Upgrading Windows with NVDA


Daniel Sommerfeld
 

Hello all.


As written in the subject, is it possible to upgrade Windows 10 to Windows 11 using NVDA? I think this is called windows anytime upgrade or something like that. I just wanted to know, if that is possible with NVDA or if there is a certain point, from where i would need a sighted person to help.


Regards

Daniel


 

Yes, in-place upgrades can be done without sighted assistance.  Once they're kicked off you will have periods of silence while they're doing the work that needs to be done and the machine will often reboot several times during the process but just pick up where it left off.  Eventually, when everything's done, you're back at the login screen.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044  

The difference between a top-flight creative man and the hack is his ability to express powerful meanings indirectly.

         ~ Vance Packard


Daniel Sommerfeld
 

Hi Brian.


Well that is typical for me. I mean doing the first step after the second.


Do you know of a usable tool, where i can check, if my pc is fit for Windows 11? I have found some tools but they are not really usable.


Regards

Daniel

Am 04.08.2022 um 17:09 schrieb Brian Vogel:

Yes, in-place upgrades can be done without sighted assistance.  Once they're kicked off you will have periods of silence while they're doing the work that needs to be done and the machine will often reboot several times during the process but just pick up where it left off.  Eventually, when everything's done, you're back at the login screen.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044  

The difference between a top-flight creative man and the hack is his ability to express powerful meanings indirectly.

         ~ Vance Packard


tim
 

You can until it reboots. Then you will have to use narrator to finish is how I did it.

On 8/4/2022 3:59 AM, Daniel Sommerfeld wrote:
Hello all.


As written in the subject, is it possible to upgrade Windows 10 to Windows 11 using NVDA? I think this is called windows anytime upgrade or something like that. I just wanted to know, if that is possible with NVDA or if there is a certain point, from where i would need a sighted person to help.


Regards

Daniel





 

Daniel,

If your computer is suitable for Windows 11 you should be being told that in the Update & Security settings, Windows Update pane.  In fact, if it qualifies you should have some sort of link that would kick off an in-place upgrade, but being that I don't have a machine where that's the case, I can't say what the exact phrasing on that link is.

If your machine does not qualify for Windows 11, there should be a message that reads, "This PC doesn't currently meet the minimum system requirements to run Windows 11"  There are occasions where that is because a given setting that needs to be turned on is not turned on, as opposed to the hardware not being sufficient.  Directly beneath that message will be another about PC Health Check, and a link Get PC Health Check, which you can activate to have the PC Health Check download and run to verify whether you have insufficient hardware or the hardware is OK but something else needs to be tweaked.

If your computer has an Intel i-series processor it must be 8th generation or newer (a number after the dash, e.g., i5-8493, that is 8000 or higher) to be Windows 11 compatible.  If you already know you have an i-series that's first through 7th generation, you cannot update to Windows 11.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044  

The difference between a top-flight creative man and the hack is his ability to express powerful meanings indirectly.

         ~ Vance Packard


Ron Canazzi
 

Hi Group,

There is also one issue that I don't' quite understand as far as upgrading to Windows 11.  When I tried upgrading my older Windows 10 machine to Windows 11 as Brian Vogel has suggested, windows itself told me I had passed the test.  But when I then began the upgrade, I got a message to the effect that the process couldn't continue because of some sort of issue with the bios security.  I was told to contact my motherboard producer for further information .

I don't know just what this message meant, but that's something to be aware of.

On 8/4/2022 12:52 PM, Brian Vogel wrote:
Daniel,

If your computer is suitable for Windows 11 you should be being told that in the Update & Security settings, Windows Update pane.  In fact, if it qualifies you should have some sort of link that would kick off an in-place upgrade, but being that I don't have a machine where that's the case, I can't say what the exact phrasing on that link is.

If your machine does not qualify for Windows 11, there should be a message that reads, "This PC doesn't currently meet the minimum system requirements to run Windows 11"  There are occasions where that is because a given setting that needs to be turned on is not turned on, as opposed to the hardware not being sufficient.  Directly beneath that message will be another about PC Health Check, and a link Get PC Health Check, which you can activate to have the PC Health Check download and run to verify whether you have insufficient hardware or the hardware is OK but something else needs to be tweaked.

If your computer has an Intel i-series processor it must be 8th generation or newer (a number after the dash, e.g., i5-8493, that is 8000 or higher) to be Windows 11 compatible.  If you already know you have an i-series that's first through 7th generation, you cannot update to Windows 11.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044  

The difference between a top-flight creative man and the hack is his ability to express powerful meanings indirectly.

