but it does report spaces that it
thinks are likely to be too many.
Gene
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
On 6/23/2022 11:28 AM, Steve Nutt
wrote:
Hi,
I would prefer NVDA or any screen
reader say something like “Three Spaces” if they are present
on a line.
All the best
Steve
It could also be argued that sighted
users don't see anything for whitespace (either spaces,
tabs, newlines, etc) (ok Word with non-printable characters
displayed is an exception).
To the OP, In any case, if you can
think of a good workaround and use case, then feel free to
create an issue. As Gene noted, you don't generally want
spaces between words read out when just reading regular
text, and depending on how you navigate, they ARE reported
now. Whether that fits what you need, will depend on....
what you need, and what you are doing.
On Fri, May 27, 2022 at 2:09 PM Gene
<gsasner@...> wrote:
Also, if I move by character with the
left and right arrows and there are spaces on a line, I
hear space as I move and if there are words and spaces,
I hear the words spelled as I move and space spoken
between words. When I up and down arrow among lines
with spaces and nothing else, I hear blank. All this
makes sense. You don't want to hear space spoken when
you are reading lines. You do want to hear space spoken
when you are moving by character through a line.
Gene
On 5/26/2022 10:32 PM, Gene wrote:
It sounds to me as though you
aren't reporting when it says space and blank with
enough detail. If I have a blank line in Notepad, I
hear blank. When I put spaces on the line and nothing
else, it still says blank. But if I want to check to
see if there are any spaces on the line and I issue
the say current line command twice quickly, the number
of spaces are spoken on the line and blank isn't.
That makes sense since if it announced space when it
saw spaces in a line when not spelling the line, you
would hear space announced during ordinary reading
between every word.
Gene
On 5/26/2022 9:43 PM, William
wrote:
Hi Quentin
Hmm, I am just wondering to my understand, blank is
nothing, but if there is spaces, and it says blank,
I may be confused.
Quentin Christensen 於 27/5/2022 10:13
寫道:
What is the context and would
you rather it read?
Hello all,
When there is a empty line, nvda will report
"blank."
But, if the line contain only spaces, say " "
nvda will say "space blank."
I wanna understand why nvda still regard it as
blank when there are spaces?
Thanks,
William.
--
Quentin
Christensen
Training and Support
Manager
--
Quentin
Christensen
Training and Support Manager
|
|
|
