Portable copy


Howard Traxler
 

Is it possible to run a portable copy of NVDA from a folder on a hard drive?  When it wants to update, will it update the portable copy; wherever it might be located?  Thanks

<HT>


Gene
 

You can run a copy of NVDA portable from anything, a removable external drive, a thumb drive, on your internal hard drive, anywhere from which your computer can see and run the program.  Of course, you shouldn't run it from a cdrom because you wouldn't be able to update it, but I suppose it could even run from one, if you never make any changes, which would all be immediately lost when the program closed.

the program will update just as it does wherever it is located.

Gene

On 8/9/2022 9:20 AM, Howard Traxler wrote:
Is it possible to run a portable copy of NVDA from a folder on a hard drive?  When it wants to update, will it update the portable copy; wherever it might be located?  Thanks

<HT>









 

It's possible to make and run a portable copy of NVDA (or any other program that has a portable variant) from any media of your choosing.

Although portable variants are intended to be, well, portable the two things that determine that they truly are:
1. They're placed on media that can be carried with you, e.g., a thumb drive, SD card, external HDD.
2. They do not install, and by that I mean in the literal sense.  Installed programs make entries in the Windows Registry and also often either add libraries of their own into the existing collection or rely on libraries from it.  Portable variants do neither of those things and everything they need is self-contained in the folder structure created.

The NVDA installer (whether a fresh one downloaded from NVAccess, or the built-in auto update function) does not update portable copies.  If you want updated portable copies you need to have NVDA make new ones for you.

So, yes, you can create a folder such as C:\Portable_Programs\NVDA and create a portable copy of NVDA there, and it will remain there, and can be run from there, and it will never be updated unless you update it.  You can also, at the same time, have an active installed version of NVDA on the same machine.  Some people create portable copies of whatever version of NVDA it is that they currently have running, and do so in a dedicated folder on their hard drives, immediately prior to updating to a new version as an "insurance policy" against possible issues.

By the way, once you have a portable copy on anything, the root folder can be copied over to as many other places as you might wish, and you have additional portable copies since all pieces needed to run a portable copy are contained in the folder structure.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044  

The difference between a top-flight creative man and the hack is his ability to express powerful meanings indirectly.

         ~ Vance Packard


 

On Tue, Aug 9, 2022 at 10:33 AM, Gene wrote:
the program will update just as it does wherever it is located.
-
You need to explain yourself further on this one.

When I (and most computer people) use the term update it refers to the program itself, not user settings that may be associated with it, whether it's a portable copy or installed.

Portable copies do not update.  Fresh copies are created.  You can ask NVDA to create a new portable copy of another version in the same place, but you have to ask it to do that, whether through the NVDA installer or from the Create Portable Copy function in NVDA Tools.  This is in contrast to how the installed copy will auto-update where all you do is confirm that this is what you want to allow.

The above is not hair splitting, it's a fundamental difference.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044  

The difference between a top-flight creative man and the hack is his ability to express powerful meanings indirectly.

         ~ Vance Packard


Gene
 

Portable programs can and generally do update just as nonportable programs do.

If a portable version of NVDA updates, it follows the same procedure as the installed version except that you will be told that a portable version is being created and it will be installed where the old portable version is.

Gene

On 8/9/2022 9:34 AM, Brian Vogel wrote:
It's possible to make and run

a portable copy of NVDA (or any other program that has a portable variant) from any media of your choosing.

Although portable variants are intended to be, well, portable the two things that determine that they truly are:
1. They're placed on media that can be carried with you, e.g., a thumb drive, SD card, external HDD.
2. They do not install, and by that I mean in the literal sense.  Installed programs make entries in the Windows Registry and also often either add libraries of their own into the existing collection or rely on libraries from it.  Portable variants do neither of those things and everything they need is self-contained in the folder structure created.

The NVDA installer (whether a fresh one downloaded from NVAccess, or the built-in auto update function) does not update portable copies.  If you want updated portable copies you need to have NVDA make new ones for you.

So, yes, you can create a folder such as C:\Portable_Programs\NVDA and create a portable copy of NVDA there, and it will remain there, and can be run from there, and it will never be updated unless you update it.  You can also, at the same time, have an active installed version of NVDA on the same machine.  Some people create portable copies of whatever version of NVDA it is that they currently have running, and do so in a dedicated folder on their hard drives, immediately prior to updating to a new version as an "insurance policy" against possible issues.