         ~ Vance Packard


-- 
Signature:
For a nation to admit it has done grievous wrongs and will strive to correct them for the betterment of all is no vice;
For a nation to claim it has always been great, needs no improvement  and to cling to its past achievements is no virtue!


 

On Thu, Aug 4, 2022 at 01:44 PM, Ron Canazzi wrote:
When I tried upgrading my older Windows 10 machine to Windows 11 as Brian Vogel has suggested, windows itself told me I had passed the test.  But when I then began the upgrade, I got a message to the effect that the process couldn't continue because of some sort of issue with the bios security.  I was told to contact my motherboard producer for further information .
-
Because Windows Update with NVDA questions are going to keep arising in cycles here, I am going to answer this even though it's not directly NVDA related.

This sort of error message is generally the result of one or both of these factors:
1.  You have a very out-of-date UEFI/BIOS installed.
2.  Your UEFI/BIOS has the TPM (Trusted Platform Module) function turned off, even though the required TPM is actually present in your hardware.

The best bet is to go to the support page for your make and model from the computer manufacturer, first, and see if there is a BIOS update.  If so, get it and apply it to see if that alone solves the problem.  If it does, you're good, but if it doesn't you are going to need a sighted assistant to "flip the switch" for TPM function on in UEFI/BIOS since there is no screen reader support prior to the operating system itself booting.

The message you get when an update halts should be pretty specific about exactly what it is that caused it to halt, so you can act accordingly to make whatever correction is necessary.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044  

The difference between a top-flight creative man and the hack is his ability to express powerful meanings indirectly.

         ~ Vance Packard


Steve Matzura
 

Doesn't Windows Update offer that? None of my machines are 11-capable, and the update screen says it right there in plain English: "Your system does not meet the requirements for Windows 11, and here's a link to some things you might be able to do ..." etc. Have you not seen this? Every system on which I have worked since 11 came on the scene has offered it in a standard update, sometimes without the poor unsuspecting user even knowing they got it.

On 8/4/2022 12:36 PM, Daniel Sommerfeld wrote:

Hi Brian.


Well that is typical for me. I mean doing the first step after the second.


Do you know of a usable tool, where i can check, if my pc is fit for Windows 11? I have found some tools but they are not really usable.


Regards

Daniel

Am 04.08.2022 um 17:09 schrieb Brian Vogel:
Yes, in-place upgrades can be done without sighted assistance. Once they're kicked off you will have periods of silence while they're doing the work that needs to be done and the machine will often reboot several times during the process but just pick up where it left off.  Eventually, when everything's done, you're back at the login screen.
--


 

On Thu, Aug 4, 2022 at 06:43 PM, Steve Matzura wrote:
Every system on which I have worked since 11 came on the scene has offered it in a standard update, sometimes without the poor unsuspecting user even knowing they got it.
-
Same here, not too terribly long after the initial release date.  The only thing I'll argue is that anyone should have been, or be, a "poor unsuspecting user" since this update is clearly identified, and optional, much like normal Feature Updates are now in Windows 10 so long as the version you're using is in support.  If you don't activate that "Download and install" link it's not going to happen, and the what that would be downloaded and installed is very clearly identified.  Any time someone encounters a "Download and install" link they need to have reviewed "the what" before choosing to activate it.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044  

The difference between a top-flight creative man and the hack is his ability to express powerful meanings indirectly.

         ~ Vance Packard


Steve Matzura
 

Hah Brian, you should only be so lucky as to not encounter poor unsuspecting users for the rest of your days! LOLLOLLOL! Some folks treat computers like toasters. Ever look at someone's toaster and ask yourself when was the last time they cleaned its insides? Do yourself a favor, keep your lunch where it belongs, and don't! Hahahaha! Some folks treat their computers just like that--happily letting things happen to them that they don't understand or care about, and then they call folks like us to answer questions about new and differeing behaviors than they're used to, and we have to sometimes unwind those behaviors and explain to them how computers aren't toasters, that they require watching, and sometimes even regular maintenance.


On 8/4/2022 7:24 PM, Brian Vogel wrote:
On Thu, Aug 4, 2022 at 06:43 PM, Steve Matzura wrote:
Every system on which I have worked since 11 came on the scene has offered it in a standard update, sometimes without the poor unsuspecting user even knowing they got it.
-
Same here, not too terribly long after the initial release date.  The only thing I'll argue is that anyone should have been, or be, a "poor unsuspecting user" since this update is clearly identified, and optional, much like normal Feature Updates are now in Windows 10 so long as the version you're using is in support.  If you don't activate that "Download and install" link it's not going to happen, and the what that would be downloaded and installed is very clearly identified.  Any time someone encounters a "Download and install" link they need to have reviewed "the what" before choosing to activate it.
--


Arlene
 

Hi, if your computer can manage win 11. You can upgrade to it. I know mine won’t do it. I tried it last year and I got some sort of notification saying this computer can’t upgrade to windows 11. 

 

Sent from Mail for Windows

 

From: Daniel Sommerfeld
Sent: August 4, 2022 12:59 AM
To: nvda@nvda.groups.io
Subject: [nvda] Upgrading Windows with NVDA

 

Hello all.

 

 

As written in the subject, is it possible to upgrade Windows 10 to

Windows 11 using NVDA? I think this is called windows anytime upgrade or

something like that. I just wanted to know, if that is possible with

NVDA or if there is a certain point, from where i would need a sighted

person to help.

 

 

Regards

 

Daniel

 

 

 

 

 

 


 

On Thu, Aug 4, 2022 at 08:07 PM, Steve Matzura wrote:
happily letting things happen to them that they don't understand or care about, and then they call folks like us to answer questions about new and differing behaviors than they're used to, and we have to sometimes unwind those behaviors and explain to them how computers aren't toasters, that they require watching, and sometimes even regular maintenance.
-
I can't disagree with you.  In this life, though, the old saw "once burned, twice shy," should apply and particularly if you've done/allowed something you had not intended in the past.  Most will learn from that.

I say the following in all sincerity:  You can't fix stupid and/or complete inattention to anything.

But being either stupid or just not paying an iota of attention will never, ever, make someone "poor and unsuspecting."  The use of the "Download and install" link as consent for doing the two things it says is now years old.  If you can't, don't, won't pay attention to it over 7 years into the Windows 10 era then the problem with something downloading and installing is not that you have not been warned.

I have a lot of sympathy and empathy during the periods of major change, but when it comes to this and because that major change occurred years ago, both sympathy and empathy are gone.  And that extends these days to those who've clung to Windows 7 long past its official retirement date by Microsoft when the update to Windows 10 has been, and still remains, free.

As I said initially in response to a post by Quentin Christensen there is a significant advantage of being part of an update cohort when "everyone's doing it" rather than waiting years after the vast majority were updating.  That, too, is a choice.  And given my personal and professional experience, I have no hesitation about saying it's a poor one (and I take the use of assistive technology into account).  Not being on either Windows 10 or 11 in 2022 is just a bad, bad choice.  And I don't know of a single person in the technical support business who would say otherwise.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044  

The difference between a top-flight creative man and the hack is his ability to express powerful meanings indirectly.

         ~ Vance Packard


Brian's Mail list account
 

Well none of my machines will be suitable. I do really feel Microsoft have rather shot themselves in the foot with this trusted hardware chip, since looking back over many years we have managed without one!

Brian

--
bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.(Virgin media)
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Brian Vogel" <britechguy@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Thursday, August 04, 2022 7:25 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Upgrading Windows with NVDA


On Thu, Aug 4, 2022 at 01:44 PM, Ron Canazzi wrote:


When I tried upgrading my older Windows 10 machine to Windows 11 as Brian
Vogel has suggested, windows itself told me I had passed the test. But
when I then began the upgrade, I got a message to the effect that the
process couldn't continue because of some sort of issue with the bios
security. I was told to contact my motherboard producer for further
information .
-
Because Windows Update with NVDA questions are going to keep arising in cycles here, I am going to answer this even though it's not directly NVDA related.

This sort of error message is generally the result of one or both of these factors:
1. You have a very out-of-date UEFI/BIOS installed.
2. Your UEFI/BIOS has the TPM (Trusted Platform Module) function turned off, even though the required TPM is actually present in your hardware.

The best bet is to go to the support page for your make and model from the computer manufacturer, first, and see if there is a BIOS update. If so, get it and apply it to see if that alone solves the problem. If it does, you're good, but if it doesn't you are going to need a sighted assistant to "flip the switch" for TPM function on in UEFI/BIOS since there is no screen reader support prior to the operating system itself booting.

The message you get when an update halts should be pretty specific about exactly what it is that caused it to halt, so you can act accordingly to make whatever correction is necessary.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044

*The difference between a top-flight creative man and the hack is his ability to express powerful meanings indirectly.*

~ Vance Packard


Brian's Mail list account
 

I do disagree, but only on machines which run legacy software as this one does. It is the only reason this is still on 7. Sadly things we need have never been made reliable in Windows 10. Indeed the operating systems simply put them out and left them orphaned off completely.

However if its look and feel you want to change, there are things like Open Shell which do a good job at making the change far less hassle.
Brian

--
bglists@...
Sent via blueyonder.(Virgin media)
Please address personal E-mail to:-
briang1@..., putting 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name field.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Brian Vogel" <britechguy@...>
To: <nvda@nvda.groups.io>
Sent: Friday, August 05, 2022 4:21 AM
Subject: Re: [nvda] Upgrading Windows with NVDA


On Thu, Aug 4, 2022 at 08:07 PM, Steve Matzura wrote:


happily letting things happen to them that they don't understand or care
about, and then they call folks like us to answer questions about new and
differing behaviors than they're used to, and we have to sometimes unwind
those behaviors and explain to them how computers aren't toasters, that
they require watching, and sometimes even regular maintenance.
-
I can't disagree with you. In this life, though, the old saw "once burned, twice shy," should apply and particularly if you've done/allowed something you had not intended in the past. Most will learn from that.

I say the following in all sincerity: You can't fix stupid and/or complete inattention to anything.

But being either stupid or just not paying an iota of attention will never, ever, make someone "poor and unsuspecting." The use of the "Download and install" link as consent for doing the two things it says is now years old. If you can't, don't, won't pay attention to it over 7 years into the Windows 10 era then the problem with something downloading and installing is not that you have not been warned.

I have a lot of sympathy and empathy during the periods of major change, but when it comes to this and because that major change occurred years ago, both sympathy and empathy are gone. And that extends these days to those who've clung to Windows 7 long past its official retirement date by Microsoft when the update to Windows 10 has been, and still remains, free.

As I said initially in response to a post by Quentin Christensen there is a significant advantage of being part of an update cohort when "everyone's doing it" rather than waiting years after the vast majority were updating. That, too, is a choice. And given my personal and professional experience, I have no hesitation about saying it's a poor one (and I take the use of assistive technology into account). Not being on either Windows 10 or 11 in 2022 is just a bad, bad choice. And I don't know of a single person in the technical support business who would say otherwise.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044

*The difference between a top-flight creative man and the hack is his ability to express powerful meanings indirectly.*

~ Vance Packard


 

On Fri, Aug 5, 2022 at 03:30 AM, Brian's Mail list account wrote:
Sadly things we need have never been made reliable in Windows 10. Indeed the operating systems simply put them out and left them orphaned off completely.
-
If you can name even five I would be shocked.  I've been doing this way too long to believe that practically anything that ran under Windows 7 won't run under Windows 10, and that's not even using compatibility mode.  Once you add that in, the number gets much smaller.

I think I've had one machine with one piece of XP era software that didn't make the cut.  I've also installed plenty of old software (as in predates Windows 10 by years) under Windows 10.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044  

The difference between a top-flight creative man and the hack is his ability to express powerful meanings indirectly.

         ~ Vance Packard


tim
 

You would be talking about the Trusted Platform Module.

That needs to be tpm2.0, and yours may need turned on.

That can only be done in bios.


On 8/4/2022 1:44 PM, Ron Canazzi wrote:
Hi Group,

There is also one issue that I don't' quite understand as far as upgrading to Windows 11.  When I tried upgrading my older Windows 10 machine to Windows 11 as Brian Vogel has suggested, windows itself told me I had passed the test.  But when I then began the upgrade, I got a message to the effect that the process couldn't continue because of some sort of issue with the bios security.  I was told to contact my motherboard producer for further information .

I don't know just what this message meant, but that's something to be aware of.

On 8/4/2022 12:52 PM, Brian Vogel wrote:
Daniel,

If your computer is suitable for Windows 11 you should be being told that in the Update & Security settings, Windows Update pane.  In fact, if it qualifies you should have some sort of link that would kick off an in-place upgrade, but being that I don't have a machine where that's the case, I can't say what the exact phrasing on that link is.

If your machine does not qualify for Windows 11, there should be a message that reads, "This PC doesn't currently meet the minimum system requirements to run Windows 11"  There are occasions where that is because a given setting that needs to be turned on is not turned on, as opposed to the hardware not being sufficient.  Directly beneath that message will be another about PC Health Check, and a link Get PC Health Check, which you can activate to have the PC Health Check download and run to verify whether you have insufficient hardware or the hardware is OK but something else needs to be tweaked.

If your computer has an Intel i-series processor it must be 8th generation or newer (a number after the dash, e.g., i5-8493, that is 8000 or higher) to be Windows 11 compatible.  If you already know you have an i-series that's first through 7th generation, you cannot update to Windows 11.
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044  

The difference between a top-flight creative man and the hack is his ability to express powerful meanings indirectly.

         ~ Vance Packard


-- 
Signature:
For a nation to admit it has done grievous wrongs and will strive to correct them for the betterment of all is no vice;
For a nation to claim it has always been great, needs no improvement  and to cling to its past achievements is no virtue!