NVDA + Windows Live Mail


James Johnson
 

Hi. First time post here. My father is blind and using NVDA with Windows Live Mail. The keystrokes Alt+M followed by I+M (for him to move an email to a subfolder) are spoken, however NVDA doesn't speak the drop down menu of subfolders so he can't navigate the choices. Does anyone know of an alternative option to move emails to subfolders, or to get NVDA to speak the subfolder list? With thanks in advance. James


 

Moderator's Note:  I allowed this post to go live just in case someone happens to know the answer to getting NVDA to speak when the noted commands are issued.

Windows Live Mail is out of support, has been out of support for years, and there are multiple reports of it becoming more and more problematic.  Your father would be wise to switch to Thunderbird, webmail, or another email client that remains in current support.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H1, Build 19043  

The ignorance of one voter in a democracy impairs the security of all.

         ~ John F. Kennedy

 


Gene
 

I use Windows Live Mail and I seem to recall some sort of problem of the sort.  One way around it, where things speak, is to select the messages or hbe on the single message you want to move, open the context menu, and press enter on move.  A dialog will come up that is accessible. 
 
the short cut in the context menu for move is the letter v so you can also open the context menu and type v to open the dialog. 
 
the description is for the ribbon version of the program but I think it applies to the earlier version as well.
 
Gene

-----Original Message-----
Sent: Thursday, November 04, 2021 4:43 AM
Subject: [nvda] NVDA + Windows Live Mail
 
Hi. First time post here. My father is blind and using NVDA with Windows Live Mail. The keystrokes Alt+M followed by I+M (for him to move an email to a subfolder) are spoken, however NVDA doesn't speak the drop down menu of subfolders so he can't navigate the choices. Does anyone know of an alternative option to move emails to subfolders, or to get NVDA to speak the subfolder list? With thanks in advance. James


Gene
 

Regarding Brian’s comments about the program becoming increasingly problematic, I still use the program as my main e-mail program.  This may vary from machine to machine, but Thunderbird opens messages significantly slower on my machine than Windows Live Mail.  While I certainly have no objecgtion to anyone trying Thunderbird or another program and using it if they like it better, at least on my machine, I find Windows Live Mail to be superiorr because of the faster opening of messages.  It remains my main e-mail program.
 
Gene

-----Original Message-----
From: Gene
Sent: Thursday, November 04, 2021 10:26 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA + Windows Live Mail
 
I use Windows Live Mail and I seem to recall some sort of problem of the sort.  One way around it, where things speak, is to select the messages or hbe on the single message you want to move, open the context menu, and press enter on move.  A dialog will come up that is accessible. 
 
the short cut in the context menu for move is the letter v so you can also open the context menu and type v to open the dialog. 
 
the description is for the ribbon version of the program but I think it applies to the earlier version as well.
 
Gene
-----Original Message-----
Sent: Thursday, November 04, 2021 4:43 AM
Subject: [nvda] NVDA + Windows Live Mail
 
Hi. First time post here. My father is blind and using NVDA with Windows Live Mail. The keystrokes Alt+M followed by I+M (for him to move an email to a subfolder) are spoken, however NVDA doesn't speak the drop down menu of subfolders so he can't navigate the choices. Does anyone know of an alternative option to move emails to subfolders, or to get NVDA to speak the subfolder list? With thanks in advance. James


 

On Thu, Nov 4, 2021 at 11:32 AM, Gene wrote:
It remains my main e-mail program.
 
-
And I'm not telling you, or anyone else, to use Thunderbird.  But you can only stretch your luck so far.  Windows Live Mail, which I recommended as a basic email client long after it went out of support, keeps breaking for multiple people for multiple reasons these days, which is no surprise.  Use it as long as you like and you can, but you would be well-advised to begin looking at replacements so that when it finally breaks for you, it won't be a choice made hastily.

That's one of the beauties of IMAP access to e-mail.  It allows you to set up as many different email clients as you might wish to "give them a spin" without it screwing up your email access on other devices or in your preferred client of the moment on the same device.

And those who use Gmail are very likely to very shortly have huge problems with WLM which, if I'm remembering correctly, does not support 2FA or OAUTH access in any way.  Google is moving millions of accounts to require 2FA next week, at least one of mine in that number.  I haven't received the notice yet on others.

There really is a very good reason for the group rule:  Unsupported versions of any software may only be discussed on the Chat Subgroup, not the main NVDA Group. 
It's not because unsupported software cannot be used past its end of support date, at least for a while, but because it is eventually bound to break and screen readers as a class will not fix any issues that they may have with out-of-support software.  Resources are limited, and programmers have to focus on what's happening now as well as what is going to happen (that's known in advance) in the future.  There's no good reason to do otherwise.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H1, Build 19043  

The ignorance of one voter in a democracy impairs the security of all.

         ~ John F. Kennedy

 


Gene
 

As far as people trying things if it appears they may want or need to use a different program in the near future, I agree.  There are times when I have advised that someone try a program so they won’t have to learn under pressure when it appears something may no longer be usable or well usable in the not too distant future.
 
I believe that when you create an GMail account now, you need to use 2FA.  But after you have created the account, Windows Live Mail signs in without problems. 
 
Gene. 

-----Original Message-----
Sent: Thursday, November 04, 2021 10:40 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA + Windows Live Mail
 
On Thu, Nov 4, 2021 at 11:32 AM, Gene wrote:
It remains my main e-mail program.
 