By the way, once you have a portable copy on anything, the root folder can be copied over to as many other places as you might wish, and you have additional portable copies since all pieces needed to run a portable copy are contained in the folder structure.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044  

The difference between a top-flight creative man and the hack is his ability to express powerful meanings indirectly.

         ~ Vance Packard



Gene
 

I should add that I'm not sure what you are saying about the portable version and updates.  You can set it not to look for updates, just as you can the installed version.  Whether it updates is determined by you, just the same as you determine whether an installed version updates. 

As I said, I'm not sure what you are saying.  I'm saying that the update procedure is the same.

Gene

On 8/9/2022 9:34 AM, Brian Vogel wrote:
It's possible to make and run a portable copy of NVDA (or any other program that has a portable variant) from any media of your choosing.

Although portable variants are intended to be, well, portable the two things that determine that they truly are:
1. They're placed on media that can be carried with you, e.g., a thumb drive, SD card, external HDD.
2. They do not install, and by that I mean in the literal sense.  Installed programs make entries in the Windows Registry and also often either add libraries of their own into the existing collection or rely on libraries from it.  Portable variants do neither of those things and everything they need is self-contained in the folder structure created.

The NVDA installer (whether a fresh one downloaded from NVAccess, or the built-in auto update function) does not update portable copies.  If you want updated portable copies you need to have NVDA make new ones for you.

So, yes, you can create a folder such as C:\Portable_Programs\NVDA and create a portable copy of NVDA there, and it will remain there, and can be run from there, and it will never be updated unless you update it.  You can also, at the same time, have an active installed version of NVDA on the same machine.  Some people create portable copies of whatever version of NVDA it is that they currently have running, and do so in a dedicated folder on their hard drives, immediately prior to updating to a new version as an "insurance policy" against possible issues.

By the way, once you have a portable copy on anything, the root folder can be copied over to as many other places as you might wish, and you have additional portable copies since all pieces needed to run a portable copy are contained in the folder structure.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044  

The difference between a top-flight creative man and the hack is his ability to express powerful meanings indirectly.

         ~ Vance Packard



 

On Tue, Aug 9, 2022 at 10:58 AM, Gene wrote:
Portable programs can and generally do update just as nonportable programs do.
-
We're just going to have to agree to disagree on this one.  I really don't have the time or willingness to delve into the differences any further than what I have.

The method is different, even if slightly different.  And that difference matters.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044  

The difference between a top-flight creative man and the hack is his ability to express powerful meanings indirectly.

         ~ Vance Packard


Gene
 

I'm saying that from the user's point of view, updating is the same.  I haven't seen anything about what you are saying, if I understand it correctly.  You appear to be saying that when you update a portable version of a program, an entirely new version of the program is placed on the machine and when you update an installed version, new files are added so technically, the procedure is the same.  But from the standpoint of the user, you follow the same procedure to update.

Gene

On 8/9/2022 9:39 AM, Brian Vogel wrote:
On Tue, Aug 9, 2022 at 10:33 AM, Gene wrote:
the program will update just as it does wherever it is located.
-
You need to explain yourself further on this one.

When I (and most computer people) use the term update it refers to the program itself, not user settings that may be associated with it, whether it's a portable copy or installed.

Portable copies do not update.  Fresh copies are created.  You can ask NVDA to create a new portable copy of another version in the same place, but you have to ask it to do that, whether through the NVDA installer or from the Create Portable Copy function in NVDA Tools.  This is in contrast to how the installed copy will auto-update where all you do is confirm that this is what you want to allow.

The above is not hair splitting, it's a fundamental difference.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044  

The difference between a top-flight creative man and the hack is his ability to express powerful meanings indirectly.

         ~ Vance Packard



Gene
 

I had thought the procedure is the same but I haven't carefully compared.  I tend not to update portable versions, though I have.  I keep an installed version current so I can test problems users discuss and I may want to play with a new feature.  But I generally leave portable versions as they are.  They do what I want so I leave them alone.

Gene

On 9/2022 10:08 AM, Gene via groups.io wrote:
I'm saying that from the user's point of view, updating is the same.  I haven't seen anything about what you are saying, if I understand it correctly.  You appear to be saying that when you update a portable version of a program, an entirely new version of the program is placed on the machine and when you update an installed version, new files are added so technically, the procedure is the same.  But from the standpoint of the user, you follow the same procedure to update.

Gene

On 8/9/2022 9:39 AM, Brian Vogel wrote:
On Tue, Aug 9, 2022 at 10:33 AM, Gene wrote:
the program will update just as it does wherever it is located.
-
You need to explain yourself further on this one.

When I (and most computer people) use the term update it refers to the program itself, not user settings that may be associated with it, whether it's a portable copy or installed.

Portable copies do not update.  Fresh copies are created.  You can ask NVDA to create a new portable copy of another version in the same place, but you have to ask it to do that, whether through the NVDA installer or from the Create Portable Copy function in NVDA Tools.  This is in contrast to how the installed copy will auto-update where all you do is confirm that this is what you want to allow.

The above is not hair splitting, it's a fundamental difference.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044  

The difference between a top-flight creative man and the hack is his ability to express powerful meanings indirectly.

         ~ Vance Packard




 

Hi all,

To clarify a few points:

  1. The nature of portable copy of NVDA: it is identical in shape and form to the installed copy of NVDA except for two things: it does not have special privileges (no audio ducking, for instance), and user configuration folder is stored in the same location as the portable copy directory. As installed and portable copies are identical, portable copies DO support updating to a newer version of themselves.
  2. Creating versus updating portable copies: you can create a portable copy of NVDA in three ways: when launching NVDA installer, NVDA menu/Tools/Create portable copy option from installed NVDA, or via command-line. These options do provide an option to start the just-created portable NVDA after creating it. This is the method Brian is talking about, whereas Gene and I are talking about updating portable NVDA once created.
  3. Answering Howard: yes, you can create a portable NVDA anywhere (removable media and internal storage included) except locations where you must be granted admin privileges and on optical media.

While I have an alpha build of NVDA installed on my computer (for development and testing reasons), I have portable versions of beta and stable builds, as well as an alpha build containing add-ons registered on community add-ons website to test add-on compatibility. I do run and update portable copies from time to time, more so for beta builds whenever new betas or release candidates are released. I keep a stable version handy to replicate stable version experiences and to test various add-ons.

Cheers,

Joseph


 

On Tue, Aug 9, 2022 at 12:08 PM, Joseph Lee wrote:
As installed and portable copies are identical, portable copies DO support updating to a newer version of themselves.
-
This being the case, is there a way to create a .bat file with a command line invocation of NVDA that would tell it not to check for updates.  I haven't needed to create archival portables for some time, but when I do I don't even want them to ask me about updating them.  The main reason, besides needing NVDA briefly on a machine where I choose not to install it, that I create portable copies is to "freeze that version in time."
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044  

The difference between a top-flight creative man and the hack is his ability to express powerful meanings indirectly.

         ~ Vance Packard


Gene
 

When I am running the portable version I want not to check for updates, I set it not to do so in the general settings, just as you can in the installed version.  I also uncheck the check box not to notify me of updates at startup.  I am never asked.

Gene

On 8/9/2022 11:51 AM, Brian Vogel wrote:
On Tue, Aug 9, 2022 at 12:08 PM, Joseph Lee wrote:
As installed and portable copies are identical, portable copies DO support updating to a newer version of themselves.
-
This being the case, is there a way to create a .bat file with a command line invocation of NVDA that would tell it not to check for updates.  I haven't needed to create archival portables for some time, but when I do I don't even want them to ask me about updating them.  The main reason, besides needing NVDA briefly on a machine where I choose not to install it, that I create portable copies is to "freeze that version in time."
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044  

The difference between a top-flight creative man and the hack is his ability to express powerful meanings indirectly.

         ~ Vance Packard



 

Thanks, Gene.  That should work.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044  

The difference between a top-flight creative man and the hack is his ability to express powerful meanings indirectly.

         ~ Vance Packard


Ron Canazzi
 

Hi Group,

Well since I am receiving conflicting information (from other lists) concerning Thunderbird accessibility, I installed a portable version of 102.1.1 and told it to check for updates.  When the updates are downloaded and installed, I can see what if any accessibility issues remain or have been addressed.  When I am sure that they all if they ever are, then I will install the permanent version to my system.
As of now 102.1.1 still has issues with the status bar. We shall see.


On 8/9/2022 12:59 PM, Gene wrote:
When I am running the portable version I want not to check for updates, I set it not to do so in the general settings, just as you can in the installed version.  I also uncheck the check box not to notify me of updates at startup.  I am never asked.

Gene

On 8/9/2022 11:51 AM, Brian Vogel wrote:
On Tue, Aug 9, 2022 at 12:08 PM, Joseph Lee wrote:
As installed and portable copies are identical, portable copies DO support updating to a newer version of themselves.
-
This being the case, is there a way to create a .bat file with a command line invocation of NVDA that would tell it not to check for updates.  I haven't needed to create archival portables for some time, but when I do I don't even want them to ask me about updating them.  The main reason, besides needing NVDA briefly on a machine where I choose not to install it, that I create portable copies is to "freeze that version in time."
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044  

The difference between a top-flight creative man and the hack is his ability to express powerful meanings indirectly.

         ~ Vance Packard



-- 
Signature:
For a nation to admit it has done grievous wrongs and will strive to correct them for the betterment of all is no vice;
For a nation to claim it has always been great, needs no improvement  and to cling to its past achievements is no virtue!


Gene
 

I think the problem will probably be fixed at some point.  It will be interesting to find out what caused it, if we are ever informed.  JAWS reads the status line.  I wonder what changed to cause NVDA not to read it when the command is used.

The message below yours, Ron, is my message discussing how to cause NVDA not to check for new versions.  I want to avoid confusion.  I don't want people to think that I was describing how to tell Thunderbird not to check for new versions.

Gene

On 8/9/2022 1:37 PM, Ron Canazzi wrote:
Hi Group,

Well since I am receiving conflicting information (from other lists) concerning Thunderbird accessibility, I installed a portable version of 102.1.1 and told it to check for updates.  When the updates are downloaded and installed, I can see what if any accessibility issues remain or have been addressed.  When I am sure that they all if they ever are, then I will install the permanent version to my system.
As of now 102.1.1 still has issues with the status bar. We shall see.


On 8/9/2022 12:59 PM, Gene wrote:
When I am running the portable version I want not to check for updates, I set it not to do so in the general settings, just as you can in the installed version.  I also uncheck the check box not to notify me of updates at startup.  I am never asked.

Gene

On 8/9/2022 11:51 AM, Brian Vogel wrote:
On Tue, Aug 9, 2022 at 12:08 PM, Joseph Lee wrote:
As installed and portable copies are identical, portable copies DO support updating to a newer version of themselves.
-
This being the case, is there a way to create a .bat file with a command line invocation of NVDA that would tell it not to check for updates.  I haven't needed to create archival portables for some time, but when I do I don't even want them to ask me about updating them.  The main reason, besides needing NVDA briefly on a machine where I choose not to install it, that I create portable copies is to "freeze that version in time."
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044  

The difference between a top-flight creative man and the hack is his ability to express powerful meanings indirectly.

         ~ Vance Packard



-- 
Signature:
For a nation to admit it has done grievous wrongs and will strive to correct them for the betterment of all is no vice;
For a nation to claim it has always been great, needs no improvement  and to cling to its past achievements is no virtue!


Brian's Mail list account
 

Yes I do this all the time in fact. Yes it does run from CD but is s l o w and you cannot change anything of course.
Brian

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----- Original Message -----
From: "Gene" <gsasner@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2022 3:33 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Portable copy


You can run a copy of NVDA portable from anything, a removable external
drive, a thumb drive, on your internal hard drive, anywhere from which
your computer can see and run the program. Of course, you shouldn't run
it from a cdrom because you wouldn't be able to update it, but I suppose
it could even run from one, if you never make any changes, which would
all be immediately lost when the program closed.

the program will update just as it does wherever it is located.

Gene

On 8/9/2022 9:20 AM, Howard Traxler wrote:
Is it possible to run a portable copy of NVDA from a folder on a hard
drive? When it wants to update, will it update the portable copy;
wherever it might be located? Thanks

<HT>











Brian's Mail list account
 

Well, it will always default to saving it where it was running from but of course being a portable copy it asks different questions, if it triggered the.
If however you manually download a new version you have to tell it where you actually want it.
Brian

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----- Original Message -----
From: "Brian Vogel" <britechguy@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2022 3:39 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Portable copy


On Tue, Aug 9, 2022 at 10:33 AM, Gene wrote:


the program will update just as it does wherever it is located.
-
You need to explain yourself further on this one.

When I (and most computer people) use the term update it refers to the program itself, not user settings that may be associated with it, whether it's a portable copy or installed.

Portable copies do not update. Fresh copies are created. You can ask NVDA to create a new portable copy of another version in the same place, but you have to ask it to do that, whether through the NVDA installer or from the Create Portable Copy function in NVDA Tools. This is in contrast to how the installed copy will auto-update where all you do is confirm that this is what you want to allow.

The above is not hair splitting, it's a fundamental difference.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044

*The difference between a top-flight creative man and the hack is his ability to express powerful meanings indirectly.*

~ Vance Packard


Brian's Mail list account
 

You can set this in the settings. I leave it on but decline if its a specific version there for a specific reason. Same goes for add ons.
Brian

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----- Original Message -----
From: "Brian Vogel" <britechguy@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2022 5:51 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Portable copy


On Tue, Aug 9, 2022 at 12:08 PM, Joseph Lee wrote:


As installed and portable copies are identical, portable copies DO support
updating to a newer version of themselves.
-
This being the case, is there a way to create a .bat file with a command line invocation of NVDA that would tell it not to check for updates. I haven't needed to create archival portables for some time, but when I do I don't even want them to ask me about updating them. The main reason, besides needing NVDA briefly on a machine where I choose not to install it, that I create portable copies is to "freeze that version in time."
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044

*The difference between a top-flight creative man and the hack is his ability to express powerful meanings indirectly.*

~ Vance Packard


Brian's Mail list account
 

Not quite, they do update, they just have additional options, or at least the alphas seem to have always worked that way.
I've seen no change to this at all. Both copies attempt to overwrite everything that has been altered, but leave other stuff untouched, including in the portable version all the add ons and settings.
The only differences in working are as stated that it can only do stuff the user its installed for is allowed to do, since its not usually the admin and has security protocols to uphold given as Brian says, it can be copied off to anywhere.

This is why it can even run on a CD as you just move the whole folder to the writing area for the cd, but it is very slow, I know I tried it!


I guess the next question will be if we can run it on a remote drive over the web. I'll pass on that one.
Brian

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----- Original Message -----
From: "Brian Vogel" <britechguy@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2022 3:34 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Portable copy


It's possible to make and run a portable copy of NVDA (or any other program that has a portable variant) from any media of your choosing.

Although portable variants are intended to be, well, portable the two things that determine that they truly are:
1. They're placed on media that can be carried with you, e.g., a thumb drive, SD card, external HDD.
2. They do not install, and by that I mean in the literal sense. Installed programs make entries in the Windows Registry and also often either add libraries of their own into the existing collection or rely on libraries from it. Portable variants do neither of those things and everything they need is self-contained in the folder structure created.

The NVDA installer (whether a fresh one downloaded from NVAccess, or the built-in auto update function) does not update portable copies. If you want updated portable copies you need to have NVDA make new ones for you.

So, yes, you can create a folder such as C:\Portable_Programs\NVDA and create a portable copy of NVDA there, and it will remain there, and can be run from there, and it will never be updated unless you update it. You can also, at the same time, have an active installed version of NVDA on the same machine. Some people create portable copies of whatever version of NVDA it is that they currently have running, and do so in a dedicated folder on their hard drives, immediately prior to updating to a new version as an "insurance policy" against possible issues.

By the way, once you have a portable copy on anything, the root folder can be copied over to as many other places as you might wish, and you have additional portable copies since all pieces needed to run a portable copy are contained in the folder structure.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044

*The difference between a top-flight creative man and the hack is his ability to express powerful meanings indirectly.*

~ Vance Packard


Brian's Mail list account
 

OK and this is my last word. MOST portable programs do, but I have not managed to get Libra Office to do it, and just recently, Ccleaner keeps pushing installed copies to me even though I'm running it in a folder as a portable.
I had to take the machine back to stop this as it decided to obliterate my list of things to look at on registry cleaning and in the end I downloaded a new portable copy and had to manually make the changes to the settings to stop it clobbering the default browser, and email client.
Be careful.
Brian

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----- Original Message -----
From: "Brian Vogel" <britechguy@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2022 4:03 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Portable copy


On Tue, Aug 9, 2022 at 10:58 AM, Gene wrote:


Portable programs can and generally do update just as nonportable programs
do.
-
We're just going to have to agree to disagree on this one. I really don't have the time or willingness to delve into the differences any further than what I have.

The method is different, even if slightly different. And that difference matters.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044

*The difference between a top-flight creative man and the hack is his ability to express powerful meanings indirectly.*

~ Vance Packard