-
And I'm not telling you, or anyone else, to use Thunderbird.  But you can only stretch your luck so far.  Windows Live Mail, which I recommended as a basic email client long after it went out of support, keeps breaking for multiple people for multiple reasons these days, which is no surprise.  Use it as long as you like and you can, but you would be well-advised to begin looking at replacements so that when it finally breaks for you, it won't be a choice made hastily.

That's one of the beauties of IMAP access to e-mail.  It allows you to set up as many different email clients as you might wish to "give them a spin" without it screwing up your email access on other devices or in your preferred client of the moment on the same device.

And those who use Gmail are very likely to very shortly have huge problems with WLM which, if I'm remembering correctly, does not support 2FA or OAUTH access in any way.  Google is moving millions of accounts to require 2FA next week, at least one of mine in that number.  I haven't received the notice yet on others.

There really is a very good reason for the group rule:  Unsupported versions of any software may only be discussed on the Chat Subgroup, not the main NVDA Group. 
It's not because unsupported software cannot be used past its end of support date, at least for a while, but because it is eventually bound to break and screen readers as a class will not fix any issues that they may have with out-of-support software.  Resources are limited, and programmers have to focus on what's happening now as well as what is going to happen (that's known in advance) in the future.  There's no good reason to do otherwise.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H1, Build 19043  

The ignorance of one voter in a democracy impairs the security of all.

         ~ John F. Kennedy

 


James Johnson
 

Thank you both for your help with this. I'll try the keystrokes with my father and see how we fair. He has just moved off of one screen reader to another so is familiarising himself with NVDA. Introducing Thunderbird might be step too much at the current moment, but I do hear your thoughts on staying in touch with compatible software and systems. Apologies for posting in the wrong group - will ensure I post the sub group with any further questions. 

With thanks,

James


Gene
 

I am replying to this thread here and not on the chat list because my answer deals almost entirely with NVDA.  I hope it is helpful.  I am not assuming what you know but since I don’t know, I am providing what may be important information.
 
If your father mostly works with program commands and not things like the JAWS cursor, there will be little difference in what he does.  You can do a lot when you switch screen-readers because a lot of what people use are Windows and program commands.

There are a small number of commands that are important at the outset that are NVDA commands. 
Read the title bar, NVDA key t. 
Adjust speech settings, NVDA key control v.
Select synthesizer, if you want to use a different available one, NVDDA insert v.
Read to end, NVDA key down arrow.  Not the numpad 2, which you can use in JAWS, but down arrow on the main keyboard.
 
Your father should find using Windows Live Mail, aside perhaps from using this or that NVDA command such as read to end, almost identical whether JAWS or NVDA is used.  For browsing the Internet, NVDA uses almost identical navigation commands, move by heading h, skip blocks of links, n move by button. b move by radio button, r to name a number of commands. 
 
Your father will probably want to learn at least a little mlore about NVDA to adjust things like verbosity, but what I’ve written may be helpful.
 
Gene

-----Original Message-----
 
Sent: Friday, November 05, 2021 9:00 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA + Windows Live Mail
 
Thank you both for your help with this. I'll try the keystrokes with my father and see how we fair. He has just moved off of one screen reader to another so is familiarising himself with NVDA. Introducing Thunderbird might be step too much at the current moment, but I do hear your thoughts on staying in touch with compatible software and systems. Apologies for posting in the wrong group - will ensure I post the sub group with any further questions. 

With thanks,
 
James


Steve Nutt
 

Hi,

 

There are differences on the web though, for example, move by Radio Button in JAWS, is A, not R.

 

But essentially the commands are the same.

 

All the best


Steve

 

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From: nvda@nvda.groups.io <nvda@nvda.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: 05 November 2021 15:45
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA + Windows Live Mail

 

I am replying to this thread here and not on the chat list because my answer deals almost entirely with NVDA.  I hope it is helpful.  I am not assuming what you know but since I don’t know, I am providing what may be important information.

 

If your father mostly works with program commands and not things like the JAWS cursor, there will be little difference in what he does.  You can do a lot when you switch screen-readers because a lot of what people use are Windows and program commands.


There are a small number of commands that are important at the outset that are NVDA commands. 

Read the title bar, NVDA key t. 

Adjust speech settings, NVDA key control v.

Select synthesizer, if you want to use a different available one, NVDDA insert v.

Read to end, NVDA key down arrow.  Not the numpad 2, which you can use in JAWS, but down arrow on the main keyboard.

 

Your father should find using Windows Live Mail, aside perhaps from using this or that NVDA command such as read to end, almost identical whether JAWS or NVDA is used.  For browsing the Internet, NVDA uses almost identical navigation commands, move by heading h, skip blocks of links, n move by button. b move by radio button, r to name a number of commands. 

 

Your father will probably want to learn at least a little mlore about NVDA to adjust things like verbosity, but what I’ve written may be helpful.

 

Gene

-----Original Message-----

 

Sent: Friday, November 05, 2021 9:00 AM

Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA + Windows Live Mail

 

Thank you both for your help with this. I'll try the keystrokes with my father and see how we fair. He has just moved off of one screen reader to another so is familiarising himself with NVDA. Introducing Thunderbird might be step too much at the current moment, but I do hear your thoughts on staying in touch with compatible software and systems. Apologies for posting in the wrong group - will ensure I post the sub group with any further questions. 


With thanks,

 

